Linksys has a new name [Archive] - Overclockers Forums

gangaskan

01-21-09, 09:38 AM

FYI,
the product line of Linksys will now be known as Cisco Small Business Products.

expect to see cisco integrations into the Linksys product line, and hopefully we will see some nice, home products that have a lot of functionality also. :)

i highly doubt we'll see any CLI or IOS associated with the devices.

its still going to be web based, maybe some new features intergreated, but regardless, cisco aquired linksys in 2003, you would think by now they would have implmented such things if they wanted to?

the real reason they bought linksys is because they also wanted a HUGE market share in the Home office / SMB sector, but wanted a simple product to deliver to the end users.

could you imagine your typical joe six pack trying to setup a router via command line?

ppe1700

01-21-09, 12:18 PM

Hey who said anythoing about a cli? There won't be any cli. It will all be web based.
I just said hopefully we will see some decent home products. Because really what can you recommend for non techy people..

gangaskan

01-22-09, 07:36 AM

i know it will be all web based, but we'll see in time :) it wont be spectacular, becuase they will want to keep costs down to a minimal, but only time will tell!

Xaero_toast

01-24-09, 08:03 PM

Linksys is home user crap, well some of it.
I like it that way. Because it's crap, it's priced like crap. So you can buy it for the low price of crap, but a third-party firmware on it, and you've got a fan-damn-tastic router. I like a $50 router that does all kinds of things it was never designed to do.

pharoer

01-25-09, 12:41 AM

I like it that way. Because it's crap, it's priced like crap. So you can buy it for the low price of crap, but a third-party firmware on it, and you've got a fan-damn-tastic router. I like a $50 router that does all kinds of things it was never designed to do.

fan-damn-tastic software doesn't remedy that it's a craptasting hardware it runs on...

Xaero_toast

01-25-09, 01:04 AM

fan-damn-tastic software doesn't remedy that it's a craptasting hardware it runs on...

I have 4 linksys routers running ddwrt. One as router/access point, one as a dumb switch, and two as wireless bridges. The only reason the router and switch configured ones don't have 2+ years continuous uptime is that one power outage a few months ago that lasted 30 minutes longer than the UPS, and because firmware updates require reboots. Not bad for a $40 router. If that's "craptastic hardware", I'll take two, please.

Mr.Guvernment

01-25-09, 01:16 AM

fan-damn-tastic software doesn't remedy that it's a craptasting hardware it runs on...

it does sometimes, why the WRT54G has done so well.

Cheator

01-25-09, 02:21 AM

when it comes to crisco, software AND hardware are crap. there is no distinction.

ou_phidelt

01-25-09, 04:43 AM

I have always had good luck with Linksys products. My current WRT54GL running Tomato has been going strong for around a year now. I am planning on replacing it shortly with an N product likely the WRT310N or 160N(not looking for suggestions in this thread) For those of you that hate Linksys/Cisco what brand do you prefer for home use?

dfonda

01-25-09, 07:55 PM

I actually prefer Linksys. Modem lasted 5 years, Router has lasted 4. Went through 2 Motorola's in 2 years.

Preferred the stack ability of the older ones tho. The new models are not stack able in the same way.
The new n I have has the Cisco name on it.

Its a lot like when Datsun changed to Nissan...One name got smaller and the new one got bigger, then the old name disappeared.

mepis

01-25-09, 09:34 PM

I dont see any changes happening. As mentioned cisco has owned linksys for years.

I personally use only linksys products. But I only use a small home network setup. That being said I do have 3 routers in my house. I have a dlink downstairs running as the AP (only because it was free and the slight speed increase with wireless N is nice for transferring movies), and 2 wrt54g V8 acting as repeaters/bridges with DDWRT on it. One of those wrt54g routers has been around since early 2007 I think? The only reason it doesnt have constant uptime is from moving from one house to another, moving from one room to another, and one firmware update. Those are the only three times it has been rebooted since DDWRT was first installed a couple years back. To me this works well.

