Overclocking X800XL

[jeepguy_1980]

I have a ATI Radeon Sapphire X800XL Ultimate (512MB) and it has lots of artifacts durring game play. This is the first computer I've built and I haven't had a powerful computer in quite a while, so I can't say how it compares to others.

I've been playing Battlefied 2 and the game play is very smooth. But I get lots of black shapes that appear on the screen or text above peoples head gets messed up sometimes. I've played it on both medium and high and it does the same thing under each setting. It's not any worse under high than it is under medium. I was thinking about overclocking it, but I don't want to fry it.

Do you guys think it's my video card? If so, do you think OCing it will help?

[Puer Aeternus]

If you have artifacts than O/C'ing is not advised (IMO). Have you switched drivers to see if that makes a diff?

[jeepguy_1980]

Switch drivers to what? I just used the ones that came with it.

[TRF-Inferno]

Switch drivers to what? I just used the ones that came with it.
Get the latest drivers from ATi here (http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=1344)

[jeepguy_1980]

Yeah, I already had that version. I should have said that I downloaded the newest version of what already came with it.

Is it possible that my card or computer is not good enough to run BF2 like it should be ran?

[TRF-Inferno]

Yeah, I already had that version. I should have said that I downloaded the newest version of what already came with it.

Is it possible that my card or computer is not good enough to run BF2 like it should be ran?
I don't think so. Your computer seems pretty strong, I'm starting to wonder if the video card itself is defective. Granted X800XLs are poor overclockers and will artifact on even the slightest overclock, it shouldn't be doing so at stock speeds. How's the cooling setup on your computer?

[jeepguy_1980]

I just have the 3 stock thermal take fans on the computer, a Mascool CPU fan and the fan on the video card.

I should add that the game is not unplayable by any means. I just didn't expect to have any flickering shapes on my screen.

[Capt_Caveman]

fwiw - I'm currently using a X800XL (til I decided what to buy next) and w/ BF2 run all settings at medium w/ AA 2X at 1600x1200 and avg 60fps. I do oc while playing to 460/575. I don't have any image issues. Sadly, I did when I had my 7800GTX 512 but all of my settings were set to High and only when I turned texture down to medium did my image problems go away.

[andyfoz]

I have a x800xl sapphire 256 and i can run bf2 on full settings now. the card is clocked to 425 and 525 although it doesnt need to be.

now the game was shocking before i upgraded to 2 gig of memory dual channel - now i can run 1600x1200 @85 hz with all settings on full.

i also have a windows account specifically for this game with only essential programs running in the back ground as this game is a monster drain on your system.

so memory is the key here - unless you are experiencing this problem on other lower spec games too!

[Puer Aeternus]

Did you say only BF2 was showing artifacts or all your games? This is important!

[jeepguy_1980]

BF2 is all of my games. I don't have any other games. I have some that came with my card, but I never installed them. They are Prince of Persia The Sands of Time and Splinter Cell Pandora Tomorrow.

I also have 2 gigs of dual channel memory and another gig of single channel memory. Though, I don't have the single channel gig installed right now, b/c I wasn't sure if it would lower my performance.

[Puer Aeternus]

BF2 is all of my games. I don't have any other games. I have some that came with my card, but I never installed them. They are Prince of Persia The Sands of Time and Splinter Cell Pandora Tomorrow.

I also have 2 gigs of dual channel memory and another gig of single channel memory. Though, I don't have the single channel gig installed right now, b/c I wasn't sure if it would lower my performance.
You seem more interested in bragging about your rig than dealing w/ the artifacts. Artifacts is a video card issue. If you wanna solve this install Pandora and see if you still get artifacts.
(You rig will play BF2 at max settings fine......mine does)

[jeepguy_1980]

You seem more interested in bragging about your rig than dealing w/ the artifacts. Artifacts is a video card issue. If you wanna solve this install Pandora and see if you still get artifacts.
(You rig will play BF2 at max settings fine......mine does)


I wouldn't really consider my computer to be anything special. If it were, I probably wouldn't have this problem. If by my "I also have 2 gigs of dual channel memory" statement, you inferred that I was bragging about my rig, you're wrong. I was replying to this comment:

I have a x800xl sapphire 256 and i can run bf2 on full settings now. the card is clocked to 425 and 525 although it doesnt need to be.

now the game was shocking before i upgraded to 2 gig of memory dual channel - now i can run 1600x1200 @85 hz with all settings on full.

i also have a windows account specifically for this game with only essential programs running in the back ground as this game is a monster drain on your system.

so memory is the key here - unless you are experiencing this problem on other lower spec games too!

