4870x2 performance

[Baby3ater666]

Greetings! My computer is as follows: Dell XPS 430, Intel Q8300@2.5GHZ, 6GB DDR3 dual channel, VisionTek ATI Radeon HD 4870 x2, Creative SB X-FI Titanium Fatal1ty Pro, 750GB HDD, Vista 64 bit SP1, 1920x1080, OCZ Gamexstream 700W PSU. All drivers, everything is up to date.

I feel that I should be getting better performance with my GPU although via GPU-Z it reports that both are working. Is my CPU bottlenecking my GPU?

I ran a recent benchmark of Crysis and this is what i'm getting.

Completed All Tests

<><><><><><><><><><><><><>>--SUMMARY--<<><><><><><><><><><><><><>

5/12/2009 7:45:48 PM - Vista 64

Run #1- DX10 1920x1080 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: VeryHigh ~~ Overall Average FPS: 26.705

Is that what I should be getting? thanks for any additional input!

[henzo]

Crysis is a poorly optimized game and those numbers look to be about avg. Run some 3dmark06 and vantage and post those results. Also, what fps are you getting in other games with all the eye candy on?

[sandyduff]

2.5GHz will def bottleneck the card... when i went from 3.2GHz to 4GHz i saw a massive boost in graphical performance

[jokers_greg]

2.5GHz will def bottleneck the card... when i went from 3.2GHz to 4GHz i saw a massive boost in graphical performance

yep, i would suggest running any game below 3ghz at the very least.

[sandyduff]

to get the most out of it you are talking 3.6GHz plus... does your dell offer any overclocking features...?

[Baby3ater666]

Unfortunately from what I've heard the bios is locked. :confused: I did a run with 3DMark06 and scored 13,723. Is that what I should be getting with my setup?

[jokers_greg]

Unfortunately from what I've heard the bios is locked. :confused: I did a run with 3DMark06 and scored 13,723. Is that what I should be getting with my setup?

aww man, dell ftl! You could really be doing much better if you had a decent motherboard :(

[Baby3ater666]

So the 3DMark06 score that I'm getting is typical for this type of build? I notice when I'm playing Fallout 3 that whenvever I use the wait feature it cuts my Frame rates in half! It never fails! Is that some type of game related bug? should I just get a new mobo or just save up for an i7 rig?

[jokers_greg]

So the 3DMark06 score that I'm getting is typical for this type of build? I notice when I'm playing Fallout 3 that whenvever I use the wait feature it cuts my Frame rates in half! It never fails! Is that some type of game related bug? should I just get a new mobo or just save up for an i7 rig?

I'd just wait, try and sell your board and cpu, and grab an i7 and X58 board. keep your video card.

[sandyduff]

13.7k...? man that cpu is holding you back... i get over 22k with my quad at 4GHz... i would save up for i7 if i were you... it really makes the most of multiple gpu setups...

[AngelicPenguin]

Crysis is a poorly optimized game

I'm curious where this comes from. I know the game runs slower than any other game but the amount of effects in that game are legions beyond anything else I've played. A lot of other games look great and run really fast, but they are not doing anything close to what that game does. It just seems like it gets flack for being cutting edge, when most other games are seriously lagging behind the hardware.

Sorry for the hijack :)

[Baby3ater666]

I was doing some other tests trying to figure out why i'm getting crappy performance. I went to crucial's website and loaded the ram detector and it did a blue screen on me! Anything noteworthy of this? :confused:

[Neural Net]

Greetings! My computer is as follows: Dell XPS 430, Intel Q8300@2.5GHZ, 6GB DDR3 dual channel, VisionTek ATI Radeon HD 4870 x2, Creative SB X-FI Titanium Fatal1ty Pro, 750GB HDD, Vista 64 bit SP1, 1920x1080, OCZ Gamexstream 700W PSU. All drivers, everything is up to date.

I feel that I should be getting better performance with my GPU although via GPU-Z it reports that both are working. Is my CPU bottlenecking my GPU?

