Puzzled! Help me out! Memory Issue.

[Amoroso]

RESOLVED! POST #29

Rig in signature.

Okay... let me first say Ive had this issue for the past year... and its been puzzling me. I posted about it, and posters threw me into the direction that the issue is VGA related. I knew it had nothing to do with the VGA card. Thus I finally came to this conclusion.

Problem: Opening a 800KB PDF simple AutoCAD line drawing in Photoshop CS2 @ 16bit and 300DPI. This causes a total system crash. No blue screen... the system just reboots itself without any warnining right after I press the 'open' button. I tried down sizeing to 8bit and lower DPI... and still the same thing.

I have 2 x 1GB 3200 Dual Kingston Value Ram DDR 400 mhz (http://shop4.outpost.com/product/4416996?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG) (my entire system is stock, no overclocking be down anywhere)

Here is what puzzles me. I swapped the sticks thinking maybe that is it. Nope, same problem.

I yank one stick out and run only 1GB...

What do I know... the file opens!!! Its a miracle!

Now what puzzles me more... I swap the working stick with the other... and what do you know... it works too!!! The file opens up fine with one 1gb stick... but it doesnt with two of them!!! How can this be possible? Im straching my head. I ran memtest86+ and it passed over 20 without errors...

however evertime it crashes... windows gives me this error

Symbolic Name: ER_KRNLCRASH_LOG

which Ive looked up to be caused by memory...

So I dont know what to do... opening large files in PDF format is a big part of my day...

I think I might go shopping for some ram tommorow. Anyone might want to foward be to some 'good' stuff... (www.frys.com) I think this value ram stuff is total crap. Unless it isnt the ram... but clearly Im at a lost here.

[jivetrky]

only thing I could guess would maybe be the memory controller? maybe it's not likeing dual channel?

Is your CPU overclocked? If so, go back to stock and see if you can open it with both sticks of RAM

[Amoroso]

Nope Im not overclocked... How can i check if its the memory controller?

[Amoroso]

Ran Windows Memory Diagnostic for acouple loops...

No errors...

I'm Stumped.

[Amoroso]

More interesting stuff...

Today went to Fry's...

Bought some Corsair Value Ram... Thought maybe the brand was a issue.

So... came home... tested it out. Same issue.

Went back to Fry's, go my money back, and decided to get Corsair 2GB 3200 TwinX XMS DDR 400... which is alittle upgrade to the value ram.

Came home and installed the hardware... okay. booted it up. Ran the program... Its working! Oh WAIT! Crashed half way through importing the PDF... oh boy... at least im getting somewhere right??? im so frustrated... So the comp rebooted and I imported the pdf... it completed the import!!! Then shortly after the import... it frooze the system... and I had to reboot it manually. Here we go a 3rd time... and it works so far and im writing this post...

Now I feel like Im playing russian roulette here... I dont know if the system is going to crash or not...

Obviously it is a memory issue. I dont know if my mobo is picky with ram. Its a DFI Ultra-d NF4... Ive been told that they arent picky... but again I dont know. I still dont feel secure about this... and I dont know what to do...

Im not sure if maybe I need to go a different way on memory... Maybe PC4000, DDR 500? I dont know where to go next.

[jivetrky]

Nope Im not overclocked... How can i check if its the memory controller?


IDK :shrug: maybe get a hold of a similar CPU and swap it out to test?

[Amoroso]

Now its working without crashing...

I dont get it... Do you think a slight overclock would do it good? Nothing major... just a little.

What would swaping the CPU do for me? Im confused...

[shadowdr]

I would suspect that it might be a program error or perhaps an error on the disk. Have you checked the Event Viewer for any warnings associated with the crashes? Have you run chkdsk from the command prompt? Do you have multiple page files on the seperate disks? Have you tried uninstalling and reinstalling the program(s) that are used during crash? I have had isseus in the past with another photo program that would crash when ram was added and pagefiles were not to it's liking.
I would actually not suspect the ram in cases where freezes and crashes were specific to a particular task.

