RD 1066 or 800?

[Keruberne]

Hi Guys

i have a problem rigt now, here DK there is a very long delivery time for RD-1066 ram specially 256mb sticks

So here is the question what is the best thing to do, buy Samsung PC-800 2*256mb and OC them to PC1066? or buy 4*128mb PC-1066 Samsung stick?

Hope u guys can help me

[Johnny Mo]

Depends on your needs.

Are you hoping to overclock your system? (looks around at the junkies gathered around the O/C crackpipe)

If so, what are your system specs??


Johnny Mo

[Keruberne]

I will OC and my specs look closer, and u will se that i have a P4 NW 2.53GHz and a Gigabyte 8IHXP

[thirteen13rulez]

its harder to get 4 ram modules synchronized than to get 2...

[Keruberne]

I still need a answer for my question

[Johnny Knoxville]

Get pc800, the 1066 are priced way too high. You can get 1gb of pc800 for the price of 512mb of 1066.
Also 1200 will be coming sooner or later, which will further rock.

[jarett]

does pc1066 overclock well, if so which brand is BEST for overclocking ?

[Johnny Mo]

Originally posted by Johnny Knoxville
Get pc800, the 1066 are priced way too high. You can get 1gb of pc800 for the price of 512mb of 1066.
Also 1200 will be coming sooner or later, which will further rock.

Look at the speed specs. 35ns is rated at PC1066.
That makes the 32ns "PC1066" Samsung = PC1200.

It's already upon us.

Johnny Mo

[baltoos]

I have 2 sticks of Samsung PC800 256Mb running at 140fsb, which is equivalent to PC1120, with no problems at all. I suggest you get yourself the same! -Dave

[jarett]

which is the best overclocking pc1066 ram out there ?

[mucke]

I think it is samsung. Mine runs fine in 156 fsb x4 on a Asus P4T 533-C.

Mucke.

[FIZZ3]

Originally posted by Johnny Mo


Look at the speed specs. 35ns is rated at PC1066.
That makes the 32ns "PC1066" Samsung = PC1200.

It's already upon us.

Johnny Mo

Not really, just like 7.5ns SDRAM was PC133, but so was 7ns. Not that the 32ns stuff isn't good. =)

[FIZZ3]

Originally posted by Keruberne
Hi Guys

i have a problem rigt now, here DK there is a very long delivery time for RD-1066 ram specially 256mb sticks

So here is the question what is the best thing to do, buy Samsung PC-800 2*256mb and OC them to PC1066? or buy 4*128mb PC-1066 Samsung stick?

Hope u guys can help me

I'd say both having 4 sticks as having to OC PC800 for stock speed are less-than-stellar solutions. The 4 sticks scenario is the lesser of the two evils, but if I were you I'd bite the bullet and order proper PC1066.

Also- why not order online? I like Mushkin (www.mushkin.com) and they ship Internationally within a reasonable timeframe. Yes, they *are* expensive.

[Johnny Mo]

Originally posted by FIZZ3


I'd say both having 4 sticks as having to OC PC800 for stock speed are less-than-stellar solutions. The 4 sticks scenario is the lesser of the two evils, but if I were you I'd bite the bullet and order proper PC1066.

Also- why not order online? I like Mushkin (www.mushkin.com) and they ship Internationally within a reasonable timeframe. Yes, they *are* expensive.

The *new* Mushkin retail Samsung 1066 256mb sticks suck donkey nads.

I just tried two sticks out and they barely do 146x4. Hell, I had those beat from a Feb batch of Sammy 800-45

Jm

[Johnny Mo]

Originally posted by FIZZ3


Not really, just like 7.5ns SDRAM was PC133, but so was 7ns. Not that the 32ns stuff isn't good. =)

I wouldn't go by speed ratings anyhow - look at my "PC800" results.

JM

[jarett]

mucke-

is that the pc 1066 you're running, and are you running it at the default multiplier so its running around 1300 mhz right ?

