Pencil Trick Fried My CPU!!! PLS HELP!

[BigAir]

I did the pencil trick on my 1ghz T-Bird, plugged it in and the first screen came on and then a black screen with a small white line at the top left corner like in DOS. From then on, when I power it on there is no picture and the CPU is hot as hell. I am scared that it will ruin my Epox 8kta3 mainboard, If that possible? I took rubbing alcohol and removed the pencil marks and the CPU still does the same thing. The L1 Bridges were connected correctly and not crossed etc. Is there a possibility that my CPU is ok? Is it my maiboard that is the problem? I cleared the bios via the bios clear jumper and the battery. Still no go. What should I do? Please help!

[Metaxas]

Its too bad that you people have the learn the hard way..

PENCIL LEAD IS A FREAKING RESISTOR.

You could have also crossed some bridges too. Graphite DOES NOT CONDUCT electricty real well. It has a high resistance factor, and think about those micro electronics, they are having to work that much harder to get that electricty through those resistor traces you put on there with a pencil. You should have used a back window defroster repair kit, or a conductive pen. Well, the damage is done. Check to make sure that there isn't crossed bridges or anything like that, and get something more conductive like the pen or something like the repair kit.

[BigAir]

Thanks for your input. The CPU is under warranty so I did sucker the shop into replacing it :-) I did know that I should have used something else to connect the bridges but I also knew that if I did that, I could not get the shop to give me a replacement id something went wrong (or is it possible to wipe it off it something bad happens?). Let me know if it is possible to make it look like nothing was done to the CPU with the other methods that you state in the case that something bad happens. Thanks!

[FBRopz]

In the event that you take this road frequently traveled again by bridging the L1s, use the defrost kit, and yes, if you fry that chip you can use fingernail polish or even a lil, and I stress a little paint thinner to wipe the defrost fluid right off.

Keep an eye on those temps and careful with the bridges :)

[kat]

you might want to look into a better hsf orb`s are chip killers

[thelarry]

Doing the L1 bridges wrong would not likely permanetly trash or overheat your cpu. You can erase the pencil marks with a pencil eraser.

A lot of people have had to erase and remake the pencil marks.

You most likely did not install the heat sink on right. That would give you a hot cpu.

[Colin]

To avoid the resistor effect use a conductive pen or defroster kit. It only makes sense.

[BigAir]

What would be the best CPU cooler for my condition if I use a peltier with it? What are your opinions on peltiers? I will definately use something different next time on the L1 Bridges. I need to figure out how to do this correctly because I plan to do it many times after. It was definately the connecting of the L1 bridges that fried it becaue I have checked and double checked everything 10 times over. I am going to test the CPU and motherboard on a different motherboard and CPU tomorrow. I will post the results here. Thanks!

[Tomas]

I didnt have any problem with using a regular pencil. Same did my friend and he has had it running for months now without a problem at all. The worst thing that can happens is that you have to re connect at a later time. that happened to me when i used to soft pencil. Now my duron works fine at 750@950

[Eriksson]

[quote]BigAir (Feb 18, 2001 04:42 p.m.):
From then on, when I power it on there is no picture and the CPU is hot as hell. quote]

Did you run your cpu without hsf ? How hot was it?

[BigAir]

Yes, I did run the CPU without the HSF as I always do to make sure there is nothing wrong with the temp of the CPU before covering it. It was hotenough to burn a square mark on my finger from the die. If I had the HSF posted on the CPU I would have probably let it run and it would have ruined my MOBo. I will post more results of testing later. Thanks!

[50feet]

try this stuff! http://www.plycon.com/trace.htm

[ReNeG@dE]

T-Birds can burn out in 8 seconds if you don't have an HSF on them so if you ran it that long you probably fried it. What do you mean you always run the CPU without the HSF? Why do you need to, or want to, check the temperatures without the HSF? Have you that with a T-Bird or Duron before or just Intel stuff? How would setting up your computer properly (i.e. having the HSF installed) have ruined your motherboard? Christ, nothing since my 486/33 has come without AT LEAST a heatsink....

Holy *****, I just reread some of the earlier posts.... If you knew about the pencil trick you should have known about the heat issues with T-Birds. If you ran the thing without an HSF its your own fault it fried and the shop and/or AMD shouldn't have to pay for your stupidity. Before you get into peltiers try putting the HSF on!

If I misinterpretted what you said (though I don't see how thats possible) then I'm sorry for the harsh remarks. If not and you did run the system with NOTHING on the chip.... I still can't believe it! knowing the 'pencil trick' but not knowing how hot they get......

[MiracleMan]

Ouch! Renegade are right. Running t-birds without heathsink are suicide! Man, YOU killed your cpu!
I'm running my Gigaron (giga duron, hehe) pencil unlocked, more than 3 months, kicking @ss rox stable!!!

