Radiator and Fan Mounting - Stacker

CobaltInfinity · Dec 4, 2005

I decided to go with the proverbial "balls to the wall" on this setup and I want some of your thoughts. The end system is going to be in a CM Stacker case and there will be the standard plethora of top of the line stuff. Storm, d5, acetal maze4, tygon, blah blah blah. I decided to go with a bixIII because this case is massive and because I can. I think I have all but finally decided to mount the radiator in the bottom of the case which is going to require some modification of that grill they have on the bottom. That is not a big deal, I have all the tools and knowledge to do that. The question becomes, how do I want to mount the fans? Where do you guys think I should mount the hardware? I'm up in arms at this point in time as I am still modding/painting/waiting on parts. All of your thoughts will be appreciated. Thanks.

pwnt by pat · Dec 4, 2005

Put the fans on pull as intakes to the case. Then use hollowed out fans as spacers on the other side of the radiator (mock-push) and mount the fan spacers to the case.

http://pat8703.kicks-***.net:3097/web/ocforums%20pictures/CobaltInfinity.JPG

bri1 · Dec 4, 2005

pwnt by pat said:
Put the fans on pull as intakes to the case. Then use hollowed out fans as spacers on the other side of the radiator (mock-push) and mount the fan spacers to the case.

http://pat8703.kicks-***.net:3097/web/ocforums%20pictures/CobaltInfinity.JPG

somewone told me that that hole is way to small for a bix3 but i dont really know i was told it fits 2x80 mm fans but pat knows what he saying personally i would just put it in the front of the case

Aidenswarrior · Dec 4, 2005

bri1 said:
somewone told me that that hole is way to small for a bix3 but i dont really know i was told it fits 2x80 mm fans but pat knows what he saying personally i would just put it in the front of the case

omg me and bri1 actually agree on something. Yes put them in the front of the case. You will have no worry about room, just use some velcro.

bri1 · Dec 4, 2005

Aidenswarrior said:
omg me and bri1 actually agree on something. Yes put them in the front of the case. You will have no worry about room, just use some velcro.

lol thanks for the velcro idea i wouldent have thought of that

found a link right here

http://www.voyeurmods.com/index.php?action=item&id=929&prevaction=category&previd=2&prevstart=0

I think those radiators are still a bit bigger than the hole but it shouldn't matter that much, because a bix3 in the front would be much better decision.

CobaltInfinity · Dec 4, 2005

I know for a fact that I am going to have to cut up the bottom of the case cause that hole is definitely not large enough. Modding the case is not really the issue. I thought about the front, and I could always machine some sort of brackets but I want to be able to keep the hard drive cage there along with the Vantec Vortex that my raptor is in and the Gatewatch that is monitoring the fans. Right now I am eating up 7 of the 5.25 bays so its not going to fit in the front.

so pat, you are essentially saying to just make sure I mount them with some sort of spacer?

bri1 · Dec 5, 2005

thats alot of bay used ohh whell

pwnt by pat · Dec 5, 2005

The bix3 will fit along the bottom of the case, seeing as it fits between the 5 1/4 slots just fine verticlly, there is no reason it shouldn't horizontally.

While you can mount the radiator by itself, I think you'll have a much easier time using a hole saw and cutting holes and using hollowed out fans to space the rad away from the bottom of the case.

You could use that one grill... I can't remember the name or manufacturer. Vio1 uses one in his thread in alt-modding project logs. Anyway, it fits a 120x3 radiator. You could use that and fit it flush to the bottom of the case and mount it up into rad's pre-tapped fan holes. The only problem with that is that mesh thing on the bottom of the stacker. Either way you're probably going to have to deal with it somehow. I've personally never seen a stacker so I don't know how much it protudes into the case. I'd imagine that it's just screwed down...

Anyway, either way will work. I think my spacer idea would look better, if you're into aesthetics. If not, mount it the easiest way possible.

CobaltInfinity · Dec 5, 2005

There is definitely going to at least be some sort of grill. My question was just, is there a particular reason for the hollowed-out fans or are you just saying it needs some sort of shroud? I was thinking of fabricating some sort of shroud out of aluminum or steel for the whole thing and it would look like it was rising out of the bottom of the case.

pwnt by pat · Dec 5, 2005

No, you don't need them. Will it make mounting easier? probably. Will it help performance? I don't know.

If you put the rad right smack on the bottom of the case, you may have a hard time getting air into the center of the rad. With the fan spacers, you might slightly restrict the airflow and/or increase noise.

FIZZ3 · Dec 5, 2005

I would much prefer the front-mounted vertical orientation over the bottom-mount one. In the latter case you're creating a huge dust-ingesting device aka vacuum cleaner. There is also the issue of where to put your pump, if there is not enough room left on the bottom.

In any case, the fan-mounted approach has a big aesthetic advantage compared to what Danger Den is suggesting. That tape business they show in the video is quite ghetto IMO, and removing it afterwards seems like a hassle.

demonR6 · Dec 5, 2005

Mounting the radiator in the front drive bays with the fans ingesting air isn't a vacuum cleaner in a different orientation? Not. I have the same case with the radiator mounted in that orientation and I can tell you from experience that after a couple of days I am cleaning the front of the case because it is in fact sucking up anything that happens to come near it. I know what one can do, having three fans would be insane.. I would probably come home and find my cat stuck to it.

Kil4Thril · Dec 5, 2005

90mm fans would fit perfectly down there. I used a BIP2 on mine in the configuration indicated. It works well, just be sure to filter or clean often. My rad would clog quickly. Of course, the cats/dogs/rat may have had something to do with it.