[Amoroso]

I would suspect that it might be a program error or perhaps an error on the disk. Have you checked the Event Viewer for any warnings associated with the crashes? Have you run chkdsk from the command prompt? Do you have multiple page files on the seperate disks? Have you tried uninstalling and reinstalling the program(s) that are used during crash? I have had isseus in the past with another photo program that would crash when ram was added and pagefiles were not to it's liking.
I would actually not suspect the ram in cases where freezes and crashes were specific to a particular task.

Ive checked for warnings associated with crashes... and none were found. I highly doubt its an error on the disk... I did a fresh format, and install of windows... cause I thought that might be the problem previouslly... and same thing occurs... so it somewhere in the hardware. I havent ran checkdisk but again I highly doubt its a issue with the drive... and no Im not runing multiply page files on seperate disks. Yes uninstalled and reinstalled so many times I lost track... I even reinstalled windows with a fresh formated drive. I can only think it is the memory... something along the memory cause now since I put new sticks in... it seems to be running fine... however... Im still alittle unsteady about its stability when performing the same tasks...

[jivetrky]

I guess that kinda brings up a good question. Is this only happening with this one file you are trying to open? it's possible that the issue is somehow software related and not hardware. Kinda hard to say I guess. I think the fact that you can do 20 passes of memtest without any errors, it seems like maybe the RAM is working OK.

[Amoroso]

I am 100% positive its not software.

I have the same installation of Photoshop on my laptop and it imports the PDF without a problem. It is hardware related.

[brakezone]

Try running prime 95 in blend mode for up to an hour. If it doesn't crash then, although it doesn't tell you your memory is perfectly stable, at least it indicates that the memory and CPU are relatively stable and unlikely to crash photoshop. At this point you can possibly look elsewhere for the cause.

If prime 95 fails then you should switch to the CPU stress mode and see if that fails. If its not the CPU it sounds like a motherboard problem

[Amoroso]

Ran Prime 95 torture test (Blend) for 10 hours... 0 errors, 0 warnings

[brakezone]

hmmm, sounds like it is not the CPU or memory. It could be that some part of the windows installation is corrupt.

[Amoroso]

I reinstalled windows already...

[jivetrky]

Well, I guess the only way to get through this is to swap each component until the problem goes away.

Can you get ahold of another dual channel set of RAM to test that?

[MVC]

Which memory slots are you using? And, have you tried switching to the ones you aren't currently using?

[HeavyD]

I don't know if this could be the problem, but it's worth a try.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/924867/

The list of affected programs is not complete, this is a known issue with the game F.E.A.R, yet it is not listed. The problem shows up after installing a critical update, thanks a lot MicroSoft :mad:... At least they eventually fixed the fix :(

Good luck!!

[Amoroso]

Well, I guess the only way to get through this is to swap each component until the problem goes away.

Can you get ahold of another dual channel set of RAM to test that?

Ive already tried two! Im not really sure if testing more RAM is the issue. Ran Prime95 (Torture Test), Memtest 86+, Microsoft Mem Diagnostic, and all test comp up clean with no errors, no warnings, and no crashes on both sets. I have a feeling it is not the ram...

MVC: Which memory slots are you using? And, have you tried switching to the ones you aren't currently using?

Im using slots 2 and 4... the orange ones. Ram never worked in the yellow slots, but I will try it out.

[Amoroso]

I don't know if this could be the problem, but it's worth a try.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/924867/

The list of affected programs is not complete, this is a known issue with the game F.E.A.R, yet it is not listed. The problem shows up after installing a critical update, thanks a lot MicroSoft :mad:... At least they eventually fixed the fix :(

Good luck!!

I download that... ran the task...

and now I get a infamous Blue Screen of Death!

http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a139/amoroso85/Altro/2224235235.jpg

[shadowdr]

So is this the issue?

[Amoroso]

Now it doesnt even blue screen anymore...

Ive unplugged and plugged every single connection on the board... there is nothing loose... sigh.

