View Full Version : DX10 cards... Whats your input?
nvidiaOCmaster
07-13-06, 06:09 AM
I know that alot of you have just upgraded to nice cards, but aren't you a little downed about DX10 cards comming out next month?
What do you think they will cost?
Will upgrading from a brand new DX9(I.E 7800's and X1900GTX's) to a DX10 be worth it?
Personally, im still waiting for the graphics card that shoots lazers and radioactive waves on command.
I saw the crysis videos.... and im prepared to upgrade RIGHT NOW!!!
synthetic_fenix
07-13-06, 06:13 AM
Won't be able to take advantage of the DX10 aspect of the card till Vista is fully released.
nvidiaOCmaster
07-13-06, 06:56 AM
Fo real?
Fo real?
Indeed, keep it real.
Yes, it will take awhile before games start showing up that will actually use anything new in DX10, same thing we had with 8.1 nd 9, cards were out long due, but we had to wait for the games.
synthetic_fenix
07-13-06, 07:17 AM
I feel pretty confident that My 7900GT and within 3months Dual 7900GTs will be plently of graphics power for atleast a year and half before i start running into problems with games that no longer support DX9
I just upgraded to an x1900xt and will be staying with it till at least end of 2007 maybe sometime in 2008. I have a feeling that the vid card companies are gonna be a little screwed with the dx10 cards for a while. Vista isnt even out yet so Dx10 isnt out yet so why bother getting one?
I dont think we will see much dx10 support in games till well in 2007 maybe even early 2008. Even then most games will still have dx9 support as its so wide a standard and there are way more dx9 cards in use than dx10 will have for a long time.
What really bothers me is MS is discontinuing all dx9 support once vista comes out. They are literally trying to FORCE people (more than usual) to upgrade to a dx10 card.. Wonder how much money ATI and Nvidia had to chauk up to MS for that.
Its going to be rough on intel who does allot of the discreet video on board to come out with dx10. Vista wont force us to dx10, only developers can do that, And by that I mean they would really need to impress us. Anyone stupid enough to abandon a market filled with dx9 cards now deserves to go out of business.
synthetic_fenix
07-13-06, 07:19 PM
I just upgraded to an x1900xt and will be staying with it till at least end of 2007 maybe sometime in 2008. I have a feeling that the vid card companies are gonna be a little screwed with the dx10 cards for a while. Vista isnt even out yet so Dx10 isnt out yet so why bother getting one?
I dont think we will see much dx10 support in games till well in 2007 maybe even early 2008. Even then most games will still have dx9 support as its so wide a standard and there are way more dx9 cards in use than dx10 will have for a long time.
What really bothers me is MS is discontinuing all dx9 support once vista comes out. They are literally trying to FORCE people (more than usual) to upgrade to a dx10 card.. Wonder how much money ATI and Nvidia had to chauk up to MS for that.
and Vista supports DX9 cards, i believe there is some backwards compatibility to DX10.
nvidiaOCmaster
07-14-06, 02:18 AM
Ill probally get vista and a DX10 card when i build my computer this christmas. Just so i dont have to update for a while.
Remember how well the first dx9 cards did for those early adopters? I think I'll wait for a review or 3 before i buy one.
nvidiaOCmaster
07-14-06, 04:49 PM
I dont buy anything until i see a good review, but theres usually reviews out before the card its self.
Does anybody know what they are adding to DX10? Ive only played 2 DX9 games, and I liked them... but the flaws were eaisly found.
Id really like to see lots more dynamic lights and lots of volumetrics. Shadows should look better. HOPEFULLY they will wait for DX10 to make F.E.A.R 2. THAT should be creepy as hell.
soulfly1448
07-16-06, 01:42 AM
Which is why im gonna buy a 7950 this week
nvidiaOCmaster
07-16-06, 02:51 AM
Your so lucky.......... post pictures.... i want to see it in a rig...
hell, I got a 7300GT with 128M on its way.... I'll post pics when its here :(
hUMANbEATbOX
07-22-06, 06:43 PM
Remember how well the first dx9 cards did for those early adopters? I think I'll wait for a review or 3 before i buy one.
i'm pretty sure i was one of the first adopters of dx9. my 9700pro gave me no problems whatsoever, and still runs to this day in my little brothers computer. unless of course you mean the early adopters of NV's dx9 parts ;)
boris_37
07-22-06, 07:00 PM
i think im stuck with my x700 and AGP till im done school at least.
deathman20
07-22-06, 10:00 PM
DX10 is suppose to cut out a lot of code left over from past DX's. So it should be faster and leave more room open at least on the CPU side of things to compute more.