[surlyjoe]

hahahahahah , the logic astounds me

[BigAir]

Ok people here is the deal, I am not the stupid idiot you think I am. It turns out that my Super Orb HSF was so tight that it crushed the die. It now oozes silicone which is quickly fried like an egg HSF OR NOT! It is standard procedure for me any my employees to check the cpu for an immediate overheat when a major modification (pencil trick) has been made. I maintain that what I did is the correct thing to be done and I welcome anyones protests because it may be the wrong thing. It has saves our asses many times before including this time because as stated before, it would have roasted my MOBO if I had not been checking the Temp. I thank those of you very much that offered any type of inteligent suggestions or ideas. I try my best to help others with my suggestions and ideas and hope that others will do the same for me. Yeah I know I should have read up on the infamous GORB but I know many people that swear by them. As you read this I have another CPU on the way and if you have any suggestions for a HSF to use on it they are very welcome. Money is no object but I don't think I want to risk a water cooler. Thank You.

[Tachyon]

The Alpha heat sinks are among the best.

[ReNeG@dE]

I've read many stories about people who turn on their AMD systems without a HSF for a couple of seconds, just to listen to how loud the Delta 38 is, or to look around the BIOS or whatever and end up frying their chips because the chips get WAY too hot (whats the standard? 50-60W of heat?). This would probably be fine on a P3 or Celeron which generate about half the heat and (I think) have heat spreaders and not just the exposed core, but not for a T-Bird or Duron.

The Pencil trick is hardly a major modification... If you are building overclocked computers for people I hope you aren't actually using a pencil to connect the L1s....

I still don't understand why you say it would have roasted the motherboard... I'm not sure it COULDN'T happen, but I don't think its 100% certain either. I DEFINITELY don't think having the HSF on would have made the motherboard roast any faster than not having it on (though that would roast the CPU almost imediately).

yeah I like your trying to help others:

"ignorant" <-- how helpful!

Now you aren't making sense... it doesn't work because it was crushed by the superorb, but it didn't work before when you tested it without an HSF and burned your finger on the core... Did you put the HSF on, crush it, take it off, "test" the computer, find it didn't work, then put the HSF back on and come to the conclusion it was the HSFs fault?

Quote from AMD:

Caution: Never start the processor unless the heatsink is properly and firmly
attached. THERMAL FAILURE WILL RESULT—THE PROCESSOR WILL BE PERMANENTLY DAMAGED.

you can check it out at:

http://www.amd.com/products/cpg/athlon/pdf/23986.pdf

Anyway, the two new Swiftech HSFs are monsters, the FOP32/38s are supposed to be good, I have the Alpha PEP66 myself and it seems to work quite well, the PAL6035 is also supposed to be good.

[Rob Cork]

Over at [H]ard OCP they fried a 1.2gig Tbird in 2 seconds flat by booting up without a hsf. From what I've heard, it is possible to fry it in this space of time with ease - this isn't a one-off. Running without a hsf for any length of time is asking for a dead chip - if the computer is on for more than a second or two you really are living dangerously, and I know for a fact that my ATX power supply won't switch off immediately it has been switched on. You have to wait for 2 or 3 seconds after pressing the power switch for it or the reset switch to have any effect - and within this time you could have fried your chip. If it's hot enough to burn your finger it must be at or above 60C, and a second later it'll probably be approaching 70 or 80 - lethal. I don't understand why you would want to test the cpu without a hsf - since it'll never be running without one (in theory), and a cpu at default speed and voltage will overheat without one anyway, what sort of a test is that? A better test would be to try it under normal operating conditions i.e. with a hsf, to see whether it overheats then - that's what's important.

Yes, I did run the CPU without the HSF as I always do to make sure there is nothing wrong with the temp of the CPU before covering it. It was hotenough to burn a square mark on my finger from the die. If I had the HSF posted on the CPU I would have probably let it run and it would have ruined my MOBo. I will post more results of testing later. Thanks!

Sorry, but the simple fact that the cpu overheats without a hsf is no indicator of whether it will overheat with one, as any cpu will definitely fry without a hsf after about 10 seconds (never heard of any surviving past 8 seconds, so I'm being generous with 10 secs). If the cpu overheats with the hsf on it will do so much more slowly, as the heatsink takes a while to heat up. This means that rather than rushing up to 70C+ (as yours almost certainly did), it will rise slowly, probably crashing soon after 60C (my tbird crashes at 58C). This will give you the warning you need to shut the computer down. Sorry to harp on the point, but I have heard of so many people killing chips by running them for a few seconds without hsf's that it really annoys me - there was no need for the chip to die. Please change your policy now - continuing to 'test' cpus without a hsf can only lead to more disasters - I can't believe this is the first you have killed, at least if you have been doing this for any length of time. Don't get too mad at me, I just don't want this to happen again.