Tualatin decision PIII or Celeron

[zoopa_man]

Hey, College has had me busy as a dog. Now that the semester is over I"M BACK hehehehe

And my project for the month of January is upgrading my system. Thought I would run it by you and ask for one piece of advice. I know for sure I want to get a Asus TUSL2-C board but for a processor I'm not sure yet. I'm split between a celeron 1.2Ghz Tualatin or a PIII ?Ghz Tualatin chip.

I see split decisions between The PIII users and the 1.2 cele users form the previous posts. Now I'm wondering how the cele compares to the PIII's. Has anyone felt disappointed in geting the cele at all and wish you had gone PIII or are you very happy with the cele's ?

From a Technical stand point the only difference that I see it the FSB ; 133 PIII and 100 for the Cele's

I know for sure I'll be overclocking the chip that I buy. Got to make that watercooling system pay it's self off :D so cooling for either chip won't be an issue. And FSB overclocking is nothing new to me, worked on my current PIII 733 and have had it overclocked before.

So......What do you think ??? PIII or Celeron Tualatin???

[Flu!d]

Due to the fact that Intel has discontinued the desktop P3 Tualatin range the only P3 Tualatin you can get is the 1.26 gig Server chip which is very expensive for a small gain in peformance...

'Bang for buck' The Tualatin based Celeron can't be beat! Basically....It is a P3.

I love my Celeron @ 1.5 gig with 256k ATC and data prefetch!! It flies!

[ol' man]

I wouldn;t get the TUSL2 if you get the 1.2GHz celeron. Do a search why! This topic is covered about once a week. The GB or ABIT boards would be better choices.

[oldfart]

I wouldn't get a 1.2. Too risky getting to 1.6 IMHO. The 1.0A or 1.1A are better (safer) bets.

[MilkPowder-2]

Originally posted by oldfart
I wouldn't get a 1.2. Too risky getting to 1.6 IMHO. The 1.0A or 1.1A are better (safer) bets.

Exactly...... :)

[zoopa_man]

Thank You a million times over. This is why I asked here before I jumped on what I thought was a sweet deal. You guys know more about what’s good and bad then anyone else. I trust you guys.. Thanks. I'll have to put out the fire in my pocket for a little while longer and keep looking around for something good. I want to do a successful overclock...Just been away for a while and so many new chips have come out since I've been around I don't know what direction to go. LOL Thanks for keeping me on the road...I'll search on and re-evaluate my decision on the board and that chip...Ooooo decisions decisions but I’d rather know then waste my money. thank you again...

Any suggestions on something new...help me spend my money. LOL everyone loves to do that. :beer:

[funnyperson1]

My suggestion is an Abit ST6 for 80$ and a Celeron1.0A which should easily do 1.5 at 150 fsb which would be better than a 1.2 at 1550 because of memory/agp/pci/eveything bandwith......and if you feel lucky id aim for 1666 at which point you could be crushing 1600+ atherlons....even with DDR

[zoopa_man]

Did my reading...your right...the TUSL2 is a bad choice...no pic divider..YUCK

The Tulatin Celerons still look like a good choice so I was half right. Just need to decide which one now...People are recomending the 1.0A chip over the 1.2 chip....WHY ???? I need reasons.
My brain says:
1.0a 10x150fsb = 1.500mhz
1.2 12x130fsb = 1550mhz

so why the 1.0a Is it just a better overclocker then the 1.2 or what ????

And motherboard....Gigabyte just makes my stomache roll..The one I have now is a horrible overclockers....have they improved that much ?? The ABIT ST6 seems more apealing only for that reason...both have my 1/5 and 1/4 PCI divisor that i'm looking for now...so if you had my money....which combo and WHY ?

[Flu!d]

Nothin' wrong with my Gigabyte....I 'am' noticing more and more people having trouble with the St-6's and the 1/4 pci divider / RAM speed to FSB ratio lately though....

They're both great boards! Have fun choosing....

