Need new cpu....Barton or TBred?

OK, before everyone gets mad at me for posting a question that has shown up already many times, just hear me out.

I purchased a barton 2500 and have been running it in my a7n8x deluxe. It will run, occasionally at 200x11 but it will crash in all games and anything that is cpu intensive. I was considering returning it and getting the 2600 tbred 333fsb instead. It looks like I will have no trouble running it at 200x11, right? My memory is pc3500 mushkin, so it will gladly run in sync with 400mhz fsb. Anyway, my main question is this....will I see a huge difference in the cache size of the tbred and barton? Thanks for the help in advance.

-Collin-

One more thing, does one overclock better than the other?

I believe the extra cache of the Barton is like an extra 100Mhz.
I also think you will get better overclocks from a T-Bred, say 1700+ B core. The 1800 T-Bred from excaliberpc.com is doing nice things. Well cept mine but thats not the cpu's fault, I just need a better PSU. GameVE.com has a 1700+ B for $49. Nice price.

Yes. Barton 2500+ overclocks better than T-Bred 2600+.

Why bother with expensive 2600+? Might as well go with $49 guaranteed 1700+ T-Bred B if you're not going with choice #1 for AMD: 2500+ Barton.

Back to your problem which almost certainly is not CPU related.

Memory is fine. That leaves one of three:
Vcore: up it gradually to as high as 1.8 volts.
Cooling: Are you using AMD retail heatsink instead of $15.99 Thermalright SK-7?
Power Supply: Can't be going for gold with cheapo power. Name brand is required for stable high overclocks.

It's not the CPU. Stay with Barton. It's one of those three things.

Well, I've got the SLK-900 with a 92mm fan......the cpu never breaks 100 faranheit. Also, I have an Achieve 550 watt ps, which is doing nicely. So, it is not possible that I just got a crummy barton?

-Collin-

Vcore? Need to up it gradually to 1.8 volts. Up Ram voltage too.

I looked up your Achieve PSU on pricewatch.

Regardless of the fact that it's labeled as 550 watts, this Achieve of yours is a $20 PSU. That's gottta set the alarm bells, $20 for 550W but watts are not important. Namebrand PSU like the 350W Fortron is the way to go. I believe even the 300W Fortron would be a better choice than Achieve 550W.

It just maybe the PSU that's slowing down your OC.

Well, that makes sense. I bought it recently, so I can return it if I'd like. How are raidmax? I cant pick up a 400 watt raidmax for around 40, but is this still too cheap? As far as the vcore, I raised it to 1.7 volts, now everything runs fine....except for games. Most run fine, but a few will crash it. Should I keep going on the vcore, or get a new psu??

-Collin-

Power Supply Unit can take out all your other components.
Many PSU manufacturers list specs that do not reflect true capabilities of their products so all info on the PSU label doesn't mean much except for the brand, just look for the brand: All Antecs (Channel Well) are good (Antec True Power is better), Fortron (Sparkle), Sirtec (Enlight, Vantec, Thermaltake), or more expensive Herolchi (Herolchi), PC Power and Cooling, C or not as good but not dangerous HEC, TTGI, Zalman (Aopen).

$40 ought to get you a Fortron 350W, that's better than most 500W PSUs. (It used to be $32 at newegg but they no longer carry it.)
Antec 350 can be had for $45 and it's really really quiet, not to mention top brand.

You can save $ on PSU. But your overclocks and stability and most importantly physical security of your components will be put at risk. If it takes out your hard drive, you'll be spreading the word about importance of PSUs just like I am now. It took me two hard drives to realize that.

_____________________
2100+ AIUHB 0248 MPMW
256MB Crucial PC2100 + 2x 256MB Kingston (Hynix chip) PC2100 @ 6 3 3 2
[152] FSB x 15 = 2280 MHz @ 1.8 Vcore with memory frequency at 100% [152] @ 2.77 Vdimm
37(min) C to 46(max) C Winter ; 42(min) C to 50(max) C Summer
Epox 8RDA+
Thermalright SK-7 with variable speed 80x25mm YS-Tech FD1281259B-2F
BFG GeForce4 Ti4200 8X 128MB; Antec SX-835II case ; 350W Antec SmartPower SL350
Five 80x25mm Ultra Quiet 18CFM Case Fans (NMB C3110KL-04W-B19)

What revision a7n8x do you have? If its not a rev 2 you may have problems running 200fsb. I would suggest tackling the problem in 2 parts. Lower your mult so that cpu speed is not a factor and first find your max stable fsb. Then after you have established that your board can handle the fsb you are trying to run at raise your mult and see how high you can get cpu speed. You will need to raise vcore to get a good oc.

