Prometeia-I or Mach II? Worth my extra $400?

Fushyuguru · Jun 16, 2003

Recently Ive just come into the market for a phase change cooler. Ive always been fond of the Prommy but when I went to browse the chip con site today, Low and Behold! Theres a new Prommy out. MachII.

So I looked up the prices, $1000. Ouch. Worse than the old prommy.

Ive been talkin with some folks over at Bowmans site www.phase-change.com and Id like to get some input from a larger audience.

So any of you guys with prommies, you think its worth an extra $400-500 for an extra 10-15 deg C lower temps, improved computer and software upgrades?

Will it be that much of a difference in your opinion between overclocks from a Prommy-I and a MachII?

Couldnt I gain some ground between a Prommy-I and a MachII just by charging the Prommy-I with R404?

Thanks forum!

EDIT: I forgot to ask about condensation. Is it such a problem with the first prommy that the revisions to the anti-condensation engineering in the MachII would make a large difference. I want to know where the extra $$ is going.

Dissolved · Jun 16, 2003

So far everyone person that bought the mach2 has gotten not a much better overclock then the first model. So i would NOT get the mach2 unless you want it for bragging rights and to waste money.

you can get a mach1 and a 9800pro or a 5900ultra for the price of a mach2.

So think about it?

Fushyuguru · Jun 16, 2003

Thats pretty much the response i would expect.

I can't see getting much of a difference out of 15deg C head temp (thats not cpu temp, probably more like 5 deg cpu temp drop). The upgradable software is intrigueing (sp?), but i doubt worth $400.

I really would like to hear about any condensation issues though.

Also, do prommy-I's come with the computer controlled heaters for the socket?

NiTrO bOiE · Jun 16, 2003

Dissolved summed it all up. Mach II is for bragging rights. Get you a first version or Mach I, you will still have $500 left over to upgrade.

Fushyuguru · Jun 16, 2003

sweet. btw, this will go to use in a new workstation whose purpose will be nothing but number crunching (ie 1E100+ matrices and fourier transforms for advanced signal processing and data manipulation).

bragging doesnt matter. just buck vs performance.

still, would like to know about condensation and heaters. (sorry if im pushing this thread, need to buy in next week).

Ge|atinousFury · Jun 16, 2003

I would also like to know about condensation issues with the Mach I compared with condensation issues with the Mach II. I was planning on buying a Mach II this Summer (not because cooler temps, but because of the other upgrades), but I am open to opinions that could have an effect on my final decision on whether I buy the Mach I\II

Dissolved · Jun 16, 2003

AFAIK, the mach2 uses a lil better compressor, lcd, software and the mounting is a tad better.

Condenstation wise, youd want to protect the cpu Zif socket with neophreme(sp?), and slicon. but other then that you should be fine.

Heaters shouldnt stress the compressor much as long as the amibent temps dont change much. if its like 50F and you run the heater and make it 75F it might heat the compressor up a bit fast. but as long as the compressor doesnt over heat, Then you should be fine

Fushyuguru · Jun 17, 2003

The heaters i was refering to are the ones that chip-con makes to put on the backside of the cpu socket (5watt i believe). They are controlled by the prommy computer as far as i know to combat condensation.

But its easy enough for me to use dialectric grease to make an air tight socket though.

Ge|atinousFury · Jun 19, 2003

What makes me like the Mach II is the new SMD chip controller with internet upgradeable firmware and software. I like the idea of my Prometia firmware being upgradeable. Especially since the SMD chip controller controls "the entire system operations and performance" (as stated on Chip-Con's website).

I've looked on the forum and I dont think this topic has been discussed yet. Does the SMD chip controller and it's upgradeability justify the price of the Mach II?

Cúchulainn · Jun 19, 2003

$400+ for upgradeable firm/software is a laugh imo. My prommy v1 does everything just as advertised and has been running 24/7 crunching for nearly half a year now. Starts up at the specified temp, fans go on and off as I've set them, etc. I can't really see what advantage the upgradeability would offer.

Fushyuguru · Jun 19, 2003

Cúchulainn said:
$400+ for upgradeable firm/software is a laugh imo. My prommy v1 does everything just as advertised and has been running 24/7 crunching for nearly half a year now. Starts up at the specified temp, fans go on and off as I've set them, etc. I can't really see what advantage the upgradeability would offer.

