Come laugh at the noob and help him fix his 2600+

Ok first things first, Hi. As you can gather I'm new here and also new to the overclocking business. I've had a search thru the forums and gleaned some know how but I just know that you folks are full of knowledge and won't mind sharing it again even if it has been covered before ( please feel free to direct me to any links that you feel will help if you prefer not to repeat yourselves.)

Now my problem. Bought a 2600+ and an Asus KT400 at the back end of last year and had no problem with the build as my rudimentary knowledge is quite good and I have an old networking degree. Now the bios set the clock speed and multiplyer by default and I have a perfectly happy system running at 1917mhz and that's the problem. I know that the clock speed should be between 2.08ghz and 2.18ghz.
The bios allows lots of settings in auto and manual mode and the stepping is very controllable but I'm a pansy when it comes to messing with it. When I tried on a number of occasions to use the auto settings to up the clock speed to a speed within the cpu's reported clock I have always got a system crash on reboot that is always so severe that it ruins the file structure of XP and nothing short of a clean install will work and then I'm back to 1.917ghz as the only stable setting. Due to this I have been loathe to mess with it.
So, I'm au fait with hardware and have built over 100 systems over the years, OC is where I'm clueless due to a lack of never learning, I'm hoping to change that from today. (The last thing I OC was a PII 400 back in the day when it was THE Ninja PC but I've tried nothing since.)

Firstly I just want to get this system running at the manufacturers clock speed of 2.13ghz and then look at my OC options ( as I would need to review the cooling, I have the retail fan at the moment). This is where I hope you all can help. I'll post as much info on the cpu and board/bios and hopefully you brainboxes will advise me. Here's hoping.

• Processor Properties:
• Version AMD Athlon(TM) XP 2600+
• External Clock 166 MHz
• Maximum Clock 2250 MHz
• Current Clock 1916 MHz
• Voltage 1.6 V
• CPUID Revision 06A0h
• Extended CPUID Revision 07A0h

Now for the motherboard report. *Aida goes a bit silly here and reports my cpu wrongly as a 2500+ but it's definately a Barton 2600+ as it was retail in the box.. I`ll post it tho as it may be relevant. The actual settings in the bios ( default by bios on build) are:-

1917mhz 11.5 X 166/33 @ 1.65V ( the auto options for clock speed are 1150, 1533, 1917 and 2300 the multiplyer is not changeable in auto )

• Motherboard:
• Motherboard Name Asus A7V8X
• Motherboard Chipset VIA VT8377 Apollo KT400
• BIOS Properties: ASUS A7V8X-X ACPI BIOS Revision 1006
• *CPU Type AMD Athlon XP-A, 1900 MHz (5.75 x 330) 2500+

Ok then folks, educate me. I hope that's enough information and I'm sorry it's a bit of a laborious post but I'd rather get it right than have people complaining that I've not followed forum guidelines ( which would be a first for me). As I said I've not messed with the manual settings as I am sick of having to install XP again but I expect someone out there understands where I'm going wrong.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated and I know most of you are in the US so I'll wait patiently for any answers.

WELCOME TO THE FORUMS!!!

1917MHz is about right for a barton 2600. that would be slow for a t-bred, but not for a barton.

1.9GHz is stock for your Barton. No doubt that Via board is corrupting your XP install when you try to overclock. 2.3 is a ginormous jump anyway.

I didn't see your RAM listed, but you will probably have a very difficult time overclocking with the VIA. I had a KT400a board that would only allow an increase of 6fsb. It was pitiful! It also kept giving me random BSODs, mainly when I tried to use my secondary IDE hard drive, but sometimes just randomly.

If you really want to try overclocking at all, I'd highly recommend you switch to an nForce2 Ultra chipset before you do anything else.

Still want to play with it, print this out in case it corrupts your XP install again.

First, I suggest you read this sticky on basic overclocking:
http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/showthread.php?t=20942

Switch everything over to manual and change your default multiplier so you can see if your chip is locked. (Your default multi is 11.5 and fsb is 166). Try switching to 11 x 166fsb and see if the underclock sticks when you exit the bios.

