network newbie gotta easy question

[deathstar13]

just added cable router.
seimens router
2x comp's
everything is setup on the internet stuff. both connect fine.

my problem is i cant get the 2 pc's to see each other so i can work between the two. is there a guide? ive read up top,if i missed it point it out please?or mabey tell me what settings i need in the network settings.kinda confusing as its my first time.
im a virgin again! :D

thanks folks!

[Twisted]

are they in the same workgroup?

[deathstar13]

yes, ive got em both listed the same.
my problem is everything before that and other settings.im just lost.but i have my work groups the same.or mabey a wizard of some sort?

[rogerdugans]

Most common mistakes I know of:
Workgroup name- must be the same
subnet- usually 255.255.255.0 on private home lans, etc. Also must be exactly the same
IP address- either DHCP or static. DHCP you should actually HAVE a DHCP Server- if you don't you end up getting M$'s defaults (which are messed up, IMO) If you go with STATIC: the first 3 octets should be 192.168.0 or something similar....and must be exactly the same on both computers. The last digit will be different, ie: 192.168.0.1 and 192.168.0.2, subnet 255.255.255.0 and workgroup home.

The last common error is.....is file sharing enabled and have you shared files on both computers?

Hopefully something in that list will fix it:)

EDIT- AVOID THE WIZARDS!!! I hate those things- they screw me up every time!

[deathstar13]

ok as i look in my winipcfg im getting differant ip address showing for the 2 pc's? not sure how to get em same. this looks like my problem tho.

[ronin1967]

I can help I have done this on several machine with firewalls and with different OS's.

What are the OS's on each of the machines?
Do they have firewalls installed?

AND WHATEVER YOU DO, DON"T RUN ANY OF THE WIZARDS!!!

[deathstar13]

ok sorry so long to get back. went to see my kids :D
anyhow 98se on both.
firewalls are zonealarm.
i can deactivate em i think my router has firewall it says. havent tested it tho. or seen anything about it. but seimens site said it was activated. ill go to grc.com soon tho.

ive saw about vnc. this seems what im kinda aimen for.except i dont want to go over the internet for my machines to connect. any way without vnc?

[ronin1967]

I just want to make sure I understand everything before we continue:

You have 2 machines connected to a cable router, the router is I assume so both machines can share the highspeed connection. If I understand correctly both machines connect to the router just fine, and both enjoy the bandwidth. You want to network the two machines so they can share files, game, or share resources(printers, etc...). Both machines run Windows 98SE

Right so far?

[deathstar13]

yes correctomundo :D
broadband on both is fine.
but pc's seem to not see each other or share.
ronin i really appreciate the help! thank you!

[su root]

If you are using a cable router, there is no need for software firewalls. I suggest you get rid of them, they are one of your problems. The router provides a firewall by default.

If not, you need to go into the ZA setup, and put your network connection into the "Trusted" zone. You need to do this on both computers.

Then, you need to check to see that "File & Printer Sharing" is installed, so go into the RightClick/Properties of Network Neighborhood, and check that that is listed, if not, add it. (it should be there kuz you can see the other computer). You need to do this on both computers.

Then, you need to share a folder or drive or printer. Go to something that you want to share on your network. Right click/Sharing..., Select "Share this folder", give it a name, and access permissions (if you want to change it, give it read&write permissions and set a password.) You always want to set a password.

Then everything should work. :D

[deathstar13]

yeh i killed the zonealarm. i uninstalled and it took a vxd file with it. grrrrrrr do i reinstalled and not runnning it.

i do have the file and printer sharing and its checked.
ok when windows boots it asks for network name? and password.
i have no pass. and the name is correct. bit i get a error stating no domain server to verify the pass.

also i went and tried to enable the sharing on the drives.it was enabled prior but changed and now its asking for who to add sharing with. well i get another arror stating "no lists avaulble check later"?

any ideas?

[ronin1967]

I will do my best, some of what I type will be redundant, so ignore it if you have done those steps already...