[FIZZ3]

Originally posted by Johnny Mo


The *new* Mushkin retail Samsung 1066 256mb sticks suck donkey nads.

I just tried two sticks out and they barely do 146x4. Hell, I had those beat from a Feb batch of Sammy 800-45

Jm

Well that can happen. Overclocking is always a game of chance. What I'm suggesting is that by choosing known 'better brand/type' stuff you can increase your chances of success.

Also, more devices per stick = tougher timing. It's always the smallest singlesided sticks that do best initially. But sometimes you need the extra storage space.

[DeviLduck]

Keruberne,
If you're using the 8IHXP, an 850E mobo, don't even consider rdram 800, for any reason.

In my tests, the newest Samsung 256MB 1066-32 rdram (CT9) is about equal to Kingston 256MB 1066-32 rdram, in bandwidth performance.

The 8IHXP board OCs best with memory in slots 1&2 only, using 256 or 512MB modules. Using 128MB modules, OCing will be ok with 4 slots filled, but still not quite as good as only 2 slots filled with mem.

Don't make the mistake of purchasing rdram 1066 that is actually rdram 800 parts. Check for the correct part numbers:
http://www.intel.com/technology/memory/rdram/valid/rmvalid.htm?iid=ipp_850chpst+body_rdram&

Check Threads here:
http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=55

[mucke]

Originally posted by jarett
mucke-

is that the pc 1066 you're running, and are you running it at the default multiplier so its running around 1300 mhz right ?

I have two 128 mb samsung pc 1066 anf it runs at default multiplier= x4.
Too bad that i dont can rase my fsb more. I think my rams
will go higher.

Mucke.

[Johnny Mo]

Originally posted by mucke


I have two 128 mb samsung pc 1066 anf it runs at default multiplier= x4.
Too bad that i dont can rase my fsb more. I think my rams
will go higher.

Mucke.


I bet you could, too. We are all anxiously awaiting BIOS fixes for the TH7-II that would eliminate the inability to run 1066 sticks at 3x mult. From the response one fellow got from Abit, I'm not sitting by the phone - basically "We'll look into it"


Johnny Mo

[Johnny Mo]

Originally posted by FIZZ3


Well that can happen. Overclocking is always a game of chance. What I'm suggesting is that by choosing known 'better brand/type' stuff you can increase your chances of success.

Also, more devices per stick = tougher timing. It's always the smallest singlesided sticks that do best initially. But sometimes you need the extra storage space.


Actually, the Samsung 1066 sticks ARE single sided, just as my PC800 128's are.

Even more, they both share the same device count - 8.

I think it's simply the opposite of your theory above, as many have demonstrated on this board and others, notably at the [H] - that HIGHER device count RAMBUS sticks overclock the best REGARDLESS of the timing. ie. the 40 ns 4-device 128's sucked compared to the 45 ns - 8 device 128's etc.

Johnny Mo

[FIZZ3]

Originally posted by Johnny Mo



Actually, the Samsung 1066 sticks ARE single sided, just as my PC800 128's are.

Even more, they both share the same device count - 8.

I think it's simply the opposite of your theory above, as many have demonstrated on this board and others, notably at the [H] - that HIGHER device count RAMBUS sticks overclock the best REGARDLESS of the timing. ie. the 40 ns 4-device 128's sucked compared to the 45 ns - 8 device 128's etc.

Johnny Mo

The theory behind the timing matter is sound, but in practice it might be that the higher device count sticks are built at a later date and have been optimized otherwise- thus performing better. I took that into account when I said that you'll be most likely to see this effect in the earliest batches of sticks.

So as to sum up the points I made:

1) Samsung should yield better chances of good OC than other brands (kingston).

2) Less devices may mean better chances of a good OC, initially

3) The newer the stick, the better the chances.

[jarett]

does anyone know if componentsdirect.com is a good vendor. they have 256mb samsung 1066mhz ram for $130

[metra]

Is one 512mb 800mhz 32pin significantly better than 2 256mb 800mhz 16 pin? Which one oc better?