At the same time I used to be a Firedog in home tech, now Im just a FIREDog in home tech, and the amount of recalls I would see on netgear and dlink sub $100 crap was unreal. For the home user linksys/cisco leads the game.

whooping_a_panda

01-25-09, 10:20 PM

ill second the wrt54gl with tomato, best router ive ever had, also have an old linksys non wifi router and cable modem that have been trucking the daily routine for the last 7 years almost. They have theyre moments but they havnt ever died on me :D.

only linksys product ive ever had die on me was a router i can be blamed for killing (bad flash)

Mr.Guvernment

01-25-09, 10:41 PM

when it comes to crisco, software AND hardware are crap. there is no distinction.

I dont think so much that it is crap, but they just make it SO dam hard to learn or use that you need to spend thousands on courses, when now a day there are so many better and easier options out there for the same price or less.

I dont see any changes happening. As mentioned cisco has owned linksys for years.

Cisco doesnt own to so speak, linksys IS cisco, they came out with linksys to appeal to consumers (from what i understood)

Cheator

01-26-09, 12:09 AM

I dont think so much that it is crap, but they just make it SO dam hard to learn or use that you need to spend thousands on courses, when now a day there are so many better and easier options out there for the same price or less.
No, its crap.

Propriatary protocols that aren't that fantastic and tie people into crisco with no choice, pricy hardware, and a crappy cli. You play with junioer and foundry like I did, and you'll never go back.

ppe1700

01-26-09, 02:45 AM

where are all your theories and comments coming from regarding linksys? is this personal experience?
im just asking because some people seem to feel quite strongly on this - whereas i have no experience with linksys currently.

ppe1700

01-26-09, 02:59 AM

I dont think so much that it is crap, but they just make it SO dam hard to learn or use that you need to spend thousands on courses, when now a day there are so many better and easier options out there for the same price or less.

Cisco doesnt own to so speak, linksys IS cisco, they came out with linksys to appeal to consumers (from what i understood)

its not that its SOO difficult to learn,
its the FACT that there are SO MANY different ways of configuring one piece of equipment, and also that there is a million times MORE functionality compared to other similar kit E.G. watchguard, sonicwall etc etc..

it actually pee's me off that other manufacturers dont offer the same quality of equipment, and the same flexibility and functionality that cisco offer.

although cisco do pee me off too. like, you cannot install an ADSL module into their ASA security appliance, which means you need to have a seperate ADSL router, which then sets you back £200 + £180 = £380 or $600 for some home equipment, or even office equipment.
but instead of an ASA you can get adsl routers, with an ios image that supports firewall feature set with stateful packet inspection like the ASA + other things, so its almost as good.

gangaskan

01-26-09, 09:04 AM

Cisco doesnt own to so speak, linksys IS cisco, they came out with linksys to appeal to consumers (from what i understood)

nope they got bought out about q1 2003 by cisco :)

No, its crap.

Propriatary protocols that aren't that fantastic and tie people into crisco with no choice, pricy hardware, and a crappy cli. You play with junioer and foundry like I did, and you'll never go back.

yup! EIGRP, OSPF, And RIPv 1&2 are your only options. afaik BGP is not supported.

its not that its SOO difficult to learn,
its the FACT that there are SO MANY different ways of configuring one piece of equipment, and also that there is a million times MORE functionality compared to other similar kit E.G. watchguard, sonicwall etc etc..

it actually pee's me off that other manufacturers dont offer the same quality of equipment, and the same flexibility and functionality that cisco offer.

although cisco do pee me off too. like, you cannot install an ADSL module into their ASA security appliance, which means you need to have a seperate ADSL router, which then sets you back £200 + £180 = £380 or $600 for some home equipment, or even office equipment.
but instead of an ASA you can get adsl routers, with an ios image that supports firewall feature set with stateful packet inspection like the ASA + other things, so its almost as good.

