Raid 1 vs other backup methods, need advice please

[Zonnza]

So I never used a raid 1 setup. I also never used a method like having a 2nd harddrive (external or internal) and just regularly copy pasting data into it.

I was discussing raid 1 with 2 of my computer buddies since I was expecting at least 1 of them to use it. Both don't, one told me he uses a 2tb network drive and just backs everything up from his multiple computers to it. Not something I would want to do since I dont use multiple computers. Althought he told me that if he was in my shoe's, he would just get a external HDD and backup data to it regularly. The other guy was the one I expected to have lots of data to store, found out he only keeps less then 20gb of extra data and doesnt care if it gets deleted. The rest of his stuff is on DVDs and CDs and his single 32gb usb stick.

I have a 320gb HDD currently and it has 250gb +/- worth of data on it. The usual stuff: music, self made movies, documents for school, saved files for games/programs (application data stuff), etc etc.

I originally was going to buy 2 new HDDs (500 or 750gb ones), and make a raid 1 out of them. But raid 1 confuses me; I read that if one of the two drives fails, then you cant use the other drive untill you replace the failed one. I also don't know how I would go about moving data to the new raid 1 setup. Would I have to move the 250gb of data to one of the new HDDs and then build a raid 1 array and it will mirror it over... or do I have to build the raid 1 first then move all the data over? I was also told I can build a raid 1 array with the 320gb HDD and 1 of the new HDDs and then remove the 320gb HDD and plug in the 2nd new HDD and rebuild the array.


Now I don't know what to do, should I stick with getting raid 1 or just buy 2 new HDD and an external enclosure(optional) and regularly backup data. Also, internal drive thru sata connection OR esata external enclosure OR usb external enclosure, which is better?

Any advice would be cool,
Zonnza

[jgv115]

I'll use your WD 320GB as example:

Since you already have 250gb worth of stuff on it. You would have to copy the stuff all out to an external source, then buy the same drive and set up the RAID1 array. When you set up any RAID array it deletes everything on the drive. After you have set it up, go into windows drive manager or whatever and format the unallocated space. There is your RAID1 drive.

Then just copy all the files over and you have your RAID1 array...

When one of the drives fail, (I'm not so sure about this bit) you can go into the bootrom and recover the files (from the mirrored drive) then everything will be fine.

If I were you, I would just buy another one of those 320gb drives and put them in RAID1. Also tell your friend to stop backing up his stuff to dvds. DVDs have shorter lifespans than HDDs and they can also break easier.

[CompuTamer]

So I never used a raid 1 setup. I also never used a method like having a 2nd harddrive (external or internal) and just regularly copy pasting data into it.

I was discussing raid 1 with 2 of my computer buddies since I was expecting at least 1 of them to use it. Both don't, one told me he uses a 2tb network drive and just backs everything up from his multiple computers to it. Not something I would want to do since I dont use multiple computers. Althought he told me that if he was in my shoe's, he would just get a external HDD and backup data to it regularly. The other guy was the one I expected to have lots of data to store, found out he only keeps less then 20gb of extra data and doesnt care if it gets deleted. The rest of his stuff is on DVDs and CDs and his single 32gb usb stick.

I have a 320gb HDD currently and it has 250gb +/- worth of data on it. The usual stuff: music, self made movies, documents for school, saved files for games/programs (application data stuff), etc etc.

I originally was going to buy 2 new HDDs (500 or 750gb ones), and make a raid 1 out of them. But raid 1 confuses me; I read that if one of the two drives fails, then you cant use the other drive untill you replace the failed one. I also don't know how I would go about moving data to the new raid 1 setup. Would I have to move the 250gb of data to one of the new HDDs and then build a raid 1 array and it will mirror it over... or do I have to build the raid 1 first then move all the data over? I was also told I can build a raid 1 array with the 320gb HDD and 1 of the new HDDs and then remove the 320gb HDD and plug in the 2nd new HDD and rebuild the array.


Now I don't know what to do, should I stick with getting raid 1 or just buy 2 new HDD and an external enclosure(optional) and regularly backup data. Also, internal drive thru sata connection OR esata external enclosure OR usb external enclosure, which is better?

