Sony & Microsoft Discuss Blu-Ray Drive For 360

[AngelfireUk83]

http://uk.gamespot.com/news/6187311....ewstop;title;2

Nothing official but it's bound to happen but it's talks about a inbuilt one not external check this sentence out

"For its part, Sony welcomes the possibility of a Blu-ray-equipped Xbox 360. "If Microsoft wants to release Gears of War 3 on a Blu-ray Disc, I think we can make that happen," Sony Computer Entertainment America's vice president of product marketing Scott A. Steinberg told GameSpot prior to today's report."

[FudgeNuggets]

********, if ANY games are released on BluRay by Microsoft it will be on the Xbox 3, not the 360. Microsoft is not Sega, they know better.

[Janus67]

********, if ANY games are released on BluRay by Microsoft it will be on the Xbox 3, not the 360. Microsoft is not Sega, they know better.
I agree. I doubt that they would specifically release games on a platform that not every system has.

[z0n3]

Games will come out always on DVD. They might have collector's editions or some such nonsense that release on Blu-Ray but I doubt it.

[YellowDart]

Why wouldn't they release games on blu-ray for consoles when they have them built in (aside from expense)? Developers that want to take advantage of it should. When the hardware is fast enough to access large textures and models quickly, I'd think it'd lend itself well to making larger more immersive games that aren't limited to multiple disks.

[synthetic_fenix]

Isn't it possible that Microsoft could release a Blueray addon drive for the 360 to then play blueray games?

[blueswitch]

Microsoft has no motivation to release games on blu-ray. As a blu-ray player for movies, they tack on another selling point, but to release a game on blu-ray versus DVD all they do is segment their own market, it would be a stupid move.

[z0n3]

Why wouldn't they release games on blu-ray for consoles when they have them built in (aside from expense)? Developers that want to take advantage of it should. When the hardware is fast enough to access large textures and models quickly, I'd think it'd lend itself well to making larger more immersive games that aren't limited to multiple disks.

Because they promised that they would keep games on DVD. If they break that promise they better send every single 360 owner a blu ray add-on.

[rainless]

I agree. I doubt that they would specifically release games on a platform that not every system has.

COUGH! *DIRECTX10*COUGH*COUGH*VISTA*

I don't know why you guys keep insisting Microsoft is a good-hearted company of basket weavers.

[Dionysos]

They have already segmented their market by not making the hard drive mandatory. If they do come out with a blu-ray player for the 360 it would most likely be an add on drive like the HD-DVD one was but your best bet for blu-ray will still be PS3 just because of firmware updates.

[mage_x]

Microsoft is not Sega, they know better.
It's starting to look like it..

[rainless]

********, if ANY games are released on BluRay by Microsoft it will be on the Xbox 3, not the 360. Microsoft is not Sega, they know better.

If they "knew better" there wouldn't have been an HD-DVD add-on.

[DerekDRP]

********, if ANY games are released on BluRay by Microsoft it will be on the Xbox 3, not the 360. Microsoft is not Sega, they know better.I totally agree with what you said, and we the gamers would be very jaded.

[Golden Monkey]

COUGH! *DIRECTX10*COUGH*COUGH*VISTA*

I don't know why you guys keep insisting Microsoft is a good-hearted company of basket weavers.


HaHaHaHaHa.....LMAO! :clap:

[FudgeNuggets]

repeat....

MICROSOFT IS NOT SEGA, THERE WILL BE NO GAME PLAYING ADD ON BLURAY DRIVE ALA 32X AND SEGA CD *


The only successful gameplaying addon there has ever been is the 2600 adapter for the Colecovision. The 32X and Sega CD didn't work, the Nintendo DD didn't work, The TG16 CD didn't work (albeit the Turbo Duo did but it was built in)..... history shall not be proven wrong.


*if they release a game playing BluRay add-on drive for the 360 then I will eat a used pair of Rainless' socks.

[benbaked]

*if they release a game playing BluRay add-on drive for the 360 then I will eat a used pair of Rainless' socks.

quoted for preservation...in case he changes his mind. :p

[jmsanders2]

Most Microsoft games are not HD-DVD right? I know lost planet and one of basketball games were hd, but I'm just trying to think of backwards compatablitiy with all the existing games. I don't think this is the case, but would an on-board bluray kill backwards comp on their existing games? If this is the case, I agree with the Fudge and his 8 star opinion.

[rainless]

repeat....

MICROSOFT IS NOT SEGA, THERE WILL BE NO GAME PLAYING ADD ON BLURAY DRIVE ALA 32X AND SEGA CD *


The only successful gameplaying addon there has ever been is the 2600 adapter for the Colecovision. The 32X and Sega CD didn't work, the Nintendo DD didn't work, The TG16 CD didn't work (albeit the Turbo Duo did but it was built in)..... history shall not be proven wrong.


*if they release a game playing BluRay add-on drive for the 360 then I will eat a used pair of Rainless' socks.

repeat....

