Hose Clamps (a cautionary tale)

[ned3000]

I ordered the wrong size hose clamps when building my system (underestimating the thickness of the Tygon tubing) so I put cable ties on all the fittings. Everything was cool until my pump died (Swiftech 355.)

I got a new pump, mounted my reservoir top on it and placed it on top of the case to bleed the loop. One of the connections leaked and I discovered that the Antec 1200 case with the giant fan on top provides a perfect path for fluid to leak directly onto one's video card.

My question is: What's the best way to prevent that kind of leak? There are compression fittings, plastic hose clamps, traditional automotive type clamps, etc.

If you're thinking "This guy's kind of a moron," I'll give you some additional evidence. I tried to drain the fluid out of my video card and somehow managed to get it into the power supply and then that failed too; there was a loud capacitor explosion.

[Bobnova]

My question is: What's the best way to prevent that kind of leak?

Don't use zipties. Problem solved :P


I'm partial to screw drive clamps.

[Daddyjaxx]

100% worm clamps except on my D5. That's snug enough to use the plastic snap clamps.

[Ben333]

I use metal screw type clamps when I have them. Make sure they are the right size, too big is no good. When using zip ties, use the good ones, not the ones that stretch with normal tightening and put one going each way on the hose. I also like the type of clamps that you squeeze with pliers to loosen then let go of to tighten. They work well and look great.

[Conumdrum]

Moral of the story, poop happens, caps go boom. It could happen to any of us. Better luck next time.

You had the AC to the PSU still plugged in and you were tearing down a loop in the PC?

Ouch.........

[thorilan]

zip ties are great if you know how to use them and you use the proper ones. that being said its few people that actually buy the correct ones and know just how tight and where on the barbs to put them and at what orientations

so most people dont bother with them.

i still have about 100k of them left ( i stocked up on them when they tore down an old motor pool building for our humvee's and didnt take them with)

when you get hose clamps you have to make sure that not only do they fit , but that they also dont dig into the tubing underneath from the housing or from the gear going all the way through .

[thorilan]

bobnova do you live in eureka?

[Bobnova]

Bout six miles north. Not to be off topic or anything :D

[Spawn-Inc]

the best clamps are the fuel line worm gear style that are smooth on the inside, so there is less digging into the tubing.

http://commonwealthinc.ca.c9.previewyoursite.com/ESW/Images/2123_fuel_line_clamps.jpg

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41bj7%2BWLhmL._AA280_.jpg


but i do use mostly plastic clamps and 6 gear clamps.

[atomic ferret]

Or use evil's clamps over at XS. They are gorgeous.

[gsrcrxsi]

+1 for zip ties for me. easier to work with IMO. i use 7/16" tubing on 1/2" barbs so i honestly dont even need zip ties or clamps, but i use the ties for piece of mind. they are very snug and not a single leak. been running zip ties for about 6 mo now, no issues

[hokiealumnus]

I'm paranoid and use worm drive clamps all around (with the one exception my pump/res, where I use Herbie clips) on 7/16" tubing with 1/2" barbs. We're playing with water inside a computer...you are always better safe than sorry.

[markp1989]

i have 7/16" tubing with 1/2" barbs and use jubilee clips, just to stop me worying.

[QuietIce]

Jubilee clips, Herbie clips - if nothing else this thread has expanded my vocabulary! :)


I prefer SS hose clamps w/brass screws. These are the better screw clamps you can usually buy at a good auto parts store and they have a very smooth motion. Over 35 years of working on and owning old cars I've seen them stand up to abuse I couldn't believe at times. If applied properly they won't ruin your tubing unless they're left on there for years, in which case you need to change the tubing anyway! ;)

My second choice is ring clamps. Not so easy to apply without the proper pliers but they look good and will also last a long time.
I ordered the wrong size hose clamps when building my system (underestimating the thickness of the Tygon tubing) so I put cable ties on all the fittings. Everything was cool until my pump died (Swiftech 355.) Wow! A 355 died?!? :eek:

Mark your calendar - it doesn't happen very often ...

[Bobnova]

The screw ones are good stuff, they're used for EFI hose connections where it has to take 45psi or more. Much nicer action then the worm drive clamps, but they don't have nearly the range of motion and they cost more. For a water cooling setup they're gold if you can find 'em.