On Start menu - click settings - control panel.
Double click on Network.
You need these 3 things besides your Network adapter.
1. Client for Microsoft Networks
2. TCP/IP
3. File and Printer sharing for Microsoft Networks
***anything else could cause trouble***
To Install them click add. You will see four items(Client, Adapter, Protocol, and Service)
You will find Client for Microsoft Networks under Client - Microsoft, TCP-IP under Protocols, and File and Printer sharing for Microsoft Networks under service. You have to add them one by one. After you see all of them in the box click OK. It will copy some files from your Windows 98SE installation CD. If it stops and asks to overwrite on newer versions, click no. After installing some files it will ask you to restart. You have to restart, love that Microsoft...

After that:

On Start menu - click settings - control panel.
Double click on Network.

Click on the Identification Tab.
There are 3 fields here, Computer Name, Workgroup, and Computer Description, shorter is better, I use:

Computer Name: CAS1 and CAS2 for my two machines
Workgroup: WORKGROUP(must be the same on both machines)
Computer Description: NONE1 and NONE2(real creative)

After that click on the Configuation tab and on the File and Print Sharing button...

Make sure all the options are checked and click OK and Ok again to close Network Properties. Once again it will ask you to resart, do it...

You have to do this on both machines...

Once you have this done on both machines, then we need to setup sharing...

Pick a folder on each machine to share. Right click on it, then click Sharing...

In the Sharing Tab, click Shared As: then type in a name

do that on both machines...then once each machine has a shared folder(of course you could selct more later) then we have to establish how they see them...

Double click the Network Neighborhood icon on your desktop.
Click on Entire Network
Click on Workgroup name
Click on the name of a computer yuo want to connect to
If you want to look at the folder temorarily just click on it, if you want to share it permantly MAp the network drive.

To Map the drive right click on the folder and chose Map Network Drive.
Then assign a drive letter and also put the check in reconnect at logon.

Then to browse it go to my computer and you will see the new network drive...

This is the text book way to do this, we may have ot paly around with some setting in TCP/IP, but we might get licky, give thsi a shot.

I will be here all night if you need more help...

[deathstar13]

ok i got to the part were i set up sharing a file. i cant finish it becouse it starts looking for a list of who can share it. then gat error saying "no list at this time,check back later"
this isnt the original sharing box i saw i had before.the other one let me mark as shared.dont know what ive changed.

also i clicked the network icon on desktop. its all blank. thats a bad thing im sure :(

[deathstar13]

ok i need to add this. on my second pc i clicked network icon it shows both pc's and entire network .

main pc is blank when i click it.




"edit" now i can see the intire network icon on main pc. but says"unable to browse network,its not accesable"
this is the problem i believe as my second pc sees the first. but cant browse it since its the above error.

[ronin1967]

first thing we need to do is restart both machines, than when it asks for a username and password, unless you entered one, just click OK. Then windows should load up. At that point we should see Network Neighborhood on both desktops, click it to open, then see if you can see Entire Network, then the Workgroup, and finally the individual computers in the workgroup, both should be there...

let see how that goes, then we will work from there...

[deathstar13]

ok i did a reboot. look above i edited it. now i lost the pc's listed on my second pc. i just have the error i stated above on both now.

[deathstar13]

wooooooooooohooooooooo finally! ty ty ty ronin and the others who helped :D:D:D im in!

seems i had access set to user level.not shared. duh
wow so many stupid settings. its no wonder i gave up hacking a year ago.

any advice to test the firwall status of the router? ill leave zonelarms off if i can trust it.

[ronin1967]

once again just another fine example of Microsoft Newtorking at it's best...

just to make sure we have nothing in conflict I need you to remove any unrelated items from Networking.

You should have Client for Microsoft Networks, your NIC card, TCP/IP, File and Print Sharing for Microsoft Networks, and nothing else...

check that on both machines

[deathstar13]

yes its exactly as u just said. i deleted anything but the 4 items.

i am kinda concerned about the firewall thing. grc.com shields up is down.lol thats kinda funny.

prolly got hacked :)
anyhow i just set em both as trusted zone.but thats the internet zone and i have to mark as trusted? dont see how that will block anything. got a site other than grc i can test on?


