Ethical problem/Major commainly using illegal software!

[jstutman]

To whom it may concern, i post this in asking for anyones help. I have recently been hired on by a major corp that as part of its jobs is computer/repair/upgrade. It has come to my attention that 90% of all its repairs are done using "hacked" illegal versions of the software. I have been there 4 weeks total and have yet to see one legal version of anything. Most software that is not hacked is licensed as personal usage key. This corporation is in the top 400 of the forbes 500. I just ask opinions on what i should do to report this. I dont feel safe on a corporation level cause, it is done like this at everyone of there stores and i feel i would be targeted. So do i report this behavior to each individual software company? or is there a government agency which i can report this? i have already put in my notice to quit and i honestly wish to report privatly. would anyone have anything they could help me with here?

thanks

[Sentential]

To whom it may concern, i post this in asking for anyones help. I have recently been hired on by a major corp that as part of its jobs is computer/repair/upgrade. It has come to my attention that 90% of all its repairs are done using "hacked" illegal versions of the software. I have been there 4 weeks total and have yet to see one legal version of anything. Most software that is not hacked is licensed as personal usage key. This corporation is in the top 400 of the forbes 500. I just ask opinions on what i should do to report this. I dont feel safe on a corporation level cause, it is done like this at everyone of there stores and i feel i would be targeted. So do i report this behavior to each individual software company? or is there a government agency which i can report this? i have already put in my notice to quit and i honestly wish to report privatly. would anyone have anything they could help me with here?

thanks
You could always share your concerns with the companies, whos software is being stolen

[FireMogle]

I think its a federal crime so the FBI may want to know.

[Sentential]

I think its a federal crime so the FBI may want to know.
Them too. Dont they have a copyright division?

[Malpine Walis]

Or you can make a report to the Business Software Alliance. They take that stuff seriously and the single report to them will cover all or most of the vendors in one fell swoop.

http://www.bsa.org/

[jstutman]

Thanks everyone. the business i am employed with Make us a list of like dignostic/repair listings. They basically say if this is what is messed up, use this program to fix it. The problem is the programs they have us use are the "hacked" illegal versions. We cannot use our own programs on customers computers cause it would be a violation which we could be sued/fined by the company if we are caught.

[Sentential]

Thanks everyone. the business i am employed with Make us a list of like dignostic/repair listings. They basically say if this is what is messed up, use this program to fix it. The problem is the programs they have us use are the "hacked" illegal versions. We cannot use our own programs on customers computers cause it would be a violation which we could be sued/fined by the company if we are caught.
Yea for things like this you gotta Cover-you-ass and report it. I would use the link that Malpine Walis used to see what can be done

[Frodo Baggins]

are the reports anonymous? (or can they be?)

[tom10167]

I don't think they'd be TOO anonymous realistically.

Who did it?
Joe who's worked here for 40 years or John who we just hired? The other thing is, would you lose your job? The company going under or something? I'm not sure how all that works.

[JFettig]

Have you even talked to this business about it? That would be the first step.


Jon

[Permanoob]

I wouldn't talk to the business about it at all. If you do plan on reporting it this would be the worst step you could take. It's bad enough that he's the new guy.

"Hmm gee, soandso has asked about us legitimizing our software library but we're getting slammed by the FBI, couldn't be him though!"

Report it.. just plain flat out report it. There has to be a handful of people that know this is being and willfully allow it. I believe they're given a chance to remedy the situation anyway before litigation/prosecution.

[tom10167]

Here's a thought: You think your comapny just bought the licensing but uses one copy/keycode for convenience? When I was working IT I KNOW our company used one serial code for Windows 2000, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.(really) etc. etc. But I also saw that they had the licensing. It's just easier to print out 20 copies of one license. And if this is some HUGE company, they're probably not stealing software. Just want you to make SURE.

[jstutman]

I know there using illegal software, cause when we work on the customers computer we have to install the software ourselves. The fact that i have to use a keygen and a "hack" to use that piece of software.

[turd]

Could it be that the customer holds the license and the hack/keygen is just to allow you to have your way with the legally installed software without requiring the customer to bring in every license # and CD for all the installed software when they require service?

[jstutman]

Nope, cause its company policy to delete the software when were done. We dont leave software on the computer unless the customer has approved the purchase cost and pays us an install fee for the software.

[tom10167]

Hahahaha........ wow. Yeah, pretty sure that's stealing.

Keygen.
<Laughing

[LutaWicasa]

A bit of a sticky wicket.........in a perfect world, allowing the company to correct this would be best. The company itself may not be aware of what some VP or super has instuted. But, this of course leaves you open to retribution from them. Also......any company that is totally unaware of what thier people are doing need an eye-opener anyway :)
Myself?........I'd report them as well as actively seek other employment. I personally wouldn't want to be professionally associated with any company that would condone these practices.

[JFettig]

I wouldnt make enemies, Talk to someone at the top of the company and if they dont do anything about it, then you have a real good reason to report it. If they do something about it, it saves a lot of trouble for both you and the company, if you report them, youll probably be out of a job and they will be hirting really badly.