[DeviLduck]

jarett,
The memory offering you're referring to is an example of a vendor selling rdram 800 (chips) as rdram 1066! Both Samsung & Kingston have real 16 bit 1066rdram available now.

Check out this post: Reading the Samsung label.
http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=129691

metra,
Your comment: "Is one 512mb 800mhz 32pin significantly better than 2 256mb 800mhz 16 pin? Which one oc better?"

Are you asking about 16 bit 184 pin rdram OR 32 bit 232 pin rdram?

In the case of 16 bit 184 rdram, modules are used in pairs, the answer would be 2X256 rdram 800 OC slightly better than 2X512 rdram 800, if using Samsung rdram 800-45 , for example. The best OCing rdram 800 I found was ECC Samsung rdram 800-45ns.

In the case of 32 bit 232 pin rdram, where appropriate mobos have 3 slots, single modules are ok (as opposed to pairs), the closest comparison would be using RIMM 3200. 1Xrimm 3200 module OCs about the same as 2X3200 modules. Since the number of 32 bit rdram mobos is so limited, this is still an open question.

Finally, there is no evidence that 32 bit rdram is any better or produces higher bandwidth performance, compared to 16 bit rdram. That fact will most likely change, when rdram 1200 & 1333 gets here.

Johnny Mo,
You're correct about the higher device count sticks being better, at least concerning Samsung rdram 800, according to what I've read. The problem is that many variables are at work here & generalizations are difficult. However, with the TH7II board, there's no question that the higher device count memory, OCs better.

FIZZ3,
In general, Samsung has been making the best OCer 16 bit rdram. However, the ("The newer the stick, the better the chances.") comment is definitely off. Memory as you know is produced in batch yields. Although batch yields are specified within "minimum parameters", some yields turn out better (results above specs) than others. That's why, sometimes it's a matter of "luck" to get great performing memory, allowing for better OCing. At times, a certain date yield becomes known as superior. The absolutely latest new sticks are NOT necessarily the best.

[metra]

OK, thanks =]

[yfan]

Originally posted by jarett
does anyone know if componentsdirect.com is a good vendor. they have 256mb samsung 1066mhz ram for $130

componentsdirect.com does NOT look good. Take a look at there reseller rating here. (http://www.resellerratings.com/seller1406-p2.html)

they've had people complaining about rebadged PC800 ram instead of 1066. I never purchase anything from sellers under at least a 7.5 rating on resellerratings.com. THen again, buy stuff from newegg.com and you'll never be sorry

[jarett]

thanks guys, phew..glad i didn't buy from them

[DeviLduck]

The State of PC-1066 RDRAM : Looking Forward

http://www.gamepc.com/labs/view_content.asp?id=stateofpc1066&page=1&bhcp=1&cookie%5Ftest=1

[Johnny Mo]

Originally posted by FIZZ3



So as to sum up the points I made:



2) Less devices may mean better chances of a good OC, initially

3) The newer the stick, the better the chances.

These two are completely wrong, I'm afraid.

My 2001 week 52 Samsung 45 ns PC800 256mb sticks overclock so much better than my 2002 week 42 Samsung 32 ns PC1066 256 mb sticks. Ya know why, fizz?

The old sticks have MORE DEVICES.
Just ask around...the 16 device Sammys are the best overclockers. Yes, even compared to 32 ns 1066 sticks produced 2 weeks ago!

Johnny Mo

[FIZZ3]

Originally posted by Johnny Mo


These two are completely wrong, I'm afraid.

My 2001 week 52 Samsung 45 ns PC800 256mb sticks overclock so much better than my 2002 week 42 Samsung 32 ns PC1066 256 mb sticks. Ya know why, fizz?

The old sticks have MORE DEVICES.
Just ask around...the 16 device Sammys are the best overclockers. Yes, even compared to 32 ns 1066 sticks produced 2 weeks ago!

Johnny Mo

More devices mean more individual chip variances. More devices mean longer trace length. More devices mean more heat.

