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StoneRyno

Member
Joined
Apr 30, 2004
Ok I have a KD7-raid with a xp 1800 so far i have managed to get it to 133 x 13.5 (on boot reported to be 1810 mhz). The PCI and AGP can't be locked.

I have 3 choices for ratios 3:2:1, 4:2:1, and 5:2:1. I understand how the ratio changes the PCI and AGP clocks. Currently the ratio is 4:2:1. I was wondering if I increase the FSB from 133 but keep the ratio the same, what effects on the PCI and AGP can I expect from the increased FSB?

Also I noticed that for RAM I only have 3 choices for its clock 133, 166, and 200. So how do i deal with that when increasing the FSB? If say I don't go all the way to 166 for the CPU what sould I do for the RAM?

Now about CPU voltage. Currently its set to 1.6. How much should I expect to increase it with changes of the FSB? and multiplier? I was thinking perhaps I could get more speed by just increasing the multiplier and staying away from the FSB if its too much trouble to mess with it.

Like if I increase the multiplier to say 15 (133 x 15) how far would be too far for the voltage. I looked over the 1800 o/c list and say many over 2 ghz with voltages ranging from 1.8 as high as 2.9 for 1800s.

Abit KD7-RAID | 1800+ with volcano 12
crucial PC2100 512MB x2 (1024MB)
intake 3 Evercool 80mm (3000rpm) aluminum
out side 1 Evercool 120mm (2200rpm) aluminum
PSU Allied 400W
Leadtek GeForce4 MX440 AGP8x 64MB
2x 120GB and 2x 250GB WD 7200 8MB
 
The ratios are the ratios of the fsb:agp clock:pci clock

For example:

4:2:1 with a 133fsb = 133MHz (fsb):66MHz (agp):33MHz (pci)
-the AGP clock would be based off a 4:2 ratio of the fsb so it would be half the speed of the fsb.
-The PCI clock is in a 2:1 ratio with the AGP clock so the PCI clock is 33MHz

5:2:1 with 133fsb = 133MHz : 53.2MHz : 26.1MHz
-the AGP clock would be based off a 5:2 ratio of the fsb making it 53.2MHz
-The PCI clock is in a 2:1 ratio with the AGP clock so the PCI clock is 26.1MHz

Keep the RAM set at the default speed of your FSB to keep it in-sync with you fsb so it operates more efficiently because there would be no wait time.

With the voltages you probably will want to increse it .05 volts for every 100MHz, but also test it's stability and try to get it running stable on the lowest voltage possible to avoid excessive damage to the CPU.

Good Luck ;)
 
Cool thx I'll sit down and calculate how much voltage based on this info might be needed.

I'm Still wondering though how the system reacts to slightly higher and lower clock speeds on the AGP and PCI. Like if I increase the FSB inbetween 133 and 166. If the ratio is kept at 4:2:1 then they will be higher and if I change it to 5:2:1 then they will be lower.

Another question about the ram. If I don't increase the FSB all the way to 166, with changing to 166 on the ram will it slow back to the FSB setting?
 
StoneRyno said:
I'm Still wondering though how the system reacts to slightly higher and lower clock speeds on the AGP and PCI. Like if I increase the FSB inbetween 133 and 166. If the ratio is kept at 4:2:1 then they will be higher and if I change it to 5:2:1 then they will be lower.
Depends on your system. My KD7 runs around 195-197MHz FSB with the 5:2:1 divider (So the PCI bus is around 39MHz) without problems. But, I get some corruption on ide devices if I push the FSB up to 200MHz (40MHz PCI bus). I haven't noticed any other problems with the onboard devices or my other cards (like my OEM radeon 8500LE). As for running the PCI bus under 33MHz, ideally that wouldn't cause problems, as the PCI ups was origionally speced at "up to" 33MHz. Some older pentium boxes (like the 50MHz) ran teir PCI bus at 25MHz. However, some ECS K7S5A users have noticed some problems with the PCI bus underclocked, so be on the lookout.

StoneRyno said:

Another question about the ram. If I don't increase the FSB all the way to 166, with changing to 166 on the ram will it slow back to the FSB setting?
I haven't really run mine under 166MHz, but at over 166MHz, setting the ram speed to 166MHz simply synces it with the FSB speed, I believe.
 
