TH7-II/Northwood Issues (Need Help)

[Busta]

I just picked up a Northwood processor and sold my old 1.7, what a mistake. I did'nt have the latest BIOS installed which supports Northwood CPU's so now I keep getting an error "29" while trying to boot up. Does anyone have any recommendations on what I can try doing to get back online asap? I know AMD fans live here, but the truth is, for mobo help I wouldnt want to go anywhere else.

Thanks.

[LarryJoe]

I am sure by now you are aware of the alternatives:

1
Bring it to a local shop so they can throw a Wilmanette in and flash it to 38.

2
Call Abit and "buy" (outrageous that they make you buy it) a new 38 bios chip.

3
Borrow a Wilmanette or a Northwood other than the 1.6A from a bud. Personally, I would be more than happy to help you if you lived near me. (the 1.6A NW is the only NW that won't boot with the 37 BIOS).

4
Return your TH7II and buy another from a different place known to have new inventory. I got mine from mwave (http://www.mwave.com) and it came with the latest 38 bios and the faster clock generator.

5
Go down to CompUSA or Fry's and buy the cheapest Wilmanette they have (1.3?), flash, and return it. Assuming they have a decent return policy.

I feel your pain. This must totally blow. I did my research as I built my machine and I didn't come across this. I also just assumed mine would have the 37 BIOS and I would have to flash it. I was very happy to see the 38 on boot-up. I also went for the 2.0A, so I would not have had the 1.6A/37 problem, but if I did, I would have been clueless (I built it 4 weeks ago) and would have taken the thing apart and rebuilt about a zillion times.

Best of luck,

LJ

[Cooler666]

2
Call Abit and "buy" (outrageous that they make you buy it) a new 38 bios chip.

that's your best option in my opinion, costs you $15, or you can send them the bios you are currently using and they'll flash it for you for around $10 to the 38 version

[Markyoshi]

... its also illegal. The board advertises support for 478 pin proccessors and the 1.6A is a 478 pin processor, no? It is Abit's legal responsibility to fix the compatibility issue. I mentioned this to vicky@abit-usa.com and she agreed to send me one for free. Hope this helps ... tell the people!!!






vicky@abit-usa.com :)

[batboy]

The TH7-II was out long before the Northwoods were released. A socket 478 Willamette P-4 will work just fine in the TH7-II that has the "37" BIOS. That was the only socket 478 available when these TH7-II mobos were first released. How is that illegal? My Northwood worked good enough to let me flash the BIOS on my TH7-II. Apparently only a few of the 1.6a CPUs are having any trouble.

[Markyoshi]

If you want to say that it's the processors fault I don't really care - I tested my processor already in an ASUS P4T-E it works fine. I think that if a company sells a product that claims to support a certain technology and as that technology evolves it becomes incompatible then the company should either revise their claim for support or make a solution available at no cost. I bought the Abit board without being forewarned that it didn't support ALL 478 pin processors and it isn't like I didn't do any research. Haven't you ever had a consumer law class? If a product claims to do something - it has to do it - it's the "implied warranty of merchantibility".

Do you think I should have to pay for the BIOS - what is your beef anyway? :eh?:

[nautikah]

I sent an email to abit complaining about this, man I purchased my TH7II-Raid and 1.6a hoping to get it running but now I'm just waiting for reply, It is sad, got it for a week now and it is just sitting there. :( If it wasn't for this forum I would be going nuts rebuilding it many times and sending MB back to store only for them to return back to me saying I was stupid and I didn't set it up right or something. code 29 sux :o

[batboy]

Nope, never took any consumer law classes. My masters degree is in geology, so didn't have to take many business classes. It's not worth it to me to check out the Abit website again, but I seem to remember when I was looking at the info there before I bought my TH7-II, it clearly stated that the Northwood would be supported with a BIOS update. While I agree that I'd be frustrated too if I were in your position, however, the fact remains that lots of 1.6a Northwoods work ok in the TH7-II and will allow the BIOS update. Several members on this forum confirm this, including Skip (one of the admins). Maybe Abit did test a couple 1.6a CPUs on it and didn't notice any problem. Maybe they only tested the 2.0a and 2.2 on it and assumed the 1.6a (which was released later) would work too. Abit is now shipping all current TH7-II mobos with the newest BIOS that does support all of the Northwood P-4's. It's your misfortune to get an older one that was sitting on a retailer's shelf for a while. Why are you not whizzed off at the retailer? I think accusing Abit of illegal activity was a bit harsh. That's my opinion and you're welcome to your opinion.

