Ripped off? [Archive] - Overclockers Forums

Paazabel

01-16-03, 02:13 PM

Before I get on the phone and RIP someone a new aperature, I need your help.

I ordered a Powercolor 9700 Pro from an on-line shop. I *think* I received a 9700 ... how can I tell the difference between them? I'm running Windows XP, and the driver comes up with "9700" ...

What can I do to make certain it is or is not the card I ordered? 9700 Pro owners -- does your driver say 9700 PRO?

pip

01-16-03, 02:20 PM

download rage 3d tweak, go into settings advanced, then the overclock tab, and if it runs at 325/310 you have a 9700 pro, if 275,270 you got ripped off

Paazabel

01-16-03, 02:40 PM

297/263.3 ...

I'm about to be upset.

PhobMX

01-16-03, 03:31 PM

RMA it right away before you get yourself to jail...

Paazabel

01-16-03, 03:41 PM

FYI ... this was a Pricewatch site. www.pcpart4less.com I'll be sure to let you all know how it gets resolved ...

flounder43

01-16-03, 03:51 PM

You do need to understand that there are differences between a third party manufacturer, like Powercolor, and a "Made by ATI" video card. Third party manufacturers do use ATI graphics chips and put them on their own boards, with their own configurations, and sometimes, the speeds are not the same.

I went to that website, and found a videocard called a "PowerColor ATI Radeon 9700 Gold 128MB 8X AGP Video Card". Is that what you ordered? If so, it is very possible you will not have the same specs as if you had ordered a "Made by ATI 9700 Pro". In fact, that card says "Gold" not "Pro".

Paazabel

01-16-03, 04:15 PM

http://www.mr-bandwidth.com/files/PCPart4Less-1.jpg

Gold? This is what I ordered ... I don't see the word gold, anywhere.

The driver in XP says, "Radeon 9500/9700" ... wouldn't it say "Pro" if the card was pro? The clock speed is one sign, but, like Flounder says, this being an OEM, who knows what speed it may run at.

I want to know how to tell between 9700 and 9700 Pro. I paid more for the latter, and therefore want my money's worth. Surely, there must be a way ...

Paazabel

01-16-03, 04:26 PM

Oh, and as far as off brands are concerned, I looked around quite a bit before doing so. Everything I've seen indicates that they had same or better performance and that all of them are similar in performance for OC'ing. The last nail in the coffin was Tom's Hardware roundup of several 9700 Pro based cards, essentially affirming the anecdotal evidince I'd already collected. After I read that article, I essentially figured I had no reason to spend the extra $$$.

http://www.tomshardware.com/graphic/20021104/index.html

flounder43

01-16-03, 04:33 PM

I saw another card that was the gold, not yours....anyway, that site does need to be more careful, some of their labeling is a little misleading...in one place they call the card you ordered a Powercolor, in another place, an ATI 9700 PRO.

http://www.pcpart4less.com/product/vcrdn00022.html

compare

http://www.pcpart4less.com/product/vcrdn002x1.html

augustwest

01-16-03, 05:02 PM

flounder those are 2 different cards. look at the product number.

Paazabel

01-16-03, 05:02 PM

Well, so far, I'm not very happy. First, there was no shipping notice and I sent an e-mail asking when they were going to ship. The next day, I was told that it shipped on the 10th. Now, I have sent e-mail and left voicemail, but I have yet to hear back from them.

The good news is that I used PayPal, so if I don't get some satisfaction, I am not embarrassed to make a scene ...

flounder43

01-16-03, 05:19 PM

Originally posted by augustwest
flounder those are 2 different cards. look at the product number.

Look at the pics...they are the same. Exactly. Even the sticker on the fan is in the same position.

Evnas

01-16-03, 05:49 PM

Originally posted by Paazabel
The driver in XP says, "Radeon 9500/9700" ... wouldn't it say "Pro" if the card was pro? The clock speed is one sign, but, like Flounder says, this being an OEM, who knows what speed it may run at.

The drivers for all 9500/9700 cards say "9500/9700 series".

And it sounds like u got one of those 9700 "TX' versions. Ive seen more then one person get the Powercolor and end up with that. Powercolor seems to be a really ****ty 3rd party to buy.