Next set the multi to 11.5 and raise the fsb by 5. If XP is not corrupted, you will need to test for stability at this point by using a program like Prime95.

You can get most of the tools you need for OC'ing here (including Prime95):
http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/showthread.php?t=61331

If that's stable, you're overclocked!

Thanks for the replies. I was certain that I read the stock speed for this was 2.08-2.13ghz and I thought I was being short changed but I will warn you and you might want to make note of this for future refernce. I drink. A lot.

I certainly will have a go at the OC at some point, I`m looking at some cooling options and may well go with a pre mod case that throws in a water cooling system I've seen at my local computer fair.
Wicked-One, I`ve not posted a sig yet as I currently run 4 rigs, 3 of them 64bit AMDs, I'm still working out what I have in what as I'm bit of a meddler. Overclocking this 2600 rig is more like a hobby to try as I'm retired and I just want stuff to do if you get my meaning. As far as I can see the OC options with the Via board are superb, increments of 1 and over 50 settings to try. It's the changing the vcore and stuff I need to get my head around and perhaps use a spare drive with a bare install so that I lose nothing of import. I don't mess with my 64bit network as I run a large ftp server and MP network om it but this seems a good project.
I've used Nforce 2 chipsets before and my FX51 server uses the nforce 3 but you would be surprised at how much slower the nf2 is than the KT400 in benchtests. It's a budget board on a budget system but I've been very impressed.
Your advice however is sound and I'll definately take lots of it before trying anything, no point going in half-cocked as the missus would say. If you would be kind enough to furnish me with your address I'll send the boys round just as soon as I break it for good.

I've used Nforce 2 chipsets before and my FX51 server uses the nforce 3 but you would be surprised at how much slower the nf2 is than the KT400 in benchtests. It's a budget board on a budget system but I've been very impressed.

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Not trying to knock the Via boards as they do perform well in a budget box, but they do not function well as overclockers as I have had experience with one in the past.

One of the problems lies in the fact that they have no AGP/PCI lock like the nForce2 boards. When you overclock, you not only raise the chipset frequency, but the frequency that all of your components interface at. It quickly leads to instability.

The settings are there as is the potential, but even the nForce2 boards have settings that are far beyond the board/chip's capability. Just keep that in mind.

Like I said, I was only able to increase the fsb by 6fsb on my KT400a, before instability erupted. Your board may fair better, but if the multiplier is locked, as I imagine it would be, then you will be discover that your are limited by the max fsb of the board.

Ah to be retired... have fun

OK I'll keep it all in mind.

I retired 3 years ago aged 36. ( I did well with my business dealings) I'm bored senseless these days.

Read sig below...

this is why AMD OCers like NF2's...for the simple fact of the AGP/PCI locks...and if you do get a BSOD error...99% of the times its because of the memory being too tight on timings...just lower the latency timings and your windows is right back...

I went from VIA to the NF2 chipset and have not looked back since...

My BSODs had nothing to do with the latency timings, glock. The board wasn't even overclocked when the issues occurred. They were directed at the SCSI controller card, but that resolved itself after I switched boards.

Ripcurl said:

OK I'll keep it all in mind.

I retired 3 years ago aged 36. ( I did well with my business dealings) I'm bored senseless these days.

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Wow. Indeed you suck! 12 years left then for me to become a multi-millionairre...

Personally, if I was financially set, I'd go back to college, get a degree in bio-med and become a labrat or anything that would have a significant impact on technology. ...or maybe I could write a book, finally improve my skills with a guitar. Then again, you're probably ready to take a mental break from the grind. OC'ing is fun, but you're not too old to get involved in a sport. No, I would probably be so overwhelmed with the choices, I wouldn't know what the hell to do!

