How much power do you really need

I read the article on the front page by mcoleg and found it really surprising. I was under the impression that these beefy systems needed beefy PSU's to go with 'em. In the near future I may have to upgrade to a quad core, new mobo and another power guzzling gtx and I was certain that I would need a bigger and better PSU to go with it but according to the article that doesnt seem to be the case.

Now when it comes to math I am lost. When you guys start using calculus and equations to figure things out I just stare at them and wonder why my ears are bleeding. I'm not stupid, I just dont get it, never have.

So to those of you that do: Are those figures accurate? Did anyone else already know that and had their new system running on a 400w PSU?

If it's all true then isnt my Silverstone 750w over the top for nearly the same system he has in the article?

And if it is, then what are the 1000W PSU's really needed for if anything?

I would love to post some technical jargin on this for a more in depth post but as I said some of it is just over my head. I would however like to see some discussion between the more enlightened minds here about this article.

Inceptor said:

I read the article on the front page by mcoleg and found it really surprising. I was under the impression that these beefy systems needed beefy PSU's to go with 'em. In the near future I may have to upgrade to a quad core, new mobo and another power guzzling gtx and I was certain that I would need a bigger and better PSU to go with it but according to the article that doesnt seem to be the case.

Now when it comes to math I am lost. When you guys start using calculus and equations to figure things out I just stare at them and wonder why my ears are bleeding. I'm not stupid, I just dont get it, never have.

So to those of you that do: Are those figures accurate? Did anyone else already know that and had their new system running on a 400w PSU?

If it's all true then isnt my Silverstone 750w over the top for nearly the same system he has in the article?

And if it is, then what are the 1000W PSU's really needed for if anything?

I would love to post some technical jargin on this for a more in depth post but as I said some of it is just over my head. I would however like to see some discussion between the more enlightened minds here about this article.

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Inceptor,

Relax, we have all been down that road including me. I was a "babe in the woods" when I came here and still am. Not all of us are electrical experts but there are those here who are and they gladly share their knowledge to those who ask. MC and Alex are only two of many. Now when you upgrade, you already have your power supply!

I'll bet 99% of us here are overpowered but the article your are referring to held my interest from the first post to the last. I was skeptical too, especially after owning two borked Antec TPs. I was silently laughing up my sleeve to some extent as were many others. C'mon guys, admit it!

The article is in my bookmarks for reference and for others. Would I recommend others to do the same? Probably not but at least we have a point of relativity to show to others. If a bigger quality power supply gives a new builder or owner peace of mind for a few dollars more, then there is no price that can be put on that. I did it!

http://www.overclockers.com/articles1452/

I came away much more humble and smarter from that article.

This was the first thread I've ever made about a front page discussion and I wanted to raise as many questions as possible with my limited knowledge on the subject. I may have gone overboard. Still moving up from an E6600 to a Q6600 and adding another 8800gtx all on my current 750w is great news. I already suspect my wife is putting arsenic in my food after every newegg/jabtec purchase.

When I built my current rig some months ago I knew that a quality PSU was important but more then that it turned out to be the single hardest component to nail down definatively. I used a few of the numerous wattage calculators out there with varying results and in the end I just posted here and got some solid advice which I took to heart and ended up with my Silverstone 750w, a purchase I dont regret after reading this.

Almost half the power though, pretty cool. Something for me to take into account the next time I'm building someone a rig.

Inceptor said:

When I built my current rig some months ago I knew that a quality PSU was important but more then that it turned out to be the single hardest component to nail down definatively.

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When I built this unit 18 months ago (starting with an A64 3500+CPU) after being away from builds for 10 years, it was quite the opposite. I thought I already knew about power supplies. Everyone buys and Antec, right? I assumed the power supply was the easy part. After two borked Antecs True Powers and a lot of patience from the guys here, we sorted it all out. Obviously I was more than "gun shy" about buying another power supply and it turned out I really didn't know jack about them.

Swearing (both literally and figuratively) that it won't happen again, I asked here after follwing many threads in the Cases and Power Supply section. Got great advice from many and the Oklahoma Wolf suggested the Corsair HX520 for me because I wanted "quiet and modular with quality." Jonny Guru played no small part in the decision either.

Now I didn't ask if 520w is enough or if it was too much, I knew it was because I ran this rig on a backup Antec True Power 430 in the interim of RMAs. I specified that I wanted quiet, quality and modular and the Corsair was recommended. I don't care if it's almost twice the power output I need (where "peace of mind" enters!) because I was done pulling my hair out!

This is why I stick my nose in the Cases and Power Supply section a lot, I wouldn't wish what I went through on anyone. I'll never belittle anyone from buying an overpowered unit for a new build or future upgrades as long as they buy a quality unit. You obviously did!

I'm glad that I dont need to worry about power issues. The security that the HX520W offers is reassuring, having a considerable overhead on my actual power requirements.

OT: Grats on the blue stars RT

Clockwork_Apple said:

I'm glad that I dont need to worry about power issues. The security that the HX520W offers is reassuring, having a considerable overhead on my actual power requirements.

OT: Grats on the blue stars RT

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Thanks Apple, it's appreciated.