PhobMX

01-16-03, 08:30 PM

hell i know, my gried gf3 was powercolor :rolleyes:

Paazabel

01-16-03, 10:43 PM

So, the moral of the story is, return it, fork out the extra $30 for the ATI and fuggedabowtit ...

organicker

01-17-03, 11:07 AM

If you look at the powercolor website one of their cards is listed as:

ATI Radeon 9700 Pro 128MB DDR DVI+CRT+TV AGP 8X
(XF97-C3 )Lite Version

Notice the "lite version". This is a 9700 Pro based card but has a default clock speed of 297. It looks like this is the 9700 Pro you got.

Paazabel

01-17-03, 07:13 PM

This is why I love these forums. You guys ROCK ...

So far, only an e-mail response from the reseller. They say that they shipped a "Pro", so (before reading this message), I responded asking for an exchange for the legit ATI 9700 Pro. I told them the dollar difference wasn't worth the performance hit and that I would pay the difference.

We'll see ... I may just have to overclock the crap out of it. ;)

Rav

01-17-03, 10:08 PM

This company isn't even listed on Reseller Ratings. I would NEVER buy from a company I didn't have reason to trust. Its not worth it for the few bucks you save for going with the cheapest one on pricewatch or whatever. The peace of mind that I know I'll get what I ordered from Newegg et al and not have a problem RMA'ing or anything else. Hope it all works out for you!

-Rav

Paazabel

01-18-03, 09:53 AM

I dunno ... I'd say I've come out ahead over the years. This is only the third time I've had to return / had an issue with what I ordered. At the end of the day, it's my own fault for not digging a little deeper into the PowerColor card.

I've used Pricewatch for years, and I probably build 5 to 10 PC's a year for myself, relatives, friends, and so on. This was also a PayPal site, so that made it attractive to me. I do all my on-line transactions via PayPal (I have a PayPal Mastercard for those sites that don't take it, which is linked to my accout!).

Anyway, I'll keep ya posted on how they handle this.

Also, all the rest of my parts came in, much to my surprise! I wasn't expecting my motherboard for another two weeks. My case is sitting in my brother-in-law's shop, and we are going to mod it for water cooling (duct work for a shroud and mounting for the other stuff) and then he's going to repaint it. So, when I found the motherboard had arrived yesterday, I was stunned. Of course, I couldn't wait, so I snagged my power supply and other parts and I have it all set up on a telephone book at the moment ...

Haven't played with it much, but so far, it seems rock solid at 10.5x200. It's a 2400+ on an 8RDA+. Once XP figures out the rest of the components, I'll be seeing how far it'll go. Makes me wish I had just sucked it up and paid the extra for the ATI up front ... since I could have it all running, now!

Oh, well ...

mcennis3

01-18-03, 12:50 PM

I always post this site for good deals but I'm having a bad experience that has made me leary of it. I ordered the 9700pro (core325/memory310) and it was actually the slower model that I received (297/263)...it took a few days before they finally agreed with me and gave me an RMA for the refund including shipping. I just checked my MasterCard and it has not been credited. After calling, I was told that it would be 30 days+ before they issued credit! ...now I'm looking at 6 weeks from the time I ordered it to the time I get a refund. :x ...Since I made a couple of dozen posts recommending www.internetIshop.com I thought I should post this experience too.

Mystikal

01-18-03, 03:41 PM

Paazabel, the card that you got is in fact a 9700 "non pro". Powercolor calls that a 9700 gold you can see the spec page Here (http://www.cptech.com.tw/powercolor/web/product_inside.asp?prd_id=Radeon9700XR97-C3) And as for the www.pcpart4less.com they classafied it s a 9700 pro so infact you should have gotten a pro version or you could slap them with a false adv. suit.

Paazabel

01-18-03, 08:29 PM

So far, no response. I agree, it's not a pro, but we'll see how they handle it. If I don't have some action in a few days, I'll take it up with PayPal ...

Redrum

01-19-03, 07:45 PM

Originally posted by Paazabel
297/263.3 ...

I'm about to be upset.

Thats a PowerColor Pro OEM. And I don't know how they can get away with saying its a pro. I bought one too and I'm sending it back tomorrow. I called PowerColor and asked about this card and they confirmed its clocked much slower. InFineon 3.6ns memory on it. Mine has an ATI 102 number on it and says Made By ATI.

Computer Specs (http://www.redrumone.netfirms.com/)

Paazabel

01-21-03, 04:52 PM

Update: So far, the reseller, PCPART4LESS, has not been cooperative. I explained that a PowerColor 9700 Gold is not a 9700 PRO, as advertised by their web site. I offered to pay for shipping to swap the cards, but this was met with a 15% "restocking fee." That translates to a $41 charge to get the "right" card.

