I just got a new setup.. pls advise guys

Hey everyone, i just got a new setup.. i was living in the dark ages with my old setup (jetway mobo, gForce2 64MB).. it's great to finally get a good board....


Ok, im not really into this OverClocking thing since i really dont know much about it, but the reason i got into this is because, wehn i first got this setup running, it was OC'd by default!!!

I dunno how this happened but, it was.. i got

MSI Mobo 865PE NEo2 Platinum Edition
Intel P4 2.40A GHZ Prescott
GeCube Radeon 9550XT Platinum Edition
2x Geil PC3200 256MB DDR400 RAM


Now, i saw some articles over the internet that this 2.40A Processor was a sweet overclocker. I would like to try it out too... specially since odly, when i first booted my PC after setup and everything, the Processer was OC @ 2.8GHZ by default... it gave me 11367 points @ 3DMark2001Se benchmark!!! It was awsome



Anyways, my motherboard came with this little application called CoreCenter which allows me to tweak my processor's settings like my:

FSB (default @ 133mhz)
Vcore 1.4000 V
Memory Voltage 2.60v
AGP Voltage 1.50v


So.. what do you guys think about my setup?? How far can i pump this thing up? As i said, it was @ 2.8GhZ on first setup.. i had great benchmark and my games were sooooper!!! However, it suddenly went back to 2.4 after a while (no errors).. Now when i try to bring it up to 2.8, it crashes..

Great Board !Good Choice( see my signature )

Get Rid Of Corecenter and use the Bios to overclock Core center is buggy Search these boards and you will see what I mean
http://forum.msi.com.tw/index.php?sid=

The reason why it is resetting back to 2.4 is when the board is unstable it will reset everything back to the original settings which is great for overclocking because itf you push it to far you don't have to worry about ending up with a " Expensive Paperweight"
When you were up at 2.8 the board must not have been stable or the cpu got hot

Not sure of the Bios settings that you have used so far so I will post some

1- Lock the PCI/AGP bus to 66/33 - you might not be able to get that low after raising the FSB as mine will only let me get to 67/34 which is fine
2- Raise your memory voltage to 2.7 or 2.8- use whichever is the lowest that you are running stable
3- Not sure of how high you have to push the FSB to get 2.8 ( don't feel like doing the math ) but you might be pushing your memory to hard. If you are still unstable try using a 5:4 divider. You will be giving up some memory bandwith but you should be able to make it up with the higher overclock you can achieve
4- watch your CPU temps - I know that 2.4E does not run as hot as my 2.8e but you might want to monitor it with Speedfan. My 2.8 can fry an egg if I let it.
5- Prescotts can be powerhogs . My original 350 Antec caused all kinds of problems that I solved by getting a 430 True Power ( I need to get a large one as it still is really not enought)

If there is anything else you need just post back

Welome to the MSI Group!

Dave

3- Not sure of how high you have to push the FSB to get 2.8 ( don't feel like doing the math ) but you might be pushing your memory to hard.

Click to expand...

He'd be at a 155 x 18 ( 620FSB)

The PC3200 will probably hold you back at some point just b/c you can't overclock your memory as far as you can with the FSB, but you can usually get a little higher by changing the FSB/RAM ratio to slow the RAM speed down.

You can use Motherboard Monitor 5 to monitor your temps... it doesn't have our specific mobo on the list but you can use the Neo2-LS ( or the Neo2-xxx,replace x's with letters, just try one of them) and the temps don't change if I remember right. Try to keep your load temps below 65-70°C ( I think that's a fairly high load temp for a Prescott, not the max, but fairly high).

At some point you'll have to raise your cpu voltage but if you're using the stock HS I would just try to oc as far as possible with stock voltage and not raise the vcore until you get a better HS or make sure you know what you're doing if you do raise it.

whoaw.. totally lost this post..

sorry guys. didnt receive notifications

anyway my sig shows my current system.. thanks for your inputs here. too bad i totally missed it.. anyway, i've got a good amount of success with OCing my system.. didnt worry too much about heat coz intel processors are said to shut themselves off before heat becomes a problem. i leave my pc side panel open anyway..will be upping my RAM to a 1 Gig.. looking for advises.

