RBX Mounting tips?

[craneage2001]

I just completed my WC setup at home, but my HDs are back at school in my old rig. I've got a Mag3 -> Chev HC(120mm w/shroud) -> RBX -> PVC res. I'm running a 3/4" in to the Mag3 and a 3/4" out into the Chev. HC. The rest of the system is 1/2" tubing. The two outs from the RBX both have a short run to individual inlets on the res.

Enough of the background stuff...I fired up the system after passing leak tests and it wavers between 36-37°C @ 1.8v x 2300mHz while sitting in CMOS. Does that seem high? I have no idea what kind of load the CPU is under in CMOS, but I'm guessing it's somewhere between idle and load.

I'll find out in a bit what kind of temps I'll have under Prime, but does anyone have any thoughts? Are these decent temps for just sitting in CMOS or should I try remounting the block before I get all my drives in? If so, are there any tips to getting a good seating (I'm using AS5)?

[sandman001]

Idle temps don't mean much, need full load temps.

[craneage2001]

I realize that, I was just curious if anyone had some general idea how I was doing so far...I have some time to work on it if need be; I won't have an OS up until later tonight.

[sandman001]

Oh, what are your ambient temps?

[UberBlue]

There are known issues mounting the RBX. pHaestus @ procooling did an extra five mounts so he would have enough good mounts for his water-block testing.

Of course DD and the designer deny any mounting problems. Only people who have paid for the block said anything.

[crimedog]

It's really hard to guess temps... I get about 10c over ambient.
As for seating the block, what I do is just following the instructions and compress the springs all the way. I don't use anti-crush pads or anything, but I'm always careful not to have one side down farther than the other. Never even worried about a crushed core, and I know i have good contact.

[SysCrusher]

Originally posted by craneage2001
I just completed my WC setup at home, but my HDs are back at school in my old rig. I've got a Mag3 -> Chev HC(120mm w/shroud) -> RBX -> PVC res. I'm running a 3/4" in to the Mag3 and a 3/4" out into the Chev. HC. The rest of the system is 1/2" tubing. The two outs from the RBX both have a short run to individual inlets on the res.

Enough of the background stuff...I fired up the system after passing leak tests and it wavers between 36-37°C @ 1.8v x 2300mHz while sitting in CMOS. Does that seem high? I have no idea what kind of load the CPU is under in CMOS, but I'm guessing it's somewhere between idle and load.

I'll find out in a bit what kind of temps I'll have under Prime, but does anyone have any thoughts? Are these decent temps for just sitting in CMOS or should I try remounting the block before I get all my drives in? If so, are there any tips to getting a good seating (I'm using AS5)?

Hard to say without an ambient air temp. If you MB has the in-socket temp, then that reading most likely is wrong. You have no air around that socket now like before. Make sure your tubing isn't pulling any where. Could be air in the rad also. My temps never get better unless i get the air out of my rad since it's mounted up at the top of the case. We need an ambient temp to really help. What kind of fans?

[SysCrusher]

Originally posted by UberBlue
There are known issues mounting the RBX. pHaestus @ procooling did an extra five mounts so he would have enough good mounts for his water-block testing.

Of course DD and the designer deny any mounting problems. Only people who have paid for the block said anything.

We all know that's all BS based on hard evidence. Only people denying anything are the ones directly involved with the review.Not to mention your last statement is absolutely untrue unless you can provide hard evidence which I doubt you can.

The guy asked for some thought about his temps, not about your opinion or about a biased review on the block.:mad:

[pelikan]

I would try it with the pads. And maybe mount it two or three times and check your temps to make sure you have a good mount.
Here's a tip to help prevent tubing lifting up the block (from a post by Cathar): With the tubing all hooked up, and your case laying on its back, the block should be able to sit flat on the cpu before you bolt it down.

[johan851]

Syscrusher - that's a perfectly reasonable statement from UberBlue. I mean, just look at the block! It's pretty narrow, and anyone can look at it and logically conclude that there could very well be mounting irregularities. Forums are about opinion...and craneage2001 asked for people's thoughts. Same thing in my mind. The review was one of the best to date, using a lot of help from those considered to be *THE* best waterblock testers.

Temps look to be pretty good to me - a lot better than mine with a Spir@l, if that tells you anything. You might try a remount or two, and if you don't have a shim, that would probably help as well - for better mounting, if nothing else.

[SysCrusher]

Originally posted by johan851
Syscrusher - that's a perfectly reasonable statement from UberBlue. I mean, just look at the block! It's pretty narrow, and anyone can look at it and logically conclude that there could very well be mounting irregularities. Forums are about opinion...and craneage2001 asked for people's thoughts. Same thing in my mind. The review was one of the best to date, using a lot of help from those considered to be *THE* best waterblock testers.