[Amoroso]

My Dialouge with DFI:

DFI Support:


939 AMD cpu architecture has the 'memory controller' inside the cpu and is not even on the board.
1. You are not the first I have seen in the last few weeks with that memory and a problem...
2. Maybe they have changed the memory IC's that make up the sticks.
3. Here is the URL for Corsair Memory's House of Help forums. http://www.houseofhelp.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=128 I am hoping that link is still a good one and they have not changed the address.
4. They have a Corsair to DFI section over there with some of their suggested timings.
5. I notice you have a dual core cpu...have you done this as I had to do on all my dual cores? http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=81429 X2 hotfixes...
Thank you.
Please use *Reply All* option when communicating with tech support. And always include previous correspondence in RE: Thank you.

Me:
Thank you for such a fast response. I am really doubting its the memory. I've already tried two different rams as mentioned in my description and the XMS at least is attempting the task where the Kingston once I press the open button crashes the entire system with no progression of the file whatsoever. Just now I used both sets of ram in another system with the same installation of Photoshop and ran the task with no problems. Also that is the same link I used to do the hotfixes when I did the fresh install of windows, so yea I have all that installed. I was getting help yesterday from www.dfi-street.com and they were helping me out on finding the problem and they told me there is a memory controller on the board... and if I ran Prime95 Torture Test for the CPU and Ram for 3 hours... and it didn't crash, and it didn't have any warnings or errors, than the CPU and Ram are fine. Sadly www.dfi-street.com is down and all their forums are shut down or not accessible. So I ran the test for 10 hours... No crashes, no errors, nor warnings. Since dfi-street is down, I really dont know anyone else to turn to except for DFI tech support directly. I cant stress how much time Im been putting on this...

I DID PRESS "REPLY ALL"

DFI Support:

Well you did not >> use *Reply All* option when communicating with tech support. And always include previous correspondence in RE: << so it is a little difficult to see what exactly I wrote earlier and the board model and all but if the board has a 754, 939 or newer AM2 processor in it then it has the memory controller in the cpu and they told you wrong.
and they told me there is a memory controller on the board..I think this description at directron of a 939 AMD processor likely speaks to the location of the memory controller best and is relative to all the 939 processors. http://www.directron.com/ada3200bibox.html Key are the two times they make this description of the memory controller in the description of the cpu. << A fully integrated DDR memory controller helps speed access to memory by offering the processor a direct connection to the main memory. >> and again in bold later in the cpu description >> A high-bandwidth, low-latency integrated DDR memory controller: >> So it becomes pretty apparent the memory controller on later AMD 754, 939 and AM2 processors is inside the cpu and not on the board as was the case before these later trend setting cpus appeared.

However be that all as it may, if you live in the Usa or Canada, you can email rma@dfiweb.com and they can walk you thru the process to rma the board for check-out and repair as may or may not be necessary and thus remove the motherboard from being your issue as it were. Trying to remember back to what was in our original email that I cannot see, I don't think you are facing a problem with the board, but I might be wrong and if you rma the board that should remove the board as the issue. Another board has less than 99% chance of having a problem, 'if' the board were the problem in the first place. Thank you.
Please use *Reply All* option when communicating with tech support. And always include previous correspondence in RE: Thank you.

...............................................

So what u guys get out of this?

[Amoroso]

Well... Im gonna decide to go buy a ABIT KN8 SLI Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 SLI ATX AMD Motherboard from Fry's today. If it works... then I know there is an issue with the board itself. I honestly have a feeling its the board not liking "something"

Not really sure if something is faulty on the board or not... thus is it really worth the RMA? I mean the board works fine in all applications. I run CounterStrike: Source at full Settings and 1600x1200 resolution with no problems... buttery smooth all day long with no crashes at all... Never had any other crash in this system... Everything is fine... However TOO DO A SIMPLE TASK AS IMPORTING A 800KB PDF FILE... IT CAN NOT DO... How are they gonna test for that. There is a conflict with the hardware and mobo somewhere and I cant find it. I seriously dont know. Its not a software issue cause I have the same application running on my 3 year old laptop and it does the task fine...