I have the same board its a outstanding board i love it got my 2.0A at 3.5GHz on air im building a water setup now hope to see more also considering the droop mod for it, for ram i would look for some good DDR 500 that way it will give some more head room for overclocking. Brands i would look for are OCZ, GSKILL, PDP XLB, hope this helps.

daumn!!!!! 2.0 to 3.5?!!!!!! oh my.. that's really amazing.. my ram is Geil Value RAm.. maybe if i up my RAM to a higher performance RAM, i could still jack up my cpu..

In my experience, Geil ram doesn't overclock very well...... my golden dragon wouldn't overclock at all, so I switched to OCZ. Unfortunately, I killed my board installing the ram (you can see the "I finally killed my mobo" thread for info). I loved my Neo2-P though, it had a few problems but overall it was a good overclocker.

Have you considered changing the stock HS to an aftermarket one? Thermalright makes some of the best HS's on the market for the price. I have an SLK-948 and with a good(but quiet) fan, I get the temps in my sig. Now that they've come out with a whole bunch of new HS's, you'd probably get a decent price on an SP-94 which gives you a temp drop of a few degrees.

For the SLK-948 at least, I had to remove the Northbridge HS and hacksaw two of the fins off of the corner to get the cpu HS to fit properly..... that doesn't take very long though.

Here's two good stores if you want a reliable place with decent prices.

www.Heatsinkfactory.com or www.sidewindercomputers.com

I got the fan in my sig at sidewinder, it's (IMO) the best fan for the Thermalright HS's.... it's not noisy at all, and because it's 38mm thick, it produces a lot more pressure than most other fans. (Pressure is needed to push air through the HS fins and out, weak fans only cool the top of the HS b/c they can't push air to the base of the HS)

some great advises here my friend.. yeah, i would go for OCZ.. but the thing is, i pretty much have little options here in the Philippines.. The choices are extremely limited.. so far the best - affordable choice i have is a GEIL Value RAM ... there are corsairs here but damn they're mighty expensive.. a 512MB corsair pair would be enough to setup a whole new AMD system!! hehe..

on the contrary though, i believe my 2x 256MB GEiL Value RAM (sig) overclocked quitewell.. not expectin any extra juice from em.. i do plan to up to 2x 512MB soon.. might still have to go with GeiL Valueram.. i know 512's are bad overclockers. but i do need more memory morethan inches of performance boost. so. adn besides. a DDR400 kicks *** as it is.. dont you agree?...

tea

Have you considered just adding another 2 x 256 kit of Value Ram onto your motherboard? The Neo2-P fits 4 DIMMs of ram, so you could run each set in dual channel with no problem. Doing that would probably save you a little money and you would still have a gig of ram.

I agree, having a gig of slower ram is much nicer than 512 of faster ram, especially with the current games that need a gig just to run without glitching.

About overclocking with the Geil, you should be fine with DDR400.... all you have to do is run the ram at a ratio, which is what most people have to do anyway with the 2.4C's, or a 2.4A in your case. Even my OCZ DDR500 will only let me overclock to 280mhz 1:1, which is still impressive, but I just run it at a 5:4 ratio and tighten the ram timings..... gives me just about the same performance as running it 1:1.

about the 4x 256MB.. yes i've given it some thought. and asked some suggestions.. please read here..

http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=345086

bout them timings.. yep.. so true.. mine is pretty suckee right now [2.5-4-48] but it's pretty fast enough for me.. got my 2.4 up to 3.0 so that's cool.. now im thinking though, when i switch to 1GB of ram.. i probably can't make it to 3.0Ghz anymore now do i?

