Looking to add to my loop

[1Kurgan1]

I recently picked up a http://www.crazypc.com/products/h20-220-compact-93720.html

This is my first time trying WC so I liked how the pump was integrated into the CPU block saving me a lot of room and the resivore built into the radiator also saved me a ton of room. I haven't installed it yet, now my question is I would like to add my 4850 to the loop. I was thinking I might need to pick up another at least 120 rad to add it in, but would probably go with a 220.

But would it be possible to run this setup and just add the 4850 into the loop or would I need another rad. And also how much is this pump really capable of? Could it do 2 rads, CPU, and GPU? Or 1 rad, CPU, GPU?

Any advice would be fantastic.:beer:

[billb]

Adding a video card to that system will tax it's capabilities.

Your question about what the pump is capable of is rather strange. A pump will pump water through pretty much anything you hook up to it, but the more things you hookup, the lower the flow rate will be and the lower the flow rate the less effective each of the components will be.

What you want to do is to find out how much heat (in watts) is generated by the things you want to cool. Then determine the flow rate you will get with the components you have chosen. Once you know the flow rate then you can calculate how much heat each component will add to the system (blocks) or remove from the system (rads). If the calculations show that the components won't remove enough heat then you need bigger/better components, a higher flow rate pump or more/better fans, or a combination these.

[relttem]

Adding a video card to that system will tax it's capabilities.

Your question about what the pump is capable of is rather strange. A pump will pump water through pretty much anything you hook up to it, but the more things you hookup, the lower the flow rate will be and the lower the flow rate the less effective each of the components will be.

What you want to do is to find out how much heat (in watts) is generated by the things you want to cool. Then determine the flow rate you will get with the components you have chosen. Once you know the flow rate then you can calculate how much heat each component will add to the system (blocks) or remove from the system (rads). If the calculations show that the components won't remove enough heat then you need bigger/better components, a higher flow rate pump or more/better fans, or a combination these.

that's on the right track, but your heat in is going to equal your heat out. First law of Thermodynamics. If it doesn't, then you have a runaway system and things will get hot or cold(which is impossible). But, since those radiators are pretty much overkill, if you overheat the water with that radiator something is wrong with the pump or your line/block is clogged or your radiator fans aren't working. Your pump will stop working due to the pressure drop. So, if you put too many things in the loop the pump won't generate enough pressure-head to pump it through everything due to the pressure loss in the components/Rad(s)/Tube. You can usually find out how much heat those components release by looking around the web. You also have to remember that your water system is probably going to pick up 70% of that on a really good day. The rest of it is lost to the air, or into the board etc. So, add up your chip, video card, and whatever else you want to cool..multiply that by .7 and you will have the amount of heat your water system needs to remove, which also needs to be less than the maximum amount of heat your radiator can remove (radiator will be rated for a certain amount of heat). But, that goes back to the radiator being overkill anyway. Then, you can get your pump's MASS flow rate, mdot, and figure out what temperature drop your radiator is going to have to provide by using:

Q(this is the total watts INTO the system) = mdot*Cp(of cooling liquid which is usually VERY VERY close to water)*(T2-T1)(which is the difference between the temp leaving(T2) and entering(T1) either the block or the rad).

That will give you a good ballpark number. Now, knowing that your radiator will NEVER cool the water lower than the surrounding air temp, you can assume that to be T1 and solve for T2, which will be close to the temp leaving the block. This is all BALLPARK.. it is neglecting losses in the tubes etc, and assuming a few things. But, it will get you close.

[1Kurgan1]

Your question about what the pump is capable of is rather strange. A pump will pump water through pretty much anything you hook up to it, but the more things you hookup, the lower the flow rate will be and the lower the flow rate the less effective each of the components will be.

The pump in this setup is only 300LPH where as most are 500LPH. So what I mean by will this pump be enough or how much can this pump handle is. Is how much can I add on before this pump doesn't have the power to get the coolant through that much tubing.

