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memory timings again! arggh

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vincent_1985

Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2003
no matter how much times i read up on it i still don't understand it!

Just don't make sense to me ya know. Somethings just aren't meant to be.

If possible can you guys help me on the best memory timings for the kingston PC3200?

i've looked around i couldn't find anything.

Thanks ever so much if you guys have a memory timngs for dummies please share as well =\
 
Basically.
The Lower, The Better.

Not to get into definitions, but to identify terms:
CAS Latency = CAS or CL
RAS-to-CAS Delay - tRCD
RAS Precharge - tRP
RAS Pulse Width or other names - tRAS or tRC

Whenever I give timings, I try to leave out tRAS, as it generally differs for each system. Usually tRAS should be CAS + tRCD + 2 but this differs in some cases, like with nForce2 chipset (where 11 seems to be ideal).

2-2-2 (CAS-tRCD-tRP) is generally considered ideal. If the system is unstable, then you must lower the memory speed, raise the voltage, or raise the timings. Usually, the first timing to go (or which stresses the memory the most) is a tRCD set to 2. Alot of memory cannot handle this, especially with less then 3V. Raising the tRCD to 3 also has the most significant single timing step effect on your memory performance.

The performance hit by raising timings decreases as timings get larger (raising timings from 2-3 hurts more then 3-4, and so on). Timings are usually measured in tCK (Clock Cycles) and can be converted into ns (nanoseconds) by getting the ns-speed that the memory is running at.

Memory running at 200MHz (DDR400) has a tCK (Clock Cycle) of 5ns (use 1000 divided by memory speed - 1000/200). Timings of 2-2-2 (tCK) on memory running at 200MHz (DDR400) is then converted to 10-10-10 (ns). Memory running at 3-3-3 (tCK) at 250MHz (DDR500) is running at timings of 12-12-12 (3 * 1000/250) when converted to nanoseconds (ns).

For definitions of what exactly each memory timing controls, there are several descriptions online that range from overly simplistic to downright confusing.
 
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hrmm so it i can get teh first three numbers 2-2-2 and the last one doens't really matter i'm pretty much good to go?
 
I appreciate that too, that's the best description of memory timing I've seen so far. :D Remembering all that stuff is kinda confusing... I just remember lower = better.
 
Agreed, that was excellent information from speed. I was surprised especially when I discovered that raising Ras->Cas from 2->3 hurt my performance more than raising the Cas Latency from 2 -> 2.5. But definitely true. 2.5-2-2 reads better mem bandwidth in memtest86 than 2-3-2. Seems counterintuitive, since the first thing you read about ram is whether it's CL2 or CL2.5....

Just a little addendum. I believe that usually, tRAS should be minimum CAS Latency + tRCD + 2 (ie. for 2-2-2, a minimum of 6) rather than tRCD + 2 (which would be tRAS=4 for 2-2-2). You do see a lot of people with 2-2-2-5 timings, but the only benefits you'll be getting with it will be the misplaced warm fuzzy feeling from such a low mem timing :p You definitely won't see any performance improvement of 2-2-2-5 over 2-2-2-6, and in fact, may have a performance hit.
 
With Intel systems, CAS is more important. Some Intel systems will only run at 2,3,2,5 at best (or 2,3,2,6).
 
tyson-chris said:
Just a little addendum. I believe that usually, tRAS should be minimum CAS Latency + tRCD + 2 (ie. for 2-2-2, a minimum of 6) rather than tRCD + 2 (which would be tRAS=4 for 2-2-2). You do see a lot of people with 2-2-2-5 timings, but the only benefits you'll be getting with it will be the misplaced warm fuzzy feeling from such a low mem timing :p You definitely won't see any performance improvement of 2-2-2-5 over 2-2-2-6, and in fact, may have a performance hit.

:) I meant to have it CAS + tRCD + 2 = tRAS , slipped my mind a bit.

batboy said:
With Intel systems, CAS is more important. Some Intel systems will only run at 2,3,2,5 at best (or 2,3,2,6).
It's not so much as tRCD is less important then CAS, as it is that running a tRCD is very stressful on the chipset/memory. When running into a stability problem, the only solution (short of replacing products) is to raise voltage. Running a tRCD at 2 is very stressful on the system, and, when a system is capable of running it without error, this points out the fact that the increased efficiency can be quite effective.
 
A lot of people swear by 2-2-2-5 but I have also come to believe in this
CAS + tRCD + 2 = tRAS
theory.

Mushkin used to have the fabled "book analogy" on their pages.
Now that link does not seem to exist any more( I tried it).

But on their spec for PC3500 lvl 2 they state 2-3-2-6 for Intel.
i.e. CAS=2 tRCD=3 tRP=2 tRAS=6, shouldn't that be 2-3-2-7 then?

Or have Mushkin lost faith in this theory?

Br
hepp
 
Holy crap, you guys know alot about this. I have a question for you, based on timings, what's the best RAM from what company?
 
try to get BH-5 chips ;) the reason most RAM wont push 2-2-2-x on some systems at DDR400, is because their CH-5 chips, BH-5 chips can do 2-2-2-x easily at DDR400....

i believe Kingston still has some, was a trick with an A in the name, so you could know, and Muskin i belive had a lot of BH-5 (i heard)

btw, i emailed kingston once asking how to recognize BH-5..

answer: "We do not disclose private company information about what chips we use" or something funny like that...
 
Ok currently my kingston pc 3200 is at timings 3-3-3-8 and at 2.6v

i'm running my computer at P4 2.6C @ 3286 mhz

is there tighter timings? I jsut fcan't ever get it right i can easily pump up my fsb to obtain 3.5 ghz+ because it's cool as hell in my comp i just feel it's my moemory that's holding me back.

currently no money for new memory so i need to see if there's a way to push my current memory.

btw for my current settings 3.2 ghz i'm at idle 17 degrees and load about 30-36degress.
 
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