I don't know, my timings are 3-4-4-8 when I'm running 275mhz 1:1, and 2.5-3-3-7 when I'm running at 5:4 and the performance is almost identical. About the gig kit, I would be surprised if it affected your overclock at all. I switched from 2 x 256 to 2 x 512 and I haven't noticed any difference at all.

I think that given the same sticks, a 512 stick won't overclock as high 1:1 as a 256 stick, but I don't think it would affect your overclock since your going to be running ratios anyway.

Have you flashed to the newest BIOS and downloaded the new CoreCenter? I think the new Corecenter will allow you to change the vcore on your Prescott... that wasn't an option when I had the board.

well, i dont know about the bios.. i dont know how to flash a bios. i do have this update utility from MSI that came with the board.. it seems to have update options for the bios.. mind telling me how to do so?

Everest tells me this:
Motherboard
CPU Type Intel Pentium 4E, 3033 MHz (18 x 169)
Motherboard Name MSI 865PE Neo2-PS (MS-6728 v2.0) (5 PCI, 1 AGP, 4 DIMM, Audio)
Motherboard Chipset Intel Springdale i865PE
System Memory 512 MB (DDR SDRAM)
BIOS Type AMI (02/05/04)

and CPUz tells me my bios is:
Brand Amreican Megatrends Inc
V3.5
02/05/2004


as for the corecenter.. i did download the latest when i got this board... havent checked lately.. but it does indeed let me change the vcore setting... however, it's pretty useless coz next time i boot, vcore is back to default.

tea

You might ask Dcasole about the vcore, I'm sure there's some way to lock it so it sets the vcore and your overclock when you get into Windows...

About flashing your BIOS, you can either do it in Windows or in DOS. I always did it in Windows, but if you live in an area that gets power surges or there's a risk of power outtages, I wouldn't recommend doing it unless you have a battery backup.

If I remember right, you use the Live Update and download the newest BIOS and then just double click on it. It should start up and tell you about any programs that you need to close (antivirus and firewalls usually), and then ask you to make a rescue disk with a floppy in case the flash goes bad. After that it should flash the BIOS and restart the computer. You'll probably get an error message that says "CMOS setting wrong".... don't worry about it, just push the key to go into BIOS (F10 I think) and then save and exit and it should restart just fine now.

Some people find that they can overclock higher if they update the BIOS.

Another thing is to use LiveUpdate and update the Intel INF drivers, those are very important for overclocking as well, so you'll want the up to date versions of those drivers.

You might ask Dcasole about the vcore, I'm sure there's some way to lock it so it sets the vcore and your overclock when you get into Windows...

Click to expand...

me is scared to touch vcore. me dont wana fry my processor. hehe.. but, soon i'll get enough courage to "flick the switches"

About the BIOS and other updates.. that's it? sheesh.. sounds really easy.. hehehe.. yes i do have an 500va APC power backup.. hmm.. THANKS A LOT MAN!! really arppreciate this advise.. didnt know i could do it from windows. gracias amigo.. maybe that can enable me to OC higher..

tea

me is scared to touch vcore. me dont wana fry my processor. hehe.. but, soon i'll get enough courage to "flick the switches"

Click to expand...

Don't do it , although some people do it most of the time there is no need . My 2.8e runs stable all the way up to 3.61

I found a way around the prescott VCore lock on my board which is a revsion one which MSI chose to lock using core center and all it did was increase my temps

Also if you have BIOS version 3.5 you might not want to flash as this seems to be the best version for this board. There is a new one , 3.A that is out but when it comes to BIOS flashing I am a firm believer that " If it Ain't broke don't fix it"

Dave

what a turn of events... hmm...

Hey Tea_J, can you check what BIOS revision you have? If you go to Live update, it'll tell you what new BIOS is out (still the 3.A according the Dcasole). I've flashed my bios about 7 times on the Neo2-P with no problems, I even flashed the BIOS on my video card yesterday to turn my 9800 pro into an XT with no problems.

Some people think there is a risk of the computer freezing while flashing in Windows, so it is possible to just load the flashing utility and the bios and flash from DOS. I'll try to find more exact instructions for the DOS method. It's what I use to flash my IC7-G b/c it doesn't come with a Windows flashing program.