cisco surely is its own beast, and if you WANT to learn it, however, in your answer to the ASA/pix having more functionality imo is bull ;) you can do just as much, if not more than your run of the mill asa with other products. our Sonicwall has very nice detailed reporting, IPS/IDS, gateway antiviri requirements if you wish among other things. sure, its a little more confusing and cumbersome but it gets the job done the same. i'm not sure how well our NSA does SPI (Stateful Packet Inspection), but i'm sure its just the same.

and with the ADSL module, i think thats what they want you to do is have a Edge router with your Pix / asa in the middle of your network? i dont know, but yeah, its just about as cheaper if not easier to buy a regular router with a module and run reflective acl's and inspect statements if you cant afford what you want. with new routers i believe you can do CBAC, but its really taxing on the cpu

Mr.Guvernment

01-26-09, 09:08 AM

ahhk, good to know :) i had always thought linksys was created by cisco :)

gangaskan

01-26-09, 09:14 AM

ahhk, good to know :) i had always thought linksys was created by cisco :)

they really had a itching to get into the consumer market and i think my teacher said there were some sort of conditions limiting them from entering the consumer market? i have no idea, but still, this was the easiest logical move for them to get the name out into the mainstream market only because everyone knew what linksys was.

ppe1700

01-26-09, 11:58 AM

nope they got bought out about q1 2003 by cisco :)

yup! EIGRP, OSPF, And RIPv 1&2 are your only options. afaik BGP is not supported.

cisco surely is its own beast, and if you WANT to learn it, however, in your answer to the ASA/pix having more functionality imo is bull ;) you can do just as much, if not more than your run of the mill asa with other products. our Sonicwall has very nice detailed reporting, IPS/IDS, gateway antiviri requirements if you wish among other things. sure, its a little more confusing and cumbersome but it gets the job done the same. i'm not sure how well our NSA does SPI (Stateful Packet Inspection), but i'm sure its just the same.

and with the ADSL module, i think thats what they want you to do is have a Edge router with your Pix / asa in the middle of your network? i dont know, but yeah, its just about as cheaper if not easier to buy a regular router with a module and run reflective acl's and inspect statements if you cant afford what you want. with new routers i believe you can do CBAC, but its really taxing on the cpu

your basically asking me for a list of things an ASA does over a router. well, i cannot give a full list but there is so much more an ASA does in terms of being a firewall or Edge device.

one of the main things i like is the clientless ssl vpn. this allows you to authenticate to a https browser that resides on the ASA, and once you are here, depending on how it has been configured then you can create secure RDP sessions between the firewall and the device you want to connect to. same can be done for telnet and various other applications that they have made.
the benefit of this, is that if you want an external resource access to a machine, then you can do so, without placing their computer on your network at all since all connections terminate at the firewall.

content filtering is an extra in a module.

2 or 4 gigabit int's on 5510 models and up
7 100mb ports with 2 x POE ports for APs or voip phones on 5505 models, you can get some 1800 routers with similar physical features.

but what really makes the asa special is the software it runs, and how it can handle these types of vpn connectivity. ssl, clientless ssl.
it does ipsec as well, but not gre.
can also handle log in by rsa secureid tags and other etc.

gangaskan

01-26-09, 02:51 PM

your basically asking me for a list of things an ASA does over a router. well, i cannot give a full list but there is so much more an ASA does in terms of being a firewall or Edge device.

i never asked you to compare a ASA to a router :P i was referring to other NSA appliances weather it would be from Sonicwall, Juniper, MacAfee, etc..

dark_15

01-26-09, 04:48 PM

Seeing how I am a bit biased on the subject, I couldn't help but put my two cents in... :)

yup! EIGRP, OSPF, And RIPv 1&2 are your only options. afaik BGP is not supported.
At least OSPF and RIP are based on universal standards. That being said I wouldn't be running that for dynamic routing outside the corporate LAN. That's what BGP is for. Oh, and every time someone uses EIGRP an angel loses its wings :(

your basically asking me for a list of things an ASA does over a router. well, i cannot give a full list but there is so much more an ASA does in terms of being a firewall or Edge device.