And as for the the 3rd gig of single channel memory comment. I was sort of fishing for some advice, as I have yet to research it.

I think that by adding a stick of single channel memory, it will downgrade all of my memory to single channel. In which case, I'm not sure if 3 gigs of single channel memory will be better or worse than 2 gigs of dual channel.

The only reason I have so much RAM to begin with, is my computer wouldn't work when I first built it. I had to throw a lot parts at it trouble shooting it and it turned out to be a bad mobo.

[Puer Aeternus]

YOU SAID: "I have a ATI Radeon Sapphire X800XL Ultimate (512MB) and it has lots of artifacts durring game play."

Sorry. I thought the issue was the "Artifacts" that you are experiencing not game performance. Artifacts is a specific issue w/ your video card. They usually occur whent he card has been overclocked. If you your card is not O/C'ed and you are getting artifacts, there is a problem. However, since BF2 is your only game, you cant really tell until you test other games that will stress your card

[largon]

Install AtiTool and use it's "scan for artifacts" feature to see if it errors. Also remember to post the GPU temperatures AtiTool displays at idle and during an artifact scan.

[jeepguy_1980]

I threw Splinter Cell in there. There didn't seem to be as much black artifacts, just one ore two here and there. However, there seemed to be a lot more distortion of shapes, i.e. walls disappearing or logs streching across the screen.

[jeepguy_1980]

I ran ATI tool scan for artifacts and I got yellow dots and squares as soon as I turned it on. The test kept going, kept saying no errors and the GPU temp rose to 59 deg C and the yellow blocks kept getting worse. I tried lowering the settings and there were still yellow dots everywhere.

Here are a couple of screen shots from my game and system temps. Those black shapes are artifacts, right? And you can see some of the scrambled text in the last image.

http://www.loopfamily.net/images/SS2.jpg
http://www.loopfamily.net/images/SS3.jpg
http://www.loopfamily.net/images/SS4.jpg
http://www.loopfamily.net/images/SS5.jpg

[Puer Aeternus]

I just wanna double check: Is your rig overclocked? I know you vid card is not. Is your computer stable in all other areas? Have you tried running Prime or done some sort of stress test that is not video card specific?

My gut reaction is that it is driver related, but perhaps you might wanna consider having to RMA your vid card :bang head .
Perhaps try an older ATI driver first and see how BF2 runs. That might just solve your problem. I know that the latest chipset drivers have caused problems for me before. I like to play it safe and wait till a driver has gotten a Unanimous thumbs up before I try it.
I hope this helps...good LUCK!!!

[jeepguy_1980]

Nothing is overclocked on my computer or video card. I did run the TRIXX stress test for my video card when I first setup my computer, but I never actually overclocked my card.

I think the problem is worse now that I ran that ATI tool and got my card up to 59 degrees.

[Puer Aeternus]

So I am curious. Did you fix your issue?

[ToXiC^]

Jeepguy how old is the vid card? Like Puer Aeternus said there have been issues with that card and more specifically with BF2 and ATi cards.

Do you have Catalyst 6.3?
Do you have Omega or DNA over the Catalyst?
Do you have the BF2 1.21 patch?

If the card is fairly new you may want to try to RMA it to where you bought it from. If it is too old to RMA try getting a Driver cleaner such as Driver Cleaner Pro. Remove all files associated with ATi, reboot, and do a fresh install of Cat 6.3. If this dosent provide improvement the card may have gotten too hot.

[jeepguy_1980]

I have Catalyst 6.3, it won't even work with the 5.x drivers. The card is new, but a refurb. I am RMAing back to Newegg. That was ATI's suggestion. The card didn't even perform well with the games that it came with, so I'm sure there is something wrong with the card itself.

I don't have or know what Omega and DNA are. Yes, I have the 1.21 patch.

[ToXiC^]

Rgr, glad you can send it back. Hopefully the new card wont have any problems for ya.