Your right, forums are about opinion. But the width of the block has no bearing what so ever and there has been no conclusive evidence as I doubt there ever will be. I can prove that very easily. Only an opinion from one person. I enjoyed the review also as performance with the blocks is what I'v been waiting to see all along. But the "mounting issue" the reviewer speaks of is nothing but BS. Not to mention they still can't come up with conclusive evidence after all the talk I had with them.

Ask yourself this. Why is it every other review out there had no "mounting issues" that amounted in 2-3C difference but just this one?

I see endless mounting issues out there or on these forums with every block used.

Before I leave it at this, no hard feelings ey? ;)

[SysCrusher]

I'd try pelikan's tip. Works for me when bolting down a block every time.

[craneage2001]

I'm currently running 200x11 @1.6v to get started and I'm hitting ~40°C load...I think I need a reseating....:(

[Cathar]

Originally posted by craneage2001
I'm currently running 200x11 @1.6v to get started and I'm hitting ~40°C load...I think I need a reseating....:(

Just as a suggestion, you may also like to try a little more thermal paste than what you're presently using.

[craneage2001]

I was actually thinking the opposite...I'm using AS5 which I applied using the 1/2 grain + spread with razor method. It was a relatively thin application over the entire core, but it could have been thinner as the AS5 is rather thick...

[Cathar]

Originally posted by craneage2001
I was actually thinking the opposite...I'm using AS5 which I applied using the 1/2 grain + spread with razor method. It was a relatively thin application over the entire core, but it could have been thinner as the AS5 is rather thick...

Just try as I suggested. I think you'll notice the difference. AS5 likes to be spread a little thicker in my experience.

[johan851]

Alright syscrusher, we can leave it at that, I suppose. Sigh...man, that's hard.

Cathar - any explanation why AS5 likes to be thicker? Sounds kinda anti-everything-I've-learned. :p

[Cathar]

Originally posted by johan851
Cathar - any explanation why AS5 likes to be thicker? Sounds kinda anti-everything-I've-learned. :p

I guess there's a vague explanation that I can offer. Every time I've spread it thinly I've yielded results about the same as AS3 which over time degraded into somewhat worse than AS3. nikhsub1 has also experienced this as we swapped experiences with using it. Applying it more thickly yielded better results for me. It still squeezes out the sides anyway so it still ends up being a really thin layer. When I've pulled the block off and inspected it, the paste just appears to made more complete contact, whereas when a thin layer is applied is seems slightly "speckled".

If I were pressed for an explanation then I suspect that due to AS5's thickness (in comparison to the earlier AS pastes) that it is prone to trapping small air-bubbles which don't properly squeeze out. When the AS5 is applied as a thick blob then when it gets squished it seems to displace the air more completely.

Just my random thoughts.

[govern1]

To add my experience in that I've had with this block...
I am currently using the RBX for the AMD64 with no mounting issues. It went on extremely easily and temps are excellent (23 idle, 26 full load). However, I was using the RBX for the Athlon XP and it would never quite seat right, it was always being tilted or pulled in the direction that the tubing was going. No matter how much I tightened it down, it always tilted a little. I remounted it about twenty different times and repeatedly got different temps with each mount. I also tried different amounts of AS5, AS3 and Ceramique. So yes, in my experience (and educated opinion), there are mounting issues with the RBX for the Athlon XP's, but none at all with the AMD64. The block works like a dream with this processor.

Just my experience with it all.

Shawn

[johan851]

Right - the mounting issues mentioned are because of the AthlonXP's narrow die. The block would work great for CPU's with a "heatspreader" (in quotes to keep Cathar happy - THAT'S NOT WHAT IT DOES!). :D But that's why I would recommend using a shim for an RBX/AthlonXP setup.

[craneage2001]

A couple of questions:

Govern: What are you running for volts/wc setup?

Johan: Where's a good source of shims to use in my setup?

Once I get all my progs back installed, I'll try reseating a few times and see what I end up with. The temps are usable now, just not where the should be...

[govern1]

I'm running the MCP600 rev 2 pump, BIX rev 2 with 2 120mm fans in a push-pull setup, a BayRes and a RBX. I'm running the AMD64 3400+ on the K8V with all stock voltages. Ambient temps are about 19 degrees celsius and right now I am idling at 23 degrees. Under load, it goes up to 25-26 degrees. Not too bad. IF you need any other info, just let me know.