[Markyoshi]

batboy,

I'm not really "whizzed" at Abit - they agreed to send me the BIOS for free - but I would be pretty upset if I had been made to pay for it like a few other members of this forum have. I still don't understand why we can't see eye to eye on why this is the manufacturers responsibility and not the consumers.
I got the mobo from AMAX, the main Chicago distributor of Abit products. At first I thought it must be a REALLY old mobo so I called their manager who checked the product ID and told me that my board came form a batch that just came in form Abit. He even checked the rest of the bunch for me and all shared the same revision number. I believe this man. Though Abit may be phasing in revised-BIOS mobo's there are definitely still tons of really recent bords with the old BIOS. I think even THEY now realize that its their responsibility to fix this problem for those of us unlucky enough to have an incompatible BIOS.
It's not going to kill Abit to throw a tiny chip in the mail and not charge $15 bucks for it. I've already been -1 computer for a week. I really don't know why you seem to think I'm in the wrong for holding them responsible... :(

[Markyoshi]

"It's not worth it to me to check out the Abit website again, but I
seem to remember when I was looking at the info there before I bought my TH7-II, it clearly stated that the Northwood would be supported with a BIOS update."

... no the product description on the site does not clearly state that a bios update is needed (or that they reserve the right to charge $15 for it) - all it says is it "supports Pentium 4, 478 pin processors". You must think I'm a bit fat idiot!
If I had been so clearly warned, I'd have no right to complain.

[batboy]

I do not think you are an idiot, nor do I have a problem with you complaining and holding Abit responsible. I agree they should not be making a profit from flashing the BIOS in this situation. In my opinion, I just thought the rash claim that it was "illegal" was a bit harsh. I think this discussion has ran it's course. We have sort of hijacked this topic when these posts probably should be in the "debate" section. I did not mean to cause any offense, nor do I intend on debating this issue anymore. Looks like we will have to agree to disagree in this matter.

[Markyoshi]

word.

[evilted26]

Another idea would be to grab the BIOS Savior from EksitData. In case your not familiar, the BIOS Savior installs between your BIOS chip and motherboard and has a switch to select between the 2 different bioses-the one on your chip and the one on the BIOS Savior. I don't want to sound like a salesman or anything, but I can't believe that everybody doesn't have one of these! The only downside is that you have to remove your old BIOS chip to install it, and then replace your old bios chip.

I intend on using this on my new system so that I can do some BIOS modding without having to worry about problems like you're having.

I'm not sure exactly which BIOS Savior is needed for the TH7II. There are different models depending on what size BIOS chip you have. My Th7II's still on order. Maybe you could tell me what kind of BIOS chip is used on the TH7II.

Oops!! I almost forgot the most important part. You can order it with the BIOS of your choice pre-loaded. You just have to e-mail them the correct BIOS. Only costs about $30. Not free, but considering what it does, I thought it was pretty cheap.

[Markyoshi]

Wow! sounds cool. but if that thing only works with one BIOS isn't it easier just to have ABIT send a free one? Hey maybe you'll get the new revision Batboy was talking about and you won't have to worry about it at all. Otherwise I think you need phoenix BIOS version 38. :)

[SteveReno]

Originally posted by nautikah
I sent an email to abit complaining about this, man I purchased my TH7II-Raid and 1.6a hoping to get it running but now I'm just waiting for reply, It is sad, got it for a week now and it is just sitting there. :( If it wasn't for this forum I would be going nuts rebuilding it many times and sending MB back to store only for them to return back to me saying I was stupid and I didn't set it up right or something. code 29 sux :o

I seached all post from Skip & i can't find anything that says that a 1.6 worked on a new TH7 II?

Please show me these post that the 1.6 worked.

I thought I done my home work before i orderd my TH7 II/1.6NW
"Be deliverd tomarrow" :( . I still belive that this is the setup i want.

I belive that Abit should have sent new bios chip automaticly to all reseller's of the product & resellers include this chip with sale.

I for 1 think that most buyers of this board "TH7 II" does not know of this error & most will just think that it's a bad board or CPU. This don't say good for Abit.

I have been an customer of Abit since 98' & most of this time i thought of Abit as a company that try's to satisfies it's overclocking customers, but this leaves me thinking.

[Markyoshi]

I don't really think there are many newly revised boards out there, contrary to what batboy believes.
Since the 1.6a is the newest northwood processor - this is a relatively new problem for Abit. Try to contact vicky@abit-usa.com about the BIOS update and don't let them make you pay for it. I don't think it will be a problem as ABIT seems to be realizing this is not an isolated incident. Hope this helps.

[evilted26]

My description doesn't do this thing justice. I said you could have it pre-loaded with any BIOS, but you can also get it without any BIOS at all.(which of course is a little cheaper) If you ordered it with the new 38 BIOS, all your problems would be solved, and then you could put a different BIOS on the BIOS Savior. Really, all it does is give you a 2nd BIOS eeprom and a switch to select which BIOS chip you want to boot with.