one of the main things i like is the clientless ssl vpn. this allows you to authenticate to a https browser that resides on the ASA, and once you are here, depending on how it has been configured then you can create secure RDP sessions between the firewall and the device you want to connect to. same can be done for telnet and various other applications that they have made.
the benefit of this, is that if you want an external resource access to a machine, then you can do so, without placing their computer on your network at all since all connections terminate at the firewall.

content filtering is an extra in a module.

2 or 4 gigabit int's on 5510 models and up
7 100mb ports with 2 x POE ports for APs or voip phones on 5505 models, you can get some 1800 routers with similar physical features.

but what really makes the asa special is the software it runs, and how it can handle these types of vpn connectivity. ssl, clientless ssl.
it does ipsec as well, but not gre.
can also handle log in by rsa secureid tags and other etc.
My main gripes with cisco are the cost of all these features are an arm and a leg, and the performance drops whenever the features are enabled. I could purchase a dedicated device that can handle the SSL VPN for the cost as your add-in module, and still have more features than what the module can do. For the webfiltering a Juniper SSG can either activate a yearly subscription or forward HTTP traffic automatically to a Websense or SurfControl Server - no extra hardware needed. Same goes for Deep Inspection (poor man's IDP) and Anti-virus - a low-cost yearly subscription. Not to mention I still have the ability to create IPSec VPN's; support RIP, OSPF, and BGP; and segregate my firewall into separate virtual routers so I can't accidentally inject the wrong learned routes between networks.

Those are my $0.02 and change, but like I said, I might be a bit biased :)

gangaskan

01-26-09, 05:29 PM

Seeing how I am a bit biased on the subject, I couldn't help but put my two cents in... :)

At least OSPF and RIP are based on universal standards. That being said I wouldn't be running that for dynamic routing outside the corporate LAN. That's what BGP is for. Oh, and every time someone uses EIGRP an angel loses its wings :(

My main gripes with cisco are the cost of all these features are an arm and a leg, and the performance drops whenever the features are enabled. I could purchase a dedicated device that can handle the SSL VPN for the cost as your add-in module, and still have more features than what the module can do. For the webfiltering a Juniper SSG can either activate a yearly subscription or forward HTTP traffic automatically to a Websense or SurfControl Server - no extra hardware needed. Same goes for Deep Inspection (poor man's IDP) and Anti-virus - a low-cost yearly subscription. Not to mention I still have the ability to create IPSec VPN's; support RIP, OSPF, and BGP; and segregate my firewall into separate virtual routers so I can't accidentally inject the wrong learned routes between networks.

Those are my $0.02 and change, but like I said, I might be a bit biased :)

no you're not :) our SSL vpn uses Active directory (or ldap even) for authenticaion, the germans make it its good stuff (my vince from shamwow impression ;) )

i think our content filtering is about 1800 / yr and our antivirius is around that for 250 users x 2 years and holy crap does that save us so much time in fixing malware that gets put on people's machines.

the problem with cisco's asa's too is you can have 4+ interfaces, but only able to use 3 untill you purchase the unlock codes to use them. by default you can have (Internal, External, DMZ) along with other encryption methods, and such you need to unlock it! as far as i'm concerned the ASA's serve a ok purpose, but they are really junky in comparision to a juniper or sonicwall firewall.

