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1700+ Tbred vs. 2500-M - Great Test

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peevuto

Registered
Joined
Apr 20, 2004
Got my 2500-M today and plunked er in after running some benchies on my 1700+ Tbred. Here are the results

1700+, 12X184, 2208 mhz, 1.55v: 3D2001 = 15632
2500-M, 12X184, 2208mhz, 1.55v: 3D2001 = 16472

What a great test as it shows exactly what the extra L2 cache will get you. Not to mention that the 2500-M is merely at 1.55v, and runs amazinly cool at that voltage (28-30 C, on air). Lots of room left on this baby I feel.

2500M stepping is AXMH2500FQQ4C IQYHA 0408 XPMW, and I know a supplier who will guarantee this stepping, but there are only 6 left!!
 
Nice work. 3DMark 2001 works the CPU harder than 3DMark 2003 to illustrate the point of the CPU/L2 cache.

From 15632 to 16472, the improvement is 5.37%. It is in line with the 5% average number we have been using for the 512 KB L2 Barton vs the 256 KB L2 Tbred, both running the same CPU frequency.


hitechjb1 said:
Cache and CPU performance

There are two processors A and B both running at 2.5 GHz, i.e. 2,500,000,000 clock cycles per sec. A basic CPU operation requires one clock cycle.

One processor A has a larger L2 cache, say 512 KB. Another processor B has a smaller L2 cache, say 256 KB.

L1 and L2 cache are for storing frequently used data for the CPU, temporarily until new data has to be swapped in from, and old data has to be swapped out to main memory. The processors can read from and write to the cache with very few clock cycles (cache latency).

Main memory (aka L3 in PC) can store much much more amount of data (e.g. 1 GB main memory would be 2000 times of 512 KB L2). To read/write the main memory, it requires much much more CPU cycle, say 30 - 80 times.

Hard drive (aka L4 in PC) can store even more data, ..., basically the universe of the data in your system, but it takes even more time, and it occurs during paging when data is not found in main memory in a computer system.

L1 cache, L2 cache, main memory (L3), hard disk (L4) form the so called memory hierarchy.

The larger the cache, the chance (probability) of finding data there is higher. Ananlysis shows that when the cache size is above certain size for a given CPU architecture, CPI and cache latency, the probability will level off. Typically, the probability is around 85 - 95% for L2 ranging from 256 KB to 512 KB or even 1 MB.

The time to read/write data to the main memory typically requires many many more CPU cycles (see earlier number). So if the CPU needs data that is not in the cache (called cache miss), it would have to wait until the data arrives in the cache again from the main memory (many more cycles later than if it is found in the cache).

Even if both CPU A and B are running at the same frequency of 2.5 GHz, CPU A will finish a given job sooner than CPU B since the probability for CPU A to find data in the cache is higher than that of CPU B. CPU A has less cache miss than CPU B.

Analysis has shown that, by doubling the L2 cache size, the overall performance would be improved by 0 - 10%+ over a wide range of applications, some more and some less, averaged typically by say 5%.

That is why we usually say a Barton (512 KB L2) performs 5% better than a 1700+ (256 KB L2) running at same frequency, or the 1700+ has to run 125 MHz faster to break even with a Barton at 2.5 GHz. Few months ago, a Tbred B DLT3C 1700+/1800+ overclock about 100 MHz better than a desktop Barton, so they were about tie. But recently the mobile Barton overclocks equally good, and in many time even higher than the 1700+/1800+, so the mobile Barton is a better choice for performance (apart from the price difference).


What happens to programs running in CPU with smaller and bigger L2 cache (page 17)

Some remarks on cache latency, cache size, memory latecny and memory bandwidth (for A64's) (page 19)
 
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This was shown way back when the 2500+ Barton started taking the crown of OCing from the 1700+

That extra 256kb L2 Cache really helps in benchies, and in performance if you ask me.
 
In a similar vein, what performance difference does the Duron only having 64 KB of cache make? Has anyone ever done any tests on that?

Or should I make that my project for the next week or two?
 
Biggles, madshrimp did a comparison of the duron to tbred and the difference in 3DMark was around 5%. Anandtech had a similar review awhile back, comparing the cache jump going from 256k - 512k for AMD/Intel. For AMD's Unreal and other games showed around an 8% difference. It may have ever been higher!

So those combined, you're looking about a 13.5% difference in gaming between a Duron & Barton at the same speed.

On the other hand, almost all of the other benchies showed less than a 2% increase for general productivity.

That said, the Duron is still the best buy at half the price, even though they don't OC as high. ;)
 
I'm interested in a mobile Athlon XP. What's the best one to get to beat my Athlon XP 2400+ @ 2.5Ghz? Also, I believe some Athlon-M's only have 256KB of L2 cache. I don't want to make the mistake of picking one of those up. I want 512KB of L2 cache.

Thanks.:beer:
 
False Christian said:
I'm interested in a mobile Athlon XP. What's the best one to get to beat my Athlon XP 2400+ @ 2.5Ghz? Also, I believe some Athlon-M's only have 256KB of L2 cache. I don't want to make the mistake of picking one of those up. I want 512KB of L2 cache.

Thanks.:beer:

Make sure you get a Mobile Barton and you'll have the 512 L2 cache. You can't go wrong w/ either the XP2500M or the XP2600M.
 
wicked-one said:
Biggles, madshrimp ...jump going from 256k - 512k for AMD/Intel. For AMD's Unreal and other games showed around an 8% difference.

Are you serious!?!?!....Holy cow. If this is true Im gaunteed 20k with my current setup if I buy a mobile Barton.

18568 (avg) * .08 = 1484 + 18568 = 20052.8
18954 (high) * .08 = 1516.32 + 18954 = 20470.32

:eek:

16472 - 15632 = 840

840 / 15632 = 5%

Thus:

My guestimated scores are = 19496.4 (avg)

=19901.7 :eek:

And to think Im only at 2.3ghz....In addition to the cache Ill tack on an additional 300mhz and about 10 more on the FSB:eek:

Thnx for the heads up....cant wait to get my Barton
 
Are you serious!?!?!....Holy cow. If this is true Im gaunteed 20k with my current setup if I buy a mobile Barton.
Yup :cool: I was trying to find the link and found another review that actually listed a 10% difference in gaming benchmarks.

Plus you will no doubt overclock alot higher. My DLTC3 maxed out at 2425. I have one of the crappier "A" cores and it still hits 2480. The "I"s average about 2630.

Think it was Twelve Orphans over @ EOCF did the upgrade to break 20k, although he was on an unlocked Barton. Oddly enough he was at 247 x 9.5. Now I think he's at 247 *10.5. His 2001 is 21,728 now. He was just shy of 20k by like 30 points before that.
 
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