4gig, dual channel question

Helgaiden · Jul 28, 2007

So im thinking about bumping to 4gigs of ram but im hesitant because i run a 32bit OS...

so my question:
is buying another 2 gigs any different than buying 1 gig if all windows can see is 3gigs anyways? Does 4gigs enable the dual channel if, again, windows is unable to see 4 gigs?

main concern is keeping dual channel up, you know?

xtreme_ego · Jul 28, 2007

if you want more memory without sacrificing perfomace jump to 4 gigs AND a 64 bit os. jumping to 4 gigs on a 32 bit os will get you a BIT of increased performance in the fact you are running dual channel but you lose out on the fact you cant address the 4th stick.. 3 gigs would slow you down due to the "odd stick" syndrome but nothing would be wasted. so the 32bit os is basically GIMPED past 2 gigs because 3 slows the mem down only providing more available ram and not dual channel. and four fixes the dual channel issue but wastes the extra gig

be warned that 4 gigs of mem may force you to up the timings of your ram.

i found this to make sense but im a bit tipsy its Friday and all/////////ment periods but ehh

hope that mkes sence

Coldblood06 · Jul 28, 2007

Somewere in this forum is a link to a place that has info on how to make you 32bit os recognize and use 4+ GB. Not exactly sure were but i think it was somewhere here in the ram section. see if i can find it later

Karnal · Jul 28, 2007

Coldblood06 said:
Somewere in this forum is a link to a place that has info on how to make you 32bit os recognize and use 4+ GB. Not exactly sure were but i think it was somewhere here in the ram section. see if i can find it later

I didnt think you could, but thats very spiffy if there is a work around.

systemhost · Jul 28, 2007

Ermm do think you can... if it's 32bit, there's only so much it can address... and that's it. You may be able to see all of it, but you won't be able to use it.

SeasonalEclipse · Jul 28, 2007

I remember theres something you do in the registry.. change a X to a O or something like that lol

billb · Jul 28, 2007

SeasonalEclipse said:
I remember theres something you do in the registry.. change a X to a O or something like that lol

32 bit OSs can not, do not, and never will use 4 gigs. You can trick them into seeing 4 gigs, but they won't use more than 2 gigs on any one process.

kallejr · Jul 28, 2007

SeasonalEclipse said:
I remember theres something you do

the thing you can do (in boot.ini) relates to 32-bit server versions of windows. they have pae and large memory support

Helgaiden · Jul 28, 2007

yeah i was about to say its impossible for a 32bit OS, its not a system block, its an actual (dare i say physical? or logical?) limitation. Anyways, so 4gigs (4 1gig sticks) gets me dual channel but a wasted gig?

xtreme_ego · Jul 28, 2007

Helgaiden said:
yeah i was about to say its impossible for a 32bit OS, its not a system block, its an actual (dare i say physical? or logical?) limitation. Anyways, so 4gigs (4 1gig sticks) gets me dual channel but a wasted gig?

yes.

but remember in a 32bit os you might not see the whole 3 gigs. its

your mem in the slots -vidcard ram- any other items you have that have mem= what you will see in system info

GTengineer · Jul 29, 2007

billb said:
32 bit OSs can not, do not, and never will use 4 gigs. You can trick them into seeing 4 gigs, but they won't use more than 2 gigs on any one process.

Not true

http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/system/platform/server/PAE/PAEdrv.mspx

Operating system Maximum memory support with PAE

Windows 2000 Advanced Server
8 GB of physical RAM

Windows 2000 Datacenter Server
32 GB of physical RAM

Windows XP (all versions)
4 GB of physical RAM*

Windows Server 2003 (and SP1), Standard Edition
4 GB of physical RAM*

Windows Server 2003, Enterprise Edition
32 GB of physical RAM

Windows Server 2003, Datacenter Edition
64 GB of physical RAM

Windows Server 2003 SP1, Enterprise Edition
64 GB of physical RAM

Windows Server 2003 SP1, Datacenter Edition
128 GB of physical RAM

Operating System Support. The PAE kernel is not enabled by default for systems that can support more than 4 GB of RAM.

To boot the system and utilize PAE memory, the /PAE switch must be added to the corresponding entry in the Boot.ini file. If a problem should arise, Safe Mode may be used, which causes the system to boot using the normal kernel (support for only 4 GB of RAM) even if the /PAE switch is part of the Boot.ini file.

The PAE mode kernel requires an Intel Architecture processor, Pentium Pro or later, more than 4 GB of RAM, and Windows 2000, Windows XP, or Windows Server 2003.

The PAE kernel can be enabled automatically without the /PAE switch present in the boot entry if the system has DEP enabled (/NOEXECUTE switch is present) or the system processor supports hardware-enforced DEP. Presence of the /NOEXECUTE switch on a system with a processor that supports hardware-enforced DEP implies the /PAE switch. If the system processor is capable of hardware-enforced DEP and the /NOEXECUTE switch is not present in the boot entry, Windows assumes /NOEXECUTE=optin by default and enables PAE mode. For more information, see the topic "Boot Options in a Boot.ini File" in the Windows DDK.

Dapper Dan · Jul 29, 2007

dare i say pwnd?

Helgaiden · Jul 29, 2007

and does that allow the OS to address the full amount of memory then? Eh?

GTengineer · Jul 29, 2007

Helgaiden said:
yeah i was about to say its impossible for a 32bit OS, its not a system block, its an actual (dare i say physical? or logical?) limitation. Anyways, so 4gigs (4 1gig sticks) gets me dual channel but a wasted gig?

with 4 sticks you lose 1T command rate

Helgaiden · Jul 30, 2007

as in...completely unable to work with 1t...like wont boot?

Evilsizer · Jul 30, 2007

Helgaiden said:
as in...completely unable to work with 1t...like wont boot?

it may be possible with 4 sticks but you are more then likly goign to have to bump both the MCH and vdimm voltages.

systemhost · Jul 30, 2007

Ok, a 32bit os, in no way, will be able to use four complete gigabytes of ram... you may be able to trick it to allow a application to use the extra amount of memory, but it won't be the same as if it was supported. Using all avalible slots on a computer also strains it so there will be a slight speed loss. Not really noticable unless you're looking very closely, so don't worry about that. I'd say it's only really worth it to get 4gb of ram if you're running vista, so then you'd might as well install the 64-bit version because it runs so freakin sweet. I do'nt see xp using more than 2gb unless you're doing some very memory intensive large file work. Most games won't even touch 1gb on my system.

Helgaiden · Jul 30, 2007

well i have 2gigs and Vista and mainly using for gaming, so 4gigs is overkill in this case?

Oddly enough STALKER had a bug (or still has, not sure) where it would reach 2gigs of RAM usage and then crash when trying to access more (thus going to the pagefile). I dunno what it was, but I ended up having to turn down my resolution from 1680x1050 to 1440x900 in order to keep it from crashing whenever I would save or do something where it would ask for a little more memory.

Phrenetical · Jul 31, 2007

Sorry but the 32bit OS can't address more then 4gbs of mem, least not properly

The PAE fix, kind of works, but the way it works is the bad bit.

It takes memory adressing slots from the PCI devices and graphics card memory.

The article i read explained all of this very clearly, and even though it is possible to use 4gbs, it was a nightmare when trying to install more PCI devices.

Not to mention you will have to do a clean and full re-install to adress all the memory correctly with PAE and not cause conflicts with your other devices. I believe the devices they listed as problematic when using PAE were

USB
PCI
IO ports

but who knows what else it can mess with. Not many people use PAE for this reason.

4gig, dual channel question

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