Thorton vs Thoroughbred

I'm a Intel man myself (don't hate me because I'm faster ), but I need to get a moderately priced system for a friend.

Looking at the XP 2200, but which would be better, Thorton or Thoroughbred core? The only thing I know is that one makes less heat and one is more OCable.

I'm a Intel man myself (don't hate me because I'm faster

Click to expand...

No problem, we won't 'cause ya ain't

Seriously, it depends on the applications, the core, and the system configuration.

The best Throughbred cores (Tbred) are the "B" versions. The most common of these are the 1700+ & the 1800+ (they're getting more scarce). Most of them will hit 2.4 - 2.5ghz.

The Thorton cores are Bartons w/ 1/2 the cache disabled & should O/C like most Bartons, minimum of 3200+. With Barton cores anything above 2.2 is good (most are getting in the 2.3 area). The Thorton might get a bit higher due to the reduced cache, but you'll need 100 - 200mhz extra to overcome the extra cache of the Barton.

It depends on the system config you're planning. For example, if you're have limited FSB speeds then you'll want either an unlocked core OR one with a locked higher multiplier.

For example, w/ an Nforce2-Ultra board & PC3200 RAM you can -

XP 2500+ (Barton) = 11x200 = 2.2ghz (very likely)
XP 2400+ (Thorton) = 12x200 = 2.4ghz (maybe)
XP 2200+ (Tbred) = 13.5x200 = 2.7ghz (not likely)

For example, w/ a "333" board you can -

XP 2500+ (Barton) = 11x166 = 1.8ghz (stock - lol)
XP 2400+ (Thorton) = 15x166 = 2.4ghz (might)
XP 2200+ (Tbred) = 13.5x166 = 2.2ghz (likely)

All AMD chips are multi locked starting on or around week 39 of this year so if you're going with a slower FSB board, that runs around 166 (333) then the higher multi will work to your advantage.

Check my sig, a MB/CPU/RAM combo that runs just over $200 - pretty damn cheap for the performance.

It breaks down -

XP2500+ = $86
AN35NU = $64
256 PC 3200 = $55

My choices would be -

1. 200fsb = XP2500+ ($86 - good bang for the buck)
2. Less than 200 look for a "B" stepping of an 1700+ or 1800+

Also check the links in this thread, lots of good info about the different cores.

http://www.ocforums.com/vb/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=250008

Do Tbreds come in 2200+ versions? I cant say Ive seen one, but feel free to correct me.

Attleast according to www.verkkokauppa.com, which is a very reputable seller in Finland, with many locations.

This system is for a friend, who needs some of the extra speed to run multiaps. 512mb of PC3200 is fine, and I'll be using the Abit NF7-S.

The Barton 2500 (€105) runs €20 higher than the 2200 (€87). Do you people think the higher overclock is worth it? This thing will have to be at a stable OC, so I don't need to run over everyday to check up.

You should go with Tbred core (2500+). Thorton is the new core for Duron and the L1 and L2 caches are limited/disabled.

Tawcan said:

You should go with Tbred core (2500+). Thorton is the new core for Duron and the L1 and L2 caches are limited/disabled.

Click to expand...

That's a load of bull. The Thorton is only used for Athlon XPs. The new Duron core is Applebred, which is based on the Tbred. The L2 is part disabled, but not the L1. Do a little reading before you post.

stamasd said:

That's a load of bull. The Thorton is only used for Athlon XPs. The new Duron core is Applebred, which is based on the Tbred. The L2 is part disabled, but not the L1. Do a little reading before you post.

Click to expand...

I said they're disabled/limited....

Ok got the info confused about the Thorton and Applebred then...

David said:

Do Tbreds come in 2200+ versions? I cant say Ive seen one, but feel free to correct me.

Click to expand...

The XP2200 was the first Tbred, they were all tbreds BUT they were Tbred As and not any better at overclocking then the pallys. Some of the Tbred As were bin sorted and sold as lower speed cpus but i think they are all gone now, pretty much everything should be tbred B or newer but i dont know about xp2200s, they may still be revision A depending on where you buy it.

The xp2100 was the last pally.

EDIT: I do remember hearing rumours of a few xp2200 pallys but I have never even seen a picture of one, a few forum members said they had one. So maybe not all xp2200s were Tbreds but certainly most were.

so I don't need to run over everyday to check up

Click to expand...

Now that I can understand - lol.

Might be worth the extra money, how much is the difference between the XP2200+ & the Thorton? (XP2400+)? With the Tbred core you'd have to search for a "B" stepping to get a real good chance at a decent O/C (see the AMD FAQ at the top of the forum). With an XP2400 you could most likely hit 2.2 w/ a 185x12 setting & you might get lucky & the reduced cache would allow it to hit 2.4 or more. Remember it only takes about 100mhz before the extra cache is negated.

Since you have the fast FSB speeds to work with I'd be real tempted to go with the newer core (Barton/Thorton) & see what I could do.

From a heat perspective the Barton/Thorton's tend to be a bit hotter, but only by a few degrees (5c).