I ran a recent benchmark of Crysis and this is what i'm getting.

Completed All Tests

<><><><><><><><><><><><><>>--SUMMARY--<<><><><><><><><><><><><><>

5/12/2009 7:45:48 PM - Vista 64

Run #1- DX10 1920x1080 AA=No AA, 64 bit test, Quality: VeryHigh ~~ Overall Average FPS: 26.705

Is that what I should be getting? thanks for any additional input!

This is possibly due to your CPU, however, load the Catalyst Control Center and check to see if Catalyst AI is enabled. Sometimes with Dells the power supply isn't supplying enough power to the card. Have you added anything after you bought the machine?


Crysis is a poorly optimized game and those numbers look to be about avg. Run some 3dmark06 and vantage and post those results. Also, what fps are you getting in other games with all the eye candy on?

Stop spreading this rubbish. It gets old, very quickly.

[Neural Net]

I was doing some other tests trying to figure out why i'm getting crappy performance. I went to crucial's website and loaded the ram detector and it did a blue screen on me! Anything noteworthy of this? :confused:

What's your setup? Download CPU-Z and see if you're running your ram within the specified limits.

[Baby3ater666]

The AI in the Catalyst controls is enabled if it were disabled that would disable the 2nd gpu! I've done tests with that already. My first post shows my system specs and I have an OCZ Gamexstream 700W PSU it has the neccessary connectors (6+2 PCIE, 6 PCIE pin) to power the beast.I have CPU Z as well, the current ram readings and timings are: type: DDR3, size:6144MBytes, Channels: Dual, DC Mode: Symmetric, DRAM Frequency: 532.0MHz, FSB:DRAM: 5:8. The other stuff is 7 clocks. Max Bandwidth says: PC3-8500F (533 MHz) :confused: that doesn't sound right, then again i'm not running anything intensive as of right now. Do you think the blue screen that I got from Crucial's memory scanner means that it's bad ram?

[henzo]

Stop spreading this rubbish. It gets old, very quickly.

-dons flame resistant suit-

I like the look of Crysis, but with my system, I should be getting more fps than I do, and that is not asking alot.

[Chris_F]

-dons flame resistant suit-

I like the look of Crysis, but with my system, I should be getting more fps than I do, and that is not asking alot.

You think that just because you have an i7 and Xfire 4890s, that you should automatically get ridiculous FPS, regardless of the game?

Crysis uses real time effects that are state of the art, and are still not featured in a lot of game engines that have been released since. Things like dynamic soft shadows, HDR lighting, lightshafts, diffraction, caustics, subsurface scattering, motion blur, and depth of field. That doesn't even begin to scratch the surface. It's a technical marvel to be able to generate those images in milliseconds.

In short, quit your bellyaching because your mad your supercomputer still isn't super enough to render Crysis at ridiculous rates. If that's what you want, perhaps you should get Xfire HD 4870s or SLI GTX295s.

[Dapman02]

funny thing is, crysis runs fine on my computer on max settings.

[henzo]

You think that just because you have an i7 and Xfire 4890s, that you should automatically get ridiculous FPS, regardless of the game?

In short, quit your bellyaching because your mad your supercomputer still isn't super enough to render Crysis at ridiculous rates. If that's what you want, perhaps you should get Xfire HD 4870s or SLI GTX295s.

Yes i do think I should get better fps in any game I put on my machine for the hardware that is in this pc. Wouldn't you?

funny thing is, crysis runs fine on my computer on max settings.


Guys, there is no bellyaching at all from me. I just simply think that I should get more than 42-44 fps at my res with very high settings is all. I am not denying the rendering that is involved in the game. It does run great on my system, but I simply think I should be getting more.

Even Crysis: Warhead is a resource hog, but is very very playable with similar fps numbers. All in all, it is truly before its time and is the best game of 2011 lol.

[Chris_F]

Yes i do think I should get better fps in any game I put on my machine for the hardware that is in this pc. Wouldn't you?

