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Ok I am gonna give 2x256mb gskill a try

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Overclocker550

Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2002
After I saw some dude hit 344fsb 1:1 with his(high latency but still.....) it made me :slobber: and realize that no 2x512 will ever clock as high as the 2x256 counterparts. I really hope 2x256 is much more forgiving on my winchester's ondie controller. Also some people refuse to believe the ondie controller bs and instead blame the cpu, ram or motherboard. People have told me I probably just got a weak pair of patriot tccd and this is why I cant get over 262 bench, 250 stable. I will see how my patriot does in the venice, if I still cant get higher, that rams getting rmaed or ebayed.

anyway I could take the le for $135 or the la for $147. the le is 275 at ras-cas3 while the la is 300 at ras-cas4. both t1 command rate except for the gig la. both gig sets are sold out anyway and if I went a gig, id go le cause t2 sucks. I will game with my patriot 2x512(unless I ebay them)and bench with my 2x256. I wish I could both bench and game with my 512 but ill lose out in benchmarks :( anyway you experts or gskill workers, is it le or la for me? I will be happy if I get 280+ benchable ras-cas3 with either(320 ras-cas4 is just as good) what I was thinking, is my chances better of overclocking the le as far as I can without changing its ras-cas3 timing or changing the la timing to ras-cas3 and hope it can still run ddr600, if not ill underclock the la with ras-cas3. Of course theres my ondie controller to factor in, if I dont hit 275 on the le or 300 on the la(ras-cas4) I know for sure its my ondie controller. Let me know asap before this TCCD is permaently sold out as samsung has ceased production of gskill and if I dont buy now, I may be looking at $200+ for 2x256 or $400+ a gig :(
 
I dont care much for suicide screenies, I was able to get to windows up to ddr500 with my corsair value but it wasnt stable at even 215 unless I took 1 stick out. My ondie controller can load windows at 280fsb with this patriot ram but its not stable much past 250. I could probably get ddr600 easy at 2.5-3-3 but it being stable or even 3dmarkable is another story. I bet all those guys getting crazy screens like 320-350 were suicide screens, if they could bench 3dmark they would tear the orb down with insane scores, I would get 24k with my eyes closed at those bandwith
 
You're too stuck on high memory speeds. The realworld performance of DDR600 w/ sloppy timings isn't all that great. Just the same if you're sure you want to do this then get the 2x256 LA modules.

Edit: It's not your memory controller bro. LOL

Sorry couldn't resist. :)
 
just ordered 2x256mb gskill la. Lets see if my ondie controller can handle even 300MHz, I really hope so, if not all the more reason to look forward to Venice. I see some of you have hit well over ddr600 with even winchesters, I guess the newer winchesters tend to have better ondie controllers on average. What do you think would be a reasonable expectation that ill get with that ram? 285x9=2.57GHz on the cpu, 285MHz of stress on the ondie controller 1:1 2.5-3-3-10 t1? I can hit 262 benchable and fairly stable with my 2x512 patriot. I hope I gain more than 20 fsb higher with 2x256 as its less stress on the ondie controller. My winchester will bench 3dmark up to 2.6GHz as well so at 285x9 I would be very near the limit of both cpu and ondie controller, I hope its stable enough to complete 3dmark at least half the time. my 262x9 is, 266x9 has completed 3dmark but maybe 25% of the time, too time consuming for me if its not stable enough. I would be both impressed and supprised if I hit ddr600, period reguardless of timing. What MHz higher on the ram would I need to make up if I go 2.5-4-4 vs. 2.5-3-3? I was thinking like 40MHz and it would be a miracle if my ondie controller could do well over 300. I might be able to do 300 but will need to drop to 8x multi for that. Much expermentation will be needed once I get this ram, but id say 285x9=2.57 has the best chance and also probably the best performance, unless I can get over 300fsb at 8x multi. I have 23.1k now at 262x9, if everything equal except I gain 23fsb and 210MHz, exactly how much higher I get remains to be seen on this gpu and my other gpus(ti4200, ti200, mx440, etc) If I do exceptionally well with this winchester, it will lessen my interest in Venice unless I see those constantly hit 3GHz. 285x9=2.57 on a winchester is nothing to scoff at and I would see very little point going Venice if it cant really overclock higher. No one knows how Venice will do or if itll even use strained silcon nor how much they will cost once they come
 
Hey Overclocker550....just thought I'd share my results, cause I did the same thing you did. I had a gig of XBL TCCD, but I tried the 2x256mb LA g.skill set.

My XBL was stable up to 265 at 1:1, but the LA's were stable up to 285 at 1:1. I am convinced that it was due to the sticks being single sided and less dense, if that is possible. My XBL will do 300mhz 1:1 with one stick, so I figured that 2x256mb would OC higher than my 2x512. I was right. However, I really didn't see the point because I couldn't play any of my games with only 512mb of ram, so I returned them and got a gig of the Winbond UTT stuff instead.

Anyway, if it is high 1:1 overclocking you are looking for, I don't think you could have made a better choice ;) Let us know how they do!

