Need Help on computer parts for new system

[s14]

Hi guys, i'm new to the forums and i don't know much about hardware so i'll do my best.

I'm in the process of building a new computer to be used primarily for work (photoshop/flash/possibly 3d & video) & of course gaming. I have decided to go with a a64 system and here's what i have so far after many days of research on this forum.

I'm from New Zealand so i won't list prices as it might be a little bit confusing for all of us. My main goal is too build a smart system, eg high quality parts that work well with each other - Don't mind pricing (just not too overboard) so if you recommend a certain ram because it performs the best, i'll certainly look into it. I'm also not too concerned with overclocking at this stage, maybe later when i feel the need for more juice.

CASE
Lian-Li PC-V1000B (Black) Aluminium Mid-Tower Case with 2x 120mm fans

Chose this because i like the architecture of the case inside, power supply at the bottom etc. I understand this brand of case is of very high quality.

POWER SUPPLY
Thermaltake Silent PurePower W0023 560W ATX Power Supply Unit

Good brand i hear, is 560W enough?

MOTHERBOARD
Asus A8N-SLI Deluxe nForce4 SLI 4PCIe SATA GBLAN ATX

Although i won't be using the sli feature i want the system to be futureproof for a while, and the pricing is so marginal between a non sli and this one.

CPU
AMD Athlon 64 3500+ (NewCastle, 2.2-2.4GHz, 512KB L2 Cache)

Chose this cpu as the 3800+/4000+ is a considerable step up in pricing. I also see there's 2 types of this socket 939 cpu, newcastle and winchester? Which is better for me?

HARD DRIVE
Seagate 250GB 7200rpm SATA

As i want this system to be "smart" would it be better..

1. Having 2 seperate drives or 1 large one? Eg. 2 x 120gb's just in case 1 dies.
2. Whats raid 0 and raid 1 that i hear people talking about?
3. Would it be even better if i had a 74gb 10,000rpm WD raptor as my OS drive and then the 7200rpm bigger drive/s for storage/applications?

CD/DVD WRITER
Sony DRU710A, Dual Layer DVD Writer, DVD 16/R/16W/4RW, CD 48R/48W/24RW, Internal, IDE

Don't know too much about these but i heard the dual layer was better. What is a good brand to buy?

MEMORY
Corsair TwinX Dual Channel Memory Kit, 2 x 512MB, PC3200 DDR (400Mhz) CL2 Memory XL Pro Series (2-2-2-5)

Eek... this memory stuff really confuses me, i see so many different types of memory and not sure on which one i really need. ECC and registered and all that - What does all this mean? I know i want 1gb of memory and i'm hearing corsair and ocz are the brands to get. Is PC3200 the way to go? i see there's DDR2-667 but this has a higher latency and is bad? If someone could point me in the right direction, maybe paste some links of good, high quality ram and i'll check them out.

VIDEO CARD
Sapphire Radeon X800 XT 256MB, DDR3, PCIe-16,VIVO

I Jumped on the PCI-e wagon. I'm not sure when the x850xt's are coming out in New Zealand so this will have to do for now. Sapphire seems to be the way to go but i'm also hearing Asus.. which one?

Thanks in advance guys

[deception``]

Looking at your post, it appears as if you are on the right track. But before you do anything, please read my DFI/s939 thread:

http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=355145

Even though some of it has to do with the upcoming DFI boards, most of the information is applicable to any s939 NF4 system.

deception``

[gvblake22]

Deception's thread there is a good read.
As far as HDD's go:
RAID 0 is a situation where the data is workload for writing and reading data is split between the two drives of the array so therefor it is faster because you have two drives doing the work instead of one but if one of the drives fails, you lose all your data. RAID 1 is a mirrored array and is nice because it is disaster proof (you won't lose your data if one of the drives fails) because the same data is written to both drives. I'm not 100% sure on the performance hit of having RAID 1 but you will not see a performance boost from RAID 1. Even with RAID 0 many people argue that it does not offer any real noticeable improvement for the cost over a single drive.
Personally, I went with your #3 option of having a 10,000 rpm raptor as my primary OS and program storage drive and then used a 120GB IDE 7200rpm Seagate as my backup/mass storage drive. I would only suggest you go with RAID 0 if you have the extra $$ to burn to have the best or you plan to do a lot of large sustained file transfers or use or something. In most cases, a simgle user desktop environment will not really benefit from RAID 0.
Nice article on RAID 0: http://www.anandtech.com/storage/showdoc.aspx?i=2101