MICROSOFT MIGHT AS WELL BE SEGA, THEY ALREADY RELEASED AN HD-DVD DRIVE THAT DIDN'T PAN-OUT ALA 32X AND SEGA CD *

[zexmarquies01]

Most Microsoft games are not HD-DVD right? I know lost planet and one of basketball games were hd, but I'm just trying to think of backwards compatablitiy with all the existing games. I don't think this is the case, but would an on-board bluray kill backwards comp on their existing games? If this is the case, I agree with the Fudge and his 8 star opinion.

No. NONE of the 360's games are on HD-DVD discs.

the game may be able to DO HD ( as in, it can be played at 1080P resolution ), but ALL 360 games are on Regular DVD's.

[Elif Tymes]

repeat....

MICROSOFT MIGHT AS WELL BE SEGA, THEY ALREADY RELEASED AN HD-DVD DRIVE THAT DIDN'T PAN-OUT ALA 32X AND SEGA CD *


That's like saying that nintendo is like Sega because the power glove didn't work out.

[rainless]

That's like saying that nintendo is like Sega because the power glove didn't work out.

What's your point? The power glove DIDN'T work out. Neither did the VR-Boy.

[Elif Tymes]

And yet Nintendo is still a huge player in the gaming business.

The failure of a non-essential peripheral has very little to do with the consoles quality/whatever.

Is "Nintendo like Sega?" Not even close. Saying Microsoft is like Sega because HD-DVD lost the war is equally ludicrous.

[rainless]

And yet Nintendo is still a huge player in the gaming business.

The failure of a non-essential peripheral has very little to do with the consoles quality/whatever.

Is "Nintendo like Sega?" Not even close. Saying Microsoft is like Sega because HD-DVD lost the war is equally ludicrous.

I still don't understand your point. The Sega CD/32X was not the end of Sega. They went on to make the Saturn (which didn't do so good) and the Dreamcast (which did). But every video game company has had a periph. which has failed. including (but not limited to) Microsoft.

Saying that Microsoft wouldn't release something like the Sega CD/32x is a direct contradition BECAUSE THEY ALREADY HAVE!

[FudgeNuggets]

repeat....

MICROSOFT MIGHT AS WELL BE SEGA, THEY ALREADY RELEASED AN HD-DVD DRIVE THAT DIDN'T PAN-OUT ALA 32X AND SEGA CD *

No, it's different because the HD-DVD drive was not for gaming, nor will be the BLuRay drive.

[rainless]

No, it's different because the HD-DVD drive was not for gaming, nor will be the BLuRay drive.

How is that different? The Sega CD was an add-on that tanked and the HD-DVD drive was an add-on that tanked. On top of that... they were both optical media add-ons that tanked (as a historical note the Sega CD was the first U.S. game device that let you play audio CDs).

Also... you don't KNOW that the blu-ray drive won't be for gaming. That's just your hypothesis.

[Niku-Sama]

i see M$ ***king us over, i am with rainless

[rainless]

i see M$ ***king us over, i am with rainless

:beer: I mean, after-all, this ain't Amnesty International we're talking about...

[AngelfireUk83]

Steve Ballmer Microsoft CEO say they will work with Blu-Ray in ways that make sense it dosn't mention blu-ray support for 360.


http://uk.gamespot.com/news/6187379.html?om_act=convert&om_clk=newstop&tag=newstop;title;2

And another microsoft rumor talks of a 60GB HDD Drive coming to Premium 20GB 360's http://uk.gamespot.com/news/show_blog_entry.php?topic_id=26276872&sid=6187414&om_act=convert&om_clk=newstop&tag=newstop;title;3

60GB HDD sold buy it's self would apparently cost $100 (£80)
120GB sold by it's self costs $180 (£120)


Also the inbuilt blu-ray drive 360 what where talking about here from another so called source

[rainless]

Steve Ballmer Microsoft CEO say they will work with Blu-Ray in ways that make sense it dosn't mention blu-ray support for 360.


http://uk.gamespot.com/news/6187379.html?om_act=convert&om_clk=newstop&tag=newstop;title;2

And another microsoft rumor talks of a 60GB HDD Drive coming to Premium 20GB 360's http://uk.gamespot.com/news/show_blog_entry.php?topic_id=26276872&sid=6187414&om_act=convert&om_clk=newstop&tag=newstop;title;3

60GB HDD sold buy it's self would apparently cost $100 (£80)
120GB sold by it's self costs $180 (£120)


Also the inbuilt blu-ray drive 360 what where talking about here from another so called source

There's no reason why they would put a bluray drive in a 360 unless it would eventually be used for gaming. Period.

Blu-ray drives are expensive... They drive-up the cost of the system. It would be illogical to include one if it wasn't eventually going to be used for gaming.

[mepis]

If they "knew better" there wouldn't have been an HD-DVD add-on.