Guys, there is no bellyaching at all from me. I just simply think that I should get more than 42-44 fps at my res with very high settings is all.

You DO though, is my point. You get 42-44 with that killer rig, while I get like 1-2FPS on my C2Q and 8800Ultra. FPS is so low, they might as well mail me the frames by way of US postal service.

If you want more than 42-44FPS, you either need to get more graphics cards, or build a time machine and swipe some hardware from the future.

Saying that you think you should get more than some arbitrary number of FPS on a game is silly.

It'd be ridiculous for me say I think I should get more than 30-36FPS in Unreal Tournament 3 on my 8800Ultra while at 1920x1200 simply because I want it to, so the games code must be crap.

If you're simply peeved that your state of the art machine still cant cut it when it comes to Crysis, well, that's the way it is. They designed that game way ahead of the hardware it would require to function. I suppose they could have put it on mothballs and just sat on it for 2 years, THEN release it. Would that have made you content? If so, the solution would be to wait a year or two to play it I guess.

I'm really not trying to flame you, I'm just saying there is nothing wrong with the code. The graphics are crazy intense. You can't blame them for pushing the envelope and modern hardware to the very limits. After all, you can always lower the quality settings to be able to play the game. If you can be mad at ANYONE, blame AMD for not making your HD 4890s fast enough.

[PhoenixOfChaos]

At that res is the CPU really bottlenecking him that much? That res, in DX 10 with high quality strikes me at ~30fps would be spot on with that setup. I could be very wrong though, it wouldn't be the first time.


edit* found this before i went to sleep. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/4870-x2-amd,1992-5.html

seems like he's about 10 fps off the average so...

[Neural Net]

You DO though, is my point. You get 42-44 with that killer rig, while I get like 1-2FPS on my C2Q and 8800Ultra. FPS is so low, they might as well mail me the frames by way of US postal service.

If you want more than 42-44FPS, you either need to get more graphics cards, or build a time machine and swipe some hardware from there.

Saying that you think you should get more than some arbitrary number of FPS on a game is silly.

It'd be ridiculous for me say I think I should get more than 30-36FPS in Unreal Tournament 3 on my 8800Ultra while at 1920x1200 simply because I want it to, so the games code must be crap.

If you're simply peeved that your state of the art machine still cant cut it when it comes to Crysis, well, that's the way it is. They designed that game way ahead of the hardware it would require to function. I suppose they could have put it on mothballs and just sat on it for 2 years, THEN release it. Would that have made you content? If so, the solution would be to wait a year or two to play it I guess.

I'm really not trying to flame you, I'm just saying there is nothing wrong with the code. The graphics are crazy intense. You can't blame them for pushing the envelope and modern hardware to the very limits. After all, you can always lower the quality settings to be able to play the game. If you can be mad at ANYONE, blame AMD for not making your HD 4890s fast enough.

It's thanks to Crysis that we've been getting significantly faster graphics cards at all. When every other game can more or less run happily on a G92 core or equivalent, what motivation would there be to sink R&D into a new GPU? Probably very little. If there was no need for faster performance, we would get only slightly faster GPUs so that one manufacturer could claim the performance crown, which equates to much slower progress as the hardware sets the bracket, not the software. Simple supply and demand.

An example is the Nvidia 9800 series and ATI 3800 series - marginal improvements came with this generation from the one before it. The same happened with Oblivion when it was released in 2006 which used to be the graphics behemoth. When it came out, existing cards struggled, but demand ensured that the next generation was significantly faster, to meet with software requirements.

Then there was demand for much higher performance when Crysis came out and it was Crysis alone that strained the cards. People forget that the current generation of consoles has changed the status quo - we now have ports that have a lot in common across platforms, but the consoles perform the same as a mid-range gaming PC, so the high-end is left idling performance wise if there aren't exclusives to specifically cater for the extra performance on offer.

Yes a long rant and it isn't that black and white, but we should be thankful that there are games every now and again like Oblivion and Crysis to push the envelope.

