Building a Pentium 4 system... VERY confused about options. Help needed!

[cd3838]

I haven't really followed computer happenings in the last year or so, becuase my athlon 1.4 @ 1.6ghz has suited me well, but it's really time for an upgrade, and I'm pretty confused about all of the ram/chipset offerings for pentium based systems. I've spent hours apon hours looking into it, and i just can't seem to decide on what i want, because i'm not understand everything. So let me lay down to you what exactly i'm looking for with this computer and my budget, and i'm sure you guys can help me out. My main requirements for this sytem:

First off, I'm looking to spend around $850 max on the CPU, Motherboard and Ram (512MBs or more is a must.) But, it wouldn't kill me to spend less.

I would like to overclock the proc so that it runs at or around 3.0ghz.

I would PREFER rambus ram, but i'm confused as to it's overclocking potential. If i was to buy a Pentium 4 2.4b (the cpu i'm looking at) and then add in two sticks of 256MB PC1066 could they handle the 166mhz bus speed even though they're only rated for 133mhz? Is there a certain type of RDRAM (i've seen a few mentions of pc1200.. but cant find much on it) that can handle this bus speed? Would I be better off buying a 2.4a (100mhz bus) and running the pc1066 @ 125mhz bus to get me to 3.0ghz? Or should i just go with DDR 333 and run the 2.4b @ 166mhz bus that way? So far the 2.4a @ 125mhz RDRAM sounds the best to me..

See how i'm confused folks? basically i want to run my computer at around 3.0ghz with the best possible performance from my chipset/ram as possible, but i need to have a type of ram that can handle the bumped up FSB. So lay down the options folks! If you even want to go as far as to recomend specific motherboards, that'd be VERY nice, and just keep in mind that i need a mobo with raid support.

Thanks for any help anyones willing to give!

Update: Okay, after looking around even more, it seems to me like there's an option to set RDRam systems from 4x FSB to 3x FSB... Now a 3x 166FSB (the 2.4b x 166 = 3.0ghz) is 498mhz "triple pumped". Not quite 533mhz bus, but it's better than having to use DDR ram to hit the speed i need. So basically, which of these would give me the best results:

P4 2.4b 166mhz(x2) (DDR) x 18 = 3000mhz, 333mhz bus
P4 2.4b 166mhz(x3) (pc1066) x18 = 3000mhz, 500mhz bus
P4 2.4a 125mhz(x4) (pc1066) x 24 = 3000mhz, 500mhz bus

So basically now, I'm unclear on the 3x multiplier setting of RDRam... Would I be better off with a 166mhz x 3 bus and a 2.4b or a 125mhz x 4 bus and a 2.4a ? Which will get me to my 3.0ghz goal more realistically? Please help me out here guys!

[batboy]

Actually, you want the 2.26b Northwood. If you're going with RDRAM, then get the Abit TH7-II motherboard and 2 sticks of Samsung PC1066 memory. To achieve 3 gig, you need to run at 177 FSB which if you use the 3X memory setting then that's 177X3=531 (close to being in spec with a little headroom. The 2.26 gig P-4 is a proven and excellent overclocker that several members have used to reach 3 gig, plus it's cheaper than the 2.4b that you're looking at.

[cd3838]

Alright.. I wasn't sure if the 2.26 could reach 3.0ghz. I'll get a really good heatsink and fan for it though. But you think that the 2.26ghz and samsung pc1066 memory can do 177fsb x 3 (531mhz) without any problems? I know there's a chance the computer wont be able to handle it, but that shouldn't be asking too much of the other components? Like i said, i dont know too much about RDRAM, but the *actual* FSB isn't going to matter? It's just the 533mhz / 531mhz that matters? The ram's not going to complain that the FSB is actually at 177mhz, becuase it's only pumping it x3 instead of x4, correct? Thanks for the help!

[batboy]

There are no guarantees in overclocking, but I think the 2.26b has a good chance of doing this. Look at some of the current posts on this subject. PC1066 RDRAM is rated 533X2=1066 (it's dual channel so you have to use the modules in pairs). Samsung memory should run a little above the rated spec. It doesn't matter if it's 3X or 4X as long as it's within spec. Now, lots of motherboards and components won't handle high FSB like 177 MHz, but the Abit TH7-II has a setting that will allow you to "fix" the PCI and AGP bus speeds to default. That's why I recommended that mobo.