[Yodums]

Originally posted by zoopa_man
Did my reading...your right...the TUSL2 is a bad choice...no pic divider..YUCK

The Tulatin Celerons still look like a good choice so I was half right. Just need to decide which one now...People are recomending the 1.0A chip over the 1.2 chip....WHY ???? I need reasons.
My brain says:
1.0a 10x150fsb = 1.500mhz
1.2 12x130fsb = 1550mhz

so why the 1.0a Is it just a better overclocker then the 1.2 or what ????

And motherboard....Gigabyte just makes my stomache roll..The one I have now is a horrible overclockers....have they improved that much ?? The ABIT ST6 seems more apealing only for that reason...both have my 1/5 and 1/4 PCI divisor that i'm looking for now...so if you had my money....which combo and WHY ?

Gigabyte doesn't seem like a good brand but I think they changed their ways since before I hesitated about asking my dad to make me a money order to buy a Gigabyte slotket since I thought they had no quality.

But the 1.0 and 1.1 Celeron-T just has been released I don't know where people that it kicks to 1.5.

Personally I like Abit and the 1.2 Tualatin seems to be a guaranteed 1.5 and 1/4 dividers like you want.

To 1.6 you'll need the vid pin mod if you don't have balls fine 1.5gig is cool and only 100mhz difference I'd be happy.

I'd take Abit ST6+1.2 Celeron+Some good HSF combo.

My 0.02

[ol' man]

Originally posted by Flu!d
Nothin' wrong with my Gigabyte....I 'am' noticing more and more people having trouble with the St-6's and the 1/4 pci divider / RAM speed to FSB ratio lately though....

They're both great boards! Have fun choosing....

Well a few of them have been with the raid boards at 125fsb's and a 1/4 divider. The others seem to be where they are supposed to be divider wise cause you cannot run a 46MHz PCI unless you have a HD on METH!

If you are going to go over 133fsb then the more expensive ASUS may be okay then but not under133fsb(really 134fsb). That is why you would want to get a different MOBO if you were going to go with the 1.2Ghz. You want those dividers under 125fsb. WIth the 1.0A or 1.1A you would definatly hit 133FSB and better I would assume.

[oldfart]

1.0a 10x150fsb = 1.500mhz
1.1a 11x136fsb = 1.500mhz
1.2 12x130fsb = 1550mhz

My take:

1.2 @ 1550 @ 130 FSB is cool as long as you have a board with a 1/4 PCI @ < 133 FSB like an ST6. 130/4 = 32.5 PCI. If you don't have that feature, 130/3 = 43.3 PCI...not good.

1.0A @ 1.5 GHz will have a 150 MHz bus which should outperform a 130 MHz FSB. You have to have decent ram for this setup. The 37.5 MHz PCI is not far enough out of spec to be a problem.

1.1 @ 1.5 is a 136 MHz FSB. Also a nice setup. If you don't have great ram, this may be the setup for you.

These are all good setups, just a bit different in the fine details.

I'm taking a chance on the Gigabyte board. I've never owned one, and have no exp with them. I usually use ASUS (on a CUSL2 right now). The CUSL2 has been the best mobo I ever owned. I run a PIII 1 G @ 150FSB, 1125 MHz. I had an ASUS P3BF before that. The feature set looks really good on the Gigabyte. I'm hoping it will meet my expectations. If it doesn't you'll hear about it (believe me).

[Yodums]

I finally opened my eyes and see why the 1.0a maybe a better choice.

If getting to 1.5gig is a definte on those chips they would require higher bus speeds.

Higher bus speeds meaning running faster as the the newer chipsets will utilize DDR ram so DDR ram will kick in to a near 166fsb or so.