Microsoft initially went with he HD-DVD add on and the in built HD-dvd drive in the elite systems because they supported the HD-DVD format at the beginning. Of course with the introduction of two new formats (hddvd and BD) large companies took sides on what they though was best. Sony came out with BD and endorsed that heavily so it was natural (and microsoft's/Bill Gate's opinion) that HDdvd was a better option. They also needed an HD media option to play movies on to compete with the PS3. The 360 was released well before the PS3 and the heavier use of HD disc media in home for movies, hence the release of the add on drive later in the 360's life. The hddvd drive was only ever meant by microsoft as a means to watch HD media. It's expected of a console system now of days as the defacto standard since the original xbox and SP2 had the capabilities of playing DVD media. The 360 can play DVD media out of the box. With the competition of the PS3 with the capability to play HD media microsoft had to respond with some sort of competition.

The HDdvd standard though, for better or worse, is now practically dead. It would be a smart move in microsoft's position to introduce another "elite" system with an in built Blue-ray disc player for HD media and an add on drive for its existing systems. Microsoft needs the competition with the HD media add on capabilities because that's where the market is at right now. It makes since for the BD player as that's where movies are being produced at now. That is a big selling point for the PS3 that it has the capability of playing BD and is frankly one of the better BD player's out on the market. If microsoft doesnt release a BD player down the line people are going to question even heavier which system to buy, escpicially the casual player's that are going to look at all options of a system, and the market is driven by the casual player because they are where most of the money comes in, hard core players only make up a small amount of the market much like hard core computer enthusiast only make up a small amount of the market.

I think Sony's CEO comment about releasing Gears of War 3 or whatever on BD should be taken with a grain of salt. Would microsoft be stupid enough to release games only on BD? I doubt it, at least not until towards the end of the life of the 360 and the merge towards there next gen system. They would segment their market heavily. People would have to run out and buy a new BD player add on to play that new game which would only make sense with the introduction of the next gen system that required BD discs anyway. That would be Microsoft's point for segmenting the market. As for right now the realize their games are expensive and are not going to push average joe away from the system by having to pay out well over $150 for a new game. The BD player wold be a smart add on move but only in the way of adding extra features and the ability to play HD media natively.

[ratbuddy]

How is that different? The Sega CD was an add-on that tanked and the HD-DVD drive was an add-on that tanked. On top of that... they were both optical media add-ons that tanked (as a historical note the Sega CD was the first U.S. game device that let you play audio CDs).

Also... you don't KNOW that the blu-ray drive won't be for gaming. That's just your hypothesis.

I was one of the few, the proud, the suckers who bought a Sega-CD. There were actually some decent games if you looked past the stupid Sewer Shark and It Came From the Desert FMV disasters.

Lunar: The Silver Star was fun, as was Sonic CD. There was also a really cool strategy game the name of which eludes me. Somewhat similar to the old NES Conflict series.

Sega CD was also my first audio CD player. With Lunar, if you put the disc in a normal CD player, you could go through all the spoken audio in the game. I heard the ending to that game before I played through it :p

If the game-makers hadn't been obsessed with grainy B-movie style FMV, the system really did have a lot of potential. Shame, that.

On topic, I can see MS doing a BR add-on, but just for movies - the same way the HDDVD add-on was not for games. Even if a future version of the 360 has a built in BR drive, it's not going to be for games, just movies. I'll eat Fudge's droppings after eating your dirty socks if it's used for games.

[FudgeNuggets]

Microsoft initially went with he HD-DVD add on and the in built HD-dvd drive in the elite systems because they supported the HD-DVD format at the beginning.


Where do you people get your facts from? There has NEVER been a 360 with a built in HD-DVD drive, the Elite just has a BenQ as opposed to a Toshi or Samsung, still regular DVD though.

Also, Major Nelson, Steve Ballmar and John Allard has repeatedly said, no PROMISED that there will be no built in HD no BluRay drive in the 360 and no games for the external units.

[mepis]

Where do you people get your facts from? There has NEVER been a 360 with a built in HD-DVD drive, the Elite just has a BenQ as opposed to a Toshi or Samsung, still regular DVD though.


I adjust my facts then. I remember when they first announced the elite model that the big changes with it where the HDMI cables and port, as well as a 120 gig hard drive and the added HD-dvd drive. That's just what I remembered from the announcement of the Elite model.

[rainless]

Microsoft initially went with he HD-DVD add on and the in built HD-dvd drive in the elite systems because they supported the HD-DVD format at the beginning. Of course with the introduction of two new formats (hddvd and BD) large companies took sides on what they though was best. Sony came out with BD and endorsed that heavily so it was natural (and microsoft's/Bill Gate's opinion) that HDdvd was a better option. They also needed an HD media option to play movies on to compete with the PS3. The 360 was released well before the PS3 and the heavier use of HD disc media in home for movies, hence the release of the add on drive later in the 360's life. The hddvd drive was only ever meant by microsoft as a means to watch HD media. It's expected of a console system now of days as the defacto standard since the original xbox and SP2 had the capabilities of playing DVD media. The 360 can play DVD media out of the box. With the competition of the PS3 with the capability to play HD media microsoft had to respond with some sort of competition.

