READ READ There are much better stuff for heatsinks than copper!!

[dxiw]

I was just wondering for all you true DIY ppl out there try making a waterblock out of graphite heres why.

here is chart of all the thermal conductivities:
http://hypertextbook.com/physics/thermal/conduction/index.shtml

aluminum is 237
copper is 401 (hence better cooler)
silver is 429
diamond is 895!
but whats insanely awesome is
graphite (parallel) at 1950..the only problem is its a non-metal....
it is hard though...

I think it would make an awesome awesome water block if the water cool cool that graphite fast enough...it would never work in a ir cause no fan coud cool a heatsink thats pulls away heat so fast....
what do you guys think about this though?

[Lusankya]

someone pull apart a disk break or drum break and get the shoes and try those :P

[Diggrr]

Yeah, but isn't parallel graphite non-waterproof?, almost a felt like material? Adding the binding resin will kill the conductivity numbers.

One more problem, alot of heat conductivity tests were based on electrical conductivity...I doubt most charts I come across since the CuSil debacle.

There is poco foam, a graphite foam with killer surface area. Alas, it too isn't waterproof.

If you find out more about this stuff, pass it on!

[Since87]

Originally posted by dxiw
but whats insanely awesome is
graphite (parallel) at 1950..the only problem is its a non-metal....
it is hard though...


However:

graphite (perpendicular) 5.7

I suspect it is not easy to find a large chunk of graphite with the crystalline structure oriented in the same direction throughout the chunk. I don't think it all that hard either. Pencil leads are made of graphite combined with clay to make them harder. I'd guess your waterblock might get eroded away by water flowing through it. And they say higher flow is always better:D

Me personally, I'd settle for a diamond big enough to build a waterblock out of.

[Jkasmann]

Graphite is an anisotropic form of copper, meaning its properties vary directionally. Note that in the parallel direction graphite is a great thermal conductor, and in the perp. direction it is basically an insulator. The same is true for hardness, in one direction it can withstand high stress but in the other very little shear force.
I am not sure, but I think the strength and conductivity directions are different (check me someone). In other words, if that is true, the direction of high stress strength is a thermal insulator.

Diamond is the isotropic form of carbon (same properties in all directions) which is why it is both hard and thermally conductive regardless of orientation.

[SkiFletch]

how about industrial grade diamonds?

[Skulemate]

Originally posted by Jkasmann
Graphite is an anisotropic form of copper

:rolleyes:

Graphite is a form of carbon.

[grunjee]

Hmmm. I was hoping to gain some enlightenment in this thread, but instead have decided to stick with my Maze2.

[AZZKICKER]

i dont understand why we dont see nickel plated stuff

nickel is one awsome heat releacer and or absorber

should be sinks of copper coated with nickel


think what a SK800 would do if it was nickel plated

[Seal]

i got a better idea guys, someone just build one out of a huge diamond. :) or how about helium 2? ~100,000 it says on teh site lol.

[The Overclocker]

Originally posted by AZZKICKER
i dont understand why we dont see nickel plated stuff

nickel is one awsome heat releacer and or absorber

should be sinks of copper coated with nickel


think what a SK800 would do if it was nickel plated

er...

we do, i cant think of any examles here (i think there ware some ram sinks) but it works on the same idea as silver or tin plating - it is mearly to fill in the gaps on the base then help thermal conductivity.

[glass]

didn't some heatsink manufacturer have a early tech. sample of graphite hs sometime during last spring.. i remember seeing some stuff of it. too busy to search the archives..

[Maximouse]

Originally posted by seal
i got a better idea guys, someone just build one out of a huge diamond. :)

Get yourself a Diamond studded AX7:cool:

They probably sell them in some computer shop in Beverly Hills;)

[CrashOveride]

it woudl be sweet to jsut have a diamon in side your wb that onyl thouches the core adn then goes in the the water compartment, but i dont think that the water coudl get ath much from it...:D :eh?: :D

[Silversinksam]

Originally posted by AZZKICKER
i dont understand why we dont see nickel plated stuff

nickel is one awsome heat releacer and or absorber

should be sinks of copper coated with nickel


think what a SK800 would do if it was nickel plated

I think you got confused, Nickel and Tin are terrible thermal conduits. Besides plating is useless, even if its Silver plated. For heatsinks that have poorly soldered fins to the base, Silver plating can help a great deal as it makes a better bonding to the fins and the base.



Thermal Properties of Materials
Thermal Conductivity, W/cm-K
Metals
Aluminum 2.165
Beryllium 1.772
Beryllium-copper 1.063
Brass 70% copper, 30% zinc 1.220
Copper 3.937
Gold 2.913
Iron .669
Lead .343
Magnesium 1.575
Molybdenum 1.299
Monel .197
Nickel .906
Platinum .734
Silver 4.173
Stainless Steel-321 .146
Stainless Steel-410 .240
Steel, low carbon .669
Tin .630
Titanium .157
Tungsten 1.969
Zinc 1.024

[6502kid]

Does anybody make a solid silver HS ?

[JaY_III]

Originally posted by 6502kid
Does anybody make a solid silver HS ?

I have seen a solid silver waterclock, was a sprial block....
but its not worth the money for the little gain over copper, and a big hole in your pocket book.