DNA and Omega are "performance" drivers. At times they used to add a boost to your vid card drivers but with ATi pumping out new versions of CCC lately I dont think they have been able to keep up.

[jeepguy_1980]

I ran that Driver cleaner and it didn't have any effect on my cards performance. I'm going to send it off Monday morning. I hope that this model of card doesn't just suck. Hopefully, it's just this particular card.

[Puer Aeternus]

Whats the verdict? Were you able to get your Card replaced?

[jeepguy_1980]

I shipped it off back to Newegg and they did receive it. It was within the warranty window, so it should be ok. I just hope they don't look at it and say it's good, just b/c it works in windows.

[Vipasnipa]

I noticed in one of those screens that your VPU temp probe was reporting 54C. Is that at idle? If so, I cringe to think what it might run at load. My X800XL runs somewhere around 45C idle, and will start to artifact if it gets near 60C (which it can reach while OC'd 40 clocks on the GPU and playing Oblivion).

*Edit* Assuming your mobo's ambient system probe is accurate, 35C is awfully high for an ambient temp. Your vid card is artifacting because it is overheating.

[jeepguy_1980]

That's immediatly after game play. But my computer does seem to run hot. I was ripping some DVDs and even though it ripped them in about 12 minutes. My CPU temp hit 64 C.

I just ordered some artic silver 5 and some of their cleaner to get my other thermalpaste off. I know that wont help my video card and I don't know what will.

The only way I can get the video card fan to run at 100% is to overclock it.

[Vipasnipa]

Get ATI Tool and you can change how fast the GPU fan spins according to temperature, or you can just set it to 100% yourself (or any percentage for that matter).

[jeepguy_1980]

Is there something else that can be causing my computer to be so hot too? Perhaps a case fan installed backwords? Or just a plain crappy case or case fans? I know I'm only on air right now, but you seem to indicate that my temps are way too high and I have seen them get hotter than I am comfortable with.

I don't want to cook my new video card when it comes in.

[Vipasnipa]

Took a look at some pictures of your case, and it looks like it has both a 120mm intake and exhuast. Assuming they aren't too badly obstructed, you should have decent enough airflow to prevent overheating. Stick in your new vid card when you get it and try playing BF2 again to see if you get more artifacting.

[jeepguy_1980]

Here are some pics of my setup, minus my video card (b/c Newegg has it now).

http://www.loopfamily.net/images/Hosting/DSCN0171.JPG
http://www.loopfamily.net/images/Hosting/DSCN0167.JPG

http://www.loopfamily.net/images/Hosting/DSCN0168.JPG

[Puer Aeternus]

arrrggghhhhh....clean up those cables! The cables are choking you intake and cpu air flow.
I have a similar set up in my case but there is nothing impeding the flow of air from the front intake to the rear exhaust. Your set up should be pulling air over your vid card. I had a 9700 pro w/ fanless Zalman Heatpipe on it. MY airflow ensured the card stayed cool even during over clocks. Cleaning up those cables will do wonders. :)

ps...consider moving that HD up higher or one notch lower so your intake fan can reach the GPU. If the GPU temp is the prob I would not worry about cooling that SATA drive. If the Sata Drive was docked just above the fan you might create a little wind tunnel that will force more Direct air towards your GPU and it willl force your cables to get out of the way. Just ideas.

[jeepguy_1980]

I could move the HD to the top bay. One thing you cant see (b/c it's not installed) is that my video card comes almost all the way out to about where the HD is sticking out and it goes in the top blue PCIE slot. That means that I will never be able to get a clear path between the two fans. I could possibly try putting the card in the lower black PCIE slot, but I think that is the secondary slot. But it would leave a nice clean path between the two fans.

[Puer Aeternus]

That still should be ok, my GPU is between the 2 fans but air is pulled over it. Whats important is that the exhaust fan directs the air from the intake. it more than likely will pull air over the top of the GPU....some air might circulate under the GPU, but you would have to stick your hand in the case w/ both fans running to get an idea where the air is flowing. I bet the replacement card will work fine. You could invest in a exhaust fan under the GPU....only if temps are still an issue. I dont think they will be.
I like your case BTW.

