Overclocking RAM - Need Help

Hello,

Ok, I cannot pass FSB of 420.

My RAM is giving me a hard time, even though it is supposed to support the overclocking Ok.

I usually run this settings:
NB 1.31v
RAM 800 MHz. 4-4-4-14 2T 1.8v
FSB 400
RAM/FSB Ratio 1:1.
CPU stock 2.66 at 3.2
Everything else, auto in the mobo

This is perfectly stable, and it it what I use for playing games.

Now, second config:
NB 1.50v
RAM 840 MHz. 5-5-5-15 2T 1.98v/1.92v
FSB 420
RAM/FSB Ratio 1:1.
CPU stock 2.66 at 3,36
Everything else, auto in the mobo

Let's say that yesterday I got a BSOD after 2 1/2 hours of working with very high load. Usually it is stable.

Now , if I try to go >420 FSB, thus, 1:1 on my RAM >840 I get BSOD.
I have tried VRAM voltages up to 1.98, wich gave me 2 more minutes of stability on the O.S. Anything below 1.92v just dont boot.
NB from 1.50 to 1.61 v.
RAM Timings auto, or 5-5-5-15 2T

am I on my limit?
What am I doing wrong?
What can i do?
Should I try VRAM voltages of >1.98v ?

I have to replace my board because the ram V wont go high enough to keep it stable under extreme load (has to be using all the memory more or less)

my ram needs to be at 2.1 normal and 2.3 for OC`ing .1 more than the board can go so if it dips I get the BSOD.

will have to look up your ram but I think maybe at least 2.1 - just because it detected and set to 1.8 originally (well it may have been wrong - my board always says 1.8 and my coarsair wont get past post without the correct 2.1)

Another pointer is make sure youve got some air flow on them -wont need to be crazy but that extra current will warm them and the mobo.

I didnt need to loosen the timings to get from 800 to 850 just needed 2.2v (reads 2.22 when not dipping #Chuckles#) had it running at 1022 but theres too much bursting and stalling on my crap board to use it in games at that speed

Well,

After your explanation (thanks) and what I read about this RAM (or very similiar) I think the mayor drawback right now it is on the VRAM voltage.

From one post:

Specs are [email protected] for 800 MHz but i pushed them to 1054@[email protected]

From the same post:
DDR 907 4-3-3-8 2T 2.2v

What's up with the timings ???
I do not understand this very well............

My modo is X48, I am interesrted in keeping 1:1 ratio (best bandwith and performance).

So I will give it a try with
430 FSB
860 MHz RAM, [email protected]

I am on air, I have really good air flow. My RAM also has alum. heat sinks.

My main objective would be a stable config at 440/450 FSB (+/- 3,6 GHz) to play. At that config, I am pretty sure that CPU is not a bottle neck for my GPU anymore.
What do you think ?

I think get to it
observe in bios for stability all round then set a mem test and see whats what.
Im using a 4GB kit all it needed was a push on the volts as your link points they opted to loosen timings.

its a lot of factors to throw in what works for one machine may not for another... get it something like and then try tightening timings (I never bother with the sub timings - think its hair splitting that just something as simple as a bios update or new driver can spoil in no time)

2.2 - 2.3 is where the speed against life expectancy starts with most ram.

in most cases over-volting takes a fair while to damage stuff and maybe never if the coolings up for it.

I super glued a CPU heat sing onto a GPU about a decade ago and it still goes as high as the OC`ing drivers will let that chip set (it was like the future really considering you couldnt use about 4 slots below it - just like a GTX280 or the like LOL)

looking at it they had to go to 2.2v to OC it so you may need to up it another 0.10 (im not worried your gonna all blowed up now, couldn`t say before I read that fact.... its not my ram at stake LOL)

Yep you were just undervolted for your plans I susspect.

may your clocking be fruitfull and in-expenceive... let us pray.