:mad:

[jid1877]

Well... Im gonna decide to go buy a ABIT KN8 SLI Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 SLI ATX AMD Motherboard from Fry's today. If it works... then I know there is an issue with the board itself. I honestly have a feeling its the board not liking "something"

Not really sure if something is faulty on the board or not... thus is it really worth the RMA? I mean the board works fine in all applications. I run CounterStrike: Source at full Settings and 1600x1200 resolution with no problems... buttery smooth all day long with no crashes at all... Never had any other crash in this system... Everything is fine... However TOO DO A SIMPLE TASK AS IMPORTING A 800KB PDF FILE... IT CAN NOT DO... How are they gonna test for that. There is a conflict with the hardware and mobo somewhere and I cant find it. I seriously dont know. Its not a software issue cause I have the same application running on my 3 year old laptop and it does the task fine...

:mad:First off, DFI boards are very picky!!! They are high end motherboards and require high end memory and power suppies. They don't like value ram!(I think that the OCZ value ram is the only one that would work well, (but am going by memory,and at 43!....well, you know the rest). And they really don't like any type of Kingston ram. They say to stay away from Kingston all together. Ram that I can remember that is on the approved ram list is: OCZ, Corsair, and GEIL quality ram. Another thing that I think I remember is that the DFI board doesn't alway detect the right memory timing for the memory. You will have to go into the bios and set it. That was a small issue I had. After setting the memory timing, my board ran great.

Most issuse I have seen other people have with the DFI boards ends up being Memory and Power Supplies. Very few problems ended up being a bad motherboard. Alot of the people that I seen over a DFI-Street that RMAed there boards, had the same problem with the new ones.

[AlabamaCajun]

:welcome: jid.

You are right about the DFI boards being picky. They don't like value ram in default settings but you can run it if you tweek. In some cases you can get VR to run almost as good as mid-high ram.

It does sound like a ram or PSU issue. What I would do in a case like this is to just go ahead with a .1-.2 volt bump on the ram. Check voltages on the VCore and 12V line from a molex while running folding or P95 torture. If PSU is ok then check the mobo connectors (you have to have ALL the connectors in place. There is usually a floppy power connector near the 1st PCI-E slots and a 4pin mol nearby. My board was unstable until I plugged the floppy one in. These power the PCI-E and from that IRQ message on your BSOD it looks like IO got bungled! Next be sure a lot of air is exiting the case, some cases are known to have cheese grate openings. This will kill modern hardware as airflow is king. I cut out the grates and use wire fan grills (the curtains and blinds sway a little now!)

[HeavyD]

[QUOTE=Amoroso]I download that... ran the task...

and now I get a infamous Blue Screen of Death!
QUOTE]

Wow!! I guess it wasn't worth a try. Were you able to recover from this step?

This a really good one. I was going to recommend increasing ram vdc earlier, as Alabama has recommended, but ram volts issues should have shown during memtest, especially test 8. In fact, any ram problem, whether it be volts, timings or whatever, should have shown. Still, a .1 or .2 volt jump might be worth a try.

[shadowdr]

Have you run chkdsk yet on all partitions to rule out hard drive errors or sector that has or may need to reallocate?

[Amoroso]

Solution Found!

After all this stuff... buying and returning items... what a hassle... I found the issue. Tweaking around with the TwinX Corsair... I found that setting the timing at 2T did not cause me any problems when I performed the task!!! Ive been reading up that 2T is recommened when you are in Dual Channel. However in the Bios when I do Ultimatize Settings (Auto) it sets up the stick to 1T. Interesting... So what I did was put my Kingston ValueRam and see if it was too good to be true... what you know... it works. The only thing I had to adjust was the voltage to the ram... the Kingston ValueRam doesnt like 2.7... in memtest So I knocked it down to 2.6 at 3-3-3-8 timing and so far its not showing errors in Memtest. Learned something new all by myself by doing some homework. Wish I just had this direction alittle earlier. Live and learn and I can say I know alittle more about adjusting memory (Yes im a total newb lol!)

