Upgrading from TT Bigwater 745! [Archive]

Immortal_Hero

08-31-06, 06:42 AM

Just ordered the parts.

Swiftech Apogee Extreme performance CPU water block
http://jab-tech.com/Swiftech-Apogee-Extreme-performance-CPU-water-block-pr-3175.html
$44 Shipped (gotta love eBay)

Swiftech MCW60-B VGA cooler
http://jab-tech.com/Swiftech-MCW60-B-VGA-cooler-pr-3317.html
Have 2 of these already. Using some TT ram sinks...

Swiftech MCP655™ 12 VDC Pump
http://jab-tech.com/Swiftech-MCP655-12-VDC-Pump-pr-2982.html

Black Ice Pro III Triple 120mm Radiator - Black
http://jab-tech.com/Black-Ice-Pro-III-Triple-120mm-Radiator-Black-pr-2985.html
Strapping 3 120MM TT fans on this bad boy.

Masterkleer Tubing 7/16" ID 5/8" OD
http://jab-tech.com/Masterkleer-Tubing-7-16-ID-5-8-OD-pr-3079.html

Coolsleeves - Horizon Blue 40" - For 5/8" OD tubing
http://jab-tech.com/Coolsleeves-Horizon-Blue-40-For-5-8-OD-tubing-pr-2423.html
Got a couple of these just incase... SLI so I figure they will come in handy.

Plastic Tubing Clamps
http://jab-tech.com/Plastic-Tubing-Clamps-pr-3490.html
Picked up 8 or 10 of these...

Immortal_Hero

08-31-06, 06:44 AM

I was running the 745 kit with just the 2x120 rad running the CPU block that game with em and the 2 Swifty VGA blocks. Just so ya know...

Immortal_Hero

08-31-06, 07:13 AM

If I were going to use a T line where would I posistion it.

I am going run.

RAD -> PUMP -> CUP -> GPU -> GPU -> Back to RAD

SolidxSnake

08-31-06, 09:50 AM

you'd put the tee:

rad->tee->pump->cpu->gpu->gpu->rad

Immortal_Hero

08-31-06, 10:03 AM

you'd put the tee:

rad->tee->pump->cpu->gpu->gpu->rad

Just like a Res, what I thought but I didn't want to create a fountain.

SolidxSnake

08-31-06, 10:33 AM

Haha, you might wanna cover your tee when filling though. My Teeline decides to shoot up whenever i fill. I think the bubbles coming from the loop shoot it up.

aaronjb

08-31-06, 10:42 AM

I would reccommend NOT using the plastic clamps. Get some non-perforated worm drive clamps instead. Head to McMaster-Carr (www.mcmaster.com) and look at page 229 of the catalog.

SolidxSnake

08-31-06, 10:45 AM

I would reccommend NOT using the plastic clamps. Get some non-perforated worm drive clamps instead. Head to McMaster-Carr (www.mcmaster.com) and look at page 229 of the catalog.

Amen.

I have only 2 of those clamps in my loop (the majority are home depot crap-clamps). They are very nice clamps, you can tighten them as much as you want (more like as tight as possible), and you'll never get a cut in the tubing.

Immortal_Hero

08-31-06, 11:15 AM

I'v had good luch with the plastic ones. I like the way they go on and the look. Besides 7/16 inch tubing isn't gonna come off of 1/2 inch barbs...

Daddyjaxx

08-31-06, 11:31 AM

I use the DangerDen perfect seal barbs with the plastic clamps and have had zero issues. CPU Killer from DD doesn't use any clamps with those fittings.

SolidxSnake

08-31-06, 11:34 AM

I'v had good luch with the plastic ones. I like the way they go on and the look. Besides 7/16 inch tubing isn't gonna come off of 1/2 inch barbs...

True, but you can never be too safe.

BTW, I can take my 7/16" masterkleer off any barb in my loop (even my 5/8" copper pipe on the bonneville heatercore). It's not like it's gonna come off under normal circumstances... this stuff takes WORK to get off :D

Immortal_Hero

08-31-06, 11:39 AM

I have trouble getting my 3/8 off of compression fittings... so barbs are going to be way harder....

Immortal_Hero

08-31-06, 03:33 PM

Well changed my mind... going to custom make a rad out of a 77 boni heater core....

