PDA

View Full Version : Price increases on the 5800's and the 2xx's mean...?

D33PJackal
03-19-10, 08:27 AM
I'd like to take a moment to point out that the most current generation of graphics cards is still selling out, and still being marked up by retailers. Both sides are seeing this happen and I want to know why, because while I hate to be that guy I am going to be that guy.

I am having trouble imagining a scenario in which the two largest GPU suppliers in the entire world cannot meet the demand of a relatively small percentage of their consumer base. I am just saying that John Smith of Dougal County who loves to play WoW on the weekends isn't running out to spend $350.00 USD on a graphics card. More if he was dumb enough to go to BestBuy (assuming they even have one in stock). So what gives? Why are both sides having such a hard time meeting demand? Don't tell me it is 06 all over again.
TimoneX
03-19-10, 08:37 AM
People are PAYING their prices. If everyone stopped overpaying...yeah. When they're relatively new a huge percentage go to OEMs and the inflated costs get buried...this period should have ended by now with ATI's 58xx series though. Prices are still too high for what you get IMO...but that's just my opinion.
D33PJackal
03-19-10, 08:40 AM
That's only part of the problem, they can charge whatever they feel like regardless of the cost on their end. I have no problem with that - I have a problem with them artificially inflating the prices and then making it appear (without saying) as if they don't have the capability to increase production. Which is, well, crap.
BobbyBubblehead
03-19-10, 08:56 AM
Global recession and luxury goods.

Good reasons to see a premium.
JonSimonzi
03-19-10, 09:09 AM
I am just saying that John Smith of Dougal County who loves to play WoW on the weekends isn't running out to spend $350.00 USD on a graphics card. More if he was dumb enough to go to BestBuy (assuming they even have one in stock).

I take offense to this, I'm Jon Simonzi of Providence County, who loves to play WoW on the weekends, and went out and spent $400 USD on a graphics card. :P
TimoneX
03-19-10, 09:22 AM
...and did it improve your wow experience? :) I don't play wow, but from what I've seen even one of my 4850s would be more than enough horsepower.
D33PJackal
03-19-10, 09:35 AM
...and did it improve your wow experience? :) I don't play wow, but from what I've seen even one of my 4850s would be more than enough horsepower.

I have an HP laptop that is five years old at this point, it cost me 400 bucks when I bought it brand new. The integrated GPU on it can play WoW at 28 FPS in 1024.

EDIT: What I am saying is that if you bought a 5870 with intent to improve your WoW experience you are literally ****ing in an ocean of ****.
ratbuddy
03-19-10, 09:37 AM
...and did it improve your wow experience? :) I don't play wow, but from what I've seen even one of my 4850s would be more than enough horsepower.

Not even close. Once you get 25 or more people on screen all casting spells and twirling their blades, things start bogging down unless you lower some settings. Granted, it would be playable on a 4850, but not maxed.
TimoneX
03-19-10, 09:42 AM
WOW! Glad I didn't try playing *THAT* then. :) Between the expensive HW requirements and the fact that it seemingly destroys alot of relationships, I think I'll pass on WoW. :)

...apparently you chose wisely jon. Well played sir.
EarthDog
03-19-10, 09:43 AM
Did they stop making them...wouldnt that be a good reason to have supply low and pricing high?
D33PJackal
03-19-10, 09:47 AM
WOW! Glad I didn't try playing *THAT* then. :) Between the expensive HW requirements and the fact that it seemingly destroys alot of relationships, I think I'll pass on WoW. :)

...apparently you chose wisely jon. Well played sir.

WoW is awful, it is literally the worst MMO I've ever had the displeasure of playing and I've been playing MMO's almost non-stop since March 2000.
TimoneX
03-19-10, 09:50 AM
Perhaps it's like opec & oil prices and they don't actually have to do anything save threaten to cut production. :) Oh btw we're out of fossil fuels...going on...wow over 30 years now.

In all seriousness I think the prices on the top end would be lower if ONE company would produce something competitive at the top. So what's up nV? Soon as one company has a large advantage prices begin soaring. This well after BOTH companies had their hands slapped for price fixing.
TimoneX
03-19-10, 09:52 AM
WoW is awful, it is literally the worst MMO I've ever had the displeasure of playing and I've been playing MMO's almost non-stop since March 2000.

