Asus i865 is Prescott Ready

Prescott will use a totally diferent voltage scheme and was said to be incompatible with all i865 and 875 boards , meaning a full upgrade to a new board . But Asus has said that they have Prescott support !

http://usa.asus.com/prog/spec.asp?m=P4P800&langs=09

I wonder how many others will be able to say the same , without making totally new revisions ?

I wouldnt be so sure of that!

If the stuff on i865 boards is true I'm done with intel. Just bought my board p4p800dlx 2weeks ago, with knowing that Id be able to upgrade quite reasonably and now this!

Must be some kind of weird joke i hope!

one angry bear

heres the info:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20030711095321.html

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/mainboards/display/20030712011416.html

This is not funny for Intel users , someone is lying here . I really hope that Asus has something up their sleves .


Edited after actually reading the 2'nd link .

Yep it may be a serious issue for some. I personally don't buy a mainboard with the expectation that it will support some new processor down the road. I typically buy both in combination, and when a new cpu comes along I generally don't consider it a serious advancement unless it DOES require a new motherboard. The way I see it, if it doesn't chances are pretty good it's not offering enough to justify an upgrade. I wasn't planning on buying a Prescott until it moves to the next socket. Of course I might buy a revised 478 board just to test out the first prescotts. I go through mainboards in about 3-4 months anyway. I never look at them as an investment for more than about 6 months at most. I think the longest I've kept any computer is about a year.

God now I don't know what to think. I bought a P4C800 hoping it would last me. Should I get the P4P800 or not. That is the question.

remember back when we had that whole AMD vs intel argument?

we said one of the main advantages was the upgradablilty of the socket A platform? Your answer was amd never did anything to warrent moving to a new chipset. Honestly, im quite glad about that - look where you are now..........

Cowboy...

You are looking at a product spec that came out BEFORE Intel changed the spec (announced last week).

Here is the current response from Asus support.
http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=215170

Asus is in the same boat as all the other mobo makers.

I was hoping fr the best , in another thread on our forum some were claiming that Asus could still do it . The question now is whose fault is it ? Intel or the Motherboard makers .

That is why I said in another thread it is too much like gambling . If you buy one , you have to do so knowing that you may have to stick with the 3.2 northwood as your highest possible upgrade .

Cowboy X said:

The question now is whose fault is it ? Intel or the Motherboard makers .

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Its Intels, they did a "last minute" spec change. Its not even confirmed that it wont work. Some mobo's will be ok, and they are supposedly working hard to find a workaround for the other , cross your fingers

LOL , and there are a host of pople going around claiming that it is the mobo makers' fault for not adhering to 'spec ' .

james.miller said:

remember back when we had that whole AMD vs intel argument?

we said one of the main advantages was the upgradablilty of the socket A platform? Your answer was amd never did anything to warrent moving to a new chipset. Honestly, im quite glad about that - look where you are now..........

Click to expand...

You're not running an old Socket A motherboard, so what are you talking about? You have a shiny new NF7-S v2, not even the original v1. The socket itself means nothing, it's the chipset that matters. Try running your XP1800+ on the first Socket A KT133 chipset or the original AMD chipset that couldn't even run with the FSB at 110 MHz. It ain't gonna happen. You can't run Socket A CPUs with the FSB at 200 MHz on any of the older chipsets, and that's where you have to get to rival the performance of the new P4 dual DDR platforms. I know, since I run both AMD and Intel systems all the time.

If you run a new CPU on an old mobo by dorking with the multiplier and running at 100 MHz, 133 MHz, or 166 MHz you'd be wasting your money on the new CPU. AMD, VIA, SiS, and nVidia have produced many different chipsets for Socket A and you need to upgrade to new mobos to run the new CPUs at their intended speeds.

There are obsolescences and deadends on both AMD and Intel platforms . But as I have been arguing in another thread the rapidity at which mobos are becoming obsolescent on the Intel side is somewhat disconcerting . I do agree that james.miller's argument concerning 'socket a ' is flawed if he meant it the way we both interpret his post . But here are my views on the matter :

1/ To expect the top processor of Nov 2003 to run in the top board of Nov 2002 is pushing it but would be nice .

2/ To expect the top processor of Nov 2003 to run in the top board of 2002 as well as it would in a top Nov 2003 board would be silly ( at least not since the BX ).