[Vipasnipa]

Yes, please, for the love of God, get some kind of cable management going on in there.

[jeepguy_1980]

Well my RMA has been approved and my new card has shipped out. Hopefully, this one will work better.


***Edit*** Actually, they're out of stock on my card and have refunded my acct. Would you recommend I go for the same card? Or something different?

[Puer Aeternus]

Well my RMA has been approved and my new card has shipped out. Hopefully, this one will work better.


***Edit*** Actually, they're out of stock on my card and have refunded my acct. Would you recommend I go for the same card? Or something different?
Different!!! My X800XL does not support HRD apparently :shrug: go w/ either The Nvidia 7800 or 7900 if you can afford the difference. or ATI's X1800/X1900. I already feel like like my X800XL is outdated after trying to play Oblivion (All other games play fantastic!)

[jeepguy_1980]

I went with a X1900XT. Hopefully this card works out a bit better. This card cost more than I wanted to spend. I kinda regret pushing the submit order button now.

[Puer Aeternus]

I went with a X1900XT. Hopefully this card works out a bit better. This card cost more than I wanted to spend. I kinda regret pushing the submit order button now.
Oh but you will be happy when you see how well it performs compared to the X800XL.
Good choice:clap:

PS..I too have had a few of those moments where I buy something for my comp and kinda regret it later. Enjoy your new toy...no regrets!

PPS...we wanna see pics of those cables after you install the card. Be nice to see the before and after.

[jeepguy_1980]

What do you guys do to organize the cable? I don't have a modular PSU. I can cram the unused ones above the CD drive, but I'm not sure what to do with the others.

[Puer Aeternus]

Cable ties. Look for ways to route the cables where they wont get in the way. Sometimes i route a set of cables, plug em in and then cable tie them off to the side (tie em to whatever you can). I also make use of the space between cd roms and hard drives to tuck unused cables into or cinch a few cables that are long w/ ties and tuck into dead space. In your case, make use of the far side of the case. those cables can run down the side of the MOBO and the extra length can be tucked in dead space. Be creative...it can bea fun project, it is no fun having a Window side panel and a messy comp to look at. Also you airflow will improve.

Others will have way better tips than I have. My cables are messy but they are out of the way of my intake/exhaust fans and none cross over my CPU's HSF.

[jeepguy_1980]

I have one lone cable that's in the way and I'm not even sure if I need it. It didn't come with my mobo or DVD drive so I robbed it from my really old P3.

It's the wire that runs from the sound card (or in my case the integrated mobo sound card) to the DVD drive. I think it's the digital audio cable. Do you still need this on new PCs?

I haven't built a computer in so long, I'm not sure if it's needed or not. I don't like it, b/c it's so short that it barely reaches the DVD drive and has to be stretched over the video card. It was a temp fix and I need to get a longer cable if it's required.

Also, my barebones kit came with a fat round IDE cable that runs to my DVD drive and the mobo came with the flat IDE cables. Which is better to use, asthetically and functionally?

[Puer Aeternus]

That cable from the rom to the sound card...I never use em. I never had a need to..your call.
The round cables have better air flow. You case has loads of them which makes it easier to redirect them as opposed to the Flat IDE cables which impede airflow and are hard to re-route (IMO). The rounded cables work as good as the flat cables. My rounded cables are name brand (IE: Antec, SOLTEC) as opposed to the generic flat cables that you usally find. I dunno if they transfer data any more efficiently but I do know they are easier to work w/.

Just My opinion. C'mon people...give some feed back for JeepGuy!!1

[jeepguy_1980]

Well, my new card is in, I cleaned off my old thermal paste and applied some Artic Silver 5 and I have performed some wire management. It's not as pretty as some peoples but the wires weren't long enough to run them all behind the mobo tray.

My system temps have dropped about 10 deg C across the board. Best of all, no artifacts.

http://www.loopfamily.net/images/Hosting/BF2_SS1_X1900XT.jpg
http://www.loopfamily.net/images/Hosting/Desktop_Post_Wire_4.JPG

http://www.loopfamily.net/images/Hosting/Desktop_Post_Wire_1.JPG
http://www.loopfamily.net/images/Hosting/Desktop_Post_Wire_2.JPG
http://www.loopfamily.net/images/Hosting/Desktop_Post_Wire_3.JPG

[SKiNNiEH]

I think it looks good for airflow, especially compared to the old photos!