-Collin-
 
"My XBL was stable up to 265 at 1:1, but the LA's were stable up to 285 at 1:1."


thats also your ondie controller talking. was this all at 2.5-3-3-x timing? my ondie is even worse than yours, I am only stable to 250, maybe 255. I can bench 262 but I get crashes sometimes. I will be very happy to get even 285 with my la, this will get me 285x9=2.57GHz on my winny. If I can do 300+ ill drop to the 8x multi
 
This was at 2.5-4-3-10-1t. I think you'll enjoy your LA's. Personally, I realized I made a mistake when I paid $150 for half a gig of ram :)

-Collin-
 
512Mb of ram isn't enough for alot of users anymore and it'll be even less than enough in a couple months when XP64 is released.
 
ill use my 512mb for benching and older games that dont need a gig. for new games, ill have no choice but swap my gig in, ill get faster load times and less HDD access but take like 20% performance hit cause of lower bandwith :(
 
Yer kidding right? You're really gonna change ram all the time based on what programs you intend to run? If I were you I'd skip the 2x256 and just figure out what's wrong with my setup. If your ondie controller is really the cause of all your trouble as you keep mentioning then sell it. The 2x256 LA sticks cost as much as a new processor. Hint hint.
 
Overclocker550 said:
ill use my 512mb for benching and older games that dont need a gig. for new games, ill have no choice but swap my gig in, ill get faster load times and less HDD access but take like 20% performance hit cause of lower bandwith :(

20% performance hit?!?!?!?!!? NOOOOO WAY, not with only a 20-40mhz HTT decrease. 20% is a massive performance hit.

-Collin-
 
NinjaZX6R said:
20% performance hit?!?!?!?!!? NOOOOO WAY, not with only a 20-40mhz HTT decrease. 20% is a massive performance hit.

-Collin-
Yea agreed. He tends to take apocolypic views on ram timings:D Its all good tho. Atleast he can finally prove the truth to himself this round ;) its maybe 5%
 
zzzzzzzzz

hopefully this thread doesn't become like his ultimate winchester thread (which he never updated with results.) why was that anyway? because they were so bad?
 
All abuse aside if you're so convinced the problem is the CPU then why change ram?
 
ok if I can do 300MHz on the ram with 2x256 but only 250(which I have now) this is effeciantly a 16.7% reduction in bandwith. 50MHz less ram bandwith is like losing 250MHz worth of cpu clocks for me, thats alot when I run my cpu at around 2.3GHz for gaming. Yes I could get another winchester but why would I when venice is about to come? I can use that new ram on venice too and gain even more performance. It sucks I have to make compromises and swap my ram depending which game(and benchmark) does better, but this is cause they cant make 2x512mb as good and cause a gig is hard on the ondie controller. 2x256 is to put it bluntly both slower and faster depending what I run


"All abuse aside if you're so convinced the problem is the CPU then why change ram?"


cause 2x256 should get me 20+ higher fsb with this cpu then when I go venice ill be flying. No point in another winny
 
Overclocker550 said:
ok if I can do 300MHz on the ram with 2x256 but only 250(which I have now) this is effeciantly a 16.7% reduction in bandwith. 50MHz less ram bandwith is like losing 250MHz worth of cpu clocks for me, thats alot when I run my cpu at around 2.3GHz for gaming. Yes I could get another winchester but why would I when venice is about to come? I can use that new ram on venice too and gain even more performance. It sucks I have to make compromises and swap my ram depending which game(and benchmark) does better, but this is cause they cant make 2x512mb as good and cause a gig is hard on the ondie controller. 2x256 is to put it bluntly both slower and faster depending what I run


"All abuse aside if you're so convinced the problem is the CPU then why change ram?"



cause 2x256 should get me 20+ higher fsb with this cpu then when I go venice ill be flying. No point in another winny

This is just one of those cases where there's so many things wrong with what you said I don't know where to begin. First 50Mhz of memory speed does most certainly NOT equate to 250Mhz of CPU speed nor does it equate to 16.7% more bandwidth. Look here:

http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=364207

The difference that 50Mhz of memory speed made was +8.1% bandwidth. The effect this had on CPU performance was +1.1%. This was from 201 to 251Mhz. Going from 250 to 300Mhz will have even less impact even assuming you can maintain the same timings, which is unlikely.

It's your money, waste it however you like, but you'll see very little difference with this purchase.
 
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from my own experience, I gain 4 to 5 MHz cpu's worth for each MHz ram bandwith I gain. I dont know why its not for you, but I experienced huge gains with increased ram bandwith. My score now is 23.1k, you just wait and see as I try for 24k. If I gain any cpu MHz, this will help even more. I gain about 3.5 marks per cpu MHz so 285x9=2.57 would give me 210MHz more cpu clocks or about 700 marks and the extra 23MHz ram bandwith would be worth 100+ MHz on the cpu or 350+ marks so id gain an easy 1000+ marks. I think this is a good deal and I can use that ram to make Venice really shine. $150 may be expensive but I also believe tccd will keep its value if not go up since its discountinued, I can always sell it anytime I want
 
Alright man. I'm quite certain you can't prove anything you just said, but alright. By all means buy the ram and get a great score in that 4 year old benchmark. Swap your ram and change your bios settings every time you run a different program. Good luck and I'd absolutely love to see the detailed results of this little "upgrade".
 
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