My most recent letter to them explains that their website advertises a 9700 Pro, but I did not receive a pro. It is not fault the part needs to be restocked and their web site should say 9700 Gold. I sent them links to the PowerColor website, showing and explaining the difference between their "Gold" and "Pro" cards.

krag

01-21-03, 06:45 PM

Man bro, that sucks bad! Almost the same thing happened to me but it was over a "Made by ATI" & "Powered by ATI" oem card. It was advertised on pricewatch.com as a Made by but after I made the purchase and started looking a little deeper on their website in the fine print it said "OEM" THe place was ocsystems.com. When I saw the problem I immediately called them and cancled the order WWheeewwwww! They alowed me to do it thank God! So I just ordered a retail ATI 9700 Pro from newegg for a little more. It seems to me that there has been quite a bit of the "ol' bait & switch" going on around hardware sites.

Evnas

01-21-03, 07:15 PM

Originally posted by krag
Man bro, that sucks bad! Almost the same thing happened to me but it was over a "Made by ATI" & "Powered by ATI" oem card. It was advertised on pricewatch.com as a Made by but after I made the purchase and started looking a little deeper on their website in the fine print it said "OEM" THe place was ocsystems.com. When I saw the problem I immediately called them and cancled the order WWheeewwwww! They alowed me to do it thank God! So I just ordered a retail ATI 9700 Pro from newegg for a little more. It seems to me that there has been quite a bit of the "ol' bait & switch" going on around hardware sites.

Theres no difference at all between a retail or OEM 9700 Pro...ur card would have come just fine. The only card that offers crap clock speeds is the Powercolor Gold version.

krag

01-21-03, 11:02 PM

Originally posted by Evnas

Theres no difference at all between a retail or OEM 9700 Pro...ur card would have come just fine. The only card that offers crap clock speeds is the Powercolor Gold version.

Oh but there is a difference. The OEM cards do not carry the "3 year hassle free manufacturer's warrenty." And from what I have read around the forums here and at rage3d for the last three weeks, there have been "some" issues with "some" OEM cards.

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=33661092&highlight=9700+Pro+OEM

Don't get me wrong here. I am not saying that all oem cards are bad. What I have deduced from my research before I bought the card is that there are a lot more problems with oem cards than "built by" cards.

Besides....the main reason why I bought this particular "built by" is because of the warrenty!!!!

Yeah...I do love my 9700 Pro! The first time I loaded a game with it I noticed a HUGE DIFFERENCE in pic quality & performance over my ti-4600......Yaaaaahoooooooooo1

Paazabel

01-21-03, 11:04 PM

Correct. After letting my anger settle and sifting through what happened, the PCPart4Less web store advertised a PowerColor Radeon 9700 Pro. If I had received this card, I would be smiling and happily going about voiding my warranty ...

However, when I got the card, I was suspicious because the word "pro" didn't appear anywhere. Not in the drivers, not in the documentation, only on the invoice. By using Rage 3D Tweak, I was able to tell the clock speed, and then I got kinda ****ed. Turns out, the web site is shipping PowerColor Gold to people who buy the PowerColor Pro.

This is wrong, it is THEIR mistake, not mine.

mattspalace

01-22-03, 08:34 AM

I only use three internet based companies for my computer component needs.

1. Newegg - these guys are simply the best hands down. I've given newegg close to a grand in the past year, and I've been totally happy. The only thing I would have a very minor complaint about is the Fedex Express saver shipping. A couple of times, I've not seen my product for ~10 days - but for "free" I can't complain too much.

2. TCWO.com - Ordered my WD 80GB SE drive and Mushkin RAM from them. It was my first order, and I was very pleased. Product shipped the same day, and I save two dollars over newegg!! They don't have quite the selection that newegg has, but sometimes their components are a couple bucks cheaper. Also got free Fedex from them too. I kinda went out on a limb with these guys, but I did my homework before I ordered. Always a smart thing to do. A friend of mine was very pleased with them as well.

3. Google.com - Google is my last choice only because they take so long to process orders. Other than that, they offer good service. Some are very pleased with them.

I would stay away from about 75 percent of the online retailers listed on pricewatch. Do yourself a favor and pay the extra four or five dollars for piece of mind. If you're willing to save 1 or 2 percent of the cost compared to a reputable retailer, you need to re-evaluate your priorites.