I *TRIED* to like it once. Had a "free" trial that cost me $1.99 or something, but I installed and played it and couldn't stand it. Deleted it and tossed the disc in the garbage in one day.
Quigsby
03-19-10, 09:52 AM
WoW is awful, it is literally the worst MMO I've ever had the displeasure of playing and I've been playing MMO's almost non-stop since March 2000.

It's fun to tool around on though, even if your tooling around consists of icc 10/25 man raids. :)

I've played MMOs since The Realm a long time ago (EQ after that) and have to say it's not a bad game. I can tell you though that after WoW I won't ever play another MMO.
TimoneX
03-19-10, 09:53 AM
Why?

DETAILS MAN! :)
EarthDog
03-19-10, 09:54 AM
Whats wrong with pricing? It was a scant 1.5 years ago that a SINGLE GPU card came out at $600. Now people are b1tching because the fastest single GPU is $400? Can we take a step back and look at a bigger picture???
D33PJackal
03-19-10, 09:55 AM
It's fun to tool around on though, even if your tooling around consists of icc 10/25 man raids. :)

I've played MMOs since The Realm a long time ago (EQ after that) and have to say it's not a bad game. I can tell you though that after WoW I won't ever play another MMO.

Personally, even though I say that about WoW I will never stop playing MMO's because I love RPG's too much. I have high hopes for the 40k MMO and if that fails, I will see where the KoTOR one lays.
TimoneX
03-19-10, 09:57 AM
Whats wrong with pricing? It was a scant 1.5 years ago that a SINGLE GPU card came out at $600. Now people are b1tching because the fastest single GPU is $400? Can we take a step back and look at a bigger picture???

You're right. They were INSANELY overpriced and now they're just ridiculous. I think the OP was referencing the way they're being "artificially" overpriced though. As in exceeding MSRP sometimes dramatically. It causes one to question whether the companies are being honest when they set these MSRPs and whether they ever intended prices to match them.
D33PJackal
03-19-10, 10:01 AM
You're right. They were INSANELY overpriced and now they're just ridiculous. I think the OP was referencing the way they're being "artificially" overpriced though. As in exceeding MSRP sometimes dramatically. It causes one to question whether the companies are being honest when they set these MSRPs and whether they ever intended prices to match them.

That is exactly what I am saying Timone. As I said in my second post, I have no problem with them charging whatever they feel like but artificially inflating it I cannot abide by. When the Wii sold out everywhere in the US did Nintendo boost its value up to six-seven hundred dollars like it was selling on eBay at the time? No. They kept it at the MSRP they said they would.
EarthDog
03-19-10, 10:08 AM
You are basing your opinion (and frankly mine as well dont get me wrong) on, well, nothing. You think they have the ability to produce more faster, and they may. What if they dont? Your frustration is based off of reasoning which you nor I nor anyone here have proof is actually, or can actually happen as far as 'making more'.
D33PJackal
03-19-10, 10:12 AM
You are basing your opinion (and frankly mine as well dont get me wrong) on, well, nothing. You think they have the ability to produce more faster, and they may. What if they dont? Your frustration is based off of reasoning which you nor I nor anyone here have proof is actually, or can actually happen as far as 'making more'.

If they are having problems with getting the GPU's made then alright, but usually when there are shortages on that side we hear about it. And let's face it, I am really doubting that somehow both companies are running into the exact same problem. If that's the case, then watch the heck out with the Fermi and the 59xx when they come out, I'd expect their projected MSRP to bloat right up in that 600 figure you mentioned before.
EarthDog
03-19-10, 10:14 AM
They have been having yield problems with 40nm parts... its been published all over.

I hear ya man, I do, but its quite common to see around this time in a products lifecycle that the supply for the old stuff dwindles the price can go up. Look at DDR2 now for just one example. That stuff was dirt cheap like 4 months ago, now its almost cheaper to buy DDR3!!!
TimoneX
03-19-10, 11:06 AM
I think a "seasoned" company like AMD has a very accurate estimate of where demand & yields will be when they provide an MSRP on a retail part. I'd have trouble accepting that yields(supply) is the cause. Some of the top of the line nV cards also seem over the top to me, but I have to say I don't keep up on pricing trends very well. I have noticed several $500+ nV cards just languishing in the newegg re-certified area for weeks whereas any ATI 58xx cards disappear in minutes at anything under $400. I think some used ATI cards are disappearing at prices over MSRP. Again I think supply would outstrip demand quickly if that other GPU company would get on the stick.

As usual competition is healthy for the consumer.