[Baby3ater666]

I noticed something a little weird, I went to the DirectX Diagnostic Tool and it says ATI Radeon HD 4870 X2, Approx. Total Memory: 3798MB! is it supposed to report that!? is it leeching off the system's ram?:confused: BTW I noticed in games like Dead Space and UT3 that they perform better when i disable the AI in Catalyst Controller, hence only using one of the GPU's.Other games there's a noticable difference in performance if the AI is on standard, hence both GPU's being enabled. Is there a difference between standard and advanced in the Catalyst AI? Thanks!

[Neural Net]

I noticed something a little weird, I went to the DirectX Diagnostic Tool and it says ATI Radeon HD 4870 X2, Approx. Total Memory: 3798MB! is it supposed to report that!? is it leeching off the system's ram?:confused: BTW I noticed in games like Dead Space and UT3 that they perform better when i disable the AI in Catalyst Controller, hence only using one of the GPU's.Other games there's a noticable difference in performance if the AI is on standard, hence both GPU's being enabled. Is there a difference between standard and advanced in the Catalyst AI? Thanks!

Are you running the 9.4 drivers by any chance? Ever tried using the 8.12s? Uninstall the drivers, download Driversweeper and run it, then install the 8.12s and see if you encounter the same problems. I've encountered issues with all other drivers apart from the 8.12s, but I haven't tried the 9.4s, waiting for 9.5.

[krag]

Are you running the 9.4 drivers by any chance? Ever tried using the 8.12s? Uninstall the drivers, download Driversweeper and run it, then install the 8.12s and see if you encounter the same problems. I've encountered issues with all other drivers apart from the 8.12s, but I haven't tried the 9.4s, waiting for 9.5.

Interresting that you would say that. I just recently went quadfire 2x4870x2 and could not for the life of me get the 9.4s to enable X-fire even with the AMD hotfix. The 9.3s work fine, but 9.4 is nogo. The drivers I used before on a single 4870x2 that were way stable was the 8.2s that you refer to. Kinda sucks that the way older drivers are the best?

[Baby3ater666]

Yes I am running the current 9.4 drivers. never tried the 8.12! will give that a shot when I'm done with my homework. Hopefully that helps, I might try reconnecting the 6 pin PCIE to from the PSU instead of the one that comes with the card, I do have the 6+2 PCIE pin and the 6 PCIE pin connected. Thanks.

[Neural Net]

Interresting that you would say that. I just recently went quadfire 2x4870x2 and could not for the life of me get the 9.4s to enable X-fire even with the AMD hotfix. The 9.3s work fine, but 9.4 is nogo. The drivers I used before on a single 4870x2 that were way stable was the 8.2s that you refer to. Kinda sucks that the way older drivers are the best?

Yep it's odd. I remember the X2 shipped with the 8.10s that actually produced a snow effect in Crysis, I thought my card was faulty and I was about to return it but I tried the 8.12s and it got rid of the problems. It is weird that the 8.12s seem to be the best, not in terms of raw performance but overall stability, for my setup anyway. If you go on Guru3d a lot of users don't report problems with later drivers, the biggest recurring problem seems to be the GPUs not setting 2D clocks properly. Hopefully the 9.5s will be different.

Yes I am running the current 9.4 drivers. never tried the 8.12! will give that a shot when I'm done with my homework. Hopefully that helps, I might try reconnecting the 6 pin PCIE to from the PSU instead of the one that comes with the card, I do have the 6+2 PCIE pin and the 6 PCIE pin connected. Thanks.

Always use the Pins straight from the power supply if you can, adapters can fail to deliver enough juice. Give the 8.12s a go and let us know how you get on.