I also went from a Via to an Nforce2, and I can hit nearly 250fsb(500). If your cpu isnt multiplier locked, you can raise it to 12.5x, or higher with a pin mod. Dont expect more than 2.2-2.3ghz on a via board though, they dont overclock well.

I have also found that via's are actualy slower than nforce2's, maybe you are thinking of the nforce1?

On a side note, you mentioned a watercooling kit. I believe you should check our watercooling section before you buy, you can usualy set up something much better for cheaper.

wicked-one said:

My BSODs had nothing to do with the latency timings, glock. The board wasn't even overclocked when the issues occurred. They were directed at the SCSI controller card, but that resolved itself after I switched boards.


Wow. Indeed you suck! 12 years left then for me to become a multi-millionairre...

Personally, if I was financially set, I'd go back to college, get a degree in bio-med and become a labrat or anything that would have a significant impact on technology. ...or maybe I could write a book, finally improve my skills with a guitar. Then again, you're probably ready to take a mental break from the grind. OC'ing is fun, but you're not too old to get involved in a sport. No, I would probably be so overwhelmed with the choices, I wouldn't know what the hell to do!

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Yes it does...when you get the BSOD boot up...saying the config file is not readable...reset the memory timings (latency)...and the windows will boot up without issues...this is a known fact with NF2's...since the PCI is locked...this is not the same BSOD that you get with another AMD chipset...were your OS is completely history...this is a memory issue...either being too tight of timings or too far high of a OC for the memory...

I have never lost a OS when getting a BSOD on a NF2 board...and it being memory timings...

I'm just reading and learning. I will say that when I tried to change the settings I did nothing manual at all, I left the auto settings on and at that point just upped to 2300 and it was of course too much. However I never once saw a BSoD but the OS was shot. I'd like to understand why, but I'll lose no sleep over it.

Since the VIA has no PCI lock...odds are you PCI Mhz was too high for your HDD(s) to handle...which in turn hosed the OS...

The FSB controls the PCI Mhz...each time you raise the FSB you raise the PCI Mhz...and even using dividers will limit your FSB and PCI Mhz...you will still run into the PCI Mhz limit...

This is why AMD OCers use the NF2...since they have the PCI/AGP lock...it doesnt matter who high of a FSB you run...the PCI will not go over 33Mhz...and in turn will not hose the OS from the PCI Mhz being too high for the HDD(s)...

Thanks for that Glock..... It's what I need to read and the only way I'll understand as my boredom threshold is low and reams of articles don't help me. Just that last sentence has given me more understanding of what happens. I'm still a bit old fashioned and just need nudging in the right direction. For instance, you like your Glock 19, I'm still in love with my Browning Hi-Power.

Ripcurl said:

Thanks for that Glock..... It's what I need to read and the only way I'll understand as my boredom threshold is low and reams of articles don't help me. Just that last sentence has given me more understanding of what happens. I'm still a bit old fashioned and just need nudging in the right direction. For instance, you like your Glock 19, I'm still in love with my Browning Hi-Power.

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Actually I own 3 glocks (19, 21 (police issued 15 round clip, 1 in chamber), 26) ...but yes...the 19 is my favorite

As for being pushed in the right step...after reinstalling the OS a few more times...that will be enough of a push to move to a NF2 motherboard ...

Plus...with that VIA board...you will never fully reach the CPU's potential...the MB is going to be your main bottleneck...

(not knocking VIA...they are some nice chipsets...but not for overclocking)

Well you live and learn. I've got a few boards knocking around, two SiS745s and a couple of old 266 via boards which are just for spares really but I also have a Gigabyte Nf2 board complete with a 2500+ Barton, unfortunately that's now on permanent loan with an EX GF and would be too much bloody trouble to get back.
I'll persevere with this ATM and I'm nothing if not thorough so you can be assured I'll document my progress on here and even if I kill something ( nothing unusual there, roasted an XP 2000+ just the other day, but it deserved it.) it will serve as a bit more education to somebody.