[Flu!d]

Gigabyte doesn't seem like a good brand but I think they changed their ways since before I hesitated about asking my dad to make me a money order to buy a Gigabyte slotket since I thought they had no quality

I don't get it! In the past Gigabyte have had a reputation for not allowing many overclocking options via the bios mainly due to the fact that a great deal of their mobo's go to OEM's for use in Aptiva's and such. But never have I heard of Gigabyte having a reputation of poor quality....In fact I have heard the oppisite and the fact that OEM's use their products in their systems can only say two things....Good price and good quality!

However times have changed for Gigabyte and this 'xet' i'm using ATM is 'very' overclocker friendly!

[zoopa_man]

Okies......As of right now this is my intended setup......

GIGABYTE GA-6OXET-C FCPGA INTEL 815EP PC133 FSB 133 W/O AUDIO 4USB -$84.70


CPU INTEL CELERON 1200MHZ FCPGA 256K CACHE OEM VERSION SOCKE -$104.00


Good Bad Otherwises ? I like it. In my price range and the celeron is the cheapest 1.2ghz 256k cache OEM chip that I could find on PriceWatch. I decided to give gigabyte a shot...like the idea of NOT doing the voltage mods.

I do want the 256K cache celeron and not the 128k cache Celeron right...or does this make a difference in overclocking ?? Help me out on this one...i'm in the blue here.

[Yodums]

Originally posted by Flu!d


I don't get it! In the past Gigabyte have had a reputation for not allowing many overclocking options via the bios mainly due to the fact that a great deal of their mobo's go to OEM's for use in Aptiva's and such. But never have I heard of Gigabyte having a reputation of poor quality....In fact I have heard the oppisite and the fact that OEM's use their products in their systems can only say two things....Good price and good quality!

However times have changed for Gigabyte and this 'xet' i'm using ATM is 'very' overclocker friendly!

So basically what you said is what I did in the past.

GB didn't seem to be like a good overclocking brand as you mentioned since they were basically OEM, and that will make me think that since no overclocking then they have no good product that can overclock well like the slotket.

[Yodums]

Originally posted by zoopa_man
Okies......As of right now this is my intended setup......

GIGABYTE GA-6OXET-C FCPGA INTEL 815EP PC133 FSB 133 W/O AUDIO 4USB -$84.70


CPU INTEL CELERON 1200MHZ FCPGA 256K CACHE OEM VERSION SOCKE -$104.00


Good Bad Otherwises ? I like it. In my price range and the celeron is the cheapest 1.2ghz 256k cache OEM chip that I could find on PriceWatch. I decided to give gigabyte a shot...like the idea of NOT doing the voltage mods.

I do want the 256K cache celeron and not the 128k cache Celeron right...or does this make a difference in overclocking ?? Help me out on this one...i'm in the blue here.

Very good setup but don't forget a good heatsink.

DUDE!
Your getting an OEM chip? Did you get the lastest scoop about them? Their Phillipine chips and they overclock better than retail chips since your not increasing the voltage much to get to 1.5 and you'll probably get to 1.6 with it.

Nice shot.
The cache will make much of a difference or I suppose as well as the new core since those new T Core will kick any P3 coppermine core around.

[oldfart]

Why the 1.2? Its the most expensive and the most troublesome to overclock. You should go with the 1.1 or 1.0 for reasons I posted above. I got a box retail 1.0A for $85.

[zoopa_man]

Yes I am aware that the OEM (Philippine) chips overclock better then the Retail chips (Mayla) Thus going for OEM and hoping for a Philippine chip


Reason for the 1.2 is mainly for the lower FSB speeds. I know i'll have several PCI devices in my PC and one of them is bound to be a trouble maker with the higher Bus speed on the PCI bus...thus I want to keep the Bus speed down as low as I can...the 12x mult on the 1.2 chip will allow me to do that and the gigabyte board will give me the 1/4 and 1/5 pci divisor to manage my PCI bus speeds.

Am I correct here ?

[ol' man]

Originally posted by oldfart
Why the 1.2? Its the most expensive and the most troublesome to overclock. You should go with the 1.1 or 1.0 for reasons I posted above. I got a box retail 1.0A for $85.

