Dudes, help me w/ oc'ing

[Dabljuh]

Ok, I finally put my system in the siggie. My prob looks like this. I bought a sys a month or two ago and I dont seem to be able to get it the cpu at a reasonable speed... (Seem to stuck at 1.6+ghz)

thats the CPU, an Athlon XP 1600+ AGKGA Y. here's the complete scripture

AX1600DMT3C
AGKGA 0131MPMW
Y6809350703

First I replaced the bull**** fan (the only one I could get at this time) with a swifty. Hard to get around here. I finally reached 153x10.5 (1.61 GHZ)

I found that I should attempt to unlock the cpu. I learned that conductive silver lacque is illegal in this country. Bad. I tried a lot of different stuff, including a self-made paste of graphite and acrylic lacque, nothing worked. Finally I went to foreign and bought conductive silver stuff. (hell of an expense). back home, i spent two days painting the cpu. during various mispaintings, I went through almost any multiplier possible, but was never able to change it. I decided that the mobo was the reason, and have an unlocked xp at a multi of 10 at around 160mhz fsb. Anything higher would make the system unstable.

Because I had great trouble on the 5V line, including random reboots and voltages dropping below 4.7 and stuff, I bought me a nice Enermax 431. Plus a case. once again, hell of an expense. The system looks good now, and the 5V is really dream-like, but I DONT GET HIGHER THAN BEFORE. The sys is somewhat more stable now since the old 300W PSU was really exhausted, but I'm still at a max of 163 mhz fsb x 10...

Its not the ram. Setting it to 133:100 ratio wouldnt help. Its not the graphics card, since no matter what multiplier I set, the cpu stops working correctly at 1.6 ghz. Its neither anything else. Its the CPU.

The point is - I got a very expensive Swifty on it. I got a great PSU, and a case temp equal ambient temp + 2°C. CPU temp never exceedes 40°C. At 1.75V, its stable up to 1.6ghz, but when I go as high as 1.64, the voltage demands skyrocket to a point where I would need a voltage mod on the mobo - and at this rate, (from 1.75 at 1.6 ghz to 1.85 at 1.64 ghz) a volt mod (to 2.1V) would bring me probably a speed of 1.7 ghz - This is by far not worth the risk and trouble of volt-modding the board.

So can anyone tell me what I'm doing wrong? This cant just be, I read somewhere the exact stepping I got would be one of the best to overclock - up to 1.75 ghz w/o volt modding. I do not believe in luck (being given a "bad" cpu wouldnt be called luck, though) so what am I doing wrong?

Right now, I run it with 163x10 - everything is running fine (sound, network, graphic), but not being able to clock higher really ****es me on. This is the second post where I ask for help, the first one was because of the PSU - when I was told that a PSU would improve my situation. It did, but not as much as I hoped...

[bobt17]

have u tried setting your multiplier back to 10.5 and then pushing the fsb since u got your swifty? that is a very high fsb and the board just might not take any higher

[Dabljuh]

After I recieved the swifty, I had my multi at 10.5 - It went to 153x10.5=1610 mhz. Stable though, but not wanting to go higher. I only managed to lower the multi when I got silver lacquer - which has helped overall performance, but not CPU performance... now its 163x10=1.63 ghz - and is basically the same as when I got the multi at 10.5.

However, its like this:
up to 1.6 ghz @ 1.75V stable
1.61 ghz @ 1.775V stable
1.62 ghz @ 1.8V stable
1.63 ghz @ 1.825V stable
1.64 ghz @1.85V stable
1.65 ghz not stable

This is what sickens me

[bobt17]

here (http://www.ocinside.de/html/workshop/socketa/xp_painting.html) is an xp painting guide if u want to try some different multipliers

[Dabljuh]

I know the guide - though I'm afraid of cutting lines, which I had to.

What I basically did to gain multi of 10 instead of 10.5 was - I simply closed _all_ the L3 bridges - while that's not a legit multiplier according to the painting guide, the actual multiplier is 10 now - and having 160x10 is better than 153x10.5 performance-wise. But I want more!!!

[PsYko420]

Hehehe lol
with that xp painting i got an oc up to 20480mhz =]

[Hoot]

I'll wade in on this because Dablijuh PM'ed me asking for adviuce.