[grunjee]

Originally posted by 6502kid
Does anybody make a solid silver HS ?

Back in the day I got a NoiseControl Silverado afer Tom declared it the king of HSF's in 3 straight shootouts (I think it was 3) ... this was when I had a P3/866 which at the time was among the better chips you could buy.

Anyway the thing's base had a chunk of solid silver that weighed... I want to say 500g, don't hold me to that, but it was massive.

It was a great HSF then but I doubt it could do much for today's AMD chips.

[CrashOveride]

i actualyl belivce silversinkssam has made soem or mad e silver hybrid sink, or was that some1 else sam? :D :eh?: :D

[Nico3k]

interesting...
i wonder how good a glass waterblock would be

[dxiw]

hmm...I got the best extreme cooler ever....

you make a diamond hollow box with a hole for direct die and fill up the box sealed with helium 2 (only 100000)..then cool the diamond box with a few pelts on the outside.....now that would be nice :)

anyways though..I dont think inudstrial diamond is that expensive I think that it would be a cool proj too build a diamond waterblock for around 100-150$. got any ideas SSS? how about a fine design like with an hsf but sealit so water can run through....

[dxiw]

Originally posted by Nico3k
interesting...
i wonder how good a glass waterblock would be

glass conducts at 1.1-1.2 if your looking for a fried chip have fun:)

[dxiw]

Originally posted by grunjee
Hmmm. I was hoping to gain some enlightenment in this thread, but instead have decided to stick with my Maze2.

dont be a party pooper lol

[Pcmod]

Umm how in the world would you shape the diamond????

[RoadWarrior]

Oh easy, just make a female mould and have superman press a lump of coal into it for you. ;)

[Skulemate]

Originally posted by dxiw
you make a diamond hollow box with a hole for direct die and fill up the box sealed with helium 2 (only 100000)..then cool the diamond box with a few pelts on the outside.....now that would be nice :)

Yeah, right... it says on that link that for helium to be that conductive it has to be below 2.2K... that's pretty damn cold... at that temperature I believe the helium would be a superfluid as well. If you were to get liquid helium, why not just let it evaporate? It'd be colder than liquid nitrogen...

[JFettig]

actually im thinking of getting a diamond plate and putting it on a waterblock as the base.. kinda how the swifty is, but i have ideas of my own for the design, but were to get them and how much?

[neo86]

Carbon nanotubes aren't listed, but they are even better than diamonds.

Unfortunatley, you need few trillion to make anything useless, and they will probably slip in between the cracks screwing up your processor.

[Penguin4x4]

Originally posted by neo86
Carbon nanotubes aren't listed, but they are even better than diamonds.

And when used as a transistor, are faster than silicone. :D

[Stedeman]

Originally posted by Penguin4x4


And when used as a transistor, are faster than silicone. :D Don't forget that carbon nanotubes are bullet proof too (awesome for those days where you want to bring you box out side and blow a few holes in it, it may just save your cpu) :eek:

[dxiw]

Originally posted by Pcmod
Umm how in the world would you shape the diamond????

thats ez...just use another diamond...like the diamond dremel cutting wheel....

[RoadWarrior]

I was just wondering what other crystalline structures would be thermally conductive. So went looking around. Seems Ruby is meant to be very conductive at low temperatures, bad at high temperatures, 20C figures don't look good, didn't know whether "low temperatures" meant subzero, cryogenic, or ultra cryogenic. Anyhoo, for people with low temp setups it might be worth investigating.

Silicon Carbide, or synthetic moissanite as it is often known also may be worth investigating. It is very diamond like in structure, and is classed almost as an element in that the structure is very strong and regular more like an element than a compound. I am finding a very wide range of thermal conductivities for it. Jewellers and gemologists say "The thermal conductivity is so close to diamond that it's hard to tell them apart" other sources say it's between copper and aluminum, and others say that it's around about the value of nickel. So that's darn confusing. If it was near copper even, you'd think that even highly inaccurate thermal conductivity tests that jewellers might use would notice that diamond is 3 times better or so than SiC.

Anyhoo, there's also another crystalline material being touted for IC packaging called AlSiC which is up there near aluminum, dunno what AMD are using now, but they might like to think about that for their CPUs.

So a Ruby slice as a cold plate in a high pressure low temp peltier sandwich might be a viable idea, or might not.

Also an idea with CPUs with heatplates might be to get some real fine silicon carbide grinding powder, and instead of using thermal paste, just mash your sink into the heatspreader, grinding them into each other to get a kind of SiC and metal powder mix mating them. Might work good with a very light dab of boron bearing grease to help stick stuff together a bit.

Well whatever, there might be some interesting crystalline compounds out there to play with. Thermal conductivity charts seem hugely variable for off the wall materials though.

Here's one of them, showing the low value for SiC.

http://www.ai.mit.edu/people/tk/tks/tcon.html


Road Warrior

[aL]

Originally posted by Penguin4x4


And when used as a transistor, are faster than silicone. :D
i used siliconE to seal my block & dont think that it would be used in a transistor. someone tried to put som Carbon nanotubes into a woman??:D

[RoadWarrior]

Hmmm wouldn't silicone transistors, be useful in multivibrator circuits.... .... .... :D :D :D