[ned3000]

This site is an oasis of civility and helpfulness in the otherwise hostile desert of internet forums :).

I'm liking the smooth metal clamps that Spawn-Inc linked to. Where do I get those?

Wow! A 355 died?!?

Mark your calendar - it doesn't happen very often ...


Early in its life it sucked in a bunch of air after my cat knocked it over with the top opened. Feline induced cavitation is probably my problem not Swiftech's.

[Spawn-Inc]

here is a good place to get them online, otherwise look for fuel line clamps at a hardware or car store.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#worm-gear-hose-clamps/=3bl3sc

[QuietIce]

This site is an oasis of civility and helpfulness in the otherwise hostile desert of internet forums :).

I'm liking the smooth metal clamps that Spawn-Inc linked to. Where do I get those?



Early in its life it sucked in a bunch of air after my cat knocked it over with the top opened. Feline induced cavitation is probably my problem not Swiftech's. *lightbulb* - that would explain the early failure ...

[ricflairw000]

This site is an oasis of civility and helpfulness in the otherwise hostile desert of internet forums :).


agreed some of the other ones jump down your throat :(
the best clamps are the fuel line worm gear style that are smooth on the inside, so there is less digging into the tubing.

http://commonwealthinc.ca.c9.previewyoursite.com/ESW/Images/2123_fuel_line_clamps.jpg

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41bj7%2BWLhmL._AA280_.jpg


but i do use mostly plastic clamps and 6 gear clamps.

Mercedes benz uses the non worm gear for the fuel hoses 5mm
part number 001 997 69 90

the best clamp is the T bolt calmp

http://www.siliconeintakes.com/images/product/tbolt_picture.jpg

but it really is over kill for our applications

[thorilan]

over kill? whats that?
;)

[ricflairw000]

over kill? whats that?
;)
its over kill says the guy that has a 3x120 and 2x120 for a cpu and gpu that isnt overclocked yet hahhaa

[jr1]

I too prefere the fuellineclamps and if i'm not mistaken you can even get them with rounded edges
At least i think i saw that somewhere
Ohh and overkill never heard of it
Running 2 X 220 rads myselve on a cpu non oced ;-))

[aphellyon]

Or use evil's clamps over at XS. They are gorgeous.

What, those are real? Thought they were just render'd... :)

[ricflairw000]

I too prefere the fuellineclamps and if i'm not mistaken you can even get them with rounded edges
At least i think i saw that somewhere
Ohh and overkill never heard of it
Running 2 X 220 rads myselve on a cpu non oced ;-))
ahhh you and i are in the same boat too hahhaha


yes some clamps do have rolled edges :D

[Bobnova]

Only too much is enough, right?


That's my way of thinking. It gets me into trouble.

[ricflairw000]

Only too much is enough, right?


That's my way of thinking. It gets me into trouble.
Seems like everyone on this forum is on the same page lol

[Conumdrum]

Just enuff to make the credit card smoke is my overkill. I'm finally getting my CC back to earthly limits after my last build. It's better than hanging at a cheap bar.

[ricflairw000]

Just enuff to make the credit card smoke is my overkill. I'm finally getting my CC back to earthly limits after my last build. It's better than hanging at a cheap bar.
I have to go to the cheap bar after this build I am in it for a little over 900$ with the case :lol

[voigts]

Using 7/16" ID tubing over 1/2" Bitspower barbs is the first thing to do to prevent leaks. It takes dipping the ends of the tubing in boiling water to get them over the barbs, and once they cool, they are so tight you have to cut them off. With 7/16" tubing and Bitspower barbs, I just use zip ties. I put two zip ties facing opposite directions onto each tubing/barb connection. I have yet to have a leak using this combination, and I leaktest my setups at 9-10psi with air pressure before filling.

That is another way to prevent this. I use a cheap $13 vacuum gauge that I got from Harbor Freight and a small air compressor (could easily use a simple bicycle pump) to pump up a loop that I've put together to 9-10psi. The least little leak will show up on the gauge, and it is easy to hear the hiss of air leaking. This way if there is a leak, I just have to take it apart and fix it. Too easy. A standard watercooling loop is usually only about 2-3psi, so if it doesn't leak at 9-10psi, it doesn't leak. http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=478351

When i used 1/2"ID tubing over 1/2" barbs, I used smooth lined metal clamps from Mcmaster. They worked great and could be tightened down like crazy. I also used plastic clamps from Mcmaster and they worked great as well. Their plastic clamps are very heavy duty.