[Baby3ater666]

Well I tried the 8.12 drivers and I actually got worse performance! I just installed the new 9.5 drivers and they seem ok I guess, still waiting for ATi to enable Avivo! I recently played Half Life 2 Episode 2 and I was averaging around the 50's outside! In Left 4 Dead when I'm outside I usually get in the high 40's with everything maxed, 8aa 16af. I'm not sure, I've never had any problems or corruption via my GPU, wondering if I need to do a fresh install of vista :bang head I have so much stuff on my computer :(. I guess I'd have to back it all up onto my external hard drive. So do you guys think that a fresh install would help or do u think that my CPU is just raping me of my performance? And like I said, to all of the 4870x2 owners out there, in DXdiag does yours show up as 3798MB under the display tab? I have 6GB of ram so i'm not sure if the GPU is actually leeching off of it or not :confused: Thanks for the help guys!

[sandyduff]

its the cpu thats holding you back... its just killing that cards performance.... you either need to overclock (which youv already said you cant do) or upgrade...

As for dxdiag i have 2809mb

[Neural Net]

Well I tried the 8.12 drivers and I actually got worse performance! I just installed the new 9.5 drivers and they seem ok I guess, still waiting for ATi to enable Avivo! I recently played Half Life 2 Episode 2 and I was averaging around the 50's outside! In Left 4 Dead when I'm outside I usually get in the high 40's with everything maxed, 8aa 16af. I'm not sure, I've never had any problems or corruption via my GPU, wondering if I need to do a fresh install of vista :bang head I have so much stuff on my computer :(. I guess I'd have to back it all up onto my external hard drive. So do you guys think that a fresh install would help or do u think that my CPU is just raping me of my performance? And like I said, to all of the 4870x2 owners out there, in DXdiag does yours show up as 3798MB under the display tab? I have 6GB of ram so i'm not sure if the GPU is actually leeching off of it or not :confused: Thanks for the help guys!

Nope, the Display tab in DXdiag lists 2298MB of memory for me. Can't say I've ever noticed it before though so I don't know what impact varying values have. Go into Catalyst Control Center and go to Information Center - Graphics Hardware. Where it lists the memory, does it say that it's GDDR5 or Hypermemory? If it is Hypermemory then your card is using some system Ram as it's own and that would explain the slowdown. Apparently you can switch this off using ATI Tray Tools, and disabling an option called "disable ATT shared memory". You can download it here (http://www.softpedia.com/get/Tweak/Video-Tweak/ATI-Tray-Tools.shtml), but I cannot vouch for it's reliability or that it will work as I haven't tried it, but it might be worth a shot.

its the cpu thats holding you back... its just killing that cards performance.... you either need to overclock (which youv already said you cant do) or upgrade...

As for dxdiag i have 2809mb

His CPU is holding him back, but it shouldn't be crippling his system. Especially when he's playing at 1920x1080, the GPU should be less dependent on the CPU in this scenario?

[Baby3ater666]

I just installed ATi Tray Tools but I can't use it! The warning box says, "Can not connnect to low level driver. Please reinstall ATi Tray Tools under Local system adminstrator account or try to start driver manually using "Low Level Driver Installation" shortcut!" Any ideas? BTW I just got COD WaW for 24.99 at Steam:). I'm averaging about in the 40's and 50's in intense battles and whatnot. Also as well, it reports it as GDDR5 which is a good thing!

[Neural Net]

I just installed ATi Tray Tools but I can't use it! The warning box says, "Can not connnect to low level driver. Please reinstall ATi Tray Tools under Local system adminstrator account or try to start driver manually using "Low Level Driver Installation" shortcut!" Any ideas? BTW I just got COD WaW for 24.99 at Steam:). I'm averaging about in the 40's and 50's in intense battles and whatnot. Also as well, it reports it as GDDR5 which is a good thing!

Apparently a reinstall fixes it, so try to install it again without installing it first and see if that helps. The only other thing I can suggest is booting into safe mode and installing it.

[Baby3ater666]

No luck! My system must have something against it... BTW I've noticed that some of my games here and there start up by themselves! I'm wondering if i'm going to have to do a fresh install :(

[Neural Net]

No luck! My system must have something against it... BTW I've noticed that some of my games here and there start up by themselves! I'm wondering if i'm going to have to do a fresh install :(

Possibly. You can always check to see what apps start up on your install by going to Control Panel - Administrative Tools - System Configuration - Start Up tab.