SolidxSnake

08-31-06, 08:14 PM

Well changed my mind... going to custom make a rad out of a 77 boni heater core....

If you're using a bonneville heatercore, make SURE TO HAVE BOILING WATER when you're putting the masterkleer over the copper pipe. Unless you have 1/2" barbs on there, you're not getting the tubing on there dry.

Maviryk

08-31-06, 08:17 PM

SolidxSnake

08-31-06, 08:20 PM

That and using a knife to "flange cut" the tubing will help him wiggle it over the pipe.

I love those HC's. 20 bucks each from Autozone. A can of paint and you're all set. I just cut off the end the piping is still perfect for 1/2" ID tubing.

Flange cutting? Cutting little slits in the end?

I tried doing that, didn't work... plus I was too scared i cut too deep and the connection would leak

Boiling water helped it go on FAST though. Took only a minute to get both tubes on where around 30 seconds of that was letting each tube soak individually.

Maviryk

08-31-06, 08:26 PM

No no, not slits, that would probably split the tubing. You take an exacto blade and trim the inside of the tubing to make a 45 degree angle...

-------------/
____________/

------------\
_____________\

Something like that.

QuietIce

08-31-06, 09:18 PM

Very hot water works fine and makes a nice seal when it cools.
Well changed my mind... going to custom make a rad out of a 77 boni heater core.... Be SURE to clean it out with vinegar and give it a thorough rinse afterwords. I let mine soak in vinegar overnight. You wouldn't believe some of the stuff that comes out of those things ... :eek:

SolidxSnake

08-31-06, 09:34 PM

Immortal_Hero

09-01-06, 07:07 AM

Moded it last night to take some 1/2 inch barbs... so none of that will be an issue... :) Will post pics later. Have them taken but my cam is dead and the charger is in another location... BTW total cost is like 30USD and this thing has some serious flow. I hooked it up to my sink to do some pressure testing and it will shoot a fountain to my sealing if I turn up the pressure...

Immortal_Hero

09-01-06, 07:12 AM

Be SURE to clean it out with vinegar and give it a thorough rinse afterwords. I let mine soak in vinegar overnight. You wouldn't believe some of the stuff that comes out of those things ... :eek:

You get yours new? Or was it salvaged from a junk yard?

Immortal_Hero

09-01-06, 10:38 AM

Just hooked my heater core up to my shower... yes my shower... I just wanted to do a little pressure testing. I capped one side and hooked the shower to the other side... All my connections will handle the ~60PSI coming from my shower. I think I'm good there :beer:. I also gave it a good flush for about 20 minutes... I can't wait for the rest of my parts. These heater cores have some major throughput capabilities.

SolidxSnake

09-01-06, 12:21 PM

New or used radiators need flushing.

Either way, I love my b'ville core. painted it black a week or two ago, looks fine and performs as well :D

Immortal_Hero

09-01-06, 12:39 PM

Wow just got F.E.A.R. and it puts a serious strain on my current radiator. This is the first time I have ever felt the air comming out of the rad feel warm... Guess I do need to upgrade... having more than 400l/h will be nice too...

QuietIce

09-01-06, 03:48 PM

You get yours new? Or was it salvaged from a junk yard? It was new - why salvage for a $20 part? But like Snake said - either way it needs vinegar and a good flush ...

Immortal_Hero

09-01-06, 06:07 PM

This one shows the parts before any moding. Thats a 1977 Boni heater core from Advanced Auto Parts (23 bucks). I also have 2 copper 1/2 copper female to 1/2 pipe thread female adaptors and 2 1/2 pipe thread to 1/2 barbs.
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/DSC00895.jpg
Here is what is about to happen to those bent pipes...
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/DSC00895wT.jpg
Dry fitted flow testing. Just to get an idea of what kind of flow to expect (3/8 inch tubing)
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/DSC00896.jpg
Copper adaptors held in place with metal epoxy.
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/DSC00897.jpg
Completed ready to test:
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/DSC00898.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/DSC00898wT.jpg

So far so good... no leaks at all. That metal epoxy sets up HARD!

Immortal_Hero

09-01-06, 06:11 PM

Immortal_Hero

09-01-06, 06:35 PM

What kind of fans should I put on this? I have 2 120mm Antec's that move like 40 CFM think that would be enough?