This thing might be a little overkill just to solve the problem you have, but once your problem is solved you could move on to BIOS mods and beta's and never have to worry about crunching your BIOS again...Just make sure at least one of the 2 BIOS's you're keeping is stable. Like I said..$30. I'll never build a system w/o one. Hacking that BIOS is just too tempting. Who knows? There may even be a way to unlock more voltage!


Check it out here! (http://www.eksitdata.com/_uk/index.asp)

[SteveReno]

Can the people having the Bios problem please tell us the Ver. # of the TH7 II board. I think this would reall help lot's of new buyer's.

[Markyoshi]

TIK003630
I think TIK003 is the batch # but I'm not sure. This was the newest batch the Chicago distributor AMAX had in stock. When I called Abit they couldn't tell me if any revised BIOS boards had shipped, but batboy says he thinks they have. Hope this helps.
:)

[SteveReno]

Yes i do think it will help...
Since Abit Hasn’t publicly announced, informed or notified anyone about this “small ” problem It’s up to TH7 II owners to inform resellers about this problem & then perhaps Abit “ with all the RMA’s” Make a better decision on this problem.

Don’t get me wrong, I like abit products & will buy in the future, but will ask more questions before the purchase.

If someone wants to “RENT” an updated Bios, my board will be in tomarrow, please le me know:beer:

Present Sys:
Abit BP6
333@550Mhz
Mem:512

[batboy]

Here you go Stevereno.

http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/showthread.php?threadid=67757

I don't know why anyone would buy the 1.6a anyway except that it's maybe a little cheaper than any of the other Northwoods. If anyone would of had read my recommendations from the time I first heard about the 1.6 and 1.8 gig Northwoods being released, I've been advising buying the 1.8 not the 1.6 (I bought my 2 gig before the 1.8 came out). Most non-2.2 gig Northwoods will usual reach between 2.4 to 2.6 on average when overclocked, so a 1.8 gig using 133 FSB puts you right at an almost guaranteed 2.4 gig with 2.5 and 2.6 within easy reach. If you're using TH7-II and RDRAM, then the 1.6 will run you into trouble with the RAM not wanting to to be stable at very high FSB and you won't reach the full potential of the CPU. Of course, then if you consider that some of the 1.6's don't like the older BIOS on the TH7-II, it really sort of becomes a no brainer. Oh well, I'm just an old fart senior member that don't know nothing, even though I've been overclocking for 4 to 5 years and have owned PC computers for about 20 years. How I managed to get my Northwood and TH7-II combo up to 2.6 gig must be a great mystery or else just a lucky accident.

[Markyoshi]

He doesn't really specify which northwood (1.6, 1.8, 2.0) though... What makes this an interesting issue is that the compatibility problem isn't with northwoods in general, only the 1.6a.

F.Y.I. Outside loop is selling pretested combos:

http://www.outsideloop.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?

I wish I had gone that route!

[batboy]

That is the really weird thing, it only seems to be the 1.6a Northwoods that are having problems with the TH7-II "37" BIOS. I have not heard of any other Northwood having the same trouble. Very strange indeed. Does not make any sense.

[SteveReno]

Knowledge is KING!

If I knew where I was going to fall tomorrow, I’d put a pillow there first…

I’m a old clocker too, back in the day where one had to buy MHZ crystals & insert on to MB to go from 33MHZ to 41 MHZ WOW!

Anyhow, I’m still glad I got the 1.6, it cost way less the 1.7 or the 1.8 & gets the FSB much higher “ Working all 8 cylinders” It's the 300A all ver again.

Ordered 1.6 (SL668- MADE IN MALAY) Abit TH7 II, 512 Samsung PC800, ENERMAX EG365P-VE(FCA) 350W . Magic Server Case.

We’ll see how it goes

Couldn’t find the over clocked 1.6’s at Outsideloop?

Here’s one from ATACOM.com
http://www.atacom.com/program/atacom_new.cgi?cart_id=2276306_65_103_118_102&USER_ID=www&PAGE=OVEI_CPUO&ADV=CPU

[Busta]

Hey guys,

sorry for not replying in awhile, but I got my issue fixed by paying $10 when I went to the local shop and updated the BIO's by poping in a 1.7 (256K) in. I emailed Vicky sometime this past week and she, without any hesitation is sending me a new BIOS chip. It was either that or send me $10 for all my hassles. She mentioned how this was a problem which she has never experienced before at her time with the company and how deeply sorry she was.

All in all, great follow-up to my post there Markyoshi.

P.S: Read below and see what my results have been like since getting back online. QUITE awesome guys, quite awesome!

[Markyoshi]

sweet! don't stop now busta! :D

[Markyoshi]

http://www.outsideloop.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=olcomp&Product_Code=CMB-INTP4&Category_Code=int-cmb

stevo:
sorry! I posted the link wrong. - These are the processor + mainboard combos - not overclocked, but tested to function together ie (preflashed w/38?)