#Guess if you dont come back it was terrable advice LOL#

BobbyBubblehead said:

I think get to it
observe in bios for stability all round then set a mem test and see whats what.
Im using a 4GB kit all it needed was a push on the volts as your link points they opted to loosen timings.

its a lot of factors to throw in what works for one machine may not for another... get it something like and then try tightening timings (I never bother with the sub timings - think its hair splitting that just something as simple as a bios update or new driver can spoil in no time)

2.2 - 2.3 is where the speed against life expectancy starts with most ram.

in most cases over-volting takes a fair while to damage stuff and maybe never if the coolings up for it.

I super glued a CPU heat sing onto a GPU about a decade ago and it still goes as high as the OC`ing drivers will let that chip set (it was like the future really considering you couldnt use about 4 slots below it - just like a GTX280 or the like LOL)

looking at it they had to go to 2.2v to OC it so you may need to up it another 0.10 (im not worried your gonna all blowed up now, couldn`t say before I read that fact.... its not my ram at stake LOL)

Yep you were just undervolted for your plans I susspect.

may your clocking be fruitfull and in-expenceive... let us pray.

#Guess if you dont come back it was terrable advice LOL#

Click to expand...

Well...... I will let you know no matter what happens......

Thanks for the help.

PD: I still have problems understanding x-x-x-x timings, and why such difference in the 2 examples abobe.

well for example the review tests of my coarsair ram was

default 2.1v 4.4.4.12 @ 800

they got to 2.3v 4.4.4.12 @ 960 & 1066 dependent (on divider times)

but no further at 4.4.4.12 due to stability

but they said it could possibly go further with loose timings.

your ram and the link you posted suggest they had to use loose timings to run past 900ish

basically the faster you go the more you may have to loosen the timings but looser timings will slow its performace for the relative x00Hz its running at.... so the question is when fine tuning is the loose timings performance any better than tighter timings at a slower frequency (x00Hz)?

only tests will show and then only real working situations will confirm the whole situation.

heat is the factor that will let you know if your new found speeds are sustainable... always depresses me to clock back to something more stable after seeing the future #Chuckles#

Oh well... I can get an I7 and who knows what form factor card when this one curls up.


CAS (tCL) Timing: CAS stands for Column Address Strobe. It controls the amount of time in cycles between sending a reading command and the time to act on it.

tRCD Timing: RAS to CAS Delay (Row Address Strobe to Column Address Strobe). Is the amount of time in cycles for issuing an active command and the read/write commands.

tRP Timing: Row Precharge Time. This is the minimum time between active commands and the read/writes of the next bank on the memory module.

tRAS Timing: Min RAS Active Time. The amount of time between a row being activated by precharge and deactivated. A row cannot be deactivated until tRAS has completed.

tRAS = tCL + tRCD + tRP (+/- 1) so that it gives everything enought time before closing the bank.

I stole and simplyfied the explanation..... couldnt remeber the terms well enough to explain it without having a sneaky look up, just remebered the formula but thats no explanation.

Ok,

During lunch time, here is what happened.

No luck, over 425 FSB (430,440,450).

I tried 5-5-5-15 , 5-6-5-16 , volts from 2.0 to 2.22

NB 1.61v

The fac that I have 4 x 2 GB might be affecting?.

Then, I concentraded on 425 (previous stable was 420)
I have to stress test, but the rig booted and worked properly for a while (until I went back to the office) with :
NB 1.51v
VRAM 2.1
RAM 850 MHz 4-4-4-14 (please note the timings!!)
1:1 ratio.

So, what now ?

Oh 4x2gig will be a spanner in the works maybe yes.
are they matched pairs?
if so they stagger in the slots i.e. 1 &3. 2&4 quite often... getting 4 sticks to play nice could require some quite loose timings.
If there not matched then the fact it fires at default speed is a small blessing.
if theres a duff`ish stick you need to stick it in slot 1 so it detects the settings of the worst ram.

you may have to test them in-pairs or independent in the same slots to determine which is the weakest.

not played with more than two sticks for a few years now... find its a pain to get 4 sticks working regardless of type or form factor.