FIZZ3 · Dec 5, 2005

demonR6 said:
Mounting the radiator in the front drive bays with the fans ingesting air isn't a vacuum cleaner in a different orientation? Not. I have the same case with the radiator mounted in that orientation and I can tell you from experience that after a couple of days I am cleaning the front of the case because it is in fact sucking up anything that happens to come near it. I know what one can do, having three fans would be insane.. I would probably come home and find my cat stuck to it.

No it's worse on the bottom as it draws from the surrounding floor/desk, also the place where the heavier particles have settled down. Front mount draws mostly floating dust particles.

pwnt by pat · Dec 5, 2005

You should have a filter on it either way so it won't matter. Plus, once the heavier particles are sucked in, they don't get replaced becasue of the constatly moving air.

FIZZ3 · Dec 6, 2005

pwnt by pat said:
You should have a filter on it either way so it won't matter. Plus, once the heavier particles are sucked in, they don't get replaced becasue of the constatly moving air.

I feel a bit silly continuing this discussion of dust, but what you're saying doesn't make sense.

1) If heavier particles get sucked in and they "don't get replaced", that just means you've clogged up some part of your system now. Not desirable.

2) A filter is good, indeed, but it does not take away the problem entirely: the filter will clog up and you will need to clean it more often than you would have with the vertical orientation. Still not desirable.

Thinking about this bottom radiator mount some more, there is actually another drawback to it: the floor surface hinders the free flow of air, and your fans will be less effective than when they would have to overcome less resistance, such as when they were to draw from the non-obstructed front of the case. In a Stacker there isn't much of a faceplate in the way there either.

pwnt by pat · Dec 6, 2005

It's out of order to make more sense.

2) This can not be said for sure. This does not take cleanlieness of the house into consideration. I have a verticle rad and a horizontal rad in my case. The verticle rad gets much more dirty than the horizontal one simply the heating solution in my house creates so much dust on its own, that the rad pulls the imputities out of the air.

Anyone who doesn't use a filter in a dusty enviroment is a sucker. Plain and simple. You can argue that it'll hurt performance but isn't this what we are anyway?

3) Every case has feet, which will allow for circulation under the case. That reason is why I suggested something to space the radiator off of the very bottom of the case. If it was faced flat then the center of the radiator would be completely starved for air. If you're going to starve the rad, at least spread airflow to all parts of the rad.

I think what you are failing to take into consideration is the fact that he said he can not do a frount mount because he needs 7 of the bays. If this wern't the case, I'd be arguing the front too but since it's not, an altearnative needs to be found. Bottom would work out more convenient than external also because you don't buy a stacker to watercool with for it's aesthetics

1) ... at which point you'll have to clean something anyway. see 2. If the fan on the bottom of the case, radiator is choking for air then it's not going to move as much as a more free flowing horizontal fan. Who will suck more debris in? It depends on the enviroment

FIZZ3 · Dec 6, 2005

pwnt by pat said:
It's out of order to make more sense.

2) This can not be said for sure. This does not take cleanlieness of the house into consideration. I have a verticle rad and a horizontal rad in my case. The verticle rad gets much more dirty than the horizontal one simply the heating solution in my house creates so much dust on its own, that the rad pulls the imputities out of the air.

Anyone who doesn't use a filter in a dusty enviroment is a sucker. Plain and simple. You can argue that it'll hurt performance but isn't this what we are anyway?

3) Every case has feet, which will allow for circulation under the case. That reason is why I suggested something to space the radiator off of the very bottom of the case. If it was faced flat then the center of the radiator would be completely starved for air. If you're going to starve the rad, at least spread airflow to all parts of the rad.

I think what you are failing to take into consideration is the fact that he said he can not do a frount mount because he needs 7 of the bays. If this wern't the case, I'd be arguing the front too but since it's not, an altearnative needs to be found. Bottom would work out more convenient than external also because you don't buy a stacker to watercool with for it's aesthetics

1) ... at which point you'll have to clean something anyway. see 2. If the fan on the bottom of the case, radiator is choking for air then it's not going to move as much as a more free flowing horizontal fan. Who will suck more debris in? It depends on the enviroment

Haha, you're the Dust King for sure.

Your PC is a testament to that: http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=428411 I just thought that was funny, no offense.

If those bays are needed, then the point is moot anyway. As long as everybody is aware of the Dust Issue.

Still, your reasoning is odd to me. Here are my points.

1) Even if a heating solution creates a lot of airborne dust, this will just settle again on the floor. Your bottom fan gets less clog because it cannot draw sufficient air. Creating that situation is possibly worse than the Dust. What we're after is maximum airflow and minimum dust.

2) I do not contest the use of a filter. It is just not a solution to sucking in dust, it simply helps.

clocker2 · Dec 6, 2005

Um, when did the issue of dust even rise into the shortlist of considerations when designing a waterloop?
T've run three different floormount rads in my Stacker with no serious dust problems (admittedly, each setup was only installed for a week or so to evaluate performance), but even had buildup occured (assuming we're not talking horrorshow, blanket coverage), a periodic swipe with the ShopVac seems a small price to pay.

I certainly wouldn't let potential dust problems stop me from at least trying an otherwise good install.

pwnt by pat · Dec 6, 2005

Haha, you're the Dust King for sure. Your PC is a testament to that: http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=428411 I just thought that was funny, no offense.

Quite hypocritical, I agree. My house gets so dusty from the heating element that a filter would get cloged after less than a week. It's much easier for me to just blow out the rads and wipe the fans off every two weeks...

Plus I keep my computer on a desk, three feet above the floor.

Radiator and Fan Mounting - Stacker

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