View Full Version : Ti4200 vs ATI8500
well, let the dogs out. i lean towards the Ti.
emilio
FREEman_ICD
02-19-04, 03:17 PM
Well, my old ti4200 (currently on the floor while my p4 HS+fan is being seated on it) scored 1446 on 3dmkar03
Got my 9800 pro today, I got a score of 6745 STOCK, with the original drivers
ti4200, will be a much better card. and this is coming from a guy that owns and is currently using an 8500.
4200 at stock speed beats a 8500 by a decent amount. Also most will clock close to a 4600 so the 8500 just can simply not compete.
the two cards are from different generations, the 8500 was originally supposed to compete with the GF3. So the ti4200 would be better.
Yuriman
02-19-04, 04:12 PM
The 8500 has much better IQ, and personaly, ive obtained over 12500 3dmarks w/o a voltmod. With the 8500, AF is virtualy free, while the ti takes a larger hit. Also, general 2d IQ is better on ati. The ti4200 has more speed, but given the choice, I would take a good overclocking 8500 any day, so long as it came with a stock speed of 275/550. You realy have to watch that anymore, many 8500's come at much lower clocks.
4200, though it's like 1.5 times the price.
ElectroX
02-19-04, 04:55 PM
I currently am running a Ti4200 in my main rig, and an 8500 128MB in my secondary. I'll swap out the card later tonight and post results...
What are the best Radeon drivers to bench with?
Yuriman
02-19-04, 05:21 PM
People say 3.2's and 3.10's.
brennan77
02-19-04, 05:46 PM
But should we use 3dmark as the only gauge?
ElectroX
02-19-04, 05:50 PM
Hey yuri, how about a link to the radeon drivers?
DDR-PIII
02-19-04, 05:55 PM
8500 better IQ, ti4200 fast, but you cant even compare these two haha, its liek comparing a 9800xt to a gf3ti200 :
dguy6789
02-19-04, 07:36 PM
Ti4200 is MUCH faster then an 8500. The 8500 has a very SMALL iq increase, and AF is about 30% slower performance, not "free". Add to that the fact that the ti4200 can oc to ti4600 speeds most of the time, and it is newer, that makes it a descion even captain obvious could pick correctly.
Yuriman
02-19-04, 07:47 PM
Its not THAT much faster than a full radeon 8500, I have one that will score 13k in 01 and 1.5k in 03. Not bad, considering its a $50 card.
ElectroX
02-19-04, 08:18 PM
Where can you get a 128MB 8500 for $50? even on the 'bay they're like 75-80
DDR-PIII
02-19-04, 08:19 PM
what kinda threadwas this anyway ? i think he was just trying to start arguements:P
no arguments, i am really trying to choose, and i didn't know the ti was so much superior. i guess the higher pricetag is for real. Yuri, i know you're a 8500 fan, but maybe we should admit that most 8500 are not like your well-picked uberclocked 8500.
emilio
Steven4563
02-20-04, 05:29 AM
as i see it i loved my TI4200 but the QI was crap it cant even compare to ATi cards
dguy6789
02-20-04, 07:56 AM
not to mention his uber clocked 8500 to get that score had 100% artifacts on the screen, which completly invalidates the score. and yes, the 8500 is maybe 60% as fast as a ti4200. that is a big difference.
PreservedSwine
02-20-04, 08:17 AM
W/ no AA or AF, Ti4200 is better
AF and no AA, R8500 is better
AA and no AF, Ti4200 is better
AA and AF, neither...buy a better card.....
maan making an informed decision is haaard. also is the 8500LE any good? or is it a crippled 8500?
emilio
dguy6789
02-20-04, 12:29 PM
an 8500LE is slower then an 8500, which is slower then a ti4200. Dont listen to ppl trying to give you false info, ti4200 is faster then an 8500 hands down. read some reviews.
PreservedSwine
02-20-04, 01:07 PM
Originally posted by dguy6789
an 8500LE is slower then an 8500, which is slower then a ti4200. Dont listen to ppl trying to give you false info, ti4200 is faster then an 8500 hands down. read some reviews.