Whats up with the memory though? Is this running dual channel too this way?

[Puer Aeternus]

Woa..big difference now! :clap:
new vid card, clean looking case good cable managment and cooler temps. Way ta go.

[jeepguy_1980]

I think it looks good for airflow, especially compared to the old photos!

Whats up with the memory though? Is this running dual channel too this way?

I'm not sure how to check if I'm actually running in dual channel or not. However, the mobo manual says that to run in dual channel A1+A2=B1+B2 which is why I used the first two slots (A1 and B1).

[Trypt]

Different!!! My X800XL does not support HRD apparently go w/ either The Nvidia 7800 or 7900 if you can afford the difference. or ATI's X1800/X1900. I already feel like like my X800XL is outdated after trying to play Oblivion (All other games play fantastic!)
How can that be? My x800GTO which is apparently nowhere near the XL version plays Oblivion perfectly fine at 1920x1200 with everything on high, the only thing I have off is the AA, which I never use cuz it just slows down everything but does nothing for quality (from what I see, its very minor).


Also, to the original poster, your cables are really not that much of a mess, you don't have enough of them to really impact your air-flow. That is definitely not the problem. However, as you already pointed out, you may have the fans pointing in the wrong direction which can be very bad. This seems to be the case with you since you are reporting 35C case temp, which is at least 10C over normal. Your case temp should be very close to ambient room temperature, within 2C would be ideal if you have good air-flow (which you should with your fans). Make sure the front fan is blowing INTO the case, and the rear fan OUT of the case.

[Puer Aeternus]

How can that be? My x800GTO which is apparently nowhere near the XL version plays Oblivion perfectly fine at 1920x1200 with everything on high, the only thing I have off is the AA, which I never use cuz it just slows down everything but does nothing for quality (from what I see, its very minor).


Also, to the original poster, your cables are really not that much of a mess, you don't have enough of them to really impact your air-flow. That is definitely not the problem. However, as you already pointed out, you may have the fans pointing in the wrong direction which can be very bad. This seems to be the case with you since you are reporting 35C case temp, which is at least 10C over normal. Your case temp should be very close to ambient room temperature, within 2C would be ideal if you have good air-flow (which you should with your fans). Make sure the front fan is blowing INTO the case, and the rear fan OUT of the case.

WTF?!?! Did you even read the entire thread..what pics were you looking at? And why on earth do you think he would have his fans blowing the wrong way?....he already established that his temps dropped after cleaning up the cables. Perhaps you oughta look once more at the before pics..I think you only saw the after pics...LOL

about the X800XL....I was only talking about HDR not being enabled in oblivion. I play the game on High settings w/ a few sliders tweaked and w/ AAX2. He asked what card to get. I reccomended a better video card that will use HDR and he got a better video card that is way more futute proof than the X800XL....which is a pretty decent card IMO...but Oblivion requires a better video card for all the eye candy.

[jeepguy_1980]

I just checked; my front fan is sucking in and the rear is blowing out. The side fan is sucking in. I checked everything using a plastic baggy. The side fan will hold the baggy to the case and the rear will push it out pretty far but the front will not hold the baggy to the case but does pull it in.

The front fan has to suck through a filter and plastic slots, where the other two fans have nothing to impede the flow.

I checked my temps again. Looks like I was a bit excited. The CPU temp is 10+ cooler. The mobo temp is about the same as before. I could have sworn the mobo temp was in the 40s before, but after looking at an old screen shot it was 32C. It is still 32C. I have no way of checking the Video Card temps.

Is 32 mobo temp still too hot?

[Trypt]

Oh.. I see.. He did a great job with the cables, thats for sure. However, I doubt it has anything to do with the artifacts, the new card is the one responsible for that, lol. But 10C sounds great, I still doubt it has to do with cable management. While the before pic is a bit messy, it is by no means responsible for 10C overtemp.

[Puer Aeternus]

The addition of the Artic Silver prolly helped drop the temps. Cleaning the HSF and re-applying thermal paste always yields great results for me. The cable managment would have made a diff too...you are right...maybe not 10c but a few degrees at least.
My case is 26c at present minus one fan. I am using only a front intake and exhaust on Low rpm and have the side panel fan turned off completely.