The HDdvd standard though, for better or worse, is now practically dead. It would be a smart move in microsoft's position to introduce another "elite" system with an in built Blue-ray disc player for HD media and an add on drive for its existing systems. Microsoft needs the competition with the HD media add on capabilities because that's where the market is at right now. It makes since for the BD player as that's where movies are being produced at now. That is a big selling point for the PS3 that it has the capability of playing BD and is frankly one of the better BD player's out on the market. If microsoft doesnt release a BD player down the line people are going to question even heavier which system to buy, escpicially the casual player's that are going to look at all options of a system, and the market is driven by the casual player because they are where most of the money comes in, hard core players only make up a small amount of the market much like hard core computer enthusiast only make up a small amount of the market.

I think Sony's CEO comment about releasing Gears of War 3 or whatever on BD should be taken with a grain of salt. Would microsoft be stupid enough to release games only on BD? I doubt it, at least not until towards the end of the life of the 360 and the merge towards there next gen system. They would segment their market heavily. People would have to run out and buy a new BD player add on to play that new game which would only make sense with the introduction of the next gen system that required BD discs anyway. That would be Microsoft's point for segmenting the market. As for right now the realize their games are expensive and are not going to push average joe away from the system by having to pay out well over $150 for a new game. The BD player wold be a smart add on move but only in the way of adding extra features and the ability to play HD media natively.

Your argument is thorough... but flawed. Customers don't expect an external media player for their video game system. And the system I love to hate, the Wii, can't even play DVDs. (And it was the fastest selling system on earth for a little while...) And how are they going to compete with Sony by purchasing their product? I mean... The competition... is buying... what you're selling.

[mepis]

Your argument is thorough... but flawed. Customers don't expect an external media player for their video game system. And the system I love to hate, the Wii, can't even play DVDs. (And it was the fastest selling system on earth for a little while...) And how are they going to compete with Sony by purchasing their product? I mean... The competition... is buying... what you're selling.

Do they need to pay sony royalties or liscensing in order to to use the Blue Ray technology? If not they could always have some other manufacturer make their hardware.

I think of the wii differently because it is so cheap of a system. Something that cheap is going to be feature limited. But the 360 and PS3 run close to the same price range. In order for the 360 to compete it's going to have to offer the same capabilities, at least in that price tier of an appliance. It can play standard DV'D's now, but they will need to offer an HD solution down the road for competitiveness or drop the price more. When your talking a $100 difference in the systems the average Joe consumer very well rather pay that extra $100 and have a blue ray player as opposed to paying $300 for a system then a couple hundred more for a seperate set top box. Most consumers and average Joe's, especially the white collar job class, wants things as "all-in-one" as possible. Microsoft for feature competitiveness will have to add an HD media solution or drop the price to justify buying two different pieces of hardware.

I still consider the wii in a seperate class because it is much cheaper then the other systems which can justify the cost of buying seperate products. The wii also has a higher profit margin per system then the other two.

The big question to my arguements then would be does microsoft actually have to pay sony anything for the blue ray spec? I can't imagine time warner and every other manufacturer in the world having to pay to produce discs and what not. Even if they do pay sony to use the blue ray spec if microsoft sells more systems then they are winning in their own market. The arguement here isnt whether sony or microsoft is going to make more profit in the end as a whole, but will the 360 or the ps3 sell more as a whole. If microsoft sells more systems but has to pay sony a tiny amount for the blue ray spec then microsoft is still leading in the console market where they are competing in this particular incident. Microsoft does not have it's own media standard it is pushing, just it's own gameing or media system here. Sony and Microsoft are not competing in the media format wars. There again if microsoft sells more systems then they are winning. If they do or dont have to pay sony for the spec it doesnt matter so much because they are not competing in that aspect in the way of media unless sony charges microsoft such a high price for the standard that it is not feasible to produce a blue ray player for the 360.

I hate to harp on the same point but again microsoft and sony are not fighting over media format wars here, just console. In the end it's which console can sell more and make more money. I still think microsoft needs an HD media solution to compete down the road.

[Niku-Sama]

Do they need to pay sony royalties or liscensing in order to to use the Blue Ray technology? If not they could always have some other manufacturer make their hardware.

I think of the wii differently because it is so cheap of a system. Something that cheap is going to be feature limited. But the 360 and PS3 run close to the same price range. In order for the 360 to compete it's going to have to offer the same capabilities, at least in that price tier of an appliance. It can play standard DV'D's now, but they will need to offer an HD solution down the road for competitiveness or drop the price more. When your talking a $100 difference in the systems the average Joe consumer very well rather pay that extra $100 and have a blue ray player as opposed to paying $300 for a system then a couple hundred more for a seperate set top box. Most consumers and average Joe's, especially the white collar job class, wants things as "all-in-one" as possible. Microsoft for feature competitiveness will have to add an HD media solution or drop the price to justify buying two different pieces of hardware.

I still consider the wii in a seperate class because it is much cheaper then the other systems which can justify the cost of buying seperate products. The wii also has a higher profit margin per system then the other two.