Any advice would be cool,
Zonnza


I've used RAID 1 for a bit now, and with the built in RAID function on the Intel Chipsets, if you have a drive fail, you can still access the one good drive in the volume to get your data off, or to even use to run your OS. I had a drive fail in my RAID a few months back, and didn't loose a single bit of data (besides what was on the OS partition. That was a RAID 0 partition though.) So i think just building the RAID, and then mirroring your current drive/copying all the files over would be your best option.

[Zonnza]

Well I want to get 'rid' of my reliance on this 320gb drive since it is old. Im going to buy 2 new drives, probably 500gb ones and use those in raid 1. From what you guys mentioned, I guess id have to build the raid 1 array with the 2 500gb drives then copy over w/e i want from the 320gb drive.

But Im somewhat still confused what happens if let say one of the 2 500gb drives fails in the raid 1. Will my computer freak out and tell me I have a bad drive? Im going to be using the onboard raid on my mobo and it is an intel chipset.

I want to know if ill have to delete the raid to be able to use the good drive or if ill be able to just boot into windows normall with the good drive still in raid and use it still... I know that if you break a raid array, at least with raid0, it says it will delete all data and has a Y/N option... I read somewhere before that for raid1 you still press Y and it wont delete your data... is this right?

And rebuilding an array is a whole different story, from what I learned all you need to do is go into your raid config (control+I) on my system bootup and it will have a new option to rebuild it?

Still very confusing to me, so any help would be great.

[TheGame240]

If all you're looking for is a backup solution, I would go with an external SATA drive. Or even a drive/docking station combo.

I think you should consider what RAID 1 is meant to do, and that is minimize downtime. It's not meant as a permanent backup solution. It does have its uses, but you should be aware of the drawbacks.


Raid 1 would give you:
Duplicate data on two drives.

Less downtime (as far as I can remember you can continue to run if a drive fails as long as one is still good). Replace the damaged drive and restoring is a matter of waiting for the controller to mirror the old drive.

Increase in read performance.


Pitfalls of Raid 1 as a backup:
Slight performance hit in write speeds.

Backup drive is not only housed at the same location as the primary, but in the same system. That means any sort of catastrophic failure (power surge, physical damage to the case, etc.) could result in both sets of data being lost.

Both copies of your data is exposed at all times. That means accidental deletes, virus exposures, etc. would expose both drives at once.

While you may only need GB now it's easier to up your storage if you use an external drive as a backup and overbuy the backup drive. For instance I had 80G OS drive, 200G storage drive and a 200G backup drive. I decided to upgrade my storage so I purchased a 500G drive to use as a backup and moved the 200G backup drive to a storage drive. The next upgrade I purchased a 750G backup drive and moved one of the 200Gs to my OS drive and made the 200G and 500G my data drives. My next purchase will probably be a 1-1.5TB drive and I'll move the 500G and 750G drive to data duty with a SSD as an OS drive. With a Raid backup solution I would of had to buy two drives every time I wanted to up my data storage capabilities. As it was I was able to just purchase a drive at a time and buy at the sweet spot for $/GB.

I would personally go the external drive/docking station route myself. Unless you have a strong need for the increased read performance.

[Zonnza]

Both copies of your data is exposed at all times. That means accidental deletes, virus exposures, etc. would expose both drives at once.

While you may only need GB now it's easier to up your storage if you use an external drive as a backup and overbuy the backup drive. For instance I had 80G OS drive, 200G storage drive and a 200G backup drive. I decided to upgrade my storage so I purchased a 500G drive to use as a backup and moved the 200G backup drive to a storage drive. The next upgrade I purchased a 750G backup drive and moved one of the 200Gs to my OS drive and made the 200G and 500G my data drives. My next purchase will probably be a 1-1.5TB drive and I'll move the 500G and 750G drive to data duty with a SSD as an OS drive. With a Raid backup solution I would of had to buy two drives every time I wanted to up my data storage capabilities. As it was I was able to just purchase a drive at a time and buy at the sweet spot for $/GB.

I would personally go the external drive/docking station route myself. Unless you have a strong need for the increased read performance.

I didnt consider the first, I havnt had issues with viruses or spyware in years since I don't go around doing dumb stuff on the internet.

The upgrading thing really never occured to me. I didn't think I would use a HDD for more then 3-5 years at a time so the cost wouldnt be that big of a deal. But I guess that if I get 1 new 500gb drive and an enclosure for it, I can only put it into use for transfering data once a week or so and then unplug it for the rest of the time.