Its kinda a stickey area.

I agree with luta also.

Jon

[MadSkillzMan]

Could it be that the customer holds the license and the hack/keygen is just to allow you to have your way with the legally installed software without requiring the customer to bring in every license # and CD for all the installed software when they require service?

ive oftenw ondered about that...what if you bring in a computer thats so messed windows needs to be installed, and they do it for you? what key do they use? and say like its so hosed u cant use like ViewKeyXP or something...

i think its safe to say taht ALMOST everyone at one time or another has copied a tape/CD (software/audio/DVD) or maybe back in the day copy a 5.25" diskette for your own use...which is software piracy....or the favorite make "backups" ....when its making backups of like library software..whatever.....point is, if ia business is doing it that is pretty darn shady...good luck man ....hope im never in this situation....ive heard on tv and radio, an add encouraging people to report any kind of software theft.

[zexmarquies01]

I say, Just go and Report them.

They know what they are doing. They know its wrong. They should have never had a chance to fix the problem, because they should have never started doing this in the first place.

They tell you to delete the files from the computers, They have you use Keygen's for the product. They knew from the beginning that this is wrong, unfair to the Customer, and to the companies that make the Programs.

you already put your 2 weeks notice in. i'd report them. Because it is the right thing to do. Simple as that. And Even if they some how find out it was you, oh well you made an enemy. But its their own fault. They deserve the punishment.

So, If i was you, i'd just turn them in. They are a corporation that is stealing, thats a HUGE " no no "

so, just turn them in.

[stryder2720]

That would be funny if it was Microsoft :)

[jstutman]

That would be funny if it was Microsoft

Not that bad, wouldnt even post here if it was.

Bill would have me in prison for a lifetime, cause he would pay some smo to charge me with fake charges and pay off the judge to make sure i get the worse penalty. The privalege of being rich and powerful. He will own the monopoly very soon. Bill is curropt most people know that, but the power and money keeps everyone in check. Funny how he started his career stealing from xerox :(

[9mmCensor]

Document Document Document.

Document everything.

Start yesterday.

Sit around get used to the company, meet your coworkers, chat with them, you know find out what they think about it, descreetly of course.

If they want to lay you off or fire you, BAM you got a fat stack of papers that say they be stealing software. Throw the letters FBI and CNN out, and see what they say. Because Federal investigation + media on a big corp like that = crappy.

[Myhre]

No kidding man. The first thing you need to do is start getting documentation and proof of any kind, extremely discretely. You really need to keep your back on this because I'm sure that a company like that could turn something around on you if your not careful. Hopefully you havn't written anything you've posted here on a machine at work. I'd say paranoia is your best friend right now. I'd say the first priority is cover your own ass and then if you can take steps from there to bring this to the attention of the proper bereau then go for it. I would say either go Better Business Berea or the FBI(whichever branch covers this sort of thing) All I know is you definatly shouldn't inform the company that you are questioning this because they can close a door on your faster than you'd think. You really just need to get a lot of proof, enough that could stand on it's own if someone like the FBI comes back and can't find anything else because the company has covered their tracks. I probably sound a bit too paranoid, but I know how larger businesses can get, and they can really mess you up financially.


-Myhre

[nissmo300]

what's the name of the company?

[Turd Furguson]

Well here is what I would like to know, is the keygen created by someone who did reverse engineering or was it created within the company? If it was a reverse engineered program they know that it should not be used. But a company can create a simple keygen themselves using the keys that they own. The keygen in this case would be legal.

[trip0d]

^ i wwanted to know if the keygen is..the "scene" keygens/cracks.

[jstutman]

No these keygen's we use are found at numerous crack sites, sites which the compnay tells us to look for. Basically use this keygen found at this crack site, if it does not work. please contact us so that we can find another.

[trip0d]

thats shady..realllly shady...and im surprized noone else has told authorites about this problem..they either pay their employees well or everyone else keeps the secret

[Crash893]

i dont see what the delema is

drop the bomb on them the problem of course is going to be proving they installed it in the first place as i saw you wrote that they delete the software when they are done

there is of course the very very very slim chance as other have mentioned that there is a legit licence somewhere and soem dumb head along the way lost it and they just use the key gen becuase they dont want to ask there boss what the code is for the 145 time. ( again very slim)

i would just report them and continue to pick up paychecks untill you hear the words audit and then i would leave asap

[Turd Furguson]

No these keygen's we use are found at numerous crack sites, sites which the compnay tells us to look for. Basically use this keygen found at this crack site, if it does not work. please contact us so that we can find another.

Well then you might as well let the sh*t hit the fan then.

[MLMIB]

I'm gunna "assume" a lot *cough cough*

the company dosn't endorse stealing nor blah blah blah (aforementioned)

BUT in order to get the job done, thats what it boils down to. now, if you have questions on how to get it done legally, ask (PM me, or AIM) because they do own a LOT of liscencing, this said it's pressure from the company to do well and exceed that ultimately drives local devisions to steal 'n all that

a case against them wouldn't stick, you'd get your boss in trouble, and he'd be fired, but I'd be suprised if it went higher than district...