Maviryk

09-01-06, 07:40 PM

Your best bet would be to pick up any pair of 120x38mm fans.

Immortal_Hero

09-02-06, 06:21 AM

Your best bet would be to pick up any pair of 120x38mm fans.For a rad? Seems like a little overkill... I doubt it is going to need that much flow to get it's best temps. I mean my TT rad cools my water down to just a few (2 to 5) degrees above ambient... It just doen't offer good flow for my new system. I have condisered going passive...

SolidxSnake

09-02-06, 06:19 PM

For a rad? Seems like a little overkill... I doubt it is going to need that much flow to get it's best temps. I mean my TT rad cools my water down to just a few (2 to 5) degrees above ambient... It just doen't offer good flow for my new system. I have condisered going passive...

No, you'll definately need fans.

I tried posting like 5 times last night, and i kept on hitting the wrong thing and lost my post :bang head

But i'd reccommend the 120x38mm panaflo FBA12G12M. 86.5CFM @ 12v, it's almost silent at 7v. Can be had at svc.com for $7.

QuietIce

09-03-06, 12:33 AM

I was going to solder on the adaptors but I didn't want to break the seal on the solder joint into the heater core so I opted for epoxy. Now all it needs is some paint. Get that when I do the rest of the case... I am curious why you would put 1/2" barbs on a 1/2" copper pipe - why add the extra restriction ...???

Immortal_Hero

09-03-06, 05:05 PM

I am curious why you would put 1/2" barbs on a 1/2" copper pipe - why add the extra restriction ...???
Every thing else is running on 1/2 inch barbs... not really adding any restriction... Plus ease of installation...

QuietIce

09-03-06, 08:40 PM

Every thing else is running on 1/2 inch barbs... not really adding any restriction... Non-sequitur

QuietIce

09-03-06, 08:49 PM

Plus ease of installation... I can see where adding the barbs is easier than just slipping the tubing on there ...

Immortal_Hero

09-06-06, 09:46 AM

Got my APOGEE yesterday! The rest will be here today but I won't be able to get it until tomorrow. :( Looking forward to setting this all up this weekend and see how much better it performes than the TT kit. Pics will be comming! Also ripped out the TT kit.

Immortal_Hero

09-07-06, 07:33 PM

Double post for some reason... using a laptop and I guess my kitty may have be playin on my keyboard...

http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/08-31-2006-002.jpg

Immortal_Hero

09-07-06, 07:34 PM

Well the new stuff is all hooked up. Leak teating/ bleeding right now... that swfity pump has some serious flow!

Phrenetical

09-07-06, 09:24 PM

pics pics pics ;)

and yeah its a kick ass little pump.

QuietIce

09-07-06, 10:58 PM

The MCP655 is great! Here are some flow rates I measured while I was flushing my parts:

MCP: 3.9 gpm (= 240 gph) (100%)
MCP/2x heater core Rad: 3.4 gpm (87%)
MCP/Storm/Rad: 1.6 gpm (40%)
MCP/Rad/MCP/Storm: 2.1 gpm (52%)

Even adding in an MCW60 GPU block and 15' of tubing I get the same CPU temps at load running one pump on P4. Typically, I run the pair at P3 ...

Immortal_Hero

09-08-06, 01:54 PM

Pics are comming guys! Tomorrow morning! Hopefully I can get the mobo stuck in in the 30 minutes I have after work!

Funny story, you know that heater core I moded above? Well if F&*ked it up. :bang head Punched a big hole in it with a screw driver accidently! So I had to head down to the store and get another, just stuck the tubes over the 1/2 copper this time! But they are cheap right, $23USD!

Immortal_Hero

09-08-06, 01:57 PM

MCP: 3.9 gpm (= 240 gph) (100%)
MCP/2x heater core Rad: 3.4 gpm (87%)
MCP/Storm/Rad: 1.6 gpm (40%)
MCP/Rad/MCP/Storm: 2.1 gpm (52%)

Storms have pretty high restriction do they not? I should see better flow with my Apogee correct? I have about 7 to 8 ft of tubing total running between all the parts.