Your anecdotal evidence is not the holy word. Luck of the draw is a big factor and I do not claim my points have a 100% overruling impact on the real world. The points I made are of theoretical interest and can be a guidance for people looking for a rational method when purchasing new ram. Some other people like to stake their faith in rumour or anecdotal posts or experiences. It seems you are one of the latter.

[Johnny Mo]

Originally posted by FIZZ3


More devices mean more individual chip variances. More devices mean longer trace length. More devices mean more heat.

Your anecdotal evidence is not the holy word. Luck of the draw is a big factor and I do not claim my points have a 100% overruling impact on the real world. The points I made are of theoretical interest and can be a guidance for people looking for a rational method when purchasing new ram. Some other people like to stake their faith in rumour or anecdotal posts or experiences. It seems you are one of the latter.

I'm basing my opinion on DATA, not conjecture.

Just do a search, fizz. Look up on this and the [H] board the RDRAM threads, esp including discussions of 16 device 256 and 8 device 128 sticks. I think you'll realize that I'm not basing my stance on either rumor OR anecdotes.

My experiences with very high clock RDRAM matches that of *foo, tedinde, JCviggen, and many others. Our best overclocks, 170 mhz + have ALL been from greater device 'older' rev 2 RDRAM. The higher density stuff you're going on about is just crap.


Johnny Mo

[FIZZ3]

Originally posted by Johnny Mo


I'm basing my opinion on DATA, not conjecture.

Just do a search, fizz. Look up on this and the [H] board the RDRAM threads, esp including discussions of 16 device 256 and 8 device 128 sticks. I think you'll realize that I'm not basing my stance on either rumor OR anecdotes.

My experiences with very high clock RDRAM matches that of *foo, tedinde, JCviggen, and many others. Our best overclocks, 170 mhz + have ALL been from greater device 'older' rev 2 RDRAM. The higher density stuff you're going on about is just crap.


Johnny Mo

I have given my reasons for what I said. I'll close the discussion with the remark that the Hard forums are The #1 source of unfounded rumour (read the P4T533 thread, and realize how delusional the majority of users there is).
Also note that resorting to name dropping like you did is a hallmark sign of an attempt to increase the relevance of anecdotal evidence. Again, there is nothing wrong with that and I'm not contesting your 'search results', it's just an observation about the method used.

[Johnny Mo]

Originally posted by FIZZ3


I have given my reasons for what I said. I'll close the discussion with the remark that the Hard forums are The #1 source of unfounded rumour (read the P4T533 thread, and realize how delusional the majority of users there is).
Also note that resorting to name dropping like you did is a hallmark sign of an attempt to increase the relevance of anecdotal evidence. Again, there is nothing wrong with that and I'm not contesting your 'search results', it's just an observation about the method used.

'Name dropping' the individuals I spoke of indicates how far out of the norm your opinion is regarding the overclockability of RDRAM. The sum experience of those 3 named people ALONE is tremendous, forget all the other RDRAM users.

Try reading up on all the other people who just happen to agree with me:

http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=91009&highlight=16device


or maybe:

http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=82575&highlight=16device


or perhaps:
http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86190&highlight=16device

I could go on and on, but your wasted argument is boring me.


Oh, and by the way, re your feelings about the [H], I suggest you try reading up in the System Intel forum, you might learn something. Then again, maybe not.


JOhnny Mo

[FIZZ3]

I had already tired of this conversation, but I will return to it to advise you to leave out the aggressive and insultive tone in the future, not only when 'discussing' things with me, but also with others you may encounter. Good luck.

[Doofie27cp2]

i have 256mb of samsung pc800, they seem just fine. I overclocked them to 1080 with no problems at all... So samsung is the way to go...

[Johnny Knoxville]

lol i love that avatar :D

[Johnny Mo]

Originally posted by FIZZ3
I had already tired of this conversation, but I will return to it to advise you to leave out the aggressive and insultive tone in the future, not only when 'discussing' things with me, but also with others you may encounter. Good luck.

And try to entertain the concept of being wrong, you may learn something.