The big question to my arguements then would be does microsoft actually have to pay sony anything for the blue ray spec? I can't imagine time warner and every other manufacturer in the world having to pay to produce discs and what not. Even if they do pay sony to use the blue ray spec if microsoft sells more systems then they are winning in their own market. The arguement here isnt whether sony or microsoft is going to make more profit in the end as a whole, but will the 360 or the ps3 sell more as a whole. If microsoft sells more systems but has to pay sony a tiny amount for the blue ray spec then microsoft is still leading in the console market where they are competing in this particular incident. Microsoft does not have it's own media standard it is pushing, just it's own gameing or media system here. Sony and Microsoft are not competing in the media format wars. There again if microsoft sells more systems then they are winning. If they do or dont have to pay sony for the spec it doesnt matter so much because they are not competing in that aspect in the way of media unless sony charges microsoft such a high price for the standard that it is not feasible to produce a blue ray player for the 360.

I hate to harp on the same point but again microsoft and sony are not fighting over media format wars here, just console. In the end it's which console can sell more and make more money. I still think microsoft needs an HD media solution to compete down the road.

i am quoting large posts to further emphasize M$ will ***k you over

[SunRedRX7]

Do they need to pay sony royalties or liscensing in order to to use the Blue Ray technology? If not they could always have some other manufacturer make their hardware.

Blu-ray victory means royalties, royalties, royalties (http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9874317-7.html?tag=nefd.lede)


Here is the info just for DVD from the article, expect blu-ray to have something more expensive.
The numbers add up quickly. Look at DVD, for example. To make a DVD player legally, manufacturers recently had to pay around $4 per player or drive, according to some estimates. A few years ago, those fees were around $15 to $20. Fees get paid every time a DVD drive gets included in a PC. Nearly every PC in the world has a DVD drive these days and roughly 250 million PCs get shipped every year. Companies that legally make DVD discs also pay fees. The DVD6C licensing group dropped the per disc fee in January to 4 cents per disc. Years ago, it was 7.5 cents per disc. Then there are verification fees.

[mepis]

That article you listed said Sony only held roughly %30 of the Blue Ray market which means microsofts money would either go to another royalty holder or very little to Sony. This means Microsoft could manufacturer a Blue Ray player for the 360 and compete.

Can anyone answer this question too? Does Sony have a seperate sister comany or department like Microsoft for it's gaming division? If it does would this smaller sister company or department not have to pay the royalty fees for the Blue Ray player as well? If they do then this would just mean even competition again if Microsoft made a BD player.

[SunRedRX7]

I would think the royalties get divided up amongst the IP holders.

[rainless]

That article you listed said Sony only held roughly %30 of the Blue Ray market which means microsofts money would either go to another royalty holder or very little to Sony. This means Microsoft could manufacturer a Blue Ray player for the 360 and compete.

Can anyone answer this question too? Does Sony have a seperate sister comany or department like Microsoft for it's gaming division? If it does would this smaller sister company or department not have to pay the royalty fees for the Blue Ray player as well? If they do then this would just mean even competition again if Microsoft made a BD player.



The Seperate Department you're referring to is SCE... basically the gaming division of Sony ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Computer_Entertainment ) they do not have royalty fees for Blu-ray and it is NOT even competition.

(Wow... Team Rainless actually posted a link... what is the world coming to!)

[mepis]

The Seperate Department you're referring to is SCE... basically the gaming division of Sony ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Computer_Entertainment ) they do not have royalty fees for Blu-ray and it is NOT even competition.

(Wow... Team Rainless actually posted a link... what is the world coming to!)


LOL, It's the first I've seen in your posts in a while that I can remember. Tommorrow the world will be filled with locusts and water will turn to blood and the world will end. j/k

Anyway, thanks for clearing that up. I do accept your arguements and you too make some very good points. But I still personally think Microsoft is going to have to figure out some way to compete whether it would be dropping prices or coming out with a player.

but then again microsoft doesnt emphasize the features it all ready has. Like upconverting DVD's which the PS3 doesnt do and the Media Center extender which does do an all right job.

[Dionysos]

but then again microsoft doesnt emphasize the features it all ready has. Like upconverting DVD's which the PS3 doesnt do and the Media Center extender which does do an all right job.

The PS3 does up convert, and may I say it does a great job of it to my 40" HDTV.

[mepis]

The PS3 does up convert, and may I say it does a great job of it to my 40" HDTV.

Sorry, I was under the impression from what I read that the PS3 does not up convert standard DVD's to HD.

[rainless]

LOL, It's the first I've seen in your posts in a while that I can remember. Tommorrow the world will be filled with locusts and water will turn to blood and the world will end. j/k



I try not to validate any of my points because I don't actually care if anybody believes me.... :)

So do you actually own a 360 or PS3 or are you taking a series of uneducated guesses? ;)

[mepis]

I try not to validate any of my points because I don't actually care if anybody believes me.... :)

So do you actually own a 360 or PS3 or are you taking a series of uneducated guesses? ;)

Im taking a series of educated opinions based on what I've read and heard in the past as well as market history and competitiveness. As for the moment Im married with a child on the way and can not afford a 360 or PS3. That and I don't game as much anymore and my modded xbox with xmbc is all I need.

[rainless]

Im taking a series of educated opinions based on what I've read and heard in the past as well as market history and competitiveness. As for the moment Im married with a child on the way and can not afford a 360 or PS3. That and I don't game as much anymore and my modded xbox with xmbc is all I need.