Ok I have ran more tests to confirm and/or try different settings. Here are my findings. If you wish to skip reading about my RAM test/confirm FSB suspisions move to the paragraph after for my next question.

When changing the ram to 166 it runs at 333 no downsizing to match the FSB. also the reverse is true. When its set to 133 it doesn't go up to meet the FSB. With that said it seems whatever i do outside of keeping the CPU FSB at default 133 i get errors in in the 1st few parts of memtest86. I figured since i know the cpu will run stable at 1810 mhz I would match this as close as possible in the tests that follow. 1st I thought (long shot) that the RAM would run at 166 so I changed it and the FSB to 166x11 (this of course didn't work system didn't make it very far before I got a bluescreen. I changed the settings back to stable and made the following, 140x13, and then 138x13. I came to the conclusion that I am stuck at default FSB or getting better RAM.

Following the voltage guideline suggested by AzN_LuvER_4_LyF I tried 133x14 at 1.675v. System booted without a problem made it all the way into windows and started prime95 torture test with folding@home and united devices running along side it. With these running I started messing around with various other apps working on misc stuff. Suffice it to say it wasn't very long before I got a bluescreen and windows rebooted.

Here is my question. Is it worth increasing the voltage to try and stabalize the system or is there other things I can do that would make this work? Or have I reached my systems o/c limit?

Also while I'm thinking about it. If I take the heatsink off (system off and no power of course) to get the numbers off the sticker that has the stepping etc on it. Do I have to reapply the AC5 before putting it back on? I should have realized these numbers might come in handy before I put the stuff on etc.

Thx sorry for the long post hope you don't mind helping me out more. I added a signature so hopefully it makes it on this post.
 
Here is my question. Is it worth increasing the voltage to try and stabalize the system or is there other things I can do that would make this work? Or have I reached my systems o/c limit?

If increasing the voltage doesn't do anything at all towards your oc, you are probably at your limit since your memory is at default speed.

Also while I'm thinking about it. If I take the heatsink off (system off and no power of course) to get the numbers off the sticker that has the stepping etc on it. Do I have to reapply the AC5 before putting it back on? I should have realized these numbers might come in handy before I put the stuff on etc.

The numbers would be good. It is probably not necessary to apply more as5, but it wouldn't hel to apply a tiny bit more when you put the hsf back on.

Thx sorry for the long post hope you don't mind helping me out more. I added a signature so hopefully it makes it on this post.

Don't worry ;) no problem
 
ok here goes the numbers. I added em into my sig. Definately going to have to reapply the AC5 when i started the system back up and folding@home being ran at boot as normal the cpu temp was about 5c higher at that load than normal. I was hoping to not have to considering how much AC5 costs. Even though it goes a long way lol.
 
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Your PC 2100 RAM is only rated at 133MHz, and you probably won't get a huge OC out of it. That's too bad, because your board might be able to hit the high 190s stably FSB-wise (depending on your hdd). If you are trying for FSBs thatleave your PCI bus out of spec by a large margin, try disabling the onboard raid, if you have it. My experience with onboard raid (althoug not on my KD7, on an MSI KT3 Ultra2-R I used to have, w/ a promise raid chipset) is that it causes problems at lower FSBs than built-in ide controllers.

As far as voltage increases go, don't follow any guidelines except this:
1) Raise your cpu speed until it becomes unstable.
2) Increase voltage until it becomes stable again, back off if your temps are too hig, or you are no longer comfortable with the voltage. Increased cooling will also help stability.
3) repeat until you get bored, hit a wall, or get temps and voltages that are too high.

Your T-bred A probably won't do more than 2GHz no matter what you do to it. What are your temps like? Allied PSUs are a little low-end, what are your voltages like?

edit: remember to be careful with increasing vcore, it will shorten the life of your CPU.
 
Max PCI bus was at 140 FSB 4:2:1 for 35 I believe it is the ram holding it back from going to 2 ghz or i need to go much higher on the voltage to get it without changing the FSB but I'm leaning towards the ram due to the errors encountered in the different FSB test in my last post. I imagine that with some pc2700 i could up the fsb to 166 and go to 5:2:1 ratio and keep the 66/33 apg/pci.