DX9 will still be in Vista but it is its own code, seperated from DX10.
As soon as Vista comes out I'll upgrade, then as soon as some DX10 games hit the market count me in for a card (it will be good timing to upgrade for me anyways).
Audioaficionado
07-22-06, 11:04 PM
I've run my DX9 6600GT in Vista Beta2 without a hitch so it will run but just not in DX10.
nvidiaOCmaster
07-26-06, 08:35 AM
You got vista beta..... Your lucky too.
chas0039
07-26-06, 08:40 AM
and Vista supports DX9 cards, i believe there is some backwards compatibility to DX10.
Not quite. Vista has both DX9 and DX10 but there is no backwards compatibility at all.
I have seen some graphics comparisons between the two and it is a stunning difference. I think it will be akin to when Shader 3 came out in Far Cry and gradually the hardware had to follow.
RedDragonXXX
07-26-06, 08:42 AM
Personally I won't be upgrading to nothing, till Vista get's released and gains some ground.
Otherwise what would be the point :shrug:
Nephewkp
07-26-06, 08:57 AM
I'm running vista ultimate beta 2 on a Pent M 1.5Ghz, 1GB ram, and a mobility9700 128MB. runs perfectly (including Aero effects). The only issues I am having are not with graphics, but with software compatability....and the lack of openGL.
I think it will be akin to when Shader 3 came out in Far Cry and gradually the hardware had to follow.
The difference is, SM3 added nothing visually and was just a way of making SM2B easier. Nothing in SM3 could not be done already with more lines of code. DX10 is supposed to add effects that dont exist in current dx9, so its not really comparable.
and Vista supports DX9 cards, i believe there is some backwards compatibility to DX10.
Microsoft is dropping all support for Dx9 once dX10 is out, as far as backwards compatible I do not know, but im sure Dx9 games would run well enough. There may be some slowness you didnt have before with Dx10 as it uses a software interpreter for dx8 apps. Or something along that lines so its slower in essence.
eric003
07-26-06, 09:33 AM
Personally I won't be upgrading to nothing, till Vista get's released and gains some ground.
Otherwise what would be the point :shrug:
AMEN
I dont really have any qualms about windows XP Pro to tell u the truth... I can do everything I need to...software, games, blah blah blah, and it runs fast and looks pretty damn good to me, especially on my dell 2007wfp...
(I) havent heard of any features in vista that will be THAT mind blowing... so you got some nice 3d windows on the desktop... whoop D freakin Doo. Is it really worth the $$$ (who knows how much... $200 for ultimate??) and maybe it will get cracked, etc..but at what costs? you know MS is going to be trying REALLY hard to make sure its Damn difficult for people to hack Vista.. I mean think about it..Xp has been out for how long?? like 5-6 years? I think one of the main reasons everybody got on the XP bandwagon so quick was because windows 98 and ME sucked A$$. but if you have no qualms with XP...why upgrade to vista? why fix whats not broken? at least until the game require or run better on vista...
idk guys, just my 2 cents :) always interesting to hear different view points I think.
The big thing with vista is that all apps are going to be 3D. I dont know exactly how that is going to work, but from the interview I read with the CEO of NV, Excel and Office will be 3D, along with the rest of MS's standard apps being shifted that way. If you plan on waiting till Vista gains ground you have a good 2 years or so till it has enough base to catch the market of potential users DX9 has. NO ONE in their right mind will issue a dx 10 only game, at least not a major title unless of course that title is made by MS themselves ie. HALO and the like. DX9 will be around for a long time, kind of like AGP. Manufaturers wish it would go away, but to ignore the sales base of AGP completely would be silly as far as the bean counters are concerned. Each manuf says they wont support it in hopes that the other will truely abandon it, then they release a part for it to scavange whats left. I think we had a poll on here and even if 30% of the market still has AGP, thats signifigant. If you have a High end AGP system, you may not want to sell it to have to get new everything regardless of vista. Anyhow AGP is off topic, what is however is the fact that even intel and others who make onboard video will need to be dx10 compliant now. DX 10 will have to wait guys, when dell has a budget enty machine with dx10 support we may begin to see some penetration into the market just as a measuring stick.
nd4spdbh2
07-26-06, 12:45 PM
i dont see why microsoft wouldnt release a DX10 for windows xp just like they did from DX8.1 to DX9...