First off, getting 1630 out of a CPU rated for 1400 Mhz is an excellent accomplishment. These XPs don't overclock the same percentage like the venerable Tbird 1.0G AXIA Y CPUs do. Just because someone else, or even several other people have managed to get better does not belittle your accomplishment. There are just too many variables in the overclocking success equation to get upset over the fact that someone else has done better than you. In my own setup, using an XP 1800, I have barely been able to do better and I paid a lot more for that 1800! Though I can push it to 12.5x140, it is right on the edge of stable. Instead, I run it at 12x140 most of the time and that is well within its "sweet zone", not to mention my PSU is a lot happier not having to run at its upper limits. With my older KT133A motherboards, there is some problem getting the FSB to run stable, with an XP, in excess of 140 Mhz. If I could, I would gladly drop the multiplier. I envy you being able to get 163 Mhz FSB to run stable on your setup. When my KK266+ arrives in a few days, I will see how much higher I can get my FSB to run.

Believe me. In my personal experiences with overclocking. With my understanding of the interelationship of the variables effecting it. There have been countless performance boasts I have seen that astound me and many that are pure Bullsh*t. Some people guage their own self-worth by their ability to impress others with unsubstantiable claims of accomplishment. If it makes them feel better, then I am happy for them. However, I don't allow them to make me feel worse about my accomplishments. Don't take me wrong on this. There are many people who I sincerely believe can and have done better than me at overclocking. Nevertheless, knowing that I have been thorough in my approach and working within my monetary limits, I am very satisfied with what I have achieved. Do I go to sleep at night, sometimes mulling over a stumbling point? Sure, but it has grown less and less consuming than when I first started. At some point, it sinks in that there is simply nothing I can ponder, or accomplish, in overclocking, that has not been pondered or accomplished already. So why agonize over it to the point of distress. Just enjoy getting there.

73, Hoot

[mEKbOY]

Very well said Hoot. The the key thing is to many variables. There is never a one set formula for overclocking.

[Dabljuh]

I see your point Hoot. You say that I have reached a good Overclock, an over-the-average high FSB resulting in an overall good performance. You say that I should not worry about my Core speed being "only" 1.63 ghz. I see and I see how you are right.

But then again, when looking at my system, using it, feeling it, smelling it, I think there's something fishy. Normally, I would have reached 1.6ghz and said, wow, nice overclock, let me get back to my life. But I feel there is still something inside that would let me unleash an even bigger portion of power inside my system. The fact that cpus with the same stepping averaged 150mhz more core speed on a website test only strengthens that feeling.

It is the entire behaviour of the overclock that makes me think - I didnt have to do anything to reach 1.6ghz. All I did is putting a real cooler on it. i could increase FSB after painting the L1 and L3 bridges, and still didnt get more than 1.6ghz. I am still not able to change the multiplier - though the XP is unlocked. Its the strange and inconsistent behaviour of the OC when I go beyond 1.6 ghz. Its not a slow and persistent degrading stability, its an aprupt break after 1.6ghz.

All these things make me feel that I have forgot one variable of those many that lead to an successful overclock.

Tonight, I will unscrew the whole beast, check everything, repaint the bridges, do it all until I get what I want.

A speed that makes my feeling of wasted powers go away. I hoped to get some answers to these problems, so I could reach that goal faster than with neverending Trial-and-error. Maybe I am going to find these answers here, but now, I have no other chance than to start from scratch.

Thank you hoot for honoring this thread with your answer. You are legitimately one great character in this community. And I am just a nut that cannot stop halfway.

Just a little story aside: I have an old P2 around, originally running at 400 I had it run at 450 now for years. Just today I realized the reason why I couldnt go to 500 was all the time the ram - not the cpu. Now I have replaced the outdated ram and have my 500mhz now - a speed I would not have believed to reach with this cpu 2 years ago.