A lot of what you read (Especially if it came from one of Fudge's rumor posts) was probably inaccurate. Like you said the PS3 couldn't upconvert DVDs... but it can. Microsoft never included the HDDVD player in the 360 Elite (that was just a rumor).

As far as competition goes... I think you'd understand things a bit more if you owned both systems. The PS3 is really building something now... and the 360 has been standing still for a long time. I mean the fact that you can use remote play to watch your bluray movies from anywhere that has wifi on your psp is just CRAZY.

And they're very quickly moving towards and online service that's both free and more robust than Xbox Live.

I say that as an Xbox Live user. I've been very disappointed with the service lately. They were supposed to be releasing a new SNK game every month. So far that hasn't happened... Both Bionic Commando and Street Fighter 2 Turbo HD remix are going to be crippled on the 360 due to their size limits. And the "membership fee" they demand is no longer attractive to me.

I'm at a point now where it would simply make more sense for me to have a PS3 (even though I never actually wanted one.(

[Dionysos]

Plus a PS3 can fold@home when there is nothing to play. It is also the best blu-ray player bang for the buck.:soda:

[rainless]

Plus a PS3 can fold@home when there is nothing to play. It is also the best blu-ray player bang for the buck.:soda:

It really is... Games, folding, linux, these just isn't much the PS3 can't do.

[Niku-Sama]

for now, in theroy blu ray should come down in price but who knows...

its sony

[rainless]

for now, in theroy blu ray should come down in price but who knows...

its sony

I don't see why the price would go down now... Unless the price of the lasers and whatnot plummets... because there's no more competition. I mean EVENTUALLY it will go down.

[Niku-Sama]

i would think that now its dominant theyre going to try to get every one to buy them, it is possible for both to fail if the price doesent come down then alot of people are going to stick to DVD's (my self included) untill we see a sub $100 NEW blu ray player and sub $20 new releases like DVD's.

i would watch laser discs still if i had a player, cant find a damn decent one but i have Cobra on LD waiting to be watched.

its about people and the money they make. i make rougly $50 a week currently, i havent been claiming un employment and minimum wage out here is $7.95 which in turn makes every thing else that more expencive. i am not waying every one in oregon is un employed but there arent alot of big comanies out here that pay well so theres alot of people in a lower income bracket that frankly cant afford such a thing and i am sure its every where not just here.

the way i see it is the fail is still possible but slim, weither they pony up and find ways to reduce costs is a big part of it and its sony, who knows what the **** theyre going to do. i also wouldnt be supprised if they said "hey screw you we bought the HD-DVD format and we use this now ho's!"

theyre just THAT crazy

[rainless]

i would think that now its dominant theyre going to try to get every one to buy them, it is possible for both to fail if the price doesent come down then alot of people are going to stick to DVD's (my self included) untill we see a sub $100 NEW blu ray player and sub $20 new releases like DVD's.

i would watch laser discs still if i had a player, cant find a damn decent one but i have Cobra on LD waiting to be watched.

its about people and the money they make. i make rougly $50 a week currently, i havent been claiming un employment and minimum wage out here is $7.95 which in turn makes every thing else that more expencive. i am not waying every one in oregon is un employed but there arent alot of big comanies out here that pay well so theres alot of people in a lower income bracket that frankly cant afford such a thing and i am sure its every where not just here.

the way i see it is the fail is still possible but slim, weither they pony up and find ways to reduce costs is a big part of it and its sony, who knows what the **** theyre going to do. i also wouldnt be supprised if they said "hey screw you we bought the HD-DVD format and we use this now ho's!"

theyre just THAT crazy

They aren't crazy at all. And they won't fail because Sony and their backers have enough cash to keep Blu-ray going indefinitely even under ridiculously heavy losses. DVD players weren't under $100 overnight. It took years before you could find one under $200. Bluray will continue to evolve until 200GB is the standard size of most movies and the discs are being read at like 16-20x.

You always have to refer to history at moments like this. I remember when CD burners first came out. The prices were pretty consistent until they started releasing a new speed every week: 8x, then 10x, then 12x... by the time they got to 16x they had found out how to cheaply manuafacture quality components and you could get a damned good CD burner for 60 bucks.

So it will take time... but they will not fail. It won't fail because they have deeep pockets, no competition, and enough leverage to wait it out.

[FudgeNuggets]

Sorry, I was under the impression from what I read that the PS3 does not up convert standard DVD's to HD.

Again you are wrong. It does but only via HDMI.

Rainless,
Dude, I haven't posted any rumor posts since the 3 systems all came out. I think you are confusing me with AngelFireUK.

[rainless]

Again you are wrong. It does but only via HDMI.

Rainless,
Dude, I haven't posted any rumor posts since the 3 systems all came out. I think you are confusing me with AngelFireUK.

That is a possibility... ;)

[EchoTheDolphin]

I still fail to see why people think Microsoft is a horrible horrible company. At least they admit mistakes and take responsibility for bad decisions. Yes, their software end charges a crapload, but that's what you get when you buy an OS or product that you want more or less ongoing support and development for.