Shawn

[SysCrusher]

Originally posted by Cathar


I guess there's a vague explanation that I can offer. Every time I've spread it thinly I've yielded results about the same as AS3 which over time degraded into somewhat worse than AS3. nikhsub1 has also experienced this as we swapped experiences with using it. Applying it more thickly yielded better results for me. It still squeezes out the sides anyway so it still ends up being a really thin layer. When I've pulled the block off and inspected it, the paste just appears to made more complete contact, whereas when a thin layer is applied is seems slightly "speckled".

If I were pressed for an explanation then I suspect that due to AS5's thickness (in comparison to the earlier AS pastes) that it is prone to trapping small air-bubbles which don't properly squeeze out. When the AS5 is applied as a thick blob then when it gets squished it seems to displace the air more completely.

Just my random thoughts.

Does the AS5 feel gritty between your fingers? I'm wondering if the silver is actually sticking together easier when it's spread evenly. I'm using AS3 and to me it seems thick.

[johan851]

Here's the shim I use:

http://www.bestbyte.net/Product.cfm?ProductID=918&CategoryID=6&Keyword=shim

They're available all over the place. Try www.svc.com, www.bestbyte.net, etc. Newegg might even have some.

[SysCrusher]

Originally posted by govern1
To add my experience in that I've had with this block...
I am currently using the RBX for the AMD64 with no mounting issues. It went on extremely easily and temps are excellent (23 idle, 26 full load). However, I was using the RBX for the Athlon XP and it would never quite seat right, it was always being tilted or pulled in the direction that the tubing was going. No matter how much I tightened it down, it always tilted a little. I remounted it about twenty different times and repeatedly got different temps with each mount. I also tried different amounts of AS5, AS3 and Ceramique. So yes, in my experience (and educated opinion), there are mounting issues with the RBX for the Athlon XP's, but none at all with the AMD64. The block works like a dream with this processor.

Just my experience with it all.

Shawn

You'll get that with any block when it comes to hoses pulling.I had the same thing happen with a TC-4 until I found out it was a hose. It's just the die is surface is narrow or small and we're balancing a piece of metal on it. That's the first thing I check is if the hoses are pulling any. A shim will help alot but I havn't seen any for the barton yet. I got and old one for a pally that i used for my heavy self designed block. Doesn't fit the barton though.

[SysCrusher]

Originally posted by johan851
Here's the shim I use:

http://www.bestbyte.net/Product.cfm?ProductID=918&CategoryID=6&Keyword=shim

They're available all over the place. Try www.svc.com, www.bestbyte.net, etc. Newegg might even have some.

LOL thanks johan. I just never look in the right place.

[craneage2001]

So just how tight can I put the block down without damage? I see some say that they fully compressed the springs...mine are about 3/4 compressed. I imagine if the springs were fully comp, there would be much less chance of the hoses pulling...

[Vengance_01]

I hadthe same problem as you. A tube was pulling the waterclock off of the die thus not letting it make good contact Heres what I had to do. Mount everything in your case, IE Pump, and rad. Then meuser the tubing this way. I re-did my tubbing this way and brought my temps back down to where they were before. Also With the radiator, make sure its getting complete fresh air. I had to mod my case. mabey tonight or tomarrow I will post pics.

[craneage2001]

1) The tubing is very flexible stuff and I did cut it to length with everything mounted in my case. Without being held down, the block sits fairly level on the cpu, all things considered.

2) I cut a large hole in the front of my case to allow fresh air in to my shrouded HC (120mm fan).

I reseated it a bit ago...the AS5 on it was compressed quite nicely from the previous mount and it fully covered the core. As an experiment, I've got a window fan blowing on my case with the side open, but I really makes no difference I've found...

[pHaestus]

syscrusher:

The lack of any basic understanding of the rules of statics (yay Archimedes) does not make them any less relevant to the world we live in.

A more helpful comment: The mounting irregularities would presumably be lessened with greater force on the springs (not recommended by AMD), a wider block (not necessary according to Dangerden), a heatspreader (XPs have none), or a shim (though I've never used one).

[SysCrusher]

Originally posted by pHaestus
syscrusher:

The lack of any basic understanding of the rules of statics (yay Archimedes) does not make them any less relevant to the world we live in.

lol How basic do you want to get pHaestus. Shall we talk about conditions for equilibrium?

Originally posted by pHaestus

A more helpful comment: The mounting irregularities would presumably be lessened with greater force on the springs (not recommended by AMD), a wider block (not necessary according to Dangerden), a heatspreader (XPs have none), or a shim (though I've never used one).

Question. How much force does it take to compress a spring 50% verses 99%?