[Baby3ater666]

I just spoke to one of my friends and he said i could unlock my bios with some stuff. ;). maybe i will be able to oc and get my performance after all! Hopefully, going to backup everything just in case!

[Neural Net]

I just spoke to one of my friends and he said i could unlock my bios with some stuff. ;). maybe i will be able to oc and get my performance after all! Hopefully, going to backup everything just in case!

Nice! To see good performance you'll need 3.2Ghz or more on your Quad which should be pretty easy. Ideally try to aim for 3.4-3.6Ghz.

[Baby3ater666]

Would I do this in the bios or with some program? I've never OC'd before. I've been doing research and a lot of people say they do it from the bios. Would you recommend a nice way to doing this?

[Neural Net]

Would I do this in the bios or with some program? I've never OC'd before. I've been doing research and a lot of people say they do it from the bios. Would you recommend a nice way to doing this?

It's done in the BIOS. Have a read of this guide to get you started - link (http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=515316). Good luck. :)

[Baby3ater666]

Hi everyone! I just ran the 3DMark Vantage and my 3DMark Score is 11,407. My CPU score is 9,496 and my Graphics score is 12,226. Does that sound around the lines with what you 4870x2 users are getting? P.S. Don't buy Dell, They will not OC no matter what = (. I'm pretty positive that my PSU is giving the card all the juice it needs, afterall, Dell said that it would satisfy it's needs!

[sandyduff]

My 3dmark vantage score (set to performance) is 15243 (15094 for GPU and 15708 for cpu) so that shows you how much your cpu is holding back that x2

[Rich'[ard]]

Unfortunately from what I've heard the bios is locked. :confused: I did a run with 3DMark06 and scored 13,723. Is that what I should be getting with my setup?
massive CPU bottleneck.
i get the same score as you do with my 512MB 4850 and 3.2ghz e6400 (pretty ancient).

oc that CPU! :santa:

[[BIOS]O.o]

My god... 13k on 3dmark06.... Massive failboat. its not your fault... well... yeah it kinda is but its out of your hands now...

[Neuromancer]

2.5GHz will def bottleneck the card... when i went from 3.2GHz to 4GHz i saw a massive boost in graphical performance

It is not a matter of bottlenecking, Crysis uses the CPU. IT is a system optimized game. (Technically it is multithreaded game, although the benefits of quad vs dual are very limited in this particular instance, unlike other games that are multithreaded, you will only see a few percentage points increase running a quad on crysis.

Did not look at stats, but if you find your scores are lower than what a 4870 should be, dont know why it is a mystery, but I posted a link to the hotfix over at techreaction.net, (tool azy to look it up) apparently the 4870x2 scores lower than a 4870 sometimes.

Dunno why KTE led me to beleive it was some big insider secret since there is a MS patch for it :s

[Badbonji]

I get 11k on my laptop with P9500 overclocked and a HD4850 mobility...
Contact Dell to see if there is anything wrong and you need to RMA something...

[Baby3ater666]

I finally decided you know what? To hell with Dell:mad:! I just picked up an Antec nine hundred case with a Thermaltake Black Widow CPU fan (big as hell) from Best Buy, and of course, a new motherboard from which I chose the Asus P5Q3 P45:D from Newegg. What do you guys think? I will probably be recieving the mobo around Saturday. I just wish that I wasn't so damn stupid to buy a Dell in the first place :cry: Will I be able to get my performance worth now since I plan on overclocking that CPU? BTW it's still the Intel Q8300 @2.5GHZ. BOYCOTT DELL!:thup:

Intel Core 2 Quad Q8300@2.5GHZ
750GB HDD
6GB Dual DDR3@1066MHZ
VisionTek ATi Radeon HD 4870 x2
Creative SB X-FI Titanium Fatal1ty Pro
OCZ Gamexstream 700PSU
LG Blu-ray.
Running on Vista Home Premium x64 & 7 RC x64