I can match your situation as much as vista 64 but not 4 sticks.

BobbyBubblehead said:

Oh 4x2gig will be a spanner in the works maybe yes.
are they matched pairs?
if so they stagger in the slots i.e. 1 &3. 2&4 quite often... getting 4 sticks to play nice could require some quite loose timings.
If there not matched then the fact it fires at default speed is a small blessing.
if theres a duff`ish stick you need to stick it in slot 1 so it detects the settings of the worst ram.

you may have to test them in-pairs or independent in the same slots to determine which is the weakest.

not played with more than two sticks for a few years now... find its a pain to get 4 sticks working regardless of type or form factor.

I can match your situation as much as vista 64 but not 4 sticks.

Click to expand...

Hello

They are exactly the same RAM.
I think I will try with only 2 sticks.
If I would loose timings for the 4 sticks, what would it be like it?

1.61v NB

Im not up on ram enough to shed any light on 4sticks (not been there since it was ddr400 1GB)
getting just 2 to overclock will be more fruitfull for a guess.
sometimes the mobo has 4 slots but design wise hopes no one will have a go - 4GIG total gets through vista64 and anything you throw at it fine.
Im low on help now unless I go read about overclocking 4sticks of ram elsewhere. #Chuckles#


do you know what the NB voltage is supposed to be for your board?
1.31 to 1.61 is some brave stuff concidering you may not have to alter it at all (could also be causing your ram to fail LOL)
dont go stress testing stuff unless you know where you should have been and where its gone to.

you were all reserved about turning up the ram volts why the crash helmet approach on the bridge?

I only needed to go 0.10v up on my NB and thats only just justifiable.

need to find what it should be and turn it down some.... sooner would be a good time - shaving some life off maybe #Chuckles#

I was so focused on the ram v and timings I didnt notice your NB started at 1.31 just noticed the 1.5 to 1.6 which is the same kind of 0.10 step I took (not 0.20 for a starter)
If your lacking a bit of pre clocking knowledge some of the stickies on here may explain things a little.
best know what your altering before you do... is the pci-e bus locked to 100? Dont want to fry that card!

18 is # 1 said:

1.61v NB

Click to expand...

NB 1.61 Its what my mobo runs on auto with FSB>333
At 400 FSB I run 1.31 (mobo would use 1.61)
at 425 I started with 1.51, planning to stress test and go down....

/edit
Also, the mobo for RAM in auto, it runs 1.92 (FSB 333) to 1.98 ....... I am also planning to stress test and go down , at FSB 425. I use 1.82v at FSB 400

I will try to tun tests, tomorrow morning (here), from 6am to 8:30am.

I am aware of the NB stuff..... so I am trying to be careful every step I take.

So, O will try to lower all volts and keep myself on FSB 425.

Testing with only 2 sticks it's only to find out if it is my RAM fault or the combination of many things................

God, I should be speding my (little) time in games...............

LOL thats when you settle for a stable clock speed - I got sick of tweaking my machine - I know a better board would stablise everything but carnt be botherd until Ive seen a good few more blue screens.

I do that bit and then start thinking an I7 would be better (So would a blue-ray mainframe network) dont think i`ll be getting one anytime soon.

Some good news

Well.

I took 2 of my RAM sticks out, to make sure and test.
Same problems with only 2 sticks.

From the sticker on the RAM: 4-4-4-12 2.0v

Hell, with this specs, and being stable at 425 FSB with 4.4.4.14 (and also 4.4.4.12 !), men, I started to think the hole RAM thing was just bull S*** to myself (I also went trhough the HOLE post on xs systems about this RAM and similiars).......

While testing for stability at 425 FSB (since I gave up going to 450), prime95 reported rounding errors ..... and then, I said S*I*T, what is doing my mobo with vcore in auto ? ........ 1.27 NO MATTER WHAT.

Damm, all of the other settings that are un auto (ram,nb v, etc) fluctuate and try to accomodate. Guess what, I made the wrong assumtion and the vcore in auto only would set the volts to its std value (or I think).