[cd3838]

Alright, thanks.. I would prefer to go with abit anyway, my last two systems have been built off of an Abit mobo, and I have absolutely loved both. But shouldn't i go with a new motherboard? One that officially supports pc1066mhz, 533mhz bus, northwood core... Are you sure that that motherboard even allows you to get up to 3ghz? I was gonna go with a motherboard with the 850E chipset, i was eyeing the Gigabyte GA-8IHXP to be exact. Thats a good motherboard though, that should still allow the overclocking i need... So I'll start looking into that, 2x256mb of rdram and the 2.26ghz P4. Thanks!

[cd3838]

One last question... Which heatsink / fan should i go with? Price is completely not an object here. I want the best fan and heatsink i can get. I want the fan to be reasonably quiet though, that's my only real request. I was looking at the Thermalright Ax-478, Alpha Pal 8942T and the MCX 462-BU... Any comments on those and any suggestions for a fan?

[batboy]

All three of those CPU coolers you mentioned are excellent. But, trying to reach 3 gig with a quiet fan is not a good idea. If you want quiet, go with water cooling. That said, the high CFM 80mm fans are less annoying than the old 60mm Delta 38 screamer that is so infamous. You'll need plenty of case ventilation too.

I would look very closely at that Gigabyte board to see if it has the "fix" PCI setting and all the other overclocking features. The Abit TH7-II will run at 533 MHz "unofficially" and has FSB settings of up to 255 MHz. Go look in the Abit motherboard section and do a search. I think you'll find that as long as the memory bus don't exceed 533 by much, it'll handle the high speeds.

Again, nothing is guaranteed.

[cd3838]

Yeah, I wasn't really saying quiet as in silent, but I just dont want a computer that sounds like a vacuum cleaner. And I'm going with a lian-li case with a blowhole and plenty of cooling... so no worries there. Thanks for all of your help man, i appriciate it!

[cd3838]

Oh, and when i install the fan... Do i want it blowing against the heatsink or away from it? I was looking at getting the MCX 462-BU and I'll get a VANTEC Tornado (Double Ball-Bearing) 84 CFM Fan... I figure that should do me up well =) I'm getting goosebumps just thinking about pushing this CPU.

[batboy]

Most heatsinks are designed to have the fan blow air across the fins. Some of the Alphas worked better having the fan suck air off the heatsink. On my P-III, I tried both an Alpha and a GlobalWin with the fan sucking and then blowing on both heatsinks. After testing, I picked the combo that cooled the best. The Swiftechs like the fan blowing towards the heatsink. By the way, after claiming you wanted a quiet fan, you picked one of the noisiest fans... lol.

[cd3838]

Yeah.. haha.. i know that, but i mean, i guess i gotta choose between the two. I couldn't find any fans in the 55-65cfm range, which is what i would prefer. It seemed like they were all 40cfm or 80+ cfm... I'll still go with a 55-65cfm fan if i can find one.

[batboy]

Here's the fan I have, it's a Delta 80mm 68 CFM.

http://2cooltek.safeshopper.com/24/261.htm?285

[psykis]

is that the screamer delta fan?
:confused:

[batboy]

I usually think of the 60mm Delta 38 CFM that I used to have as "the screamer". It's more shrill and whines more than my ex-wife. The 80mm Delta fan I have now is not quiet by any means, but I can tolerate it ok. More of a "windy" noise than anything.

[cd3838]

Yeah, i remember those fans, and how annoying they were... My computer's no longer in the room i sleep in so I figure a loud fan wont kill me too much. Just gotta turn up the music on those klipsch's of mine =) I ordered everything from newegg last night, and i decided on DDR (512mb of pc3200... 200/400mhz corsair XMS) because i just couldn't find a rambus board that had all of the features i wanted. I found an ASUS one that was close, but it didn't have raid! So anyway, i fell in love with the Abit IT7-Max board, and I got the pentium 4 2.26ghz cpu (retail) like you said to do, and the MCX 462-BU with a tornado fan and some artic silver 3, a couple of 120GB WD "SE" HDs, plextor 40x CDR, DVD, etc etc... I'm gonna pick up a DVD-R drive and a Radeon 9700 in the next couple of weeks as well. So thanks for all of the tips, and I'll definetly post my results when my computer gets here (hopefully on) wednesday.. Newegg is great about getting stuff out on time, so hopefully i'll be posting a reply in 2 days with my results! Thanks!

[batboy]

Sounds like an awesome system. I'm assuming you know that the IT7 uses USB mouse and keyboard? Good luck.

[cd3838]

Yeah, that's one of the reasons i liked it... no more legacy connectors, it improves the boot time by 6 or 7 seconds, and i dont use any of those anyway. and who can complain about 8 USB 2.0 ports and 2 Firewire ports built in in place of a few ps2 and serial connectors and a parallel port? I know i can't!