Well I havn't purchased any new drives yet and probably wont for a few weeks cause of school midterms and projects starting up.

Now I guess ill lean away from raid 1 cause I live in florida and thunderstorms do cause a lot of power surges here in the rainy season. So having an external drive and only plugging it in for backing up would be a better idea i guess...

[amer1337]

imo raid1 isnt a good backup solution because say in your situation one of the two 500gb drives failed...

TRUE you can still use the "degraded" array with one good and one failed drive, but as soon as you pull the dead drive out to rma it your unable to access your data until you install a new drive and begin to rebuild the array.

If i knew this personally before creating my mirrored array i would have just installed them as seperate drives and used a program like syncback to periodically copy new/improved data to the second drive and use that as backup. This is also beneficial in the sense that if my mobo gets fried by a thunderstorm or i spill juice on it and short it out, i am now free to upgrade to a better mobo/cpu combo instead of being stuck trying to find a board with the same raid controller to save all my data. (of course a moot point if you use an external raid card, but you mentioned you were going to go with an onboard chipset that intel has in your board)

[deathman20]

I originally was considering a Raid 1 solution in my server. Then went to a backup idea. Course the drive is still housed in the same case (til I decide to remove it from the case and use a seperate housing) it is strictly a backup drive and partitioned as such so only the backup software can read it.

Its better practice to do backups instead of relying on a raid array to protect your data. As well doing backups, you might be able to fit say 1TB of data onto a 640Gig drive or less depending on its compressibility by the software and how much CPU power you want to use during the backup.

My main OS drive on my PC goes from ~45Gigs to 24Gigs. Backups have there uses.

[Nikooo]

Interesting question comes to mind,
what happens if the motherboard dies (and you have done the raid with the built in raid controller)
can you put one of the mirrored HDDs in a USB enclosure or inside another PC and see
the contents?

[Mr.Guvernment]

TRUE you can still use the "degraded" array with one good and one failed drive, but as soon as you pull the dead drive out to rma it your unable to access your data until you install a new drive and begin to rebuild the array.


Wrong, you can access your data as it is all in tact on the other drive, you will just run as a degraded status, that is the point of raid to allow access to data even with a drive failure.


with raid 1 ideally you should be able to read the drive by putting it into another system, ideally that is, sometimes some raid controllers dont play nice with arrays made in other systems or chipsets, this is why Raid is NOT a backup.

[mattspalace]

You could always just use the backup utility in MS Windows. It works fine. Just select the files and/or drives, select a schedule, and let it run. That's how my dual 640GB WDs are set up and it works like a champ - provided you leave your computer on.

[Hawker-rider]

I tried raid 1 for a while, but wasn't very impressed with it, I didn't have a drive failure or anything like that though.

I decided to go to Raid0 for the speed for my OS and data. I use a program called "save'n'sync" it's a small program that comes in a few different versions, for backup.
It let's me schedule an enormous amount of different folders to backup, there's anoption that it will only change the new data on the backup, so it's pretty quick to do it. instead of having an external drive I just have an IDE drive in my system that's not hooked up to the power molex, this to limit the up-time for the drive and therefore increasing reliability.

[Xaotic]

Interesting question comes to mind,
what happens if the motherboard dies (and you have done the raid with the built in raid controller)
can you put one of the mirrored HDDs in a USB enclosure or inside another PC and see
the contents?

Not a bad question. For arrays beyond two drives, you normally will need an ICH-xR chipset to attach the drives onto. For a two drive RAID-1, you should be able to read the data fine from either of the mirrors. In the event that Windows has issues with the partition tables, recovery software will allow direct access for copying the data off of the disk. Needless to say, once there is a failure, the first task is to ensure the integrity of the data. The "good" drive needs to be treated as read only until data is secure.

For more complex configurations, I have had three boards die under varying Intel matrix RAID setups. Two of mine and a customer's. Mine have full regular backups. l have been able to recover the data when switching or upgrading various ICH-xR chipsets. These include a matrixed RAID-0 and RAID-5, no data loss, RAID-10 and RAID-5, no data loss, and a customer's single OS drive with supplemental RAID-0(for data storage, go figure), also no data loss. YMMV.

All that said, the most important lesson is, RAID is NOT a backup. Data corruption can occur and simply be propagated by the RAID till all drives are corrupt.