As for the CPU, go with the 90nm Winchester if possible for the reasons listed in deception's thread. ALSO, if you read that thread you'll notice he suggested waiting for the new revision E winchester chips, I would try and wait... If you're spending the $$ you might as well wait and make sure you get the best;)

Memory: You don't need ECC (Error Correction) or Registered RAM. The RAM you linked to is very good RAM and is exactly what you need: non-ECC unregistered DDR. Also, as listed in deception's thread, the RAM based on TCCD chips have been performing very well, especially in AMD Athlon64 systems. THIS (http://www.anandtech.com/memory/showdoc.aspx?i=2235) and THIS (http://www.madshrimps.be/?action=getarticle&number=1&artpage=1014&articID=258) are nice resources for TCCD based memory reviews. I think the best bang for the buck TCCD memory would have to be the Patriot XBL PC-3200 HERE (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-220-033&depa=0) . The reason they make DDR RAM in the faster speeds is because they will be guarunteed to run those speeds where as the PC-3200 RAM is not GUARUNTEED to run faster speeds but with a little tweaking they will, and usually at a cheaper price than the faster RAM. The faster RAM needs lower latencies because the data is moving through so much faster that it is often not stored correctly and errors result causing the system to freeze or crash. By using lower latencies, this in a sense gives the chips a little more time to check what's going on and send the data out without errors. Even though the latencies are lower, the higher speed usually makes up for the lower latencies. Even if you bought PC-3200 RAM and you tried to run it at higher speeds like 260+ mhz, you will have to relax the latencies to get them to run stable. You either have lower speed with tighter timings or faster speed with looser timings; generally the faster speeds with looser timings will perform better and allow for a higher overall overclock of the system. In some cases like RAM with BH-5 chips and the new OCZ Voltage eXtreme RAM, they can run fast speeds (260+mhz) with tight timings (2-2-2-X) if they have enough voltage pumped through them (at least 3.2 volts).

As for the video card, its a relly nice card, but it cannot run SLI. I know you're not gonna be running SLI right away but if you want it for future proofness that means that you would consider going SLI in the future which means you need two SLI compatable video cards. ATI doesn't have any SLI cards out right now so if you got that card you would have to buy a new one (or two new ones) if and when you wanted to go SLI. But if you got one 6600GT, or whatever flavor of 6800 with SLI now, all you would have to do is get another one later when you decided you want SLI and boom, its done, you have SLI. Just a suggestion.

oh yeah,
WELCOME TO THE FORUMS!!! :clap:

[fabulouscoops]

Work machine, Photoshop, video encoding? I am thinking back up and reconsider an Intel system. If you are not gaming primarily, then hyperthreading and the other strong points for pentium 4 chips should be considered.
Nice case, nice power supply
HDD. I would not go with RAID 0 with a work machine. Go with the raptor and a large drive for backup or two drives in RAID 1
RAM I would look at getting 2 gig of RAM. And, you really don't need the lowest latency best stuff if you are not overclocking.
Nice vid card.

Let me echo a welcome to the forums.

[craigiz1]

WELCOME TO THE FORUMS!

I think your on the right track too.
I would save money from the case and get the All-In-Wonder video card since you want to do video editing and such. I would pass on PCI-E at this time.
Do more research on the power supplies. 560 watt is plenty. Do a forums search on power supplies.
I have used Asus mother boards before and was very happy with it.
I love AMD processors. I would try to get a 1meg cache, again because of the video editing.
Stay with the large capacity hard drives. (for the video stuff) Seagate is good. Do a forum search on hard drives. I like Western Digital.
The memory is excellent.