A quick statement about voltages. I know 1.9v pushs the temp up to about 50c maybe higher CPU core, almost immidiately upon booting into windows, and the volcano 12 fan spun up to 5000 rpms. Plus 1.9 is about a 25% increase if I did my math right. 2.0 would be ~33%.

Temps. I'll listed em by sensor and what I named them since there is an uncertainty as to what the non CPU ones are actually sensing.

Depending on room temp (70 - not more than 80 F) with the AC on it never gets above 72F and if i forget to turn it on over 80F (i try not to fogrt so that is rare).

I have LM90 Remote [CPU Core] (range 42-45c), LM90 Local [CPU ext] (35-38c), WinBond 1 [case?] (39-42c), and WinBond 2 [???] (34-37c)

over a 24 hour perdiod according to MBM 5 here are the voltages
(300 readouts)
Core0 (CPU) avg 1.6v high 1.63v low 1.57v
Core1 (RAM?) is steady at 3.33v
+3.3 is steady at 1.54v
+5 avg 5.07v high 5.08v low 5.05v
+12 avg 11.97v high 12.04v low 11.92v
-12 is steady at 2.58v
-5 is steady at 3.38v

I'll be happy if I accomplish a 2 ghz o/c on this pc. I would say that would be a good 1st time accomplishment.

I am considering investing in some new ram as that gives me the potencial of future cpu upgrades. the KD7 supports upto like XP 3000 or somewhere around it i think. I may in time disable the onboard raid but in the mean time it holds the 2 120s. And with the 2 250GB on the standard IDE and the CD drive on the other IDE I would have to remove the CD to put the 120s on the IDE.

I calculated out wattage usage using some assumed numbers along with calculated numbers. I'll post that info to this thread when I get home. As added info.

Thanks so much
 
IMO, 1.9v is a little high for your cooling on a tbred A (with a 1.5v default). But, I'm more conservative with voltage than most. I have a tbred-B (1.6v default) that I don't take over 1.775v. RAM would definately be a good investment. If I remember correctly, the promise onboard controller I had actually cut out at around 35-36MHz, but that could have been a fluke or the cheap implementation by MSI. Do you know what chipset the KD7-R uses for raid?
 
I agree on 1.9v being high I only set it to that and boot the system to see how the volcano 12 would react. I'm cocerned about runnning it above 1.8v thats 20% increase. As promised here is a rundown on power. Whats hooked up and the stats off the psu sticker.

psu
(+3.3)----(+5v)----(+12v)----(-12v)-------(-5v)--------(+5VSB)
28 A------30 A------15 A------0.8 A---------0.3 A-------2 A
[--220 watts--]----------------9.6 watts---1.5 watts--10 watts
[--------380 watts--------]

-------------(+3.3)------(+5)------(+12)-----Watts
Mobo------3.00 A------2.00 A---0.50 A-----25.90---(assumed tomshardware)
CPU---------------------------------6.63-------79.56---(calculated using amd cpu specs)*
RAM x2-------------------2.00-----------------10 ea---(assumed toms hardware)
VID CRD---6.0 A--------2.00------------------29.80---(assumed toms hardware)
CAP CRD---???----------???------???---------???------(couldn't find specs)
250GBx2---???----------???------???---------21.4-----(max each according to WD)
120GBx2---???----------???------???---------19-------(max each according to WD)
DVD-----------------------1.10-----1.10-------18.7----(from drive)
CDRW--------------------1.50-----1.50-------25.5----(from drive)
Fans x3-----------------------------0.15-------1.8-----(from fan)
Fan----------------------------------0.38-------4.56----(from fan)
KB-------------------------0.60------------------3-------(from KB)
Mouse--------------------0.10------------------0.5-----(from mouse)

Total: 291.32 watts

* I = [(CPU Vcore x CPU Core Current) / 12] x 1.25
I = [(1.6v x 39.87) / 12] x 1.25

This probably doesn't look the greatest as the font doesn't line up well and tabs don't seem to work. But I think its readable.
 
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