Anyone remember the wildly outrageous marketing claims Sony made about the PS3? I sure do.

[uberwoot]

I still fail to see why people think Microsoft is a horrible horrible company. At least they admit mistakes and take responsibility for bad decisions. Yes, their software end charges a crapload, but that's what you get when you buy an OS or product that you want more or less ongoing support and development for.

Anyone remember the wildly outrageous marketing claims Sony made about the PS3? I sure do.

When it all comes down to the marketing clames is at the end of the day when a system still works and dosent self destruct. Who cares if they say it will cure cancer and what not or its powered by Chuck norrise. I just want it to work when i go to turn it on.

[FudgeNuggets]

The PS1s and PS2s had problems too with lasers mainly (and it is WELL documented, in spite of what Rainless may say, I have proof and have linked it NUMEROUS times). It was fairly widespread too but not to the level of the 360 I believe but it was still a large amount. Sony would neer admit to the problem and told their users to go buy new units, they skate by with no bad PR. MS admits the problem, attempts to make good on the problem and then gets lambasted by the users and media. Not quite fair is it? Who cares? 2 Evil monolithic companies, I don't feel a bit sorry for them, the consumers however should burn both to the ground!!

[John G]

Well….basically, we have reported news with no new information. :)

The Sony representative's comment is even somewhat of a subtle way to scare 360 owners (and potential owners.) Release a Blu-Ray version of Gears of War for 360? Completely absurd and the person saying it knows it; it's a planted comment to make people think they have to be afraid of Blu-Ray games they can't play without spending more money.

A Blu-Ray drive for the 360 at this point ONLY has value in bringing HD movie playing to their system as a selling point for the system as a whole. Games stay out of the picture because it won't make MS more money and MS knows it, and the direct comments of their leadership continue to reflect that knowledge.

A Blu-Ray drive for the 360 will eventually happen, I have little doubt. MS needs to add HD movie capability back into the list of features. Whether the drive is internal or external matters little. I wouldn't be surprised if it were internal on HDMI units only in order to assure that the HDCP chain stays intact. Either way, the drive will only be for movies.

Something to watch… drive prices have been coming down. A good indicator is PC drives. Lite-On BD-ROM drive is down to $140 on newegg, now…and that's a drive sold on it's own profit through a retail channel. It comes with a BD version of PowerDVD that's kind of like a "Lite" version with some limited capability.

On a side note, I'm going to be building a new PC in the upcoming weeks… Pretty soon I'm gonna be playing WoW and Oblivion on a new machine, 42" 1080p 120hz LCD, and full size home theater system…lol. :D Anyway, full blown PowerDVD Ultra is another $100 for the full Blu-Ray movie experience…another one of those BD players with fully upgradable software - PC. :)

[VinnyTAMU]

I agree with Fudge, MS will not release Blu-ray games for the Xbox 360.

[rainless]

I still fail to see why people think Microsoft is a horrible horrible company. At least they admit mistakes and take responsibility for bad decisions. Yes, their software end charges a crapload, but that's what you get when you buy an OS or product that you want more or less ongoing support and development for.

Anyone remember the wildly outrageous marketing claims Sony made about the PS3? I sure do.

Hahahaha... I take it you must be under 15 or so... And even then... if you want a more recent example, how's about Microsoft's attempted Hostile Takeover of Yahoo? What about all the companies Microsoft has run out of business and people they've put out of work?

I'm a writer. I used to use Wordperfect exclusively. It's what I learned to write on and I got to be very good at it to the point that I knew every single feature and option and hotkey. Microsoft ran Wordperfect out of business. (As in it was actually their GOAL.) Same thing with Netscape. And smaller companies they stole from and bought out to prevent lawsuits. The EU won a multi-billion dollar anti-trust suit against Microsoft.

This isn't Green Peace or the Public Broadcasting System. Nothing Sony has ever said about the PS3 compares to Microsoft's stupid denials while Xbox 360s were dying left and right (this was BEFORE they admitted it). Peter Moore's official excuse was "Things Break."

[FudgeNuggets]

That was one of Moore's few gaffes..... his most recent being his love for extending the NFL's exclusivity deal with EA. Sadly, I'm beginning to agree with Rainless that all companies are out for two purposes 1. Make the most money possible regadless of ethics or quality 2. Kick the consumer in the balls as hard and as often as possible in the process of 1.

[Kenshiro]

I don't see why the price would go down now... Unless the price of the lasers and whatnot plummets... because there's no more competition. I mean EVENTUALLY it will go down.

People are predicting another price cut for PS3 this Chirstmans, which is about 9 months away... quite a long time to wait.

[Kenshiro]

The PS1s and PS2s had problems too with lasers mainly (and it is WELL documented, in spite of what Rainless may say, I have proof and have linked it NUMEROUS times). It was fairly widespread too but not to the level of the 360 I believe but it was still a large amount. Sony would neer admit to the problem and told their users to go buy new units, they skate by with no bad PR. MS admits the problem, attempts to make good on the problem and then gets lambasted by the users and media. Not quite fair is it? Who cares? 2 Evil monolithic companies, I don't feel a bit sorry for them, the consumers however should burn both to the ground!!