Cool. Now I know I don't need to upgrade my cheapo 400W for my new system. Even if it really only provides 350W it hsould be plenty

petteyg359 said:

Cool. Now I know I don't need to upgrade my cheapo 400W for my new system. Even if it really only provides 350W it hsould be plenty

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Petty,

That test is not a recommended solution for a new power supply for all new builds depending on what your new build is. The author will tell you that and the test using the newer Antec Earth Watt model power supply is of decent quality Seasonic OEM. I don't know what you have for your "cheapo" power supply, some of them are dangerous. All 400w power supplies are not created equal. Be careful.

I know, but my new system should be using only a tiny bit more power than my current one (if not less), and my current system should run fine on a 300W power supply.

I've been saying this for a while now, I knew even 500 Watts was way over doing it. My last power supply in my recently retired computer had a Thermal take 420 Watt PSU with what they branded as a total watts viewer which displayed the current watts usage for the whole system. Every customer review I read on it said it must be broken or it must not be reading the watts correctly (poor fools killed this line of PSU's as it is no longer made). My last system was an Athlon XP 1600, 1GB RAM, 2 HDD's, GeForce 6800 GT overclocked and I was assured I needed at least a 400 Watt PSU for it. It never displayed more than 155 Watts under full load and about 100 Watts at idle.

Check out this fan controller from Zalman. It displays your system watts as well. If you search for reviews on it you will find the reviewers are surprised to see how little power their system is using.

petteyg359 said:

Cool. Now I know I don't need to upgrade my cheapo 400W for my new system. Even if it really only provides 350W it hsould be plenty

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Like RollingThunder said this kind of thinking can be quite dangerous. If you value your system at all don't be counting on some cheapo generic to be able to handle over 80% of its rated load. Plenty of deer and youngyear built crap can't even handle 50% of their rated loads. Have you even checked your 12v rail via DMM to see how its holding up under your rather modest load? In fact if we're talking about the top system in your sig it might really be a problem as many socket A athlon XP motherboards draw power for the CPU from the power supplies 5v rail and not the 12v rail like modern systems. What are the 12v and 5v rails rated for on your el-cheapo PSU? It might have very little power available on the 12v rail where you need it for a new system.

Anyone looking to measure their power consumption from the wall can get a Kill-a-watt from newegg for $23. (remember to factor in efficiency when determining DC power consumption to see how much power your system is actually using.)

Yes todays power requirements are often exaggerated, as this article proves, but if anyone out there is reading this article and thinking of using a 500W Powmax assassin quality unit because "well my system doesn't use close to 500W so I'll be fine" then please donate your hardware to someone before you kill it. As always it comes back to the quality of the PSU. The only reason this experiment was sane was because the EA380 is a pretty decent PSU (despite its low price tag.) Sure, get a PSU that’s more in line with your systems actual power demands but stick to the good stuff like Seasonic S12's or Enhance 80+ units and the like, or maybe even an Antec EarthWatts ; )
Of course if you want to step up to server quality Zippy, Etatis, PC P&C turbocools, ect. then by all means do so, just recognize not ever system needs than kind of power (and many will prefer the lower noise and higher efficiency of the high end desktop quality units like ones I mentioned.) Still not sure on what's good or what you actually need... stop by the power supply section, we'll sort you out =)

I'm running an 2900XT and 3.6GHz Conroe on a 3 year old Sparkle 550, and it doesn't even seem to be taxed. It is a server grade unit, but all the same.

Glad the article finally got put up!

Maybe we can edit a link to mcoleg's thread in there. I didn't see it.

I really don't recommend relying on el-cheapo PSUs, not even if they claim to be 1000W (for powering a 300W load, for instance). I can tell from experience, your computer will eventually fail as mine did (the caps are cheap, airflow design, mosfets, everything is cheap). I have a 500W Generic crappy psu and can't overclock my rig which demands at most 180W - 220W at load.

Also, crappy PSUs won't guarantee low ripple, efficiency (which in the end only reflects on electric bills), stable voltages and could damage and corrupt your hardware and data).

My grain of sand.

So why exactly are there so many good reviews of Rosewills on Newegg? They're definitely cheap...

petteyg359 said:

So why exactly are there so many good reviews of Rosewills on Newegg? They're definitely cheap...

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Most of those reviews are "feel good" with nothing to back them up. They write a review a few days after their new power supply is connected which tells us nothing except it powered up. About the only thing that type of review proves is that the "on-off" switch works and has a nice "click" to it.

If some of the same buyers had to write another review 6 months later, the review may be much different.

These are reviews:

http://jonnyguru.com/reviews.php

It's a very good article. I also used a kill-a-watt to measure my main system's usage and the results would have astounded me 1.5 years ago.

Peak overclocked power draw (dual prime orthos + DXRTHDRIBL, uses even more juice than CS:Source, but only on dual core) FROM THE AC was 375 watts, which would probably equate to around 300 watt DC draw. And this was with a 1.5v OCed opteron, ****loads of fans (albeit weak ones), 5 hard drives, a 7900 GTX and whatnot.

And I'm using a 510 watter.

And the new intel core X's use much less juice than the A64s.

There are still 2 reasons to go overkill though, for us uber-clockers.

1) It's easier on the power supply.

2) The higher watt rated power supplies tend to be nicer overall in terms of cabling, power connectors, looks, cooling, things like that.

3) It's badass =p

Max0r said:

3) It's badass =p

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I agree.

In case anyone didn't see the original article, here's the link. Nice job mcoleg.

http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=511180

The only reason you need lagrer PSU's these days is for the GFX cards, CPU's are using less power, while GPU's are not becoming more efficient at all! it seems.