Good Luck!

[metallicafan666]

over all i think your components will work fine and you came to the rite place for info and guidance

that power supply will work fine and even more than fine i have one lol

if you go with the 10,000rpm :burn: drive it makes noticeable more heat than a 7200rpm drive so i would suggest a hard drive cooler that fits in a 3.25" bay (awsome investment)

and make sure your over all cooling inside your case is up 2 par with your cpu

good luck man :attn:

[Sentential]

Well if you are going to get an SLI board might as well get a 6800U or GT so that you can run SLI at a later date

[s14]

First off, thanks to everyone who replied to my post, gained a lot of knowledge from deception``'s thread as well as all the rest, some really good points and it made me shuffle a few of my options around :)

These are the changes i have made so far...

Case
No change

Power Supply
Going to try and get the OCZ Powerstream 520W but if i can't then i'm sticking to the Thermaltake.

Motherboard
Still a little bit stuck. I definately want an nforce 4 board, but unsure on which one to get. Even though i wouldn't be using SLI at this point in time, and it's not really suited to me, the ASUS A8N-SLI Deluxe still seemed like a very nice board from the reviews i have read. Also, i have my mind set on using an ati card. I also understand MSI have an nforce 4 board. What is it called? i can't seem to find it, only the Microstar K8N-NEO2-PLATINUM NFORCE3 board. I don't think we have the DFI boards over here.

CPU
Well it seems Winchester is the way to go but i'm gonna take up deception``'s advice and wait until the revision E's arrive if they are coming quite soon. Any idea when? I'm also thinking about forking out the extra money and getting a Sledgehammer. It may be worth it for my line of work. If not, then i'll be sticking with the 3500+, the 3200 is only NZ$130ish cheaper so no biggie.

CPU COOLER
Decided that i should get one of these regardless of overclocking now or not. Yet, after all this reading about overclocking it seems more appealing to get it running faster yet still stable, for a fraction of the cost of a more expensive cpu. How fast could i get a 3500+ at? 2.6ghz? stable?

My choices are:

Thermalright XP-90 CPU Cooler with 92mm Evercool Fan (NZ$115.00)
Thermalright XP-120 CPU Cooler with 120mm Evercool Fan (NZ$130.00)
Zalman CNPS7000A-CU Super Flower CPU Cooler (NZ$79.00)

Question: will the XP-120 fit on either the ASUS or MSI MB? For NZ$15 more i might as well get the large one.

OTHER COOLING
Is there any other cooling i should be aware of? will the 2 x 12cm fans in the lian li case do the job?

HARD DRIVE
After much reading i've decided upon the 1x Western Digital Raptor 74GB 10000rpm SATA for my OS and 2 x Seagate 200GB 7200rpm SATA in raid1 config. Reliability is so important for me and after the benchmark that gvblake22 posted, raid 0 seems pointless :)

CD / DVD Writer
Have still yet to do some more reseach on these, will check out some later on.
I heard liteon was a good brand?

MEMORY
2gb would be ideal, but 1gb is affordable...
I see that Corsair DDR550 is very good but DDR400 is nothing special and if i was going to get DDR400 it is probably better getting OCZ PC3200 Platinum Rev.2 ... correct? I can't seem to find any DDR550 here, so looks like i'm still flipping it up between these too.

1. OCZ Dual Channel Platinum Memory Kit, 2x512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR400, Rev 2 is NZ$700 ish

2. Corsair TwinX Dual Channel Memory Kit, 2 x 512MB, PC3200 DDR (400Mhz) CL2 Memory XL Pro Series (2-2-2-5) is NZ$583.00

From my understanding OCZ is faster at DDR400, but Corsair is a fair bit cheaper... decisions...

VIDEOCARD
Got my mind set on a sapphire x800xt at NZ$1060.00 - but i could be easily persuaded. Don't think i'll have money for 2 x 6800 cards anytime soon but as mentioned, could get 1 card now the other one later. I found this card... is it ULTRA or GT? GeForce PX6800 TDH, 256MB DDR, GeForce 6800, PCIe-16, TV Out, DVI (NZ$740.00 - so it is a lot cheaper than the ati card. maybe i could get 2 of these?)