For the Neo2-P, the BIOS revisions would fluctuate from being a flash that helped to one that messed up your temps. One BIOS flash made my cpu load temps read at 0 or even -10.... not likely on air cooling. The 3.A BIOS was accurate as far as I could tell and my overclock stayed the same (I'm already at my max stable overclock, so flashing wouldn't help me get higher, I'd just notice if my max overclock dropped).

Dcasole is right about the vcore, he was able to overclock his Prescott an enormous amount just on stock voltage, and since we don't know what your temps are right now, it would probably be best to leave the vcore alone until we know what your full load temps are.

Have you used Prime 95 yet to find your load temps while your overclocked? You might want to read the article in Dcasole's sig about cooling the Prescott.

I'd stick with Dcasole's advice on the vcore, but I still feel that if there wasn't anything to fix, they wouldn't come with a BIOS revision. Since they've come out with a dozen BIOS revisions for your board, I'd say there's a bit that had to be fixed. Most of them add support for new graphics cards or add new cpu microcode to add support for new cpus or to change settings for the new cpus. Do what you want though, it's your board

-Meatball

Tea_J

but I still feel that if there wasn't anything to fix, they wouldn't come with a BIOS revision. Since they've come out with a dozen BIOS revisions for your board, I'd say there's a bit that had to be fixed. Most of them add support for new graphics cards or add new cpu microcode to add support for new cpus or to change settings for the new cpus. Do what you want though, it's your board

Click to expand...

MTB is absolutly correct MSI seems to release a new BISO update every month for one reason or another

It seems the main reason why they release so many is the fact that they just cannot get the BIOS to read the temps correctly

On one release they get the Northwoods correct and then you see a bunch of Prescott owners complaining , then they release another and it is the reverse

They really do not give a good description of exactly what they are " fixing" with a new release so it is really a " Crap Shoot"

If you go over to the MSI boards and do a search or post a question as to which is the best BIOS for your board I am sure that you will get a multitude of answers and then you can make a decision as to if you need to update or not

They only reason why I say " if it is not broke don't fix it" is because the MSI boards are full of posts that are titled " I flashed my Bios and my board is dead"

when i first booted my PC after setup and everything, the Processer was OC @ 2.8GHZ by default... it gave me 11367 points @ 3DMark2001Se benchmark!!! It was awsome

Click to expand...

This is a feature on MSI boards called "Dynamic Overclocking Technolgy" (DOT for short)


Like I said before this is a great board and you have a nice chip that should allow for some great overclocks. I am sure that you will be happy with both so why not just try to overclock with the Bios and see how how far you can get before messing with the Vcore or a bios update.

A prescott employs what is called DYNAMIC VID which will vary the Vcore up and down accourding to the load that is placed on the processor . This is one of the reasons that it is dangerous to change the vcore in the BIOS

you can read about why MSI chose to lock the VCORE on some of the boards
here

I think once you get all the settings in the Bios right ( which MTB and I will be happy to help you with ) you might be surprised at how far you will be able to go


Good Luck and let us know
Dave

hi guys. thanks so much for the valuable information/advises..

well, ima stick to my 3.5 BIOS for now.. that's what everest said about my version by the way..

And as for OC, yep this "is" my max stable OC... stable under 48 hours of Prime95


As for the heat, i'm not really worried that much as i know these intel processors turn themselves off way before heat becomes a problem.. Not that im beeing careless.. i do check my temp once and a while. look sok @ 49-53C

This is a feature on MSI boards called "Dynamic Overclocking Technolgy" (DOT for short)

Click to expand...

i turned it off.. the first time i got this board, i didnt know it was running DOT.. i was shocked to find out i had a 3.4Ghz processor when i just bought a 2.4 hehe. but the darn PC kept turning off by itself.. if it wasnt that, it's the audio dying on me.. didnt know why at first.. ehhe

tea