There is nothing wrong also with compression fittings as a lot of people use them and they work fine also.

[ricflairw000]

OK i was using air to test for leaks :D
I was up around 15PSI and listened for leaks and fixed them too
I now know i was waaaay overkill haha

good to know it only runs on 2-3 PSI :) thanks for the info

[ascl]

Using air for leak testing is a great idea!

[Daddyjaxx]

But testing with air could cause leaks that would never happen with water due to the much greater pressure.

[Spawn-Inc]

Using 7/16" ID tubing over 1/2" Bitspower barbs is the first thing to do to prevent leaks. It takes dipping the ends of the tubing in boiling water to get them over the barbs, and once they cool, they are so tight you have to cut them off.

thanks for the flash backs! sliced my finger cutting tubing that way.

But testing with air could cause leaks that would never happen with water due to the much greater pressure.

5 psi should be enough for testing and not cause issues. i wouldn't go above 10psi as the rads aren't meant to handle a lot of pressure.

[rainless]

I ordered the wrong size hose clamps when building my system (underestimating the thickness of the Tygon tubing) so I put cable ties on all the fittings. Everything was cool until my pump died (Swiftech 355.)

I got a new pump, mounted my reservoir top on it and placed it on top of the case to bleed the loop. One of the connections leaked and I discovered that the Antec 1200 case with the giant fan on top provides a perfect path for fluid to leak directly onto one's video card.

My question is: What's the best way to prevent that kind of leak? There are compression fittings, plastic hose clamps, traditional automotive type clamps, etc.

If you're thinking "This guy's kind of a moron," I'll give you some additional evidence. I tried to drain the fluid out of my video card and somehow managed to get it into the power supply and then that failed too; there was a loud capacitor explosion.

I got some of my hose clamps from Home Depot. Got others from Menards. But the BEST clamps I got were a pack of 20 clamps at the dollar store. They were just the right size.

It took a lot of experimenting though. Bags of clamps at Home Depot and Menards were mislabeled. They were scattered all over the place. Two clamps labeled to be the same size wouldn't fit on two different ends of the same hose...

I don't think you need anything fancy. Plain old metal clamps. They stay in a moving car for five or ten years, they'll stay in your water cooler just fine.

[ascl]

There was a picture on the xtremesystems forums (I think) of someone that hooked up their rad to the mains water to flush it... and I guess they blocked the end, and the tubes blew out! Definitely don't introduce too much pressure to your loop.

[Spawn-Inc]

There was a picture on the xtremesystems forums (I think) of someone that hooked up their rad to the mains water to flush it... and I guess they blocked the end, and the tubes blew out! Definitely don't introduce too much pressure to your loop.

yes i've heard of that and would love to see it. but city pressure is about 45psi-60psi. so 5 or even 10 shouldn't do anything. but someone said they blew up a plexi res at 10 psi when they blocked one end.

[ascl]

Here ya go spawn:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=187491&highlight=psi

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=78453&stc=1&d=1210543801

[Bobnova]

Mains around here are 70-75psi, enough to blow up all sorts of stuff :P

[Spawn-Inc]

wow, bad. but that wasn't what i was expecting. i was thinking it split like a banana for some reason.

[QuietIce]

yes i've heard of that and would love to see it. but city pressure is about 45psi-60psi. so 5 or even 10 shouldn't do anything. but someone said they blew up a plexi res at 10 psi when they blocked one end. IIRC the max pressure for an MCP-355 is almost 9 psi (just over 6 mH2O). There are times I've pinched off a hose to "jog" the system and clear out some stubborn pocket of bubbles. To me that makes 9-10 psi almost perfect for a static air pressure test.


IMO - If something blew out at 10 psi then it was faulty to begin with ...

[voigts]

But testing with air could cause leaks that would never happen with water due to the much greater pressure.

It depends on how certain you want to be that you setup is tight, within reason of course. I know that if my setup doesn't leak at all at around 9-10psi, I absolutely do not have any leaks. If the loop is properly put together, 10psi is no problem at all for it to handle.

IMO - If something blew out at 10 psi then it was faulty to begin with ...

