Four opportunities for A64

Three opportunities for A64

Hello
I want to switch to athlon 64, and I do need new RAM for it- the TwinMOS will not run properly

So I was thinking of 2x512MB, and I reduced the imense offers to only four:

• Corsair XMS PC3200XL (TCCD, and they are cheaper than A-DATA's or OCZ's)
• A-DATA PC4000 (high frequencies, but crappy timings)
• OCZ PC3700EB (nothing to say)

Well, now I do have a problem: which of them would be best for A64? I have enough money for the OCZ, but I do not want do buy it if I can get similar results with spending 60 € (Germany) less...
The TCCD will also achieve very high frequencies (with lower timings, of course), so right now it seems to me that they would be a good choice for the Athlon (since they run 2.0-2-2-5-1 at 200MHz up to 220).

Ok, to be perfectly honest, I need your help. I cannot test it myself, so I depend on you- on your results, on your experiences.
Is PC4000 (with crappy timings) as fast/ faster than PC3200 (best timings) (using dividers, same corespeed)?
Is the EB really the best RAM for A64 (why?) and will the Ballisitx with the same ICs (but different version) be nearly the same?

Buh, I hope you can answer this and help me, thank you

Kamui

edit: ereased the Micron Ballistix- don't want to be shocked, after all

If you run 230mhz or 250mhz using divider like 5:4 with 2-2-2-6-1t timmings, running @ 290mhz 1:1 @ 3-4-4-8-1t will still be better. Maybe smeone who can achive both these run some benchies to see which actually is better

CandymanCan said:

If you run 230mhz or 250mhz using divider like 5:4 with 2-2-2-6-1t timmings, running @ 290mhz 1:1 @ 3-4-4-8-1t will still be better. Maybe smeone who can achive both these run some benchies to see which actually is better

Click to expand...

This is what I've heard and what I think, but if someone could run some benches I would be completely satisfied and persuaded
Shortly after that I will buy some good RAM- meaning some modules >250MHz-
thank you!

Please, could anyone post his results?

hey bro sorry i didnt get to follow through w/ my benchies, ihave been really buisy, but later tonight, or tomorrow, after morning church, im gonna have a benchy sestion and try to brake my 3dmark record, so ill have both sets of ram in and ill give stuff of 2-2-2@220,2-2-2@250,3-4-4-8@250,and 3-4-4-8@270(or how ever high i can bench)

No problem, as long as you bench it within the next two weeks I can wait

Needless to say that I am a bit jealous of your resulsts, right?

K4mui said:

Needless to say that I am a bit jealous of your resulsts, right?

Click to expand...

lol.......yeah ill get then by sunday im sure, i hope it will help you in you desision...

I am in the same boat as you. I am also very interested in the results of this test as I am currently leaning heavily towards pc4000. IMO I think that eb is overpriced, but maybe if the results show there is a huge difference in performance, I'd consider spending the cash.

OK, something that makes me doubt everything I know:

SuperPI:
A64 (NC;S754) 10x250, EB @250 3.0-3-2 => 1M: 36s; 32M: 31m 55s
A64 (NC;S939) 10x253, EB @212 2.5-2-2 => 1M: 34s; 32M: 30m 19s
A64 (CH;S754) 10x250, Corsair @208 2.0-3-2 => 1M: 34s; 32M: 31m 25s

As you can see, the first rig has no chance against the other two- ok, the S939 has dualchannel, the other S754 has 1MB ²Cache, but they both have less RAM-clocks!
If the Clawhammer used TCCD @ 2.0-2-2 at let's say 215MHz (I think this is realistic), it would slay everything, wouldn't it?

I don't get it....

Super PI 33's

the first rig has no chance because it has only 512 L2, and single channel memory controler.

the second rig has only 512L2, but it has Dual channel(helps alot for super PI

the third rig...hummm im not sure bout it, my rig is about = to it, exept my ram is running 1:1.


EDIT: i just tested at 10x250(CH-S754) w/ 2-2-2@208= super PI 35s.....

EDIT just tested again w/ 2M...

10x250(CH-S754) w/ 2-2-2@208= Super Pi 2M "1m 22s"
10x250(CH-S754) w/ 2-2-2@250= Super Pi 2M "1m 18s"

EDIT:Interesting 3Dmark Results
9x267=2403(CH-S745) w/3-4-4@267 3dmark 01'= "24,080"
10x250=2500(CH-S754) w/2-2-2@208 3Dmark 01'= "24,130"
10x250=2500(CH-S754) w/2-2-2@250 3Dmark 01'= "24,840"
10x253=2531(CH-S754) w/2-2-2@253 3Dmark 01'= "25,042"

the run w/ the ocz cant really be compaired, because i couldnt run 3Dmark above 267 resulting in only 2403 CPU clock. this is because my shuttle cant run HTT speeds above that. If my Abit KV8 Pro wasnt RIP, then i could have showed results off of it at 275+.

the 3Dmark results were very interesting in my opinion. im really supprised on how well the 2-2-2@208 held its own i think that sam. TCCD@ 208-220ish would be a great alternalive to BH-5/6 if didnt wanna take first place in the Super Pi list, or the 3Dmark list , but you still wanted GREAT performance for your money and time(because it would be hard to round up bh5 right now....)