As for PSUs I agree 100% with c627627. I would take a 300w or 350w fortron over a cheapo generic 500w psu any day. Typically what you see from many PSU manufacturers is the wattage rating at some crazy ambient temp like 20c or something like that. That is not a realistic temp at all. When you run that psu under normal conditions and temps then the wattage starts to drop drastically. Typically the Fortron supplies are on the opposite end of the spectrum, being rating a bit conservativly.

from my experience...
The cache helps in benchmarks but day to day performance feels snappier with high mhz.

I get the same 3dmark results with my 1700+ @ 2.5ghz as I did with my 2500+ @2.3ghz.

The Barton seemed to be more tempermental while o/c'd with randome lock-ups and crashes even though prime95 was stable.

I prefer the t-bred.

NinjaZX6R said:

1. will I see a huge difference in the cache size of the tbred and barton? Thanks for the help in advance.

-Collin-

One more thing, does one overclock better than the other?

Click to expand...

Congratulations on the 2.5 Ghz overclock, LBJGH. That's quite an achievement. Usually people overclock Barton and T-Bred B similarily though. So if they have a below average to average setup, would you still recommend the T-Bred?

I'd say the price is a major part of the decision too since difference between the two can be $30 to $40.

2.3 Barton is better than 2.3 T-Bred. Getting 2.4 out of either is not average, it's more of an achievemnet for average setups I'd say. What do you think?

go with barton..
it runs cooler and usually is the better chip for gaming and the such

Thanks c627627, but I think I got a fluke 1700+ ... but most people are hitting 2.4ghz with the DLT3C 1700/1800's with a good air cooling setup (slk or swiftech)

2.2-2.3GHz should be attainable for most rookie o/c'rs with the DLT3C.

I didn't really notice the difference with the extra cache... I guess a good analogy would be the 1700+ would be a high revving turbo 4cylinder and the 2500+ would be a V8 full or torque at low rpm. Both chips get the job done...

c627627 said:

Congratulations on the 2.5 Ghz overclock, LBJGH. That's quite an achievement. Usually people overclock Barton and T-Bred B similarily though. So if they have a below average to average setup, would you still recommend the T-Bred?

I'd say the price is a major part of the decision too since difference between the two can be $30 to $40.

2.3 Barton is better than 2.3 T-Bred. Getting 2.4 out of either is not average, it's more of an achievemnet for average setups I'd say. What do you think?

Click to expand...

Well, I appreciate all the help guys. I was monitoring my voltage rails and they are perfect...not a drop or increase anywhere. Does that mean this psu is ok? Also, to update you on the memory.....I run it at 166, way below rated speed and everything is rock solid! I run it at 200, still under spec, but close to, and it crashes.....faulty memory???

-Collin-

i would say go with the t-bred B 1700/1800, as its cheaper, and youll attain a higher clock speed with it. mine runs at 2200MHz @ 1.6V, but right now im running 220x9.5 2090MHz at 1.5V. its all about the voltage....a barton running at the same speed as a DLT3C will almost always need .1V-.15V more to be stable.

Re: Re: Need new cpu....Barton or TBred?

LBJGH said:

I get the same 3dmark results with my 1700+ @ 2.5ghz as I did with my 2500+ @2.3ghz.

Click to expand...

Your results are more favorable to the barton than the 3dmark nums below, where a 2.25g barton got 15815 and a 2.25g tbred got 15427, which is almost a tie.

???

no doubt the Barton gets better benchmark results but the 1700+ just feels quicker because of the extra mhz.

Re: Re: Re: Need new cpu....Barton or TBred?

johnoh said:

Your results are more favorable to the barton than the 3dmark nums below, where a 2.25g barton got 15815 and a 2.25g tbred got 15427, which is almost a tie.

???

Click to expand...

forgot to post the link I referred to when I said "below". oops.

http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/20030210/barton-15.html