And he'll see that not only is the R8500 faster than a Ti4200 when AF is applied, but the R8500 is faster than a Ti4600 (With AF applied)
The Ti4200 is a more robust card, but not by very much...and ATI's Anisotropic Filtering algorithm is MULTIPLE times faster than nVidia's....
The Ti4200 is faster, except when you enable a healthy dose of AF....
AF is free on the RADEON's, but takes a heavy toll on nVidia hardware...
Supertrucker
02-20-04, 02:19 PM
the ti4200 is faster, by about 10% under normal overclocking conditions. the 8500le can be a good card, it is a full 8500 core at a lower clock of 250 instead of 275, but there are many les with bad ram, if your getting an le you want a 250/250 card.
and my 8500LE (w/ bga ram) could do 300/300 with no cooling mods or volt mods, which was good for about 11.5k in 3dmark 2k1 WITHOUT turning the image quality slider to performance (all i do to "optimize" for 3dmark is close backround tasks), ZERO atrifacts. and this is in an amd system, a well built p4 would score better. 2k1 is very system dependant so its hard to judge cards alone that way.
what it comes down to is that an 8500 is a good value, and so is a ti4200, if you only have enough for an 8500 get that, they are still good cards, but if you have enough for a 4200, it is worth the extra money
Yuriman
02-20-04, 02:38 PM
Read what I said. I wouldnt take an LE over a ti4200, but I would take a full one over it. AND it wasnt artifacting at 335/330. I could get about 340/340 w/artifacts, and get nearly 13.8k points in 01.
ElectroX
02-20-04, 02:53 PM
How do I tell if I have one of the fast 8500's? I know it's not LE but you said there were fast and slow ones...
I'd have to lean over to the ATi side and say the 8500.
Yes, the TI4200 is faster. No doubt about that :D However, the 8500 has way better IQ (I was horrified by how bad my best friend's 4200 looked) and is "reasonably" fast. Back before I fried my 8500, I played UT2K3 with full AA and AF (@1024x768) and it was always around 40FPS if I remember right. Not as fast as a TI, but still definatly playable.
If you're thinking of buying either card, I'm assuming you aren't exactly looking for it to be future-proof. Because of this, I'd say the 8500 wins. If the card will be in your main gaming rig or something, you should get the 4200, or wait a bit longer and upgrade to someing current :D
JigPu
Originally posted by dguy6789
an 8500LE is slower then an 8500, which is slower then a ti4200. Dont listen to ppl trying to give you false info, ti4200 is faster then an 8500 hands down. read some reviews.
http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTAyNjc2MjI0MXRHR29GcmpGaE1fMl82X 2wuZ2lm
http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTAyNjc2MjI0MXRHR29GcmpGaE1fM18xX 2wuZ2lm
http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTAyNjc2MjI0MXRHR29GcmpGaE1fM18yX 2wuZ2lm
http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTAyNjc2MjI0MXRHR29GcmpGaE1fM18zX 2wuZ2lm
http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTAyNjc2MjI0MXRHR29GcmpGaE1fM180X 2wuZ2lm
http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTAyNjc2MjI0MXRHR29GcmpGaE1fNF8xX 2wuZ2lm
http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTAyNjc2MjI0MXRHR29GcmpGaE1fNF8yX 2wuZ2lm
Originally posted by JigPu
I'd have to lean over to the ATi side and say the 8500.
Yes, the TI4200 is faster. No doubt about that :D However, the 8500 has way better IQ (I was horrified by how bad my best friend's 4200 looked) and is "reasonably" fast. Back before I fried my 8500, I played UT2K3 with full AA and AF (@1024x768) and it was always around 40FPS if I remember right. Not as fast as a TI, but still definatly playable.
If you're thinking of buying either card, I'm assuming you aren't exactly looking for it to be future-proof. Because of this, I'd say the 8500 wins. If the card will be in your main gaming rig or something, you should get the 4200, or wait a bit longer and upgrade to someing current :D
JigPu
I agree. At first, the 3DMark scores had me convinced that a Ti4200 was the way to go, but after seeing how the two cards performed in real life, the 8500's IQ beat the 4200's hands down. Each seemed just about as fast as one another.