[jeepguy_1980]

Cranked the settings up to max in BF2 with max anti-aliasing and max resolution.

The graphics are way kick ass now. Not sure if it justifies my stupidity in spending this much on a graphics card, but it sure is cool. I don't think I'll temp fate with the overclocking for now.

If you're running 26C minus a fan, I wonder what must be wrong with my computer. I'm still 32C mobo and 38C cpu. The good thing is that even under a load the temp doesn't climb much, but I'd like the idle temp a bit lower.

Guess I've ventured way off topic here and should be posting under a different forum.

[Puer Aeternus]

My 26c was at idle. I dont even want to tell you how high my CPU temps are....thats a different story :mad: Your 35c is kinda normal IMO. I have had several comps and 30's was an average case temp. However you oughta give yourself a high 5 for having such great CPU temps on air!

If you wanna be fussy, you could play w/ the fan rpms and see what happens. My exhaust fan is a 90mm and my intake a 80mm. Both are on lowest RPM's. I think having the 90mm as exhaust helps as it is pulling more air thru the case as opposed to a large fan trying to push it across the case. So that being said..what if your exhaust fan was running a little faster than your intake...I dunno, just a theory.
What HSF you using for your CPU? My socket 7 uses a TtVolcano 7+...others hate it, but I always liked it. I find Thermal take a hit or miss kinda thing. Some of their products are really good and others not so good.


edit: that side panel fan I find kinda weird. I rather have it duct'ed direct to my cpu or vid card rather than blowing across my case. My side panel fan is off set so it is blowing at nothing really where yours aligned w/ your cpu...hence your great cpu temps I think. In the summer I usually turn it on out of desperation.
I will take some pics and you can see what i mean..and you can mock my cable managment. Yours puts mine to shame, but still, mine is not as bad your before pics :)

[jeepguy_1980]

What HSF you using for your CPU? My socket 7 uses a TtVolcano 7+...others hate it, but I always liked it. I find Thermal take a hit or miss kinda thing. Some of their products are really good and others not so good.


If HSF means my CPU fan, I'm running a Masscool fan. Apparently, it's a cheapy little fan.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835150057

This is the first computer I have built in years. Even though I am pretty good at using computers, I was so out of it when it came to buying the components I needed for my build. I didn't realize the value of good fans and good PSUs and so I bought the cheapest crap.


Also, thanks for all your help in resolving all of my issues.

[Puer Aeternus]

http://img378.imageshack.us/img378/533/neuterreceiptcopy20023da.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
The cables at the bottom of the case are running down the rear of the case, it is hard to tell from the pic.

http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/3724/neuterreceiptcopy20038bt.jpg (http://imageshack.us)[/IMG]
If you look close, you can see where the 90mm side panel aims at nothing in particular.

[jeepguy_1980]

Yours looks like it over laps part of the CPU. Maybe you could make some sort of an angled duct.

I'm sure that as I add more components to my case, I'll be stuck with more wires like you too.

I'd like to find a short SATA cable and some exension cables for my usb and firewire front pannel jacks. Maybe one with a harness b/c it was a pain plugging the firewire cable to the mobo since it's like 8 different little plugs.

[jeepguy_1980]

This guy has an offset fan on his case and he made an angled duct

http://mod.vault9.net/forums/Artag_s_Rig-t18099.html

http://www.mtheads.co.za/images/case/Fan%20duct.jpg

[Puer Aeternus]

Hey, that looks like a foam tube! Great idea. I used to use dryer duct but I bet that tube is as flexible and has no ridges on the inside unlike dryer duct.
In one of my older cases. I modded my comp so the front intake fan was much higher up, in the CD rom bays. I aligned it it was blowing air directly in line w/ the cpu and exhaust fan. This was way better than having the intake at the bottom, as air was moving across cpu as opposed to the GPU. Later I added a duct and well.... it was Overclocking time fer sure!
But now adays the GPU needs almost as much cooling as the CPU so my cooling priorities change.
I am gonna look for some foam tubes and give that a try....after I mod my side panel fan..noisy lil' bugger that it is.
Thanks for the pics and ideas :)