dark_15

01-26-09, 06:32 PM

no you're not :) our SSL vpn uses Active directory (or ldap even) for authenticaion, the germans make it its good stuff (my vince from shamwow impression ;) )
Ahh... but my Sunnyvale, CA engineers make even better stuff. Juniper SSL VPN's support LDAP, AD, RADIUS, Certficate-based, ACE, and a few other authentication types that I can't quite remember off the top of my head :p
Not to mention there's the clientless proxy solutions, full layer-3 VPN funcitionality (including server-side connections and UDP traffic!), a fully customizable web portal for file shares, intranet bookmarks, RDP, Telnet, SSH, and even citrix bookmarks. It's quite trippy if you ask me :)

i think our content filtering is about 1800 / yr and our antivirius is around that for 250 users x 2 years and holy crap does that save us so much time in fixing malware that gets put on people's machines.
Are you using standalone or the software that comes on the box? Juniper's is a simple subscription that turns it on for the max capacity of the box, but I've got to say logging is atrocious unless you happen to like reading syslog messages. But it still manages to get the job done each and every time :)

the problem with cisco's asa's too is you can have 4+ interfaces, but only able to use 3 untill you purchase the unlock codes to use them. by default you can have (Internal, External, DMZ) along with other encryption methods, and such you need to unlock it! as far as i'm concerned the ASA's serve a ok purpose, but they are really junky in comparision to a juniper or sonicwall firewall.
My point exactly... the Cisco ASA licensing is about as complicated as Microsoft's! With a Juniper SSG if you buy an interface it will simply just work after you install it. No licenses necessary.

The ASA's are really good at keeping your job security; no one ever gets fired for buying Cisco ;)

ppe1700

01-27-09, 05:38 AM

no you're not :) our SSL vpn uses Active directory (or ldap even) for authenticaion, the germans make it its good stuff (my vince from shamwow impression ;) )

i think our content filtering is about 1800 / yr and our antivirius is around that for 250 users x 2 years and holy crap does that save us so much time in fixing malware that gets put on people's machines.

the problem with cisco's asa's too is you can have 4+ interfaces, but only able to use 3 untill you purchase the unlock codes to use them. by default you can have (Internal, External, DMZ) along with other encryption methods, and such you need to unlock it! as far as i'm concerned the ASA's serve a ok purpose, but they are really junky in comparision to a juniper or sonicwall firewall.

you need a sec plus bun. we never buy the basic models, so we have some silly ammount of vlans, sub interfaces and ALL 5 physical interfaces on the 5510, 5520 etc. the 5505 has basically a switch that you can keep in the default vlan.
i would like to know juniper, and their ins and outs. but generally with other vendors equipment there is less flexibility with the configuration and it can set you back..
ive never had to restart a cisco firewall to fix an issue. ive frequently had to restart watchguards because they can get their knickers in a twist. same goes for other cheaper equipment.

but ultimately, someone mentioned how they hated cisco because you have to spend thousands on studying to know how to use it - that is a little misleading as the courses are there to explain the ins and outs of networking as well the specifics on how to complete that with their kit. the same networking rules can be applied to other vendors. i could go on, but for example, routing protocols, switching, vlans, etc. obviously cisco proprietary protocols other vendors will not use. but, generally, other vendors just copy or mimick what cisco have already achieved.
another example, is that there was a need for POE before it was created of course. cisco made their proprietary poe before it was ratified / standardised so that it could be implemented..
same with hsrp.
blah blah :santa2:

gangaskan

01-27-09, 07:20 AM

you need a sec plus bun. we never buy the basic models, so we have some silly ammount of vlans, sub interfaces and ALL 5 physical interfaces on the 5510, 5520 etc. the 5505 has basically a switch that you can keep in the default vlan.
i would like to know juniper, and their ins and outs. but generally with other vendors equipment there is less flexibility with the configuration and it can set you back..
ive never had to restart a cisco firewall to fix an issue. ive frequently had to restart watchguards because they can get their knickers in a twist. same goes for other cheaper equipment.