I just played two games, NFS Underground & UT2004 & with the mem @ 208 I COULD NOT see any diff in game play at all.

I would expected that 250 mem speed would have killed 208, but it didnt.

Still I would like to see some EL or EB at 280 - 300 mem speed & see what gives here.

Well, thank you for that!
Now I'm pretty unsure about what I should do... could you do another SuperPI- bench (actually the only bench I care about, don't know why)?

I'd ask you for 220MHz@ 2.0-2-2 vs. your maximum @3-3-4 (4 RAS-to-CAS).
Same corespeed, and again the matching dividers- lot of work for you
Actually this is what I need to decide, Corsair XL or A-DATA PC4000 (and the a-data do 280 without problems at about 3-3-4)

Hmm, after thinking a bit about it, I wonder if I shouldn't take low- latency- RAM... if my memory controller is crappy, modules like A-data's PC4000 cannot run at their full speed, and therefore the low latency stuff would be better- in this situation... puh, hard decision.

Sorry to get things confusing. I have many benchmarks made up with super PI to upload tomorrow.

I have tried about every thing with my mem tonight & I will have to say, Go with the tight timing with mem rhat will run about 215-220. I am loosing a few point but the game play & FPS in the games is very good.

I would think you are going to have to get 280-up to beat it & you will still need alittle bit of timing at that.

Trying for such a speed is a chance & if you dont get there you are in a bad spot. If you could get mem that would do these speed but still tighten up if the CPU want that would be best chance.

But I think that the safe & cheap play would be going with tight timings @ 215-220. The performance of this setup on my rig has really suprised me that it does this good.

I will organize all the screenies & upload tomorrow.

Wow, thank you very much!
That was kind of surprising, though... well, I think I'll take some TCCDs then, or maybe I'll give the Ballistix a shot.
I think OCZ's or a-data's TCCD would be good, because Corsair's XL don't OC that good from what I heard, the a-data do very well- but at a hard price 360€ (EB 3700: 360€; Corsair XL: 275€; a-data PC4000: 220)
In this case EB would be better than a-data's, what do you think?
Of course, Corsair is the price- winner (TCCDs) here, but I still wonder if they would clock really good... something I don't need to think about concerning a-data's PC4000. They are cheap, they clock high, but have really bad timings...

Well you could always run the adata at 280+, personally...the real-world performance difference isnt enough for me to warrant spending the money for the low latency ram.

these are TCCD's too right?

Mushkin 3200 lvl2 V2

Yes, they are, but don't seem to overclock as good as OCZ's... slowly I get the feeling like OCZ cheates- they get best results nearly everywhere...
But their prices

Anyway, the Level II V2 are not yet available in Germany, at last I didn't see them- which means actually the same


btw: Waaah, cannot make a decision...

edit: Just read how good the new CH-5 seem to overclock... 235MHz @2.0-2-2 on a NF7! Holy *hit, this is fantastic! I must ask this guy (german) on what voltage, he modified his BIOS, so maybe this is not representative for every mainboard, but definately worth a thought...

I keep hearing over and over that the newer ch-5 does 230-240 at tight timings and no more than 2.9v. This makes it real attractive for someone not wanting to do board mods or buy a booster. Even with an Intel rig, you can run 5:4 and have fun.

Damnit, now Im stuck on what to buy as well. :

1.Kingmax Hardcore pc4000:
2-3-2 [email protected] or less
2.5-3-3-5/2.5-4-3-5 @ DDR500+ @ 2.75v
3-3-3@PC4400 @ 2.85v

2. Crucial or Kingston Value ram with Micron 5ns Ic's (the crucial is available is *single sided* too)

3. Some of this new Ch-5 stuff, what modules does this come in btw?

What do you guys think?

Asked this guy now- he's running 230- 240MHz FSB 2.0-2-2-x(5/8/11) at 2.95V (max. on unmodded Abit NF7)

Wow, that really looks nice. But he said he had modified his BIOS, so I do still not know if CH-5 will run that good (and it is very good) on A64- which is of course what I want

I wouldn't recommend the Kingmax, a-data are cheaper (at last in Germany) and they will go up to 290MHz at 2.8V

If you can get modules with mT-5BC and can afford good cooling (I hate fans ), go with them- you could manage results nearly equal to OCZ's EB- series...

CH-5, well, look above, I'm still thinking if they will run in an A64- rig... but could be very fine. Look in TwinMOS, Buffalo etc, but right now I cannot find them anywhere but Mushkin's Level One (way to expensive)- but if they run like I heard, the would smash Corsair's XL

The kingmax are actually cheaper in the US, and they seem to run at slightly better timings compared to the adata. At the moment, Im looking at kingston value ram with hynix d43 or micron 5ns Ics.