You can usually find out how much heat those components release by looking around the web.

Where exactly, I could find out how hot my videocard/processor run by reading a review, but these are pretty much all done with air cooling and will give the temp of the card with the cooler on there which I would assume I would need something different.

[supra]

Check psu calculators, they'll at least get you in the right ballpark. iirc a 4850 uses about 95 watts

[1Kurgan1]

you will have the amount of heat your water system needs to remove, which also needs to be less than the maximum amount of heat your radiator can remove (radiator will be rated for a certain amount of heat).

I can't seem to find what my rad can remove heatwise, checked reviews, the website, all instructions, and the box and no info on that.

Check psu calculators, they'll at least get you in the right ballpark. iirc a 4850 uses about 95 watts

So when checking hw much heat something puts out you wouldn't go by a temp, but rather how much wattage it uses?

[relttem]

watts is a measure of energy, which translates into heat. But, the hotter it is getting the more Watts it is expelling. Back to the first law of thermo; Energyin = Energyout. If you look at your power supply, that will tell you the MAXIMUM amount of power you can put into your entire computer system. But, not all of that is going to your CPU..you have power going all over the place, (HD, lights, pumps, fans etc etc)..and then you lose a lot to the air, board - that is why only a fraction of the power is actually picked up by the water. Your radiator might be rated in terms of Temp, so if you know your dT (change in temp from inlet to outlet) you can figure out how many Watts it can remove, or if you know how many Watts you need to get rid of you can figure out what temperature requirements are going to be needed. ..I'd call them and ask the radiator is capable of.

[1Kurgan1]

This i what I found for stress test watt consumption, Oc'ing of course would change this so I should probably guess higher.
242 - videocard
256 - CPU

[Conumdrum]

Well, nice starter WC setup. It has potential. I saw a post/test that kinda came close to thermal load vs heat dissipated. It was done by putting the setup in liquid and how the temp increased was directly related to heat. It came pretty close to 90% of the electrical watts used. It's what I use for WC needs.

The rad on your setup is acceptable for a hot CPU, but adding a 4870 will increase your CPU temps somewhat, but decrease your GPU temps a lot. It's up to you if you think the CPU temp increase is worth the trouble.

Whats nice about your setup, that pump can accept an aftermarket top and be modded by a bit of soldering to a MCP355 pump. So thats umm $20 for the top.
http://www.petrastechshop.com/xsladdctop.html

I'd replace the rad with this, you can also use your older rad, but why when a 320 is enough. $60
http://www.petrastechshop.com/ptsulracomce.html

Of course another $30 for hose, barbs, Tfitting, clamps to move up to a better diameter hose.

Then the GPU block. I like FC blocks, but there are good GPU only blocks, you'll need heatsinks for the RAM and Vreg etc chips. Thats about another $80 max, better than $100++ for a FC block.

So, you can try the GPU block first with the same setup you have. See what you end up with. If not enough, then I gave you some decent options.

Ohh crap, just realized you'd have to replace the CPU block if you modded the pump. It's a full new setup except the pump, well thats $65 or so at least saved.

Try cooling the GPU, let us know.

Here is some real world thermal testing.
http://www.martinsliquidlab.com/SwiftechMCR320-Review.html
http://www.martinsliquidlab.com/SwiftechMCR220-Review.html

[relttem]

This i what I found for stress test watt consumption, Oc'ing of course would change this so I should probably guess higher.
242 - videocard
256 - CPU

that is CONSUMPTION..not the same as what the chip/videocard is giving off.

[1Kurgan1]

that is CONSUMPTION..not the same as what the chip/videocard is giving off.

Where exactly would I find out how much it is giving off?

[relttem]

I'd do 70% of that number for how much the water is going to have to pick up..other people might give you some other ideas.

[billb]

Swiftech MCR220 Rad testing (http://www.martinsliquidlab.com/SwiftechMCR220-Review.html) by Martin has what you need to know..