I need my system on 24/7 even after power failure

[lennytiger]

Hey Guys,

My server box for my DSL needs to be kept on 24/7. Usually this would be easy as I would just set the BIOS to Power on after AC Break or something like that in power management properties.

This BIOS doesn't have that setting... I'm wondering if its possible to short circuit the power switch, eg (join PS wires together) and leave it like that so the puter thinks its always being switched on, would this work?

I'm sure i've seen this thread around before, but search didn't pull much up...

[JoT]

Why not get a cheap UPS? Then the power never does go out, and the power going in is nice, clean electricity :D

[lennytiger]

I can't afford one... South Africa doesn't have support for them when they break!
Is my little "mod" possible though?

[Susquehannock]

Actually most cheap UPS do little for cleaning up the current. They are only designed
to switch to battery power when the current drops below a certain level, usually 100V.

UPS with AVR (Auto. Volt. regulation) on the other hand supply your system from a
separate circuit which is monitored to supply a consistant sine wave.

[lennytiger]

Is the power switch mod possible???

[Veland]

Nope, that would be tha same as holding the power switch in, and would signal a hard reset (try holding in your power button and see what happens!)

So either you need a bit of circuitry to detect powerloss and then send a signal when the power is back, or some wild and whacky bodge job!

Like this: Get a 220V (or 110V if that's what you got) motor and a 12V relay. Visit you lokal junk yard to get this..

The 220V motor should be spinning slowly, so look around. Then put a wheel with some "knobs" on it, and an open copper strip switch. Positioned so that when the wheel rotates, the knobs will press the copper strips together where the knobs are. The copper strips is connected to the powerswitch header on you mb

Then but the relay into the circuit of the motor, with the 12V switching power hooked to your PSU. Should be a NC relay..

The theory (condition after power loss):
The PSU is not running, so the relay is closed. When power returns, the 220V motor starts spinning, the knobs presses the copper strips together momentarily, thus powering up your PSU. As the PSU starts, 12V is sent to the relay, shutting of power to the 220V motor and it stops.

Sorted!

...pretty proud of myself for such a junkyard friendly solution...

[Archer36]

Yea, while I never tried it but it should be quite easy. Just take a switch and attach two wires then solder them to the green and one black wire on your ATX connector. It should act like an old AT style power supply, I also was thinking about doing this one my smoothwall so when the power goes out it comes back on.

The only thing that kinda bothered me is if the power is doing the on and off thing for 5 minutes what affect that would have on the computer. Then again I can get the mobos like $10 on ebay so it would not be much of a loss.


And Veland that would work too, just a bit more complicated :p

[Veland]

Ok, try it! Hold you power switch in constantly!

Waiting

Waiting

Waiting

What, it turned itself off? Didn't it? After about 4 seconds? AFAIK it's part of the ATX spec.. So on anything other then AT you can't just keep the button pressed...

[Archer36]

Like I said in my earlier post can you just short the Green and Black on the ATX connector? While I have done this to test fans while not plugged into the mobo but I don't see why it would not work.

[Bios24]

I'm still voting for a cheap UPS. So what's the deal? You can't buy them anywhere? The only thing you really have to service on them are batteries. If the whole thing dies, you can always just buy a new one. They aren't really worth servicing unless you can do it yourself. Then the computer would stay on even if the power went out. (at least for a while)

The switch idea is pretty complicated. Is it really worth it? Are you away from the box for long periods of time where you wouldn't be able to see if it's on/off? Have you tried unplugging it and plugging it back in? Maybe it will start automaticlly?

[lennytiger]

Yea, while I never tried it but it should be quite easy. Just take a switch and attach two wires then solder them to the green and one black wire on your ATX connector. It should act like an old AT style power supply, I also was thinking about doing this one my smoothwall so when the power goes out it comes back on.

The only thing that kinda bothered me is if the power is doing the on and off thing for 5 minutes what affect that would have on the computer. Then again I can get the mobos like $10 on ebay so it would not be much of a loss.


And Veland that would work too, just a bit more complicated :p

Couldn't you just wire the black and green directly together and lose the switch then? I don't really need the switch, but wil the motherboard need those wires plugged into it to boot?

[Archer36]

Couldn't you just wire the black and green directly together and lose the switch then? I don't really need the switch, but wil the motherboard need those wires plugged into it to boot? Yea you could loose the switch but then you have to poke your head in the computer if you ever need to turn it off for some reason.

[lennytiger]

I think i have an old AT case around somewhere, then i could just wire it up to that as you said previously and it should work! Great, now i just need to find some time when i'm not studying!

[Cap'n Pedro]

Whoah, who said it wasn't possible? It just takes a little knowhow (http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=401139).

[Susquehannock]

Re: cheap UPS ...

Ask yourself this ... What do they do?

In addition to what I presented above ... cheap non-AVR UPS do absolutely nothing
for brown-outs unless they drop below the lower limit. For instance, if the brown-out
only drops to say 102V, the battery won't kick in and your computer's power supply must take up the slack.