Thanks guys for all your help! You dont know I happy I am! :bday:

[Amoroso]

Memtest is reporting 2 Errors on the 6th pass... :mad:

Can someone help me out on the timings. I just want the thing to run stable. Although Im not experiencing any crashes... How siginicant is 2 errors? If im not experiencing any problems should I be worried about it? I believe 3-3-3-8 @ 2.6v is stock for these sticks...

[shadowdr]

Any errors mean writing bad data to disk.

[HeavyD]

Memtest is reporting 2 Errors on the 6th pass... :mad:

Can someone help me out on the timings. I just want the thing to run stable. Although Im not experiencing any crashes... How siginicant is 2 errors? If im not experiencing any problems should I be worried about it? I believe 3-3-3-8 @ 2.6v is stock for these sticks...

hmmm, with those timings at 2.6v and 2T, you shouldn't have any errors. What about the Corsairs? If you still have those they are much better than the Kingston Values. Which test had the errors (I'm guessing #5 or #8)?

Also, I have found that problems with 1T can sometimes be solved with a little extra vdimm. The Corsairs need at least 2.75v to run stable at 1T, sometimes 2.8v when OC'ing and/or using tight timings.

I can't say that I've seen anything that recommends 2T for dual channel, except maybe some old info pertaining to running 2GB or when using 4 sticks. You are loosing quite abit of memory bandwidth by running 2T at 3-3-3-8.

My Corsairs ran rock solid @ 2-3-3-6 1T 2.75v with stock speeds (no OC). Now that I've OCed, my timings are 3-3-3-8 but still stable at 1T with 2.75v

[Immortal_Hero]

Solution Found!

After all this stuff... buying and returning items... what a hassle... I found the issue. Tweaking around with the TwinX Corsair... I found that setting the timing at 2T did not cause me any problems when I performed the task!!! Ive been reading up that 2T is recommened when you are in Dual Channel. However in the Bios when I do Ultimatize Settings (Auto) it sets up the stick to 1T. Interesting... So what I did was put my Kingston ValueRam and see if it was too good to be true... what you know... it works. The only thing I had to adjust was the voltage to the ram... the Kingston ValueRam doesnt like 2.7... in memtest So I knocked it down to 2.6 at 3-3-3-8 timing and so far its not showing errors in Memtest. Learned something new all by myself by doing some homework. Wish I just had this direction alittle earlier. Live and learn and I can say I know alittle more about adjusting memory (Yes im a total newb lol!)

Thanks guys for all your help! You dont know I happy I am! :bday:

I have the same series of Corsair RAM and mine hates 1T as well. They also like a min of 2.8v even at stock speeds to get stock timings (rated at 2.75).

[HeavyD]

I have the same series of Corsair RAM and mine hates 1T as well. They also like a min of 2.8v even at stock speeds to get stock timings (rated at 2.75).

With 4x512MB, you would pretty much have to stick with 2T. But with 2x512MB or even 2x1GB, 1T is totally feasable. Definitely need at least 2.75 to run 1T with Corsair though.

[Amoroso]

Ran it overnight... however manuallly setting the stock timings... I got 4 errors... all on test #4.


Looking at the How-to Guide for Test #4...

test #1 - 4
are cpu fsb speed and or vcore related (meaning lowering fsb or increasing vcore saw errors in these tests disappear)

What should I adjust mine too? Again Rig in the sig.

[HeavyD]

This is weird, I haven't seen errors in test 4 before, sometimes in 3 but not in 4. And unless you have tweaked your fsb and/or vcore before, it's unlikely they would be a problem - especially with all the successful stress testing you did in the earlier posts.

Can you post some CPU-Z screens so we can see what you're running - main screen and memory screens. (I like to use the F5 key with CPU-Z running to get my screens, neat little trick).

[Amoroso]

http://pietroamoroso.com/images/cpuz.jpg

HeavyD- You are right... the only thing I am really changing is 2T... in 1T there is no errors. I ran Prime95 just now... after 8 hours it had a rounding error. Only thing is that the 2T is causing it... thinking it might need some tweaking to get around to it? Wish I knew people with similar ram to do timings. I returned the TwinX... trying to "make do" with these Kingstons.