[Tiger]

A very sobering insight into this hobby of ours Hoot. Just one thing Hoot didn't mention and that is patience. If there is one thing I have learned over the past several months working with these AMD procs is that they mature well providing they are not abused. So with some care and patience you may still achieve your goal. Some interesting reading can be found here;
http://people.freenet.de/s.urfer/conditioning.htm

[Dabljuh]

But now can see

I have unscrewed every single bit of my PC. I have tested it and tested, severally times repainted the L1 bridges until I figured out that the Palomino/Athlon jumper on my board were a mistype. Finally I have my unlocked XP, and full control over multiplier. Unlike other sources saying, the POST message still is the original 1600XP on my system, but WCPUID and other programs verified that I am running at the multipliers I selected.

So I could test my system under all kinds of multipliers and FSBs. I now know these things for sure

- At an FSB of 168, my ram stops working correctly. Can fix by selecting less agressive timings.
- At an FSB of 170, my GFX card stops working. Cant fix, no Vio voltage on my board available
- At an FSB of 165, everything on the Mobo is running at its best
- The CPU did however crash at speeds higher than 1650 mhz, no matter what FSB is set.

For I have tested and painted so long (I had to unscrew EVERYTHING! Damn Swiftech) I finally had the Idea. The arctic winter here in europe came me to help, I took the bare mobo+peripherals outside (-10°C) and turned the thing on. Finally! I was able to breach 1.7 ghz core speed!

I realized, that after having bought the Swiftech, I thought I could forget about CPU cooling for a long long time, I thought my Mobo and my PSU were hindering me from clocking higher.

Now I am falling back to the hard truth of overclocking:
Every OC is only as good as the cooling.

Now while I'm kinda disappointed that the Swifty which costed me 140$ plus a long train ride wouldnt do more, I now know where I have to pack the gorilla.

It all comes down to cooling.

I also realize how much this new case has helped me - It keeps my mobo temperature lower than when I have it on a piece of paper on the ground. I love my system, and I'm thinking about getting some real cooling placed on it, to reach the speeds I want.

Tips appreciated.

btw, I'm now back at my old 163x10 setup, proven to be the best on my system.

[bobt17]

sounds like u are ready for water cooling :) i know thats what i am getting now that i reached 1.6ghz with my 1500+ with air

[Dabljuh]

Hmm... Do you know If one can put a Vapochill system into an existing case? I'd love to have liquid nitrogen cooling, but I dont want to give up my case...

[praetor2k2]

can the xp's be overclocked much?

[Hoot]

Originally posted by praetor2k2
can the xp's be overclocked much?

A lot depends upon your motherboard. I have two motherboards that are excellent overclockers of Tbirds, but with my XP they did not yield as good an overclock as I've read from others. The best I can get out of my XP 1800 (1.535 Ghz) is 1.755 Ghz (17%).

Now that the XPs have been out long enough to yield good statistics, they appear to follow a close parallel to the higher speed Tbirds.

The Tbird 1.0, 1.2, 1.33 and 1.4Ghz all top out around 1.6Ghz, without extreme cooling measures. The difference being the amount of core voltage needed to get there. The XP 1.33, 1.4, 1.47, 1.53 and 1.59Ghz all top out around 1.75 Ghz, without extreme cooling measures. The difference being the amount of core voltage needed to get there.

With the upcoming die shrink to .13 microns, we'll probably see yet another line of CPUs that will eventually follow the Tbird and XP parallel.

This is all just my opinion.

73, Hoot

[Jeniva]

Originally posted by PsYko420
Hehehe lol
with that xp painting i got an oc up to 20480mhz =]


wow...20.48GHZ..I think you had a major mis type there......im suprised no one else caught this...

[scorpion4life2]

Dude, once you unlock your xp you will not see those high fsb's anymore. I am at 141fsb 13x on a xp 1800. I did volt mods and could get 2.2 volts max but it did not help any.It's funny but today I finally realized that 1765 is were i am going to stay at. I could squeeze no more out of this chip. Sure I could get to the desktop at 1.833 but anything above where I am at presently crashes on sandras burn in wizard. I will not fool myself into believing it is stable when it is not. Sure it ****es me off but what can you do? It is what it is.I have no idea how some people get d
amn near double their speed. OK, OK i'm hating :mad: a little .Point is, be happy if you get more than a 200 mhz increase, it really is a great accomplishment. Think of how many people burn their chips up by just trying;)