Questions:

1. What is a good brand for nvidia cards? Leadtek? Asus? Gainward? Gigabyte?
2. Would 2 nvidia cards in SLI be very beneficial for me if i was going to tackle video & 3d? I know it's very good for gaming.
3. Any idea when the x850xt will come out over here? I know it's only slightly faster than the 800, but gotta have the latest and greatest :)
4. When is ati bringing out their sli equivalent, maybe i should wait for that.

Thanks again guys for all your help!

[gvblake22]

Wow, thats one helluva post w/ a LOT of Q's! haha
I'll see what I can do:
MOTHERBOARD
ASUS and MSI both make decent boards. On the whole I would have to say that ASUS has a better reputation for stability than MSI does and ASUS boards usually include a better software/hardware package.
MSI Neo4 Platinum/SLI: http://www.msicomputer.com/product/p_spec.asp?model=K8N_Neo4_Platinum/SLI&class=mb
or
MSI Neo4 platinum: http://www.msicomputer.com/product/p_spec.asp?model=K8N_Neo4_Platinum&class=mb if you don't want SLI on an MSI board.

ASUS should also have an NF4 Ultra board out soon. Chaintech has one available and other companies should soon be following suit (fingers crossed)
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CPU COOLER
The XP-120 should fit on both boards. I kinda like the XP-90 a little better because it is easier to find high performance 92mm fans for the XP-90 than it is 120mm fans for the XP-120.
and the cooling in that Lian Li case is very good, just fill 'er up with fans and you'll be all set:)
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OPTICAL DRIVES
I have two Lite-On drives (DVD-ROM and CD-RW) and they both work great and are nice and cheap.
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MEMORY
The OCZ stuff will probably overclock better but, like you said, may be more expensive. Corsair makes great RAM so don't hesitate to pick up either of these as they are both great choices.
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VIDEO CARD
I think that card you listed may be a plain vanilla 6800 (not GT or Ultra) hence the cheap price. It is still a good card, just not as good as a X800XT or 6800GT/Ultra. The X850's should be out somtime this month I would assume unless ATI just really wants to commit suicide and let nVidia continue to dominate the market...

I hear that Gainward makes very good cards but they are usually a little bit more expensive. Some prefer BFG, some prefer XFX, some prefer Leadtech; Its really hard to say that there is an established dominant leader in that makes nVidia cards. I say just stay away from the companies you've never heard of before:rolleyes:

I would also say that SLI would not really be worth the extra cost, especially right now. I don't really know how they perform in video editing stuff but I would assume that if you had ATI's latest and greatest you would have no problem doing whatever you need to do;)

As far as ATI producing an SLI equivalent, WHO KNOWS! Seriously though, SLI from ATI is still prettymuch a roumer.

[s14]

Thanks gvblake22,

Sorry about the questions, i have much to learn :) Since i'll be waiting on the new revision E cpus i might as well wait for the ASUS NF4 Ultra board and also the radeon x850xt :D i hate waiting mind you.

Off topic - i have a xp2600+, how do i find out if it's a barton? always wanted to try overclocking. I've got a thermaltake xaser case with like 7 fans but no cpu cooler i dont think. Since i'll be turning this one into a server i dont have much love for it anymore thus could risk overclocking :)

cheers

[gvblake22]

you can download a program called cpu-z (just do a google search for it) and it will say what core it has and how much L2 cache. If it has 512k cache then its a barton.
If your gonna use it in a server I would suggest NOT overclocking it becuase of the increased risk of instability with an overclock (I'm assuming you don't want your server to crash). Overclocking isn't gonna kill or damage your chip unless you run EXTREME high voltage through it 24/7 and even then its still gonna take a good beating. I'd say have fun overclocking the system and see how far it will go and then just drop it back to a very stable clock (stock) so it will be a good reliable server.

[s14]

nah not a barton :( only 256 l2 cache. Yeah she's server material alright :)

cheers