Oh yes, that is so true. Lots of problems with the laser. The reason Sony didn't care that time.... because they are the dominant one in the market. Literally, there was nothign out there to challenge the PS1 and PS2.

I'm a playstation 3 owner, and a playstation nuthugger. I don't support Microsoft, but i dont want them to go away. With the xbox in the market, that creates competition between giant corporation and prevents monopoly, which in turn is great for consumers. Remember the PS1 days, how long was it before Sony decides to have a price cut on their consoles. Not only that, the prices of the games are insane. Of course, new games are $50, but they stay at that price like forever.

[rainless]

Oh yes, that is so true. Lots of problems with the laser. The reason Sony didn't care that time.... because they are the dominant one in the market. Literally, there was nothign out there to challenge the PS1 and PS2.

I'm a playstation 3 owner, and a playstation nuthugger. I don't support Microsoft, but i dont want them to go away. With the xbox in the market, that creates competition between giant corporation and prevents monopoly, which in turn is great for consumers. Remember the PS1 days, how long was it before Sony decides to have a price cut on their consoles. Not only that, the prices of the games are insane. Of course, new games are $50, but they stay at that price like forever.

Actually new games are $59.99. $49.99 would be reasonable.

[Dionysos]

$49.99 is the new PC gaming price point.

[rainless]

$49.99 is the new PC gaming price point.

You mean "New" as in "in-the-past-ten-years"...? And either way... this is the console section.

[Kenshiro]

Actually new games are $59.99. $49.99 would be reasonable.

My bad... actually, i meant new games during the ps1 era. They stayed at $49.99 for a freaking long time before any price drop.

[Dionysos]

You mean "New" as in "in-the-past-ten-years"...? And either way... this is the console section.

Don't know where your buying your games but your getting ripped off if thats what you've been paying for the last ten years. I've only spent 49.99 on my past 3 pc games but like you said this is the console section, btw where are the master chef can beat up samus/snake threads.:beer:


P.S. I know chief is spelled this way, I was just making fun of normal console forums.;)

[FudgeNuggets]

btw where are the master chef can beat up samus/snake threads.:beer:


I think I was one of the last people here to stop hating (after all the MS 360 issues). I no longer had anything to hate on. I hated Sony because their quality on the PS1 and PS2 were shoddy. I hated MS after the 360 quality debacle and I hated Nintendo for releasing something with such fun gameplay but weak graphics and a crapton of shoddy games.

Fact is that I'm a gamer, have been for over 20 years and the will likely buy every system that comes out until the day I did (just like I have the last 20 years). The only platform I've dropped is the PC.

[rainless]

Don't know where your buying your games but your getting ripped off if thats what you've been paying for the last ten years. I've only spent 49.99 on my past 3 pc games but like you said this is the console section, btw where are the master chef can beat up samus/snake threads.:beer:


P.S. I know chief is spelled this way, I was just making fun of normal console forums.;)

You CAN buy PC games cheaper than $49.99... but that doesn't mean it's the retail price. Hell.. I only paid 38.99 for the 360 version of Call of Duty 4... that doesn't make it an industry standard.

Warcraft III was 49.99. Warcraft II was 49.99. The original Warcraft might have been 39.99. But that was over ten years ago. (I would know because I was working retail about 15 years ago.)

[Dionysos]

I think I was one of the last people here to stop hating (after all the MS 360 issues). I no longer had anything to hate on. I hated Sony because their quality on the PS1 and PS2 were shoddy. I hated MS after the 360 quality debacle and I hated Nintendo for releasing something with such fun gameplay but weak graphics and a crapton of shoddy games.

Fact is that I'm a gamer, have been for over 20 years and the will likely buy every system that comes out until the day I did (just like I have the last 20 years). The only platform I've dropped is the PC.

I'm not hating on any system, I own all 3 current consoles (in my sig). I was just joking about how you can go into a console only forum and read the stupid threads, where as here there is good discussion about topics that are thoughtful and well researched. This is one of the smartest console forums I've seen in along time. Sorry if my joke went over your head or you think I'm here just to troll cause I'm not.

*Pulling tail between my legs and going to the corner*:(

[FudgeNuggets]

I'm not hating on any system, I own all 3 current consoles (in my sig). I was just joking about how you can go into a console only forum and read the stupid threads, where as here there is good discussion about topics that are thoughtful and well researched. This is one of the smartest console forums I've seen in along time. Sorry if my joke went over your head or you think I'm here just to troll cause I'm not.

*Pulling tail between my legs and going to the corner*:(

Well that was rather condescending.......

and believe me, we've been through the fanboy bickering......ad nauseum

[VinnyTAMU]

This is one of the smartest console forums I've seen in along time.

I believe it is that way because of the top notch moderators we have on these forums and their diligence at keeping discussions civil.

[rainless]

I believe it is that way because of the top notch moderators we have on these forums and their diligence at keeping discussions civil.

Moderaters? I thought we just had a bot... ;)