[nissmo300]

what's the name of the company?

[Crash893]

yes what is the company name

[tom10167]

I don't think he wants to tell us but GOD I want to know.

[upstreamcurrent]

I doubt he wants to post the company name because if someone else from that company browses these forums, maybe his boss, he could have serious problems.

[MLMIB]

I worked for them too, i can verify that there is some questionable practices, but read my other post, it's not going to fall on the company(they have made it possible to do everything through legal means)

[nissmo300]

I worked for them too, i can verify that there is some questionable practices, but read my other post, it's not going to fall on the company(they have made it possible to do everything through legal means)

Will you tell us the name of it?

[MadSkillzMan]

Compuhyperglobalmeganet? Flancrest Enterprizes? Edgeco? Cutcom? Interslice?

[Silversinksam]

A bit of a sticky wicket.........in a perfect world, allowing the company to correct this would be best. The company itself may not be aware of what some VP or super has instuted. But, this of course leaves you open to retribution from them. Also......any company that is totally unaware of what thier people are doing need an eye-opener anyway :)
Myself?........I'd report them as well as actively seek other employment. I personally wouldn't want to be professionally associated with any company that would condone these practices.


I agree with Luta's comments and you should also consider protecting yourself. I'm not talking about retribution from your employer, I'm talking about whomever investigates this, not finding you culpable of taking part in this possible illegal activity. If your going to be the whistle blower, make sure you get in writing that you will be indemnified of any prosecution. :rolleyes:


I doubt he wants to post the company name because if someone else from that company browses these forums, maybe his boss, he could have serious problems.

PLEASE DO NOT POST THE NAME OF THIS COMPANY If the name is revealed this thread may disappear.

[MadSkillzMan]

lol i was wondering when the master of trolls would pop in

[Ian Cody]

He already mentioned he put in his notice to quit, so i dont think he is extremely worried about being fired.

So i would turn them in, if they doing bad stuff, which seems they are, than they get slapped with some hefty fines and maybe some lawsuits or something. Punishment is served.

If they arent doing bad stuff, they get investigated anyways, and learn that doing bad stuff can get you slapped around, so they dont do it in the future either, preventive maintenance.

Than you feel good either way, you helped a bad company get punished, or helped an OK company learn the error of its potential future ways. :) :thup:

[Turd Furguson]

Any update on this b/c I still would liek to see what is going on...

[Kid Payne]

I wouldnt make enemies, Talk to someone at the top of the company and if they dont do anything about it, then you have a real good reason to report it. If they do something about it, it saves a lot of trouble for both you and the company, if you report them, youll probably be out of a job and they will be hirting really badly.

Its kinda a stickey area.

I agree with luta also.

Jon


I don't agree with bringing this to the attention of a top company exec. That would mean he went over his immediate supervisor behind his/her back. Chain of command can work for you or against you sometimes. If you think your immediate supervisor is approachable, then that would be the person to talk to. If not, I'd look elsewhere or even outside of the company. Either way if in fact they are violating copyright laws, you still need friends in the company to do this.

[jstutman]

Well when i was in the military, i was all about chain of command. Here where im just some Labor inforced employee who makes the big man money and makes the manager keep his job. This reason alone i wouldnt care about chain of command. I Wouldnt care what they do, fire me etc. Its just a job and there are thousands out there that more less dont break the law. They follow it. Asumming there ethical. I myself would prefer to stay with a company thats ethical and does what right and get paid less. That way i know i will be treated right. IMHO

[MLMIB]

so the name is.... yea, can't tell, mainly 'cause of what SSS said (although I tend to believe he knows....)

it's a shame it happens, yea, but I doubt many of you can say you wouldn't do the same if no one would ever know if in the same situation. but thats just opinion

[jstutman]

in a quick sense note. there making a **** load of money from the customers. BUT in all reality the programs we are using are whats making the money, and they have no repect to pay those companys there respect.

[MLMIB]

you fail to realize quite a few things, most of which I can't go into due to the fact it'd give away the company, but by no means do I think the companies would care in the end, can't bite the hand the feeds you.

that, and we pay for the serial number, not the CD. those cd's that boot up and install every os arn't illegal so much as the CD key's included with them, it's not illegal to install norton onto 20 computers, so long as it's one at a time and never on 2 at a time.


you guys are making quite a few assumptions, and if the mods allow(SSS would hafta contact me to draw lines) I'd be more than willing to play devil's advicate.

till than I have class in 8 minutes :)

[tom10167]

You have a PM MLMIB.

[MLMIB]

yea, waitin for a mod to weigh in

[jstutman]

well me as a the thread poster, approves of saying who it is. i dont care anymore in fact, but i want to make sure theres an okay. that way i dont get in trouble :)

[MLMIB]

me 'n SSS are havin a conv about just that, 1 point was what you wish, it'll be resolved with 2 days(college exams>all currently, sry)

[jstutman]

me dont care. Sam if you read this. he has my permission to post the company.