[Amoroso]

Also quick question...

If Im not experiecing any problems task wise... is it okay to work on my computer. School is coming up... I do alot of 3D renderings, AutoCAD, Photoshop. Is it okay for me to work with these conditions?

Im not ignoring the problem... I just wondering if its safe for me to work in this enviorment while I get it to ultimate stabililty.

[HeavyD]

Whoaaa, you're not getting errors at 1T but you are at 2T - very weird!!

Ok, for starters I think your Trc is too low - should be at about 11 for your current timings. Your DRAM Idle Timer looks really weird too, mine is set for 16 clocks, I'm not sure where that should be but 16 has worked fine for me. I'll check my other rig which is running Corsair value ram.

You could probably run this way for school, but at the risk of corrupt data and/or a crash at an inopertune time.

[HeavyD]

Also, can you select Slot #2 for memory and give a screen?

[Amoroso]

Slot #2

3,4 are empty.

[shadowdr]

There is also the possibility that some of the hidden timings might have carried over from a previous set of ram. You should download SPD Tool and read all the timings that the manufacturer has entered and compare them with what you have in bios. I have had a similar problem with refresh rate timings. They were not in the spd settings but changing it allowed me to run 1t whereas it was not completely stable at 2t before changing it.

HeavyD is right about the trc, it looks way low for the other timings mine is set at 12 for 5-2-3-2.

[Amoroso]

Do you have a link to SPD Tool? I cant seem to find it.

n/m found it... was hidden in here http://www.benchmarkhq.ru/english.html?/be_memory.html

[Amoroso]

SPD Tool doesnt seem to work...

[shadowdr]

I was thinking of this one http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=486965&highlight=spd+tool
And also another that the interface is easier to use herehttp://www.benchmarkhq.ru/english.html?/thaiphoon_e.html. If the one you found is not complete enough try them.

[shadowdr]

Sorry to repost but I should add that the SPD Tool is good for ddr and ddr2. While I do not know if Thaiphoon burner supports ddr2 it has a better details page when it reads the spd. After using them awhile you can see the hex values more easily without having to look at the details page, going back and forth. Both are capable of reflashing the spd to different timings but as allways be warned that doing so is at your own risk and may render the ram unbootable. That bieng said I have used both with no ill effects when reflashing to reasonable settings.

[HeavyD]

Amoroso - any luck after changing tRC and idle timer? If so, you should try 1T with your original problem. Hope you get SPD to work, we should see what the rest of the timings are set to.

Shadow - thanks for info on SPD Tool(s), I'll have to try it out. Does it work from within Windows?

[Amoroso]

Thanks guys!

Right now Im running Memtest86+ with the settings you guys provided me. So far its looking good... although its on its 4th pass... so we will see. If its good after 10 passes I am going to call it good. I am so scared to open the LCD screen and find a error... It isnt like im overclocking it... I just want it stock and stable :temper:

[shadowdr]

Yes they both work in windows. I should also point out that reading them side by side with A64 Tweaker, you can get a good idea if ram settings have been carried over by the bios from another stick or set. The ns settings are divided by 5 for the numerical settings (Why must everthing use multiples?). Some of the settings are ambigious when comparing side by side, such as tref. A64 reports it in my system as 166/3.9, it is however set to 200/7.8. It might be that it shows the combined setting in A64 but I can tell you that the 166/3.9 setting in bios will crash windows almost instantly on my system.
Many of the values may not be set in the spd timings and have a value of zero like my PQI. If having stability issues the bios may have set these on it's own or carried over from another set. Looking at the dump files from other sets of ram with very similar timings may give you insight as to where the problem could lie. Be sure and save the dump file of your ram as it is easier to open and minimize while comparing.