HOLLY CRAP dx10 cards are gonna be out in august! when in august ... will the G80 be out then ?
i dont see why microsoft wouldnt release a DX10 for windows xp
Because then you wouldnt fly down to best buy and buy a copy of the latest and greatest now would you?
nd4spdbh2
07-26-06, 01:43 PM
but didnt they do a dx 9 update for windows xp when it had 8.1 and same with 2000? but i could be wrong.
Well they had to make a update because then no os had directx 9 when the directx 10 will be already in the os.
chas0039
07-26-06, 05:07 PM
No DX10 for Win XP.
deathman20
07-26-06, 05:10 PM
No DX10 for Win XP.
Exactly. Microsoft has said numerous times there will be no DX10 for Windows XP period. Theres to much of a code rewrite and probably affects how its intergrated within windows to even consider dropping DX10 in XP anyways.
White_Pawn
07-26-06, 05:24 PM
i think DX 10 will be really nice. especially with this SM 4 and unified shaders. This is supposed to use the same graphic content as cinimax and stuff and boy would i love to play an rpg or fps in graphics like that.
The only thing that needs improvement really, is the OS, namely vista.
Audioaficionado
07-26-06, 05:59 PM
Exactly. Microsoft has said numerous times there will be no DX10 for Windows XP period. Theres to much of a code rewrite and probably affects how its intergrated within windows to even consider dropping DX10 in XP anyways.DX10 also won't be on XP because Microsoft will use it as a carrot to entice faster migration over to Vista.
HOLLY CRAP dx10 cards are gonna be out in august! when in august ... will the G80 be out then ?
Is that so? I've only seen the Ati 1950 refresh card listed as coming out soon, and that's a DX9 card virtualyl identical to the 1900 series.
I haven't actually seen much news on the timeframe of DX10 capable videocards, now that I think about it.
Although waiting for those cards is enticing, I do recall reading that the next generation of cards is going to be even more power-hungry than the current one. That's a big drawback in my book. Even if the first DX10 cards will be able to run new games using that, they will probably only do it poorly because of some other performance limitation (as was often the case in the past with cards supporting 'future' technologies), and whilst wasting a lot of energy and producing heat.
So I'm leaning towards buying soon and upgrading in about a year.
It'll probably be a year or so before any selection of games is available for an OS that isnt even on the market yet. I would say at least a year is a safe bet to need anything dx10 related.
did you guys read the timeframes? apparently, the specs for DX10 were released early in comparison to the current VISTA timeline. VISTA's proposed launch is in Q1 2007. however, in anticipation of DX10.. game creators supposively started coding and everything and yeah things mite get hectic at vista's release.
if everything is going as they say..
vista gets released
dx10 is released
games are released
graphics cards are... *no comment* lol.
legionaire45
08-02-06, 11:46 PM
Im going to wait until Halo 2 Vista comes out-then I'll upgrade to DX10. Right now though my 6800 LE is keeping me happy. One thing I find interesting about DX10 is physics part that is supposed to be integrated into it, unless im mistaken. Geometry shaders (think thats what they will be called) will be cool too.
Dan0512
08-03-06, 05:55 AM
I'm getting an x1900xt, and I'll stay with it for one year at least. Literally, I don't give a crap about Vista or DX10, since it will be a lifetime until we start to see DX10 only games (lol DX11 would already be out then). I'm staying with XP for a looooong time, or until I have 2GB+ of RAM.
dan
deathman20
08-03-06, 08:11 AM
I'm getting an x1900xt, and I'll stay with it for one year at least. Literally, I don't give a crap about Vista or DX10, since it will be a lifetime until we start to see DX10 only games (lol DX11 would already be out then). I'm staying with XP for a looooong time, or until I have 2GB+ of RAM.
dan
It will take ~ 1-2 years before games start using DX10. But then again when should that of started? When it was suppose to come out early this year, or late this year or now early next year?
