Need your opinion Case cooling hd, cooling cpu gpu cooling I want to cool the world!!

Need your opinion Case cooling hd, cooling cpu gpu cooling I want to cool the world!!

Ok I am a newbie here and have a question as I have read all the boards and found nothing similiar to what I am about to ask. This is not a sales message I am looking to gather opinions on a new product.

I am a designer/inventor and I am on the verge of coming up with a way to cool a case by 40 degrees or more from the outside air. The neat part about this is I have managed to fit this device into just two 5 1/4 bays and run off a standard power supply.

I am about too spend a small fortune, to me anyway, on the final production unit and then have it manufactured. So my question to the board is would you buy something like this???

Some advantages that I have considered:

If your case is cooler your cpu, gpu hdd etc.... will all run cooler

All your heatsinks will be more effective...

This would eliminate the need to run Peltier TECS and water coolers... Water in my system still scares me

Finally an overclockers dream reason...

If you are overclocking your machine and you are running a Peltier on your cpu or using a water cooling block on your cpu you always run the risk of condensation because you are running much cooler then ambient. My design lowers the ambient temperature of the entire case which allows you to run your cpu a few degrees higher to eliminate condensation!!! I think? The final tests are underway.

So please save me from spending my lifesavings on a faulty design or something that you all would consider a waste. Or tell me I hit the nail on the head and you can't wait to see it! Either way let me know what you think.


Thank you,
Dan
Coolerbydesign

Three questions before I can make a decision: how much would it cost; how much noise, if any, will it make; and how much power (in watts) would it take?

EDIT: Also, is this 40 degrees Celsius or Fahrenheit?

Ok some additional details.

I am looking at producing two models a "regular cooler" if you will and a "super cooler"

The regular cooler will draw about 40watts and 4-5 amps based on the current design this could change but I don't expect it to change by more then 20% or so. The regular cooler will employ two 40mm ball bearing fans that will be internal and no outside fans I expect the final product to be very quiet. Expect a drop from outside temps between 20-30 degrees Fahrenheit depending on your case size and airflow characteristics. Iam expecing pricing to be under 100 dollars. That might be 99.99 but under 100 is my goal.

The "Super Cooler" will essentially double the power requirements but it will also get you about 30 more degrees so expect a drop of temps on your case to about 50-60 fahrenheit, below outside temps. The "Super Cooler" will be quite a bit louder as it will employ external fans as well although I am trying to make it as quiet as possible, moving air just makes noise. Pricing will be around $200.00.

Both the Regular Cooler and Super Cooler fit in two bays.

Also for maximum cooling it will be recommended that your case be sealed for air leaks. This will provide maximum cooling efficiency minimum internal humidity and a significant sound dampening. A decent quality plexi will suffice in most cases or you can get creative and use foam in a can or styrofoam or whatever you like.

Hope this helps.

Dan

Two 40mm fans won't push much air at all, especially for cooling an entire case. A decent 40mm fan will push less than 10 CFM. The air coming out might be 20-30 degrees cooler, but the total thermal power taken out of the air will be too low to matter much.

Also for maximum cooling it will be recommended that your case be sealed for air leaks.

Click to expand...

Is this some sort of recycling air conditioner? I don't see how plugging all the holes will help when the case fans are still there.

I'll explain as best as I can without too many details as this is still in development and I can't disclose a whole lot about the how. In a nutshell the fans should only be circulating the air inside the case as it circulates this air it cools it therefore not a lot of fan power is required. A typical case is a little over 1 Cubic Foot and a large case might push 2 or so. Therefore even with just two 40mm fans blowing 8ish cfm you are recirculating the air in the case about 16 times per minute (in a perfect world). So as it circulates it cools. A sealed case will cool faster and too a lower temp then an open case.

As an aside the follow on to this prodcut will be a sealed case. Made mostly of plexi.

~Dan

40W would only get my 486 more than 40F below ambient.... only for as long as I didn't turn it on!

Sorry, but you're kind of trying to get a motorbike to do the job of a city bus here.

C'mon, the CPU alone is blowing 80W or more into that case, there's at least 200W of heat to get rid of. And that will just MATCH ambient, to go below it you need a whole lot more.

regards,

Road Warrior

I think for that price I'd just risk the water and Pelter. I do assume you mean $US? If so, $100 and $200 translates to about $200 and $400 in my dollar. Sounds quite interesting though, but do 80mm or 60mm fans not fit into you design?

im not sure how you could possibly accomplish this goal.... i dont mean to discourage you as i think that if you CAN do it this would be an amazing feat... i just dont see how you could take something thats making an extreme amount of heat CONSTANTLY.

i could see it SOMEHOW if there was exhaust or intake, but i just dont see how it could be done otherwise. its like putting a fire in a closed room and just blowing the heat around. its not going to change the temperature... maybe i have it wrong?

Great responses from everybody I really appreciate all the insight. I'm gathering from a lot of your responses that there is doubt whether or not this can be done or if I have the rifght size fan or what not.

To clarify....

I am running the "Regular Cooler" prototype as we speak it is rather ugly but effective and I am seeing close to 30 degree drops in my case. The longer I run it and the tighter I seal up the case the cooler it gets.

I am running an XP1800 512MB Ram, nothing fancy no overclocking in a regular old Soyo mintower.

I am working on getting shots of the unit and what not but gravity and my cam met the other day. They got along fine until the ground got involved...

im gonna be the 1st....

WELCOME TO THE FORUMS!!!!!!!!

That is a very good idea. It is like the VapoChill case cooling but I assume that it would not cost $1200 or so. Well keep us posted with data and pictures.

Thank You,
Daniel

I'm interested... in following this thread to see what develops.