Exactly. +1

[ricflairw000]

three small leaks last night :( (one drip every 5 seconds)
i took everything out and got it sorted outside the case going to put it back in and go at it agian. The case was wet so thats also why i pulled everything out

that was the first time i fired up the loop

[ascl]

What was leaking? Did you fix it? How?

[ricflairw000]

What was leaking? Did you fix it? How?
well i have this hoakey set up for the raidaitor outlet because the 90* wont let me put a clamp on it.
so i have a strait out to a 90 so its three clamps within 3 inches.
one was from there one was a fitting loose on a radiator
last one was a random clamp

[ascl]

Ah okay. Was just curious... you have it fixed now I hope?

[ricflairw000]

OK i cant lie anymore, i had one geyser of a leak. a hose wasn't even on when i fired it up that's why my case has to dry out hahaha


I am testing it right now :D so far so good
I will put it back in the case tonight if all goes well

[aphellyon]

OK i cant lie anymore, i had one geyser of a leak. a hose wasn't even on when i fired it up that's why my case has to dry out hahaha

:eek:

[ricflairw000]

:eek:
yeah it was a mess I was only using water at the time so no problems there haha. I was half way smart about that. But i have sound deading foamy stuff from petras so that has to dry out

Its suppose to hit 100* today at my house so by the time I head home from work it should be all dried and ready to rock

[aphellyon]

Make sure your components are bone dry before you fire it up man... or this could turn into a freak'n greek tragedy. :D

[ricflairw000]

Make sure your components are bone dry before you fire it up man... or this could turn into a freak'n greek tragedy. :D
I dont have components in yet haha
just testing the res pump T radiators
so next is the blocks hahhaha
getting to be a pro before i put it on the actual components, no room for error there :D

If I had a dollar for every time I thought "ok this is the last time i am putting it together its good to go" this build would be free

[aphellyon]

Ahhh.... I gotcha.

[nzaneb]

getting to be a pro before i put it on the actual components, no room for error there :D

I'd say you made the right choice!! So you really forgot to attach a hose!? :D I commend you for your honest, and thank you for making me laugh. As I could almost see your face when you heard the sound that all H2O guys fear, gushing water... :bang head

Glad you didn't hurt anything though :thup:

[ricflairw000]

I'd say you made the right choice!! So you really forgot to attach a hose!? :D I commend you for your honest, and thank you for making me laugh. As I could almost see your face when you heard the sound that all H2O guys fear, gushing water... :bang head

Glad you didn't hurt anything though :thup:
I was thinking "holy crap!!!! the tank of the radiator must have ripped off !!!!" it was just dumping water lol


I took it off to get to a leaky fitting and got the fitting taken care of and fired it up haha

[BobbyBubblehead]

my rigs in bits right now on a crate... Lian armoursuit on its way :D
and so after cleaning some of my blocks and stuff and throwing it back together in some fasion so I could use it in its down time?
I set it rocking and all was well on a crate and six bolts #Chuckles#
the day after I take a look to see how the cpu block looks after re-seating the o-ring and such and I noticed its fine but I forgot to tighten the hose clamps! on the block (Dingbat!)

anyhow no problems... except for a different smoking board from earlyer (another stupid tale) :rolleyes:

im on a destruction roll right now though so that was lucky!

starting to feel I always sease to amaze myself :-/

lets hope I can get it into the shiny new expensive case without wrecking anything anyhow. now I have to double check to see if I even tightend the clamps up in the first instance :shrug:

heres hoping im over my dose of stupid :)

[MongGrel]

This site is an oasis of civility and helpfulness in the otherwise hostile desert of internet forums :).

I'm liking the smooth metal clamps that Spawn-Inc linked to. Where do I get those?



Early in its life it sucked in a bunch of air after my cat knocked it over with the top opened. Feline induced cavitation is probably my problem not Swiftech's.

I just had to add my remark to this one, one of the reason's I love OCF.

The civility of everyone, anyone gets too rude they get corrected pretty fast from what I've seen :)

That or they aren't here long.

:beer:

[aphellyon]

I just had to add my remark to this one, one of the reason's I love OCF.

The civility of everyone, anyone gets too rude they get corrected pretty fast from what I've seen :)

That or they aren't here long.

:beer:

Here here! :beer:

[markp1989]

I just had to add my remark to this one, one of the reason's I love OCF.