So, I raised vcore to 1.35v/1.37v and now I run prime WITHOUT A PROBLEM, at:

450 FSB x 8, 1:1 ratio with RAM
RAM, at 900 MMHz 5-5-5-15 2.12v
NB 1.51v

I have to extend the stability testing, but the starting point now is (really) good.

My CPU temps are at 56c at 100% load. 44c idle.
NB went from 30 to 34c but since I attached time ago a fan to the NB heat sink that is running at 70%, I know I still have room to control it. Maybe I will try to go down on NB volts.
I maybe also try to lower RAM timings to 4-4-4-12 2.12v but maybe this is pushing my luck..............

I was sure that my components, were high q. and they should be able to take this type of punishment or more.........

Now, this is my limit. I only want to run stable now, and start playing games.

you need to read up on that mobo get to know its bios features inside out.
I only have my sata and ram sub timings on auto... everything else I have set knowing its default value and why its been changed if it has.

if your default ram v is 2.00v I doubt 2.12v is high enough maybe 2.2v

but I think your getting like a dog chasing its tale on this one... read up on the board and components values and settings then try.

(in spain? suggest any good regions to check out - Ive got a UK scout unit with me, looking to defect.... any input appreciated, just a thought)

BobbyBubblehead said:

you need to read up on that mobo get to know its bios features inside out.
I only have my sata and ram sub timings on auto... everything else I have set knowing its default value and why its been changed if it has.

if your default ram v is 2.00v I doubt 2.12v is high enough maybe 2.2v

but I think your getting like a dog chasing its tale on this one... read up on the board and components values and settings then try.

(in spain? suggest any good regions to check out - Ive got a UK scout unit with me, looking to defect.... any input appreciated, just a thought)

Click to expand...

Yes, yes vcore in auto is partly my fault, I read the manual............ the description on the auto function wasn'w so clear.

I am going to work on the VTT voltage, since I did not check the value, and >=1.4v might be BAD for my 45nm CPU. If it is the case, I am downgrading to a more conservative oc from 400-420 FSB (which is what I had before )

I have figured out all others and set accordinly

Now, to your second question, we have to do the up - down approach

North spain -> less heat, more "inside / camp" tourism (also good beaches)
South -> LOT heat, LOT beach... not so many "green" spots. .

Make a choice, then we continue..........

#Chuckles# Im english (Dont want to go too far south or I`ll fry and more the point have to deal with English people LOL) Costa Lobster`s give me the fear. If I liked stealing other peoples women, fighting and being obnoxious I`d stay here in the land of the well observed and heavily taxed.

I`ll check my wish list and tell you the spots i`ve found - further north seems to have less of a premium ive noticed but its a huge country with lots of interpretaions of laws in regions.... much to learn including the language... maybe places edging on the more rural side have some well ripend people in toe (nearly put `old` but there could have been trouble for that)

if you feel you can help then we can take it to Private messages.... sure someone will moan about talks on defecting in threads if we carry on LOL

between us and bored moderators then.

or maybe start a thread under general hardware on moving your rig to a unfamilar land #Chuckles#

Ok,
FSB 450 x 8 -> 3.6 GHz
FSBT (VTT) down to 1.33v (1.4 in BIOS).
NB down to 1.50v
vcore 1.384/1.392v
VRAM 2.19v 901 MHz 1:1, 5-5-5-15

System stable, and running Ok. My GPU now its seems even better
/edit
I am happy now, no more OCing. Now, to play.

Regarding other stuff.... I'm PM you.........

See ya.

Good.... I think now your starting to get somewhere.

much better to poke at settings when you know what there for #Chuckles#... helps no end on the progress side.

go enjoy that fat GPU for a bit.... you can get back to breaking stuff later.

If your low on spare time - you dont want to spend it between exciting bits of games and blue screens LOL been there.

my machines not the spec of yours and it eats anythings I throw at it.