Can't get my head around plastic guns. Ceramic is interesting ( no heat sig) but if I had to get grow'd up I'd like to look at Sig Sauer. ( yeah I'm an ex soldier and still want to lay with guns, getting too hard in the UK).

Ripcurl said:

spares really but I also have a Gigabyte Nf2 board complete with a 2500+ Barton, unfortunately that's now on permanent loan with an EX GF and would be too much bloody trouble to get back.

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Hi

If you're really interested in learning the in's and out's of overclocking (even just for fun), then I strongly recommend that you either swop the G/f's board with your KT400, or simply go out and buy the cheapest NF2 board you can find (an Ultra preferably). They're so cheap now, I doubt you'd even notice the cost.

To repeat: the KT400 is going to complicate learning about overclocking.

reinstalling win xp

you guys need to look into getting drive image 7 for your rigs... i've installed and activated windows so many times that i can't activate it over the internet now... i have to call and do it over the phone... typing in number sequences... blah blah blah. after doing that i decided to spend the 40 bucks and get driveimage, you know how it takes FOREVER to install windows- even with SATA raid, it takes awhile. Well, i imaged a fresh install with only the windows updates installed. Now, when i restore the image, i just install the latest video driver, and go my merry way with installing whatever i want. This last time, i imaged a complete setup- it took 6 mins to backup my two 80 gig drives onto a third hard drive. it takes about 20 mins to restore, and i don't have to answer any questions, and i don't have to call and try to explain that i crash my computer as a matter of pride...lol
BTW, if you do this, i suggest getting tweakui also, and move my documents to another drive so you don't have to back it up every time you restore your drive. WHEW! sorry this is kinda off subject, but i thought this was important because Ripcurl will be tired of installing XP over and over and over... use that time to tinker instead of waiting for XP to finish up.

AND....
I moved form a via board to my nforce2 ultra and am able to push my 1700 tbred to 2343MHz with water... with no mods... my via would only let me get to 2000MHz...
good luck with your o/c

Ripcurl said:

Can't get my head around plastic guns.

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Plastic?...no plastic on mine...no way could I even think about going through a metal detector even fully stripped ...

"The frame on a GLOCK handgun is made out of a synthetic that is actually stronger than steel, yet 86% lighter. It's virtually indestructible. A GLOCK pistol can withstand temperatures ranging from -40°C (-40 F) to +70°C (+158 F) and still come out firing."

"The metal components on a GLOCK are practically indestructable. That's because they're finished with a unique surface treatment called Tenifer that makes those parts virtually as hard as a diamond. It is even more corrosion resistant than stainless steel."



As for the back up baords...I fully understand...I had a 8KHA+ that was my back up for the longest time...now I keep a old A7N8X Deluxe rev 1.04 for back up...about all they are good for anyways...

I learnd on a kt-600 with NO options i ahd to pin mod. Then it will autmaticy set FSB divider. Set it to 200mhz if your mem will hadle that(with a pin mod) on the cpu sockt. Then also set your stocnk diveder lower (again with a pin mod) and u can also set the voltage this way. This will fool your mobo into thinking that those r your "stock" cpu settings. I did this and i got 2.35 ghz out of my tbred. i had to leave the FSB stock though. and up the multi. I now have an NF2ultra board and i'm loving it.

Welcome.

I'm just going to repeat what has already been said - you need to get an nForce 2 board. Abit NF7-S is what I recommend, there is a reason it is what I use.

A good motherboard is the foundation of a good overclock. No point in having a great CPU if you can't get it to run at its full potential.

The type of RAM you have is also important. Some RAM will help you overclock further, some will just do what it should. And some is just plain broken at times :-D.

However I think it is most likely a hard drive issues that causes Windows to screw up.

There are lots of stickies in the forums, ok so you aren't a fan of big articles. Who is? But most of them are fairly good and not too long.

And seeing as you have so much spare computing power around, I urge you not to waste it. Find-A-Drug might interest you. I'd also encourage you to join team number 2072, but that might be pushing it a bit much.

Anyway, nice to have a new member, and any other questions just ask.