[RollingThunder]

Memtest is reporting 2 Errors on the 6th pass... :mad:

Can someone help me out on the timings. I just want the thing to run stable. Although Im not experiencing any crashes... How siginicant is 2 errors? If im not experiencing any problems should I be worried about it? I believe 3-3-3-8 @ 2.6v is stock for these sticks...

Amoroso,

Two errors or any errors in Memtest is still significant. Memtest86 DOS should only be your preliminary test. It will surely fail Orthos/Prime95 and SuperPi in Windows.

I don't know the DFI boards at all regarding timings and voltage. Perhaps relaxing your timings a little more (3-4-3-8 or 3-4-4-8) may solve your problem, I don't really know. Try it.

Try each of your RAMs individually single channel too. You might have a bad one.

[Amoroso]

Ran Memtest86+ over night... 17 passes with no errors. I think Im error free.

Oh and I ran the 1T and I still have error running that task in Photoshop. Very werid.

correct me if Im wrong, but there is only a 1% decrease in memory bandwidth when switched to 2T?? I dont think thats an alarming rate where I will see any performance issues.

[Amoroso]

Guess it wasnt truely 3-3-3-8 afterall???????

But this is the first set of ram I ever put into the board. Very weird.

[HeavyD]

Ran Memtest86+ over night... 17 passes with no errors. I think Im error free.

Oh and I ran the 1T and I still have error running that task in Photoshop. Very werid.

correct me if Im wrong, but there is only a 1% decrease in memory bandwidth when switched to 2T?? I dont think thats an alarming rate where I will see any performance issues.

Excellent on the memtest :beer:

As far as 1T/2T, for most of us around here, it's about squeezing every last bit of performance out of our rigs while remaining stable. Your setup is seems to be stable until you run Photoshop under certain circumstances, but thats probably where stability is most critical for you. You might loose a little bandwidth, but in real world apps I don't know if you will actually see a difference. I would go with 2T and be confident that your rig won't interfere with your studies any more, IMHO.

[HeavyD]

Guess it wasnt truely 3-3-3-8 afterall???????

But this is the first set of ram I ever put into the board. Very weird.

hmmm, if I'm reading that right, it's showing 4-3-3-8 at 200MHz??? That doesn't make a lot sense. Let's hope Shadow (or anyone else) can shed some light on that. I imagine there's more settings to look at as well.

[Amoroso]

Thanks again HeavyD for all your help! Yea 4-3-3-8 doesnt seem right... I dunno. I was reading reviews on NewEgg on the same excate ram... and they are running 3-3-3-8. Weird.

[RollingThunder]

Thanks again HeavyD for all your help! Yea 4-3-3-8 doesnt seem right... I dunno. I was reading reviews on NewEgg on the same excate ram... and they are running 3-3-3-8. Weird.

Amoroso,

I agree with Heavy that 1T to 2T may be 3% difference real world. You won't see it running your everyday programs. As far as your timings, I would believe what they show in Memtest86 over other software first.

Every board can be different. I wouldn't sweat it if you find a stable point.

[shadowdr]

Hmm, no it doesn't seem right but those are the programed settings. That is likley why it would not run 1t@8-3-3-3. It might run 1t at 8-3-3-4 and may have more bandwidth that way. It is hard to say without seeing the memtest bandwidth score, but you should try and see if it is at least as good as present settings and you may not have any issues with CS.
It may be like my ram, it's default settings are 5-2-3-2 but 7-3-3-2 gives the same bandwidth in memtest and benches the same as well.
IMHO if you bought ram that was advertised with 8-3-3-3 timings that is what you should get.

[Amoroso]

Hey guys... I think im in some trouble now.

I just set the TCL to 4... and put the timining in 1T... and now it doesnt want to post up. I dont see a screen. Computer starts and runs... however it doesnt want to go. The fans stay at high speeds... Since it doesnt post up... I cant even get into BIOS... I cant even turn off the computer with the power switch either... I have to turn the PSU switch off.

Help me lol.

[HeavyD]

You're going to have to reset your bios. Should be a red CMOS jumper on your motherboard. With your power off, move the jumper, power up for a couple of seconds, power down and move the jumper back. Power up again and go straight to BIOS and set everything back up again.