3/ It is however not unreasonable to expect or hope that a top board which became readily available in June 2003 would have an upgrade path in Oct/Nov 2003 .

4/ It is not unreasonable either to expect number 3 since manufacturers openly claimed that to be the case . Some still do actually .

If you try to put a latest gen Athlon in a very old board it is quite obvious that you will be forced to as DaveB put it dork the multiplier , but this is normally quite late with AMD . They often release paralell lines of processors for a while and this helps avoid relatively sudden obsolescence . The 100Mhz Thunderbirds existed with the 133 ones right up until the last , the 1.4 had a 100 Mhz version as well .

Another point is that even though an upgrade may not give you all the whiz bang of a totally new setup as mentioned in assumption number 2c , it still offers very good gains . For example back in the day when there were the 100 FSB coppermines and the 133 fsb ones , you could upgrade a P3 500 to a P3 1000 100 mhz version . Would it be faster than a P3 1000 on a 133 bus ................. nope . Would it be similar in performance ................ yes . Would it knock the stuffing out of your same rig with the 500 ................ definitely !

And finally it would certainly outperform your neighbour who 3 months earlier bought a spanking new P3 800 133FSB on a board at least a year newer than yours .

There is definite benefit to us to avoid such sudden obsolescence and for us to have some of the options we once had in the past .

Mind you, I think the i850 Chipset that still performs rather well even today has lasted over all the Intel speed changes up until the 800FSB/HT revision.

Brilliantly fast and very stable chipset. Even the i850 which was 400FSB only at the time could run the 533FSB speed P4s perfectly fine.

Not all Intel chipsets are like that, but you can't forget the ones that do. How many AMD chipsets over 2 years old could claim that?

I'll agree , the i850 did last a long time as the top chipset , if only having one wasn't so expensive . But the 440BX still rules .

DaveB said:

You're not running an old Socket A motherboard, so what are you talking about? You have a shiny new NF7-S v2, not even the original v1. The socket itself means nothing, it's the chipset that matters. Try running your XP1800+ on the first Socket A KT133 chipset or the original AMD chipset that couldn't even run with the FSB at 110 MHz. It ain't gonna happen.

Click to expand...

i'm talking upgradability, backwards compatibility and longetivity. When the big argument went off, one of the main points from the intel side was that amd never did anything to warrent moving to a new socket (not chipset, sorry about that lol) but intel, on the other hand, kept making so many improvements that they HAD to move to a new socket - s423 to s478 for example.

You can't run Socket A CPUs with the FSB at 200 MHz on any of the older chipsets, and that's where you have to get to rival the performance of the new P4 dual DDR platforms. I know, since I run both AMD and Intel systems all the time.

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Well, then you'll also know that there is only one amd cpu that runs a stock fsb of 200mhz - the 3200+ barton. So that doesnt worry me too much.

Honestly, i'd rather pay £40 for an xp1700 and having it run a little slow on an old chipset for a month or two than spend over £100 on a s478 northy AND another £100 on a motherboard.

If you run a new CPU on an old mobo by dorking with the multiplier and running at 100 MHz, 133 MHz, or 166 MHz you'd be wasting your money on the new CPU. AMD, VIA, SiS, and nVidia have produced many different chipsets for Socket A and you need to upgrade to new mobos to run the new CPUs at their intended speeds.

Click to expand...

As i said there is currently only that there is only one amd cpu that runs a stock fsb of 200mhz, below that the highest is 166mhz and 90% of the socket A boards you can buy today will run at 166mhz.

Then there's backwards compatiblility. With intel boards, you are SOL.

*What happens if you want to move from p4 willy to northwood but only have the money for a motherboard? you SOL - you cant use that wily on your shiney new board.

*What happens if you want to move from p4 northwood to presscott? new board time - sorry but your 1 month old motherboard wont cut it.

*There are socket a boards that suport both sdr AND ddr on the one board - making the ideal upgrade from an older pc. Does intel have any equivilent?

*Just to throw it in: there's the price. There's always the price.

james.miller said:

i'm talking upgradability, backwards compatibility and longetivity. When the big argument went off, one of the main points from the intel side was that amd never did anything to warrent moving to a new socket (not chipset, sorry about that lol) but intel, on the other hand, kept making so many improvements that they HAD to move to a new socket - s423 to s478 for example.