This is strictly my opinion, but I think AMD has quit binning the Barton/Thorton cores. They just lock them at a given speed & sell them at the speed rating (they all will hit 3200+ speeds). <- this is strictly an obervation of the latest OC results.

Do Tbreds come in 2200+ versions? I cant say Ive seen one, but feel free to correct me.

Click to expand...

Yes they do. There are now a handful of results out here for the xp2200s. My own experience is that it is a mediocre O/Cer.

The best Throughbred cores (Tbred) are the "B" versions. The most common of these are the 1700+ & the 1800+ (they're getting more scarce). Most of them will hit 2.4 - 2.5ghz.

Click to expand...

Yup. The "B" core 2100+ is also another excellent choice. Any of these three are probably going to be a better choice than the 2200s.

stamasd said:

That's a load of bull. The Thorton is only used for Athlon XPs. The new Duron core is Applebred, which is based on the Tbred. The L2 is part disabled, but not the L1. Do a little reading before you post.

Click to expand...

That came off as rather rude, perhaps it was maybe a simple mistake?

To me it sounded like FUD, but to everyone his. Claiming that the L1 is disabled has no basis whatsoever as it hasn't been done to any CPU I'm aware of, ever. So it looked to me like someone was trying to start a rumor.

stamasd said:

To me it sounded like FUD, but to everyone his. Claiming that the L1 is disabled has no basis whatsoever as it hasn't been done to any CPU I'm aware of, ever. So it looked to me like someone was trying to start a rumor.

Click to expand...

Ummmm disabled/limited - > disabled or limited.... I never said L1 was disabled... geesh...I sure feel welcomed on here.

And no I'm not trying to start a rumor.... where did you get that impression from?

stamasd said:

To me it sounded like FUD, but to everyone his. Claiming that the L1 is disabled has no basis whatsoever as it hasn't been done to any CPU I'm aware of, ever. So it looked to me like someone was trying to start a rumor.

Click to expand...

At the risk of hijacking this thread, perhaps, as I stated , it was a simple mistake. The full L1 cache is there and the L2 cache is limited as 256k of it is disabled. There is no need to make a mountain out of a molehill. If you have a problem, take it up in a PM with the member. We have already established that the L1 is unaffected so no-one will be misled by this thread.

Thank you.

Be careful as new Thortons and Durons and Bartons are multiplier locked.

Check the codes before you buy if you can
http://www.ocforums.com/vb/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=244237


To the best of my knowledge there are no locked 2100+ T-Bred B's because they are not made any more.

Some weeks 39-42 and all post week 42: 2000+, 2200+, 2400+, are locked because they're Thortons now.

Unfortunately 1800+s made post week 38 are locked too in most cases.


So that leaves 2100+ until there's at least one case of locked 2100+s but there hasn't been one anywhere yet.

Just make sure it's a 2100+ T-Bred B and you can hit 2.3 with adeqaute cooling and name brand power supply pretty much guaranteed.


Oh and I did some readin' stamasd, and new Applebreds are based on Barton grade processor modules
http://www.c627627.com/AMD/AthlonXP/

stamasd said:

The new Duron core is Applebred, which is based on the Tbred. Do a little reading before you post.

Click to expand...

c627627 said:

Oh and I did some readin' stamasd, and new Applebreds are based on Barton grade processor modules
http://www.c627627.com/AMD/AthlonXP/

Click to expand...

I know and use your table, and while it's very good I haven't seen yet any evidence that Applebreds are based on Barton. All I've found so far points that the core is derived from Tbird.

Heres some pricing:
2200 Tbred (€83) boxed
2200 Thorton (€84) bulk
2400 Tbred (€88) boxed
2400 Thorton (€87) bulk
2500 Barton (€117) boxed
Which one would you recomend?

Also, I think I might be able to get a pre week 39, since the supplies to Finland are slow, and normally stay in storage for a while. The only way I could do this, is by going to the store, and asking to see the boxes

The one code for the Bartons (on the website), is AXDA2500BOX / ADUAXDA2500BOX / 12140062
I really can't match that to any on the link, so I think thats the wrong code.

The best Throughbred cores (Tbred) are the "B" versions. The most common of these are the 1700+ & the 1800+ (they're getting more scarce). Most of them will hit 2.4 - 2.5ghz.

Click to expand...

i was under the impression onthe the DLT3C's would go thta high, and the others wouldnt get as far, or not even close... is it true any B will go 2400 w/o a big problem?

Unfortunately 1800+s made post week 38 are locked too in most cases.

Click to expand...

i was unaware of this...is it true? i really hope not...

Enough multiple reports of post week 39 locked Thoroughbreds so that's a sure thing.

Hey stamasd, let's find out together. I think new Applebreds are laser cut Bartons and maybe old initial releases were cut T-Breds, post links showing Applebreds are based on T-Breds or based on both.

Right now I'm leaning toward early versions being based on T-Breds and new ones on Bartons, post links either way, would you?

As far as yields go, it would make the most sense for all the latest Applebreds to be laser-cut Bartons...

But AFAIK, all Applebreds I've heard of thus far have T-Bred steppings.

Sorry for the hijack.