Here's a page from what I think is your manual, in case you're having problems finding the jumper.

55011

[shadowdr]

You can also hold the insert key while booting,pressing the reset switch several times(still holding the insert key). This can take several attempts but usually works to boot into a default mode like the first time it would boot when built. This will not reset the bios settings like resetting cmos so enter bios as soon as it boots and revert to the 8-3-3-3 before booting to windows.

Do both sticks detect the same timings with the spd tool? What are the spd for refresh rate and the cas latencies supported? These are just a few lines down from what the screenie shows. I had forgoitten if it supports (list) several latencies it will show only the highest in the timing summary at the bottom. To be sure they both are programed the same detect module 0 and then clickk file, tab to compare and select module 1. Any differences will highlight in red.

Have you tried the other two ram slots? I have heard of a few that had success with them and not the primary slots.

[Amoroso]

Phew! Thanks again! Totally forgot how to reset the CMOS... I thought u had to remove the battery aswell. Thanks for that!!!

[HeavyD]

You can also hold the insert key while booting,pressing the reset switch several times(still holding the insert key). This can take several attempts but usually works to boot into a default mode like the first time it would boot when built. This will not reset the bios settings like resetting cmos so enter bios as soon as it boots and revert to the 8-3-3-3 before booting to windows.


That's a cool trick!! Is it a DFI trick or does it work with other mobos? If it doesn't reset the timings, will it be able to POST so you can get into bios and make the changes?

[HeavyD]

Phew! Thanks again! Totally forgot how to reset the CMOS... I thought u had to remove the battery aswell. Thanks for that!!!

You are most welcome. I would also like to see the info that Shadow mentioned, but I think you may have already found the most stable settings for your situation. For some reason your DFI and Kingstons just don't want to play nice :bang head :bang head

[KillrBuckeye]

Regarding occasional errors in Memtest86+, I just wanted to note that I have experienced cases in which memory would throw a few errors in Memtest after many passes, yet could pass 24+ hours of Prime95 torture testing, and after 8+ months of everyday use, said system is still rock solid stable. I can't explain it, but either Memtest86+ is falsely reporting a problem with the memory, or the defect in the memory is insignificant. My approach is to always use Prime95 torture test to check for stability. If it passes 20+ hours, the system is stable (at least in terms of CPU/mobo/memory) IMO, regardless of what Memtest tells me.

[Amoroso]

Just ran another memtest86+ and no errors reported. I think I should just keep these settings since they work with the programs I am using. I still dont understand why Photoshop crashes when I run a certain task with the stock settings... and when I ran memtest... it didnt report any errors. However when I switched to 2T... Photoshop doesnt crash during that same task. Dont know why is that... could be the ram... I dunno. As of now with school and all, I really depend on my comp, and having a stable system is my priority as of now... in the summer however... its open game!!! :)

Thanks again guys! Ive seriously wouldnt have done this without you guys. I was about to get a new mobo to see if that was the issue last week... good thing Fry's was out of stock lol. Cant believe all the hassle I went through when it was just a change of a few settings in the Bios. Amazing.

[shadowdr]

That's a cool trick!! Is it a DFI trick or does it work with other mobos? If it doesn't reset the timings, will it be able to POST so you can get into bios and make the changes?

Yes, works on all I have tried. It boots to default safe settings like 100 mhz times the multi and reads the spd for ram. It boots at these settings without changing anything in the bios so you don't have to go through and change everything. It can take several cold boots and resets before it will work but well worth the effort sometimes.

[HeavyD]

Yes, works on all I have tried. It boots to default safe settings like 100 mhz times the multi and reads the spd for ram. It boots at these settings without changing anything in the bios so you don't have to go through and change everything. It can take several cold boots and resets before it will work but well worth the effort sometimes.

That is awesome!! Going to save me a lot of time when I test for OC limits of my components and find out how far is too far, although I am getting good at loading my settings back in after a reset - about 30 seconds to get it working again :D