Overclocker550
02-20-04, 05:38 PM
Originally posted by Yuriman
Its not THAT much faster than a full radeon 8500, I have one that will score 13k in 01 and 1.5k in 03. Not bad, considering its a $50 card.
prove me with a compare link cause my ti200 scores as high as my 8500 in 3dmark and many games. 250/525 can hold its own against my 300/320 :eek:
Steven4563
02-20-04, 05:53 PM
yes the TI4200 might be alittle faster but id rather play a game with better IQ @ 60fps than play a game and crap IQ @ 75fps
Most people here would agree with me here
Originally posted by Overclocker550
prove me with a compare link cause my ti200 scores as high as my 8500 in 3dmark and many games. 250/525 can hold its own against my 300/320 :eek:
Who needs a link...a simple search on Futuremark shows the 8500 can do 14k :rolleyes:
3DMarks aren't life... :rolleyes:
brennan77
02-20-04, 08:32 PM
Originally posted by Gautam
3DMarks aren't life... :rolleyes:
Exactly.
mmh i think this issue just died for me, a cheap 9500 just came in the picture. i am ASSUMING it is better than any of these cards right? cause if it is not, then WTF is wrong with videocard's model numbers, i mean, 9200 is worse than 9000 wich is worse than 8500, but the 9100 is better than all these except maybe the 8500, and an FX5200 is crap compared to a two years old Ti4200. I am going crazy!!!
emilio
Hehe. The 9500 is far better than every other card you listed. If its old enough, you may have a shot at modding it to a 9700. Even without the mod, it's a great performer.
Yuriman
02-21-04, 10:28 AM
A 9500 256bit, L shaped ram, is ~9600pro. A 9500 128bit is better than 9600np, not as good as pro. The 9500 isnt THAT much faster in raw speed than an 8500/9100/ti4200, maybe just 15-25%, but the IQ is INCREDIBLE compared to them. THe 9100 blows the ti4200 away in IQ, and when my 9500 died and I had to use my 9100 again, I almost cried.
Originally posted by Tazon
i mean, 9200 is worse than 9000 wich is worse than 8500, but the 9100 is better than all these except maybe the 8500, and an FX5200 is crap compared to a two years old Ti4200. I am going crazy!!!
emilio
9200 isnt worse then a 9000...it IS a 9000 (with 8x AGP)
The 8500 was renamed to the 9100 when they realized it was faster then the 9000 and was high in demand
Since 9100 was already taken, they had to name the "new" 9000 the 9200, of course.
drewthomas14
02-21-04, 11:42 AM
I have personally owned a 8500le 128mb flashed to 8500 because it had the 8500 ram. I got it for 80shipped from newegg. I have compared the iq with my friends msi geforce 4 ti4200 128mb and the 8500 is noticeably better. Likewise with the 9500 as I stated in another thread. I , personaly , think the ti4200 and 8500 are both great bang for the buck cards. I would go for whichever you can get cheapest. here is one of my 3dmark scores http://service.futuremark.com/compare?2k1=6968385 , i had a higher one with my fsb @ 220 ,but i must have saved over it somehow. my 9500->9500pro only makes ~ 2000 more in 3dmark2001 than my 8500le , but it really shines in 3dmark2003.
I have owned both the 8500 (one that OC'ed very well at that) and a few TI4200's and the 4200 wins every time. The 8500 is barely faster than a good TI200 :rolleyes: . The 8500 does look noticeably better though.
Yuriman
02-21-04, 08:10 PM
Barely faster than a Ti200? How long has it been since you used the 8500? With the newest drivers, its easily faster than a Ti500.
Originally posted by TUK101
I have owned both the 8500 (one that OC'ed very well at that) and a few TI4200's and the 4200 wins every time. The 8500 is barely faster than a good TI200 :rolleyes: . The 8500 does look noticeably better though.
Maybe the day of release, with the first (garbage) drivers. But since, it has change quite a bit, and is a lot faster then a Ti200
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