"edit" found scan at sygate.com.
im really suprised but the scan was exaclt they same wether or not zonelarm was on. showed 2 times my pc reprted but the ports were closed ,so im safe but not hidden. i think the zonealarm with marking the network as safe is basically marking the internet as safe.

so byby zonealarm! thanks ronin

[ronin1967]

don't worry once we have this figures out we will have your firewall back up, of course if it is a router, and not a switch or a hub, then you are protected by it...so you are safe...

let's go ahead and assign each of the machines it's own IP address:

Start
Control Panel
Network
Click TCP/IP
Click Properties
Select IP Adress tab
Click Specify an IP address
Enter 192.168.000.005 for IP Adress on one machine and 192.168.000.007 for the other
Enter 255.255.255.000 for Subnet mask on both machines.

Click oK, keep clicking ok until you are out of Network, it will make you restart, go ahead, then when you do try this again:

asks for a username and password, unless you entered one, just click OK. Then windows should load up. At that point we should see Network Neighborhood on both desktops, click it to open, then see if you can see Entire Network, then the Workgroup, and finally the individual computers in the workgroup, both should be there...

[deathstar13]

well they both do have differant ip's.
and i do get all the functions u stated in the network.

should i still go mess with it?

[ronin1967]

sorry I was also helping someone setup a network...

where did we leave off, are you able to connect to the internet from each machine? did assigning IP's allow the two machines to share files?

[deathstar13]

i was able to share internet no problem earlier.both accessed on thier own with differant ip's
just the pc's didnt see each other.
well you were vary helpfull to me.this is one area i really hate becouse its all microsoft settings and it can be really confusing.

[ronin1967]

I am glad I was able to help, just not sure I did, you can still connect to the internet from both machines, but were you able to setup file sharing across them?

[deathstar13]

no i couldnt file share. that was the problem .niether saw each other. was in the network settings tho was were the problems were.it would almost be impossable with all the combinations of stuff to have any kinda guide written id think.

[ronin1967]

assuming each machine has it's own IP, have you tired to ping one from the other?

[deathstar13]

umm no i havent. but i can access both and transfer files.
they do have differant ip's i even double checked when i tested the firewall stuff. as it gives your ip it sees

the ip syfgate reported wasnt either machine tho.thats good!

[su root]

Wow.. this has been a busy thread.. I'm glad you got it working, here's a few pointers though:

You can install a client in your network neighborhood properties called "Client for Family Logons" or something like that, and change the "Logon Manager" dropdown box to that. That will get rid of the Network logon boxes at startup, w/o comprimising windows 98's security (*caughLOLcaugh*) :D

The software firewalls won't do any good, they'll just cause you more problems than anything. If they are set to "internet zone", then it will reject any incomming request. If they are set to "trusted zone", then they will reject any incomming request except for file transfer. Your router will reject any incomming packet, no matter what it is, from the internet, unless you specifically requested it, ie: asking for a webpage. (or changed the router's config).

You may consider upgrading from windows 98 in the future, windows 2000 and XP provide better security, more reliability, etc, etc. Unfortunately, their networking is more complex, but their network connections are auto-setup correctly most of the time. Just a thought :)

[deathstar13]

yup im sure xp isnt far away in my future.
right now im always reconfiguring my suystems and swapping hdd's so i dont feel like messing with the hassle of buying a bunch of copys of xp.then activating em,every time reinstall.

but its coming to the point where all my hardware is almost all purchased for my 2 main rigs.mabey a 3rd added later since i have alot of parts.
for some reason zonealarm is being a large pain in my A$$.
when i uninstall it it takes a vxd file with it. then i get boot errors.and now since ive had to reinstall it back to fix the error, it wont come out of my mscnfg settings.cant even change it in ZA preferances.any ideas? mabey a registry deletion in order?

[DDR-PIII]

why not get xp pro.... you dont need to activate and its much better IMO

[ronin1967]

I agree XP would make certain things simplier, but where is the changelle, plus we all know 98SE is capable of doing what he wants, just a matter of figuring it out...I have to admit it is killing me that I can't figure out why...

but I haven't quit yet!