Anyone have a valid opinion on shims???

[TUK101]

I was wondering about the effectiveness of shims, and are they worth the risk? I was thinking of getting one for my Celeron 800 processor. The idea of them makes sense to me that a shim would balance out the hsf and make it more effective. But are they worth the risk of shorting the processor out. I know that there are copper shims and aluminum ones, and also if i remember correctly there is also an authentic compound shim as well. Anyone out there know which one is the best bet and where i can get the best price/shipping bargain out there? Thanks, and also I would just like to say that Overclockers Forum has been a really big help to me, you guys kick azz!!!:cool:

[N3D2000]

well on the Duron line of cpu's they have rubber/foam type standoffs on the corners that compress but provide abke pressure as well, I dont know if you can do a similar thing for celeys but I think you can use neoprene foam and make a shim from it (just make sure it's not too thick).

[Kingslayer]

You want a valid opinion on shims? Ok I'll give you one.

Most people say that they aren't necessary. Some say it makes the CPU run hotter. Some say they are for pansies.

These people are dead wrong on all aspects.

It is a $10 part that will give you protection from ruining a $100-$200 part. None of the chip makers will warranty your chip if the core is cracked.

Common sense says that is a good investment.

They have come along way in the shim department. The anodized ones that claimed to be non-conductive were a waste, but they have next generation non-conductive ones that are made from plastic.

[William]

shims do raise cpu temps, especially the copper ones. The nonconductive ones don't short out the cpu and don't raise temps as much(about 1-2C). I use them on both the cpus because I can't afford to crack a cpu(i did it with a fop38). I can go without one, great. If you want one, it sure is an excellent insurance policy.

[Bender]

I have herd that using a shim with water cooling will help temps and reduce the chances of chipping your core; is this true?

[William]

Originally posted by Bender
I have herd that using a shim with water cooling will help temps and reduce the chances of chipping your core; is this true?

I have never heard of a shim reducing temps unless it is leveling a heatsink on the core. I don't think it would, but I could be wrong.

[UnseenMenace]

Shims because of the belief that they are safer create a false sence of security which can cause some people to take less care when fitting a HSF. The shim has the possibility of creating as many problems as it is supposed to solve, Poor quality shims or those that have been dropped in transit may have a slight curve in ithem which can lift the HSF away from the CPU. The Metallic based shims conduct electricity and as such have the abilty to damage the CPU, these are additional risks not forgetting that shims increase CPU temprature.
Overall I consider that there are as many downsides of using a shim as there is upsides. I would personally suggest just taking exceptional care when mounting your HSF as this is cheaper than a shim. I cant help wonder that if shims are such a good idea why are they not made or supported by Intel or AMD.

[touser]

Originally posted by UnseenMenace
Shims because of the belief that they are safer create a false sence of security which can cause some people to take less care when fitting a HSF. The shim has the possibility of creating as many problems as it is supposed to solve, Poor quality shims or those that have been dropped in transit may have a slight curve in ithem which can lift the HSF away from the CPU. The Metallic based shims conduct electricity and as such have the abilty to damage the CPU, these are additional risks not forgetting that shims increase CPU temprature.
Overall I consider that there are as many downsides of using a shim as there is upsides. I would personally suggest just taking exceptional care when mounting your HSF as this is cheaper than a shim. I cant help wonder that if shims are such a good idea why are they not made or supported by Intel or AMD.
because for intel and amd the more processors you break the more you have to buy :D

[UnseenMenace]

Originally posted by touser

because for intel and amd the more processors you break the more you have to buy :D

While this is indeed a valid point, If Intel and AMD were concerend about selling large quantitys of CPU's they would have made them weaker many years ago, considering that the majority of computers are purchased through the likes of large manufaturers such as Dell an excessive amount of CPU problems would cause the manufaturer to stop using the product as they would have to fix the problem under warrenty and the general public would associate an unreliable computer with this companys name, which makes me even more certain that there is another reason why Shims are not supported by the CPU manufaturers especially when you consider they could make considerable money from producing this product themselves.

[MetalSiren]

I have a shim on mine. the reason I have one is becuase I'm using a custom clip to fix the broken tab on the mobo socket.

Hmmmm, I was just thinking. Maybe if you put a vary, vary tiny bit on thermal paste inbetween the shim an the heatsink the temp.s might not go up too high. I'll have to try this next time I take off my heatsink.

[JaY_III]

Originally posted by MetalSiren
Hmmmm, I was just thinking. Maybe if you put a vary, vary tiny bit on thermal paste inbetween the shim an the heatsink the temp.s might not go up too high. I'll have to try this next time I take off my heatsink.

BAD IDEA. this will let heat flow even easier to the skim and as a re****, it will get hotter and heat the CPU up more.
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Shims can be good if you plan on taking your heatsink on and off on a regular bases.. if you plan on putting it on an leaving it on, I dont see any need for a shim. I have taken a heatsink on/off on my Intel FCPGA CPU manyh times without a shim and havent had a problem... and this is using GORB aka CPU killer at times

[Burning Phoenix]

I personally have built quite a few computers this year for people and on half that were not slot 1 chips i had to install the heatsink. Each time it was nerve racking but i took my time trying to equally apply pressure downward while hooking on the clips carefully not letting it rock on the chip. I did chip one this year but it still worked. It ran hotter than normal so when i took off the heatsink to apply artic silver i found small chips of silicone on top. I cleaned the surface and reinstalled the heatsink with lower temps resulting. So don't worry just apply steady pressure and even if it does crack maybe you'll be lucky and it'll still work.

[TUK101]

;) Thanks for all of your feedback!!! I think that I'll pass on a shim for now. One thing that would be nice about having one is that it is a *itch to get this hsf connected that I just bought for this thing. Those darned clips are some stiff ones, so a shim would kind of be an insurance policy. As far as my question for cooling, that one seems to be a toss-up. I am running around 38 degrees C right now, and it dont seem to be doing anything funny, so I'll leave it alone.

[The Overclocker]

the are unconductive ones going around, meaning they are made out of card

[Richard]

My opinion (you can decide whether it's valid in your case or not) is that shims are unnecessary.

I've had a couple coppermines, and a few thunderbirds; changed heatsinks numerous times and even watercooled. I've not once had a problem. At no time was I ever unnecessarily worried about fracturing the core. While these cores are indeed breakable; they aren't _that_ fragile.

Using a bit of common sense and a steady hand and you should never "crack" a core. In most cases of reported broken CPUs it appears that the installer was in a bit of a hurry to slap the heatsink on. Always check and double check the orientation of the heatsink before clipping it to the motherboard. Never force it to go on. If it seems like you're having a difficult time applying a heatsink you might be doing it wrong. Granted there are some clips (Alphas) that are a bear to get on and off. As long as you use your head you shouldn't have a problem.

Keep in mind that a shim isn't a guarantee that you won't crack the core. It is still possible to overtighten a waterblock or other such device. Plus, shims also present other possible problems. There are reported claims of people frying brand new CPUs when a shim shifted and caused the heatsink to be improperly mounted.

The key element is that no matter what - you should always take your time and use common sense. If you feel uncomfortable risking a brand new CPU let someone help you. (Sometimes it's easier with two sets of hands.)