I would like to find a 1.0A Philli chip though.

[oldfart]

What are your plans? How high of an overclock? The 1.1 @ 133 FSB will have everything exactly in spec. This will get you to 1463. For me, I want a setup that will definitely make it to 133 FSB minimum. Too big a risk with the C1.2.

[Flu!d]

The 1.2 is by no means 'more troublesome' to overclock....In fact it's probably better due to the fact that the FSB is right in spec @ 1.6 gig. The difference is that the 1.0 or 1.1 ghz varaties will do the same speed on a higher FSB thus adding to their peformance....Won't nessecarily hit 1.6 gig 'easier' though....

[oldfart]

Yeah, its in spec IF you get to 1.6. That is an awful big IF isn't it??

[Flu!d]

Oh yeah....:)

[zoopa_man]

Originally posted by oldfart
What are your plans? How high of an overclock? The 1.1 @ 133 FSB will have everything exactly in spec. This will get you to 1463. For me, I want a setup that will definitely make it to 133 FSB minimum. Too big a risk with the C1.2.


I see the light now...and why the 1.1a is maybe a better choice over the 1.2 And you hit the nail right on the head, I want to make it to 133 FSB anything less is just too slow anymore.

The 1.1 @ 136FSB will give me my 1500 and a PCI speed that's not too far out of spec. 34mhz

With the 1.2 @ 133FSB gives 1596 and pci 33 perfect.....But you say it's a big IF GRrrrrrr

If that's the case and 133 is a big IF with the 1.2 I'm going to snoop around for a 1.1 tonight and see what comes up. I'm not ready to drop the cash on the table just yet

Thank You for your input...keep it coming...I appreciate your knowledge to help me make and educated buy.

That voo doo lady with the chicken bones knows nothing about overclocking. LMAO

[oldfart]

I'm just not much of a gambler. Some people get the 1.2 to 1.6, many dont. I'd go with the sure thing. BTW, even the 1.0A @ 1500 has a 37.5 PCI bus. Not far enough out to cause a problem. You will need decent ram though. If you want 1.5 with a PCI bus as close to spec as possible, the 1.1 is the one for you.

[ol' man]

Originally posted by oldfart
I'm just not much of a gambler. Some people get the 1.2 to 1.6, many dont. I'd go with the sure thing. BTW, even the 1.0A @ 1500 has a 37.5 PCI bus. Not far enough out to cause a problem. You will need decent ram though. If you want 1.5 with a PCI bus as close to spec as possible, the 1.1 is the one for you.

This is why you want the 1.0A to hit 160fsb. :D So you can use the GA-60XET's 1/5 divider to give a 32MHz PCI;)

[zoopa_man]

160FSB Is fun to say. LOL :D

In reality I got one good Micron pc133 chip 256mb and two generic chips pc133 one 32 and one 64 (This is what happens when ram prices are outrageous and then cheep. Paid the same for my 64 as my 256 :( ) TO tell the truth I don't know that the generic ones will make anything over 133 It's a miracle they can do that speed.

So...If I wanted to go 160FSB i'd need to buy some pc150 or some good 133 and hope it preforms at 150 (which is all a 150 chip is. a 133 that is stable at 150, yes ? ) Another gable in any event....I'm like you Odl fart...not a gambler...Water in my computer is gambleing enough, LOL

So right now the 1.1 is still looking like the option for me. Just got back form Wal-Mart so havn't checked Price Watch yet...but i'll post lowest prices for the 1.1 and I think I allready posted for the 1.2 So we can do some comparing..and maybe some point and laughing too about who paid too much :beer:

[oldfart]

This is why you want the 1.0A to hit 160fsb. So you can use the GA-60XET's 1/5 divider to give a 32MHz PCI
ol' man, I'll be testing that out and will let you know.

[zoopa_man]

Originally posted by oldfart

ol' man, I'll be testing that out and will let you know.