Most games under develepment will take advantage of DX10 hardware now that it will be released relatively soon. And since GFX card makers are making the DX10 cards as we speak (making or finishing up on the final product) in all due time there will be DX10 games (but they probably will have backward capibilities with DX9 and such).
BigDan3131
08-03-06, 07:11 PM
Literally, I don't give a crap about Vista or DX10, since it will be a lifetime until we start to see DX10 only games (lol DX11 would already be out then). I'm staying with XP for a looooong time, or until I have 2GB+ of RAM.
dan
I agree, XP for a long time. Vista bites and ATI DX 10 cards will be compatible with DX9 games so I'll but new when I buy the new system gear.
Brute Force
08-12-06, 05:09 PM
First of all, why purchase a G80 or R600 that even ATI and Nvidia both said will push the power usage envelope to a whole new level, when you are not going to be able to use a lot of those transistors for a long time.
Look at the transition from DX 8/8.1 to DX9. Except for a rare gem here and there, there were no real (that means effects that could be emulated in the previous DX set) for several years. Same story will be with DX10 (WGF 2.0).
Also Open GL 2.0 can do all that DX10 can and much more today, it just has to be a emulated layer on top of the Direct X driver set right now. However in Vista it will be native.
Also I have been hearing rumors of a "DX9-L" around, I haven't been able to find out much details about it other than it is supposedly going to be released around the same time as DX10.
deathman20
08-12-06, 05:36 PM
DX9-L is suppose to be what is used in Vista and update XP if not mistaken so its cross platform capatible. Like you said there hasn't been much about it released I think its more speculation more then anything.
G80 and R600 all the way :) And who says we can't use those transistors? Lots of us run large displays and all the more power we can get the better.
Yup, the newer cards will deffinitly give us the superior eye candy, but to sell games they will need to be playable on mid range cards for the mass 'es, so that means we should all be pretty safe for a while.... I hope :)
Also, they mention DX9-L on page 14 of this powerpoint presentation
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fdownload.microsoft.com%2Fdownload %2F9%2F8%2Ff%2F98f3fe47-dfc3-4e74-92a3-088782200fe7%2FTWPR05007_WinHEC05.ppt&ei=kl3eRNeTMaD-wQKD06iIDw&sig2=0DWEflDPgh4Asb2Q0s4YSw
knightwolf6543
08-12-06, 08:09 PM
now will DX10 cards be able to play DX9 games? i plan on geting a 8800 when they come out but i have heard it will be DX10
now will DX10 cards be able to play DX9 games?
They would be complete morons to not make them DX 9 compatible. They wouldnt even think of it untill there were 100's of games available. No one would buy a card that could play 3 or 4 games.... So I would bet a million to a doughnut that yes they will be.
Kibokun
08-12-06, 08:38 PM
I'm just going to wait as long as I possibly can to get DX10 cards at a lower price considering the time before a game truly needs them...
knightwolf6543
08-12-06, 08:43 PM
if its better then a 7900 GTX i am geting it :P 8800 gt that is :D
nvidiaOCmaster
08-13-06, 10:52 PM
will the G80 series be pricey?
Brute Force
08-14-06, 01:59 AM
will the G80 series be pricey?
I would guess that they would set new price records, simply because from what I have seen Nvidia is not making the move to 80nm and the new die size is nothing to be happy about, ATI is unto 80nm but their die size is still huge.
Maraxus
08-14-06, 02:11 AM
will we be able to bring , say, a 1900xt to dx10 capabilities using drivers or software?
deathman20
08-14-06, 07:30 AM
will we be able to bring , say, a 1900xt to dx10 capabilities using drivers or software?
Doubt it, its not a truely fully capatible DX10 card, its part of the way there but not all the way hardware wise. Cards come out there either DX9 or DX10, no if ands or buts about it. Maybe it will start changing and all we'd have to update is a bios but I doubt that as well since the graphic card makers want us to buy new products, not reuse old ones.