Yes, a good UPS with AVR helps your power supply too, and thus the rest of your system.

I have never understood why some will spend $2,000+ to build the best system
possible, then "protect" it with a $30 UPS. Or even worse, a $5 power strip
bought at a yard sale. :rolleyes:
This is not rocket science people.

[JoT]

Yay for investing in good APC UPS?

[JTanczos]

But even a cheap UPS would protect against the on/off drops that happens sometimes. THey happen quite often here this time of year and they typically down every computer without at least a simple $30 UPS. Recently purchased a Smart APC UPS 1400 from ebay that powers the computer, 2 monitors, a switch, router, and cable modem for 40 minutes. Great little system!

As for what you want to do be careful. You wont have any of the auto shutoff features to protect your motherboard.

JT

[Archer36]

Smart APC UPS 1400 from ebay that powers the computer, 2 monitors, a switch, router, and cable modem for 40 minutes. Great little system!


:drool: gee how much did that cost? I need a UPS but just can not spend the money to get one :(

[Etacovda]

unless you're serving files on your dsl server, why not just buy a dsl router...

[Electron Chaser]

One way to do it is to use a one shot timer relay. That has the coil hooked up to your outlet and one of the sets of dry contacts wired in parallel to your pushbutton on you PC. When the power comes back on It closes the contact for say 3 seconds and then opens on timer complete.

The only thing is that when you buy the relay you have to make sure that the coil voltage is the same as the voltage in your outlet. Other then that it is a very easy addition probably take you less then an hour to wire the whole thing up.

[pik4chu]

Whoah, who said it wasn't possible? It just takes a little knowhow (http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=401139).
btw people. this WORKS. except you dont need that big of a cap, 10uF will work

[JTanczos]

:drool: gee how much did that cost? I need a UPS but just can not spend the money to get one :(

$140+$30 shipping ;)

Heard here that even used Smart APCs are better then some of the cheap $30 ones just because they are very well made server grade units designed to last a long time for critical applications.


That relay switch thing was actually what I was thinking about had I the experience to build such a unit. Good thing someone else knows how! :)

JT

[four4875]

I have an apc smart-ups 1400 rackmount, modified with batteres that are a little over 3 times the capacity each, and i get around 3 hours of runtime with my comp and dual monitors on it. its a great ups, i need to get the oscilloscope home out fo storage to get some pics of its signal compared to the wall.

[zexmarquies01]

ACTUALLY...you probably could build something to Auto-turn on when power shuts off...the only problem is...well...it won't turn on if there is no power.

But It will keep trying to turn on the PC untill there is a power flow.

Build yourself a circuit.

Use a relay that is Set to " open " when there is a power flow. When power stops...it closes the contacts sending the power to turn on the PC. Once the power turns on, It will Then Open the contacts and thus act as if a power button was just pressed and then let go of.

The only problem i truly see is that the Relay might shut off to soon, before enough power can get through it to start the PC. I'm SURE somewhere there is a Relay i mentioned that has a timer built in as well, so it stays " On " for like 1 second after it senses a current flow, thus letting the PC turn on.

Thats just the Button part. most of these relays run off of 12 volts. Sooo, you'd need to have a 12 volt adapter plugged into your AC outlet. And then that hooked up to the Relay.

Then, Take your PC power switch Hook up the 5V input into the Input contact of the relay. Then the ground wire gets hooked to the ground Contact on the relay.

Bam there ya go.

As long as the 12V adapter gets power, it will keep a current flow to the relay, keeping it in an open position..basicly acting as if the power switch is not being pushed.

As soon as power shuts off, The conacts in the relay close. And will stay closed untill it gets its 12 volt Power source back.

so when the contacts close, it will allow the 5v Power source try to turn on the PC. if the power is out...there won't be a 5v source anyways...so, as soon as power comes on, since the contacts are already closed, the PC Should turn on.

Like i said though, you would probably need a relay that not only is open while it has power feeding to it, but also has a timer on it, so it allows power flow for a few seconds then shuts off. Letting the PC get the 5v input to turn it on.


If i thought that up right...that SHOULD work.

the ONLY thing i'm not sure of is...well..turning the PC on with the power button held in. i'v never done it before honestly. Someone will have to try that. Kill power to their PC, press and hold the power button, then plug the Computer back in, and see if it turns on. If it turns on, then what i said above SHOULD work....at least in theory. heh.

Any other electronic Guru's want to read over what i just said and see if it would work? Because i had to do this type of stuff in Electronics class that i took. So in theory it SHOULD work...but if someone can look over what i said, it would help verify if i'm correct or not.


*EDIT* After double reading some posts, i JUST noticed Electron Chasers Post...basicly i said the EXACT same thing as him...just i went into more detail...all in all, If you know what your doing, you could wire this thing up in about 15 min.