After talking to countless people and weighing the pro's cons of the Mach 2 (namely -- new upgrades vs. price [$400 bucks!])....

I think I'll go with a Prommy I. Pulling sub -30 deg C or more cooling and costing a little more than a full system, quality water cooler, that seems like a deal to me. Shelling out the downpayment to a car lease for a Prommy I with *glitter* on it. Thats just retarded.

Plus I can already think of some upgrades to the Prommy I that would tickle my gray-matter. I'd be weary to do it to a $1k+ cooling unit:

- splice in an R-parts subcooler for increased phase cycle efficiency.
- recharge the system with R404 and customizing the fill to get the max lowest temps.

Ge|atinousFury · Jun 19, 2003

On the FAQ on Chip-Con's website, there is a question about a video card cooler and, if made, it's ability to add-on to existing Prometia systems. They say it's "a possibility" and that they have several projects in development.

I wonder if the upgrades will only be available to add on to the Mach II because of the software/firmware add on to the SMD chip........

Right when I've almost decided to order a Prometia I, an idea like this hits me and I start wondering what if

lol

NiTrO bOiE · Jun 19, 2003

Ge|atinousFury said:
What makes me like the Mach II is the new SMD chip controller with internet upgradeable firmware and software. I like the idea of my Prometia firmware being upgradeable. Especially since the SMD chip controller controls "the entire system operations and performance" (as stated on Chip-Con's website).

I've looked on the forum and I dont think this topic has been discussed yet. Does the SMD chip controller and it's upgradeability justify the price of the Mach II?

You could do the same with a Vapochill. Just doesn't have the windows interface though. Also I doubt you will need to change the settings that often.

Ge|atinousFury · Jun 19, 2003

So far I haven't gotten any advice whatsoever to get a Mach II, so as of now I'm just going to get a Mach I in a month or so when I have the money.

Can the Mach I be purchased with a LCD screen like the Mach II?

Fushyuguru · Jun 19, 2003

Ge|atinousFury said:
So far I haven't gotten any advice whatsoever to get a Mach II, so as of now I'm just going to get a Mach I in a month or so when I have the money.

Can the Mach I be purchased with a LCD screen like the Mach II?

I think it just has the Temp screen and thats it. The Mach II basiclly has new LCD controller on the board so without the controller, I dont think you can use it.

Fushyuguru · Jun 19, 2003

Also, about vid card cooler. Th best thing about a prommy is that it doesnt take up case space. So that leaves room to water cool your chipset and vid card, maybe add a TEC or IceProbe (http://www.coolworksinc.com/iceprobe.htm) ... SOOO many options. I love it.

Ge|atinousFury · Jun 19, 2003

Fushyuguru said:
I think it just has the Temp screen and thats it.

Does this come standard?

Fushyuguru · Jun 19, 2003

every one ive seen has a temperature display on the front.

with the Mach II you have a temp display but you can also have it display system info (like a Matrix Orbital screen) or buy a screen with a different color. More *glitter* and hype I think.

NiTrO bOiE · Jun 19, 2003

Fushyuguru said:
Also, about vid card cooler. Th best thing about a prommy is that it doesnt take up case space. So that leaves room to water cool your chipset and vid card, maybe add a TEC or IceProbe (http://www.coolworksinc.com/iceprobe.htm) ... SOOO many options. I love it.

Neither does the Vapo. It's mounted in a seperate compartment.

Dissolved · Jun 20, 2003

Ge|atinousFury said:
On the FAQ on Chip-Con's website, there is a question about a video card cooler and, if made, it's ability to add-on to existing Prometia systems. They say it's "a possibility" and that they have several projects in development.

I wonder if the upgrades will only be available to add on to the Mach II because of the software/firmware add on to the SMD chip........

Right when I've almost decided to order a Prometia I, an idea like this hits me and I start wondering what if lol

That wont happen for a few years. making a phase change to cool 2 objects from one compressor is near impossible, But it has been done. seeing the prommys use small compressors and r134, theres not enough cooling power to too a fast cpu and gpu w/o bringing the temps down alot, or theyd have to upgrade there refrigerent and/or compressor

Prometeia-I or Mach II? Worth my extra $400?

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