Immortal_Hero

09-08-06, 02:07 PM

BTW the Masterkleer tubing is awsomel! Way better than the clear stuff at Lowes. I was susprised as to how flexable it is!

QuietIce

09-08-06, 03:20 PM

Storms have a high restriction - the Apogee should fair much better.

Yeah, I liked the MasterKleer too! I got some for my second WC since I decided to try their clamps (which I didn't like) ...

Immortal_Hero

09-10-06, 04:52 PM

Pics:

There are a lot here... got a little snap happy!

I tried to post them in order but they are not totally sequential...

http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/01.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/02.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/03.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/04.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/05.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/06.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/07.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/08.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/09.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/10.jpg

Immortal_Hero

09-10-06, 04:53 PM

http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/11.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/12.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/13.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/14.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/15.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/16.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/17.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/18.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/19.jpg
http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/20.jpg

Immortal_Hero

09-10-06, 04:54 PM

http://webpages.charter.net/zmaddox5306/Images/21.jpg

Completed for now!

Dragoon42

09-10-06, 05:03 PM

from your pics it looks like you went:

T Line --> pump -> cpu?

you're getting the heat dump straight from the pump...

SolidxSnake

09-10-06, 05:28 PM

from your pics it looks like you went:

T Line --> pump -> cpu?

you're getting the heat dump straight from the pump...

I'm surprised SO MANY PEOPLE STATE THIS.

Temp difference in the water DOES NOT CHANGE BETWEEN COMPONENTS ENOUGH TO MAKE AN IMPACT ON TEMPS. Running a continuous loop negates that effect. More important is tube routing. You want the least amount of tubing in your loop.

OP: Looks nice. I'd probably run it pump>rad>cpu>gpu>gpu>tee>pump to clean up the tubing a little, it'd probably cut down on some tubing length as well.

Also, we're using the same tee-line setup (brass barb and cap for fillport)... YUS :D

Dragoon42

09-10-06, 06:01 PM

I'm surprised SO MANY PEOPLE STATE THIS.

Temp difference in the water DOES NOT CHANGE BETWEEN COMPONENTS ENOUGH TO MAKE AN IMPACT ON TEMPS. Running a continuous loop negates that effect. More important is tube routing. You want the least amount of tubing in your loop.

OP: Looks nice. I'd probably run it pump>rad>cpu>gpu>gpu>tee>pump to clean up the tubing a little, it'd probably cut down on some tubing length as well.

Also, we're using the same tee-line setup (brass barb and cap for fillport)... YUS :D

In either case, it wouldn't make sense to put dump more heat in the water right before it runs to the cpu?

I'd run my loop in the above also

SolidxSnake

09-10-06, 06:18 PM

In either case, it wouldn't make sense to put dump more heat in the water right before it runs to the cpu?

I'd run my loop in the above also

It doesn't matter, either way. Heat in the loop is constantly accumulated, as well as constantly dissipated.

I'm not exactly sure on how to explain it, but some of the gurus here should be able to (Thorilian... though I haven't seen him around in a long time)

QuietIce

09-10-06, 06:44 PM

Right!

On my 2nd WC the rad is external and the lines exit/enter near the PCI slots. The order on that loop is
T-line>pump>CPU>chipset>GPU>rad because that uses the least amount of tubing. If I had put holes in the top of the case instead of by the PCI slots I would have put the rad between the pump and the CPU.

The chipset block is only to eliminate internal fans ...

Immortal_Hero

09-10-06, 08:06 PM

There is actaully a reason for the extra tubing. If I want I can remove the entire loop in one piece without draining... which is nice and it aids in installing the GPU blocks... SLI is kind of a pain...

Phrenetical

09-10-06, 08:30 PM

the only thing i'd say is your supposed to space out the blue stuff around the tubing further, not as bunched up like that.

it still prevents kinking regardless of if its spaced out a bit more, and looks 1000 times better not bunched up.

check link in my sig to see what i mean about that stuff.

other then that looks nice,

temps temps temps??

Alien1099

09-11-06, 09:57 PM

from your pics it looks like you went:

T Line --> pump -> cpu?

you're getting the heat dump straight from the pump...

For a storm CPU block Pump > Cpu is probably the best order since it thrives on pressure and pressure is greatest right after the pump.