The civility of everyone, anyone gets too rude they get corrected pretty fast from what I've seen :)

That or they aren't here long.

:beer:


I must agree :D . one of the only forums i have been in where i can ask basic questions without being flamed at for not already knowing the answer.

:D

[ricflairw000]

I must agree :D . one of the only forums i have been in where i can ask basic questions without being flamed at for not already knowing the answer.

:D
Yeah i get that vibe too on other forums

[QuietIce]

Everybody on this board was a n00b at some point and most of us try not to forget that. If you do see a bit of rudeness it's more probably a couple of older members having a "minor" disagreement ... ;)

[aphellyon]

I must agree :D . one of the only forums i have been in where i can ask basic questions without being flamed at for not already knowing the answer.

:D

Hee hee, yup.

Noob: Anybody here know how to....

Leets: :temper::mad::rolleyes::argue::sn:

Noob: :-/ ... don't flame me bro...

[ricflairw000]

Everybody on this board was a n00b at some point and most of us try not to forget that. If you do see a bit of rudeness it's more probably a couple of older members having a "minor" disagreement ... ;)
Ive seen this "minor" disagreement haha

[BobbyBubblehead]

anyhow back to clamps for a minute here (dont want to interupt the love #Chuckles#)

I fitted out an armoursuit case today and used the trusty screw clamps and while priming the loop I notice its running out the NB block and onto my gtx280 :(

the clamps where as tight as can be without ripping the block off the board but they still failed.

so I stuck on a couple of cheap (dirty cheap clamps) and its fine now, give or take the soaking.

so now im failing to see the point in buying the dedicated variety because there more likely to fail.

seems its just a loose bore tubing and when the dedicated clamps were tightened it caused a crease in the radius of the pipe and room for the coolant to end up everywhere.

seems ok now.... just hope it doesnt fry when I flick the switch.

did it ten hours or more back and ive had a 30inch fan blowing in there so maybe by tomorrow we should be safe by some margin.

anyone begs to differ then please shout up before I go flicking the switch.

im havin a grim week... wasted two machines to some degree.

:shrug:

[ricflairw000]

make sure there is no watter in the connectors or on the pins inside the boards.

i use the worm gears from the hardware store.

[voigts]

Two things you have to watch out for with metal worm drive clamps are first that they are no more than 3/8" wide, which often the clamps at hardware stores are wider, and second, that you don't accidentally put the end of the clamps onto the wrench area at the base of the barb.

[ricflairw000]

Two things you have to watch out for with metal worm drive clamps are first that they are no more than 3/8" wide, which often the clamps at hardware stores are wider, and second, that you don't accidentally put the end of the clamps onto the wrench area at the base of the barb.
Yeah these hardware ones are pretty wide they are almost the size of the barb

[BobbyBubblehead]

two fine pointers indeed.

I just had a bad combination of a generous bore 3/8 tubing combined with the block on the Gigabyte GA-EP45 Extreme board, there slightly undersize compaired to a normal 3/8 barb.
so the grub part of the clamp was oversize by a few mm and beyond the clamps smallest config.

much as voigts has pointed out.

it just kind of seaped a ittle and collected on the gtx280 EK ram back plate... I carnt determin if any has run into the redundant fixing holes and got on the pcb without breaking the card down and that means ordering new thermal pads first.... so im gonna wait it out.

still have the dry gtx260 underneath it but safest to leave it until the morning.... maybe use a spare psu and run the loops overnight.

[muddocktor]

Two things you have to watch out for with metal worm drive clamps are first that they are no more than 3/8" wide, which often the clamps at hardware stores are wider, and second, that you don't accidentally put the end of the clamps onto the wrench area at the base of the barb.

Yeah, the narrower worm drive clamps are much easier and better to make an effective seal on the tubing sizes we use. The 1/2" wide clamps are much harder to get an effective, water-tight seal with on 1/2-3/8" ID tubing.

[ricflairw000]

Yeah, the narrower worm drive clamps are much easier and better to make an effective seal on the tubing sizes we use. The 1/2" wide clamps are much harder to get an effective, water-tight seal with on 1/2-3/8" ID tubing.
it was a bit hard but no leaks ............. now haha

[QuietIce]

That's the one major advantage of ring clamps - no issues with width! But getting just the right size is critical with them and the pliers can be a pain to use in tight places ...