160 FSB PWHohahahahaha God I love saying that. :burn:


Anyway.... How soon will you be testing that because I am VERY interested in how you do...and even in how close you get. If I were rich I'd get all three chips. But that's a big IF and the same kind I don't want to end up realizing when I make a decision on a chip. Test away and let me know how you fare...I just realized that my PIII 733 will run on the gigabyte board I intend on buying...so I can spare my self some time and get the new board and not the chip yet. Will soften the blow on my wallet and give me a chance to shoot for 825 again with my PIII 733 (5.5X 150FSB) Will also tell me if My RAM and PCI devices can run at those speeds.....More I think about this the more I like it...But on the other hand the PIII 733 dosn't overclock as well as a cereron I would think. Mmmmmmm still might try it though.




microx-press.com cele 1.1 256k (retail :( want OEM) $115

microx-press.com cele 1.2 256k (also reail) $121

Just for kicks :

PIII 1.26 512k (retail ) $285 (I'll take three :beer: )

[oldfart]

With any luck, I'll be setting it up tomorrow.

Right now I run a PIII 1 G, 150 FSB, 1125 MHz on a CUSL2 and 512 meg of Crucial PC133 7ns. It runs 150 FSB 100% stable with the ram @ 3-2-2. It will run 160 3-3-3 (never tried 3-3-2). My nic doesn't like 40 MHz PCI, but I have a couple others lying around I can try. With the 1/5 PCI, I should be good anyways.

I'm not an overclocking maniac like some people around here <cough> ol' man <cough>. 1.5 GHz will be fine for me. I'll try for 1.6 just to see if it can do it. If it takes too much voltage to do it, I'll back off.

[MaxFSB]

>>are supposed to be divider wise cause you cannot run a >>46MHz PCI unless you have a HD on METH!

LMAO at HD on METH! Good one ol'man....

Well I turned my Cel 1.2 into a keychain today when I tried to pelt it, d@mn... must have used too much force trying to get the HS/fan to hook up with the socket tabs. Scratched the top layer and broke a trace. Ordering a 1.0A tonight... got 512MB of 150FSB 222 SDRAM so will be going for 1500 at 150FSB. Never was able to get 1600 stable under Prime95 at 1.6V, temps too high which is why I was trying to pelt it. I will be real happy with 1500 at 150FSB at 1.6V or lower, nice and cool and quiet. Keep you posted when the new 1.0A gets here. Anyone else with 1.0A, 1.1A, 1.2, or 1.3 cellys keep us posted with your OC results.

[zoopa_man]

Welcome to the forms MaxFSB

Sorry to hear about the chip getting crushed. Happens to all of us at one point or another. I killed a PIII 800 with and ORB AGGG

In any event. I posted some prices that I found on price watch. I searched ebay too and only found Retail chips made in malay = not as overclockable so I hear. $99 cele 1.1 128k retail boxed ebay

Other then that welcome the forms again, your input will be very valuable to all of us.

[Flu!d]

Those damn Golden Orbs with the 'twist lock' system....Geez they sucked! Still got one here....Tried to use it once, a few years ago, but gave up - too risky, didn't want to damage my chip!

[oldfart]

1.1 128K is NOT the CPU you want! That is a Celeron Coppermine, not Tualatin. You want a 1.1 256K CPU.

[zoopa_man]

Originally posted by oldfart
1.1 128K is NOT the CPU you want! That is a Celeron Coppermine, not Tualatin. You want a 1.1 256K CPU.

Yah I know I know.....Ooopsies on my part. Girl friend is trying to help now. LMAO I thought we discussed this before...Computers or Women never mix both. LOL Now that she's gone home....brain works again.

Back to being serious...i'm having a hell of a time finding an OEM celeron 1.1 256k chip. Found only two retail box ones. The majority are the 1.2 cele's Maybe i'll have to wait for the computer show this month ???? There I can look righ at the CPU and see Malay or Phill Hehehehe PWHOhahahahaha not a bad idea...If I can't find one that's a definate online.