I really think having a case designed to go with it will help you greatly. Most cases are designed with moving air in and out as quickly as possible. So that directly works against your product. Sealing a case only goes so far. The results will be inconsistant at best for your end user. I would think that having a case designed to go with your unit would be a big help in consistancy not to mention a reputation and image of professionalism. The latter is big to a lot of people.

If it's affordable, and effective, I'd go for it. In fact, I was just thinking this morning how great it would be to be able to have cooler air in my case.

Just a quick update. The case is a go. I spoke with a manufacturer today and gave them the design I was looking for. It will start as a standard ATX mini tower and depending on feedback it may grow to a full tower as well. Case details are basically this.

Monster Power Supply (Not definitive but in the 500w range)

Sealed tight aside from a few slots for your PCI and AGP

Completely Refrigerated to approximately 30-60F below room temperature

Oh yeah and it will a bad arse clear case. With gold fasteners i.e screws and clamps etc...

Pricing will be around $300 USD including the monster Power supply, and refrigeration. Wow!

Thanks for your feedback please keep it coming

This is quite fascinating and a good idea but I have a few questions/recommendations/observations..

One: I would start with a mid tower case rather than a mini, mini is just too small for computers these days, especially for modders and overclockers and peeps with big rigs and lots HDD's. And also allow for the consumer to use whatever PSU they wish, and merely have recommendations as to the power recquired for operation.

Two: This sounds like it works in the same concept as air conditioning recirculator does in a car. instead of taking air from outside and cooling it, it takes the air inside and cools it, thus, slowly lowering the temp of the inside air by a few degrees each time.

Three: Two leads to three in that.. the only way for air to be cooler is that it \must be cooled...obviously. so does this unit use any types of refrigerant or similar that would need to be refilled? Since simple thermal physics dictates that you cant cool air with just air, the actuall temp will never be cooler than the original, it only feels that way. which is why you cant get below ambient temps on just air cooling alone. Unless you add a refrigerant, thus lowering the temp of the air. Which technically results in the same problem as before only now, ambient is just cooler. allowing for cooler temps of the components.

four: You did say the wattage, and the amperage. but will it run off any of the standard voltage lines found in a PSU? 3v, 5v 12v ? because at the ratings you listed thats 8-10 volts, sooo is it going to run at varying amperage/wattage to comply with the ATX power standards or are adapters or something going to be needed for it to run? Or will it be varying in efficiency depending on power, like peltiers?

five: as what RoadWarrior said.. Heat generated by the components in a computer needs to go somewhere, either radiated through some medium, such as air, then vented out of the case. or absorbed by the case itself and then to the outside air. if this is designed as an air conditioning type setup. all air conditioners have intakes and out-takes (forgot the word) But if it is, then it would lead back into question 3 above.

In closing, this is a good idea, and I would probably look into it if there were more details and specs and definate numbers of the models so they can be compared to existing setups and perhaps specsheets of the concept on how it manages to cool 200W+ of heat in an enclosed space with 2 40mm fans... just dont see it feasible in this stage but I hope to see further developments of this, and will subscribe to this thread

Well, thats my $.03 I hope it helped you in some way

Disaster!!!! I just spent twenty minutes responding in detail to your questions only to do some whacky keystroke and lose it all uhhhh!

Ok in order very briefly elaboration tomorrow after coffee...

One)Meant Mid not Mini very sleepy my bad... Choose your own PS may be an option at your own risk... Good modders need not worry but I worry about the guy with a 230 watter running a p4 oc'd with 4 10k rpm drives a graphics card the side of Utah and he's got it sitting on top of his cable box to keep it cool.

Two) Yup sort of...

Three) No refrigerant this is pretty much maintenance free... pretty much

Four) It will be powered from the 12v leads.

Five) Exhaust I believe is the word you were looking for at least it's the one I found. This is kind of the unique part of the whole concept... How do you get rid of the heat? Well for that stay tuned as I can't really say right now.

As far as fans I may have spoken too soon or out of order. The system I am running now is using two 40mm's and I am seeing good results if I find that bigger fans yield better results then I will not hesitate to add those. However they will still be inside a sealed case so noise should be at a minimum...

~Dan

ya exhaust.. had a brain fart in the middle of my reply, heh.

and I think you really need some pics of this to help us understand what your talking about even if they are crappy quality. buy a disposable camera. take some pics, goto developer place and have them put on a CD, then upload them.. because to me, this still seems scientifically and physically impossible... sorry.

*edit* it snot that I want schematics or anything.. tohugh it would be nice for explanation purposes.. but perhaps a drawing of the design/theory? since you do have a working prototype it seems.

Oh And, are you not able to mfr these? since sending it to a fabricator or whatnot can (and is) very expensive when you could do it yourself.. maybe, making some cheaper units that may not look as nice, but a good way to get some user feedback before they have to shell out a hundred or two just to try one out, know what I mean?

coolerbydesign said:

Disaster!!!! I just spent twenty minutes responding in detail to your questions only to do some whacky keystroke and lose it all uhhhh!

Click to expand...

and btw, thats why I copy what Im typing every now and then if its a long reply so that doesnt happen.. especially before I hit submit.. just a tip for later

Yeh I am ready to see some pictures/drawings. What I have in my mind is that it would exhaust the hot air through the drive bays like one of the 5.25 bay fan exhaust units you can buy.

Thank You,
Daniel

Just a quick update as I am battening down the hatches for Isabel coming through today.

First "Beta's" if you will should be ready in the next 30 days or so. At that time I will have significantly more data to with all of you. I will post on this thread and a new one when the first few systems are complete. I will be looking for people to test and review them.

Thanks,
Dan