Well, then you'll also know that there is only one amd cpu that runs a stock fsb of 200mhz - the 3200+ barton. So that doesnt worry me too much.

Honestly, i'd rather pay £40 for an xp1700 and having it run a little slow on an old chipset for a month or two than spend over £100 on a s478 northy AND another £100 on a motherboard.
[/b]
As i said there is currently only that there is only one amd cpu that runs a stock fsb of 200mhz, below that the highest is 166mhz and 90% of the socket A boards you can buy today will run at 166mhz.

Then there's backwards compatiblility. With intel boards, you are SOL.

*What happens if you want to move from p4 willy to northwood but only have the money for a motherboard? you SOL - you cant use that wily on your shiney new board.

*What happens if you want to move from p4 northwood to presscott? new board time - sorry but your 1 month old motherboard wont cut it.

*There are socket a boards that suport both sdr AND ddr on the one board - making the ideal upgrade from an older pc. Does intel have any equivilent?

*Just to throw it in: there's the price. There's always the price. [/B]

Click to expand...

sofar, nothing has been shown that a prescott can't work in a springdale/canterwood from asus/abit....
I can't say anything about the new via chipset mobo.

btw, you can use just one stick or two sticks of memory, in each and every springdale/canterwood mobo made today.
dual chanel or single, in just one mobo.

also, just so you know, I'm not using the new 2.4c chip...but the old 2.4b

mica

Completely missing the $7 423pin to 475pin adaptor that makes the very first Intel chipset for the P4 work up until the 800/HT CPUs.

Whereas the very first AMD chipsets were hardpressed to get above 112Mhz. Motherboard revisions had to come out for each Athlon revision on top of that.

HotKoala we are not even bringing up the issue of third party adaptors or we could also talk about wire tricks etc . It has nothing to do with the fact that a company producing mobos with minimal or no upgrade paths soon after their launch is not good . Because someone later on came up with a nice workaround does not remove the problem . Especially since many , in fact most adaptors come out too long after the usefull lives of many boards .And most are expensive , not the one you mention , but most are .

Going back to a 423 board is a bit too far in my opinion , unless it was a Rambus board , since RIMM 800 modules will still give good performance . But those 423 boards will generally lack most of what has been standard on boards now for over a year . The socket adaptoer is a bit too late for many 423 users . When the 478 Norhtwoods first came out that would have been fantastic .

Oh yeah another thing , those 423 to 478 adaptors only have a 50 % success rate and may not work with your heatsink .

What chipset will the Prescott support?

Surely, seeing as the cpu is out in a couple of months, we would have heard from either Intel, saying they have a new chipset, or from a motherboard manufacturer saying they will be releasing thier new top of the range board.

I havent seen any of this.

We are talking a couple of months.... motherboard manufacturers cant design a motherboard for the prescott in this small space of time. One of the chipsets (875/865) will support it. It probably just isnt very stable, maybe only the 875 will.


This is Intels leap which will leave AMD for dust, why arnt they bragging about it? Why arent the motherboard manufacturers trying out do each other to be the first to realease a nice board for the cpu?

And if Prescott boards are out in August,
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/mainboards/display/20030712011416.html
that must mean Asus,Abit,Gigabyte etc have got the prescott in thier labs..... it doesnt take a curious overclocker to throw one in an 875/865 does it, like that support reply above from Asus suggests they havent done.

I reckon the 865/875 will support the 478 prescott, and that the 775 prescott will not. Whether it takes a new chipset or new 875 revision to support the 775 prescott I dont know.

I have a hunch springdale and canterwood will support the socket 478 prescott, and new a revision of the Canterwood will support the socket 775.
I also think that another prescott is on the way, with its own chipset, cos there are obviously problems at the moment with what they have got now.

We would have heard more if a new chipset is on the way, and I dont beleive intel would make such a good cpu if they didnt think any motherboard manufacturers could support it properly in october.

Like somebody said somewhere above, we havnt heard it will or WILL NOT be supported. They are keeping secrets.

the i865/875 chipset already supports it, it always has. What happened last week, is that Intel announced a mandatory voltage spec change so many MOTHERBOARDS that have already shipped may not have been built to that new spec.

Its nothing at all to do with the chipset.