It will take ~ 1-2 years before games start using DX10. But then again when should that of started? When it was suppose to come out early this year, or late this year or now early next year?
Most games under develepment will take advantage of DX10 hardware now that it will be released relatively soon. And since GFX card makers are making the DX10 cards as we speak (making or finishing up on the final product) in all due time there will be DX10 games (but they probably will have backward capibilities with DX9 and such).
Well that is just dead wrong information right there. Crysis is going to be a DX10 game and it's scheduled for release around April 2007. That is less than a year by my count. It will supposedly have a DX9 version, but have fun playing a next gen game with previous gen graphics....might as well just play FarCry a second time.
Wolverine690
08-17-06, 01:07 AM
I just upgraded my system to what's in my sig, granted things didn't go as planned since I had to RMA 3 out of the 5 parts I ordered :( but I think I should be good with this setup for at least a year probably more.
I'm not concerned with DX10 or Vista as it will probably get delayed again, I've heard rumors of it getting delayed till mid spring now. then you also need DX10 games which currently there are none to my knowledge though there are I think 3 currently under developement which are slated for release shortly after the launch of DX10 cards, which is kinda stupid as you can't use the DX10 yet without Vista.
DX9 will work on Vista but from what I've read it will be at a reduced rate & heard if you run 2 identical systems 1 with vista & 1 with XP the gaming results would be slightly better on the XP machine in DX9. But was said that only hardcore gamers would notice the difference. So with that I would think things won't be to bad using DX9 in vista.
Anyhow if you upgrade now to any of the current Uber cards I think you are safe for as many others said, for about a year to a year & a half at least.
Vista will launch & probably have a crap load of bugs I'm sure just like most of their other OS's had right at launch. I think I waited a yr to go to XP b/c of such bugs & issues with things. So I'll probably wait about a year after launch to get vista & a DX10 card.
Another thing an XP Pro comparable Vista will probably run you about $250-$350 or more, while a XP Home version (watered down vista) will probably be around $100-$250 ish. MS OS's are always so over priced at launch & usually stay that way.lol
ChristmasGT
08-17-06, 01:12 AM
Yeah, I don't have any plans to upgrade my 7900 GT for awhile, I plan on running 2 7900's soon, that'll last me for at least a good 2 years.
I'll probably do an overhaul when Quade Cores come out, until then I paid for my 754 and i'm going to use my 754.
Derek8819
08-17-06, 01:14 AM
I keep looking to upgrade my nvidia 6800, but I have a dell without SLI, its a XPS 400. I dont wanna replace the MB so I am looking at the 7950, or should I wait for the 8 series cards?
deathman20
08-17-06, 07:26 AM
Well that is just dead wrong information right there. Crysis is going to be a DX10 game and it's scheduled for release around April 2007. That is less than a year by my count. It will supposedly have a DX9 version, but have fun playing a next gen game with previous gen graphics....might as well just play FarCry a second time.
What I ment to say not just DX10 but a good amount of them. I know theres Crysis and if not mistaken Halo 2 that will be using DX10 right out of the box if not mistaken. Does Unreal 3 engine use DX10?
With the D820 you would be processor limited with probably anything better than a 7900GT, the 7950 would be a waste unless you were going to upgrade the proc as well, I doubt dell left you with alot of OC'ing optins did they?
I plan to wait a year to upgrade but that is only becasue of monetary reasons and the fact that I'm getting a laptop instead of a new desktop. If I had the cash I would be upgrading as soon as I read a few positive reviews on the dx10 cards.
BenF - you could get a sager lappy that will keep up with any desktop around. At one point they had better video cards than the desktops, and even have sli in their lappys as well as raid 0 and 1. I know I had one a while ago, and it amazed people.
http://www.sagernotebook.com/index.html
deathman20
08-17-06, 12:43 PM
Might I ask how a laptop can have a better video card then a desktop? They use the same compenents its just getting hold of them is another question and the larger companies can get them quicker then we can.
It was a brief moment when Nvidia scaled the 6800 ulda down for mobile and it achieved higher clocks than the desktop because it was a die shrink, didnt last long, but it clocked better and ran faster in benches. It was all over www.talknotebooks.com at the time
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