you fail to understand my statement though, out of the box you get bare bones, most companies cant afford the extras, and even more so now with our economy in a twist. yes i know there are other ways to do what you want to accomplish, however, you can get a sonicwall NSA 3500 for 2500-5000 us and a asa with the same equivalent would be around the same price range possibly more if you want to add 3des or other options, however, the NSA has 6x ports you can use for whatever, you can only have 2 WAN ports though i think, i may be mistaken, but i think that's the case.

idk, we're comparing apples to oranges, its a lost cause ;) THEY ALL DO THE SAME THING

we all have our peference

ppe1700

01-27-09, 07:39 AM

you fail to understand my statement though, out of the box you get bare bones, most companies cant afford the extras, and even more so now with our economy in a twist. yes i know there are other ways to do what you want to accomplish, however, you can get a sonicwall NSA 3500 for 2500-5000 us and a asa with the same equivalent would be around the same price range possibly more if you want to add 3des or other options, however, the NSA has 6x ports you can use for whatever, you can only have 2 WAN ports though i think, i may be mistaken, but i think that's the case.

idk, we're comparing apples to oranges, its a lost cause ;) THEY ALL DO THE SAME THING

we all have our peference

a 5505 with a base licence and a 5505 with a sec-plus-bun is two completely different products.
the product is chosen based on client needs. and if you do buy a base licence then it is upgradeable with an upgrade, if you wish to expand the business.

if you are referring to the crypotgraphic features, then this is a free upgrade providing your not living in a country such as afghanistan BUT where we buy our kit from, we dont need to do this upgrade as it comes already with this enabled. this may be because our supplier has agreed not to ship to those countries? idk.
now i think about it, the only time i have ever had to register for a 3des/aes license is when we have had an RMA direct from cisco.

gangaskan

01-27-09, 10:48 AM

a 5505 with a base licence and a 5505 with a sec-plus-bun is two completely different products.
the product is chosen based on client needs. and if you do buy a base licence then it is upgradeable with an upgrade, if you wish to expand the business

wouldn't it be easier to have everything bundled though? wouldn't you get ticked off if you found out you needed to buy another license if you wanted to use more than 3 interfaces on your asa even though they're physically on the device itself? to me that makes no sense ;)

the only real nice thing i like about the asa's are you can do any command in almost any mode without having to execute the "do" command other than that they can get very cumbersome imo, i never played with the configurator app, but 90% of my experience is from config mode.

ppe1700

01-27-09, 10:56 AM

wouldn't it be easier to have everything bundled though? wouldn't you get ticked off if you found out you needed to buy another license if you wanted to use more than 3 interfaces on your asa even though they're physically on the device itself? to me that makes no sense ;)

its funny, but i have never had this problem!

the only real nice thing i like about the asa's are you can do any command in almost any mode without having to execute the "do" command other than that they can get very cumbersome imo, i never played with the configurator app, but 90% of my experience is from config mode.

your right about that! i still sometimes Do and get command failed lol

play around with asdm, dont get tooo used to it though ;)

gangaskan

01-27-09, 11:00 AM

nah, i played with the SDM for my router, it just clutters the crap out of my config, i hate it.

ppe1700

01-27-09, 11:24 AM

nah, i played with the SDM for my router, it just clutters the crap out of my config, i hate it.

ASDM is different. sdm is cack

Mayonati

02-10-09, 06:29 AM

gangaskan

02-10-09, 07:08 AM

Having worked on a lot of Linksys stuff, I sincerely hope that Cisco takes a good look at their IOS / GUI and the hardware in general and does a good reform. I've never had much good luck with Linksys stuff, and if they can even get a tenth of Cisco's quality out of the conversion I'd think it was a completely new brand! Hehe.

one thing you have to keep in mind, is that even though our economy is crap, they need to consider that not everyone is going to go out and pony up $2-300 dollars for a router.

hell, mine was 350 and i cant upgrade it at all! :P my 851W is maxed in terms of flash and ram, however, i rarely go above 20-40% ram so i'm in the gravy train :) cpu usage, not so much, but i peg that pretty good at times.