Back to sqaure one with my Radiator Selection

[SemiCycle]

I have my WB and Pump, and the tygon hosing is on its way, but my radiator decision has proven to be the hardest part.

I originally wanted to purchase a Black Ice II Radiator for my water cooling setup. I wanted to mount this in the top bay of my Antec SX830 Case. I really wanted this project to leave as much free area at the bottom of the case as possible, that is why I decieded on top mounting. I don't want to front mount it at all. The dimensions of the BI2 seemed perfect for the task (9.79 x 5.9x 0.98 inch)

However, everyone seems to think Heater Cores are a much more effective way to cool your WB, so I gave in and decided to take a look. On my way from work today, I stopped by Advance Auto Parts and looked at their Heater Core book (It had pictures and dimensions which was great). After about 25 mins, I found 9 heater cores with dimensions that are some what close to the BI2. that list was then cut to 6 when the guy working there said he couldn't get 3 of them. These are the models I found with prices :


Black Ice II - 9.79" x 5.90" x 0.98"
$59
--------------------------------------
Toyota (2-703) - 8.50" x 5.75" x 1.25"
$105.29

GM (2-681) - 10.5" x 6.25" x 0.98"
$66.99

Ford (2-671) - 6.00" x 6.13" x 1.25"
$79.99

GM (2-471) - 9.50" x 5.63" x 2.00"
$44.29

Honda (2-570) - 7.88" x 4.34" x 1.25"
$82.39

Toyota (2-609) - 7.13" x 5.25" x 1.25"
$61.99

I guess I don't really see the value with getting one of these, and here are my reasons.
1) First off, a heater core has no pre drilled holes for mounting a fan or shroud, so I will have to spend alittle more to make it fit.
2) All of the heater cores above have either 3/4 or 5/8 barbs, so I will need an adapter or 2 to make the hose fit.
3) A couple of the heater cores above have some very strange default barb configurations. I would probably have to cut them to make them fit correctly.

Okay, I've given my none educated views. Can you guys help me and tell me what you think. If you know of a radiator/heater core that can fit an a top 5 1/4 bay, let me know, It will only make my search easier.

[AMDninjaboy]

Hey slipknot,

I cant really help you on mounting it in a bay, but the best reason for using a heater core is restriction- they have way,way,way less restriction than the "rads" they sell. I believe I read an article on flow rates that showed a 8gph restriction with a heater core and like 40 or 50 gph restriction with one of the rads. All of the rads showed a big flow rate drop compared to the heater core. I have the part#471 gm heater core, I'm mounting it outside the case to have cooler air blown over it. The fitting were easy just cut the extra tube off and they were close to 1/2" found a couple fittings at Home Depot and soldered em on-done piece of cake man.
Hope that helps ya a little bit anyway.:burn:

[Hardware Man]

Check to see if you can find a heatercore for an 86 Chevy Chevette. The core itself is 6" X 6" X 2" (not including the fittings). Napa Auto Parts has them for around 27 dollars. (Although they may have to order it)

[JFettig]

i was supprized at how expencive those cores were compared to the 89camaro one i have mine was 18.99, but it wont fit into the top like you want it to, im gonna make it very nicely fit in the bottom!

[DodgeViper]

Glad to see that your looking elsewhere, because the BI2 have the fan mounting system to close the the rad. You want the fan or fans mounted about 1" from the rad. All fans have a dead spot directly in the center. If you mount the fan directly to the rad your center of the rad will not get air passing through it. Below is an article I wrote on the making of the shroud using a Chevy Heater Core, but this article could be used on any heater core.


CLICK (http://www.dwpg.com/content.php?contid=3&artid=134)

[Shazbot]

Hi Slip,

I'm guessing you picked those prices from one of the on-line catalogs like the Fedco Heater Core catalog (?). If you look up the price at Autozone.com they should come in much lower, like around $20.

If you plan to use 1/2" tygon tubing you might be able to slip it over the inlet/outlet for the rad if you pick one with 5/8" piping. It's something I plan on trying myself. It'll save a fair amount of effort with fitting adapters and such. (Has anyone already tried this BTW?)

Pretty much any heater core you use will out perform a BI2, so you can go for one that's smaller and have more room at the top of your case.

In the end the cost and effort to mod a heater core to be a rad may be more trouble then it's worth. If that's the case you may want to buy a pre-modded heater core (with fittings and all) from DangerDen or DTek. You'll still pay less then a BI2 and get more performance. The BI2 does have a cool look going for it though. *shrug*

Hope this helps. Good luck.
Mark

[JFettig]

i was able to get 1/2inch vinal tubing over 5/8 pipe, i dont think itll be a problem with getting tygon over it, and all my fittings are 1/2inch copper pipe, with 3/8 vinal streached over it..

[SemiCycle]

All of those prices came from teh man standing behind teh counter at Advance Auto parts. After I found the heater cores, I gave him the list and he put the prices beside them. When I got home, I verified them on Advance Autoparts web site, and everyone was the exact same price

I started more reseach though, so I will list a huge list of possible canidates in an hour or so when i'm done

[SemiCycle]

BTW, I got Koolance to send me one of their cool looking 3 fan case shrouds for the top of my case for 10 bucks shipped. I plan to mount the heater core right under the shroud in the top drive bay. I also plan on using 3 vantec stealth 80mm fans to cool it. In addition, I may also get a 3 fan 5-1/4" drive bay cooler. Do you guys think this is enough, or should I find a way to mount fans under the radiator as well for the push/pull effect?

If I don't have to mount fans under the heater core, I can select a heater core up to 2" thick. If you think I should put fans under the heater core, then the heater core can't be more then 1 2/3" thick

[JFettig]

pm http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=99018 he has a heatercore for you im sure, hes got one thatll work great with that koolance thing i think

[SemiCycle]

Looks like I have a much better list to work from now. I made this list by going through the *Lookup chart* at http://www.heatercore4u.com/
Any of you guys using one of these HCs?


Buick Century 1996-90
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-378.htm
8" x 5-5/8" x 2"
2-378

--------------------------------------------------

Chevrolet Cavalier 1984-82
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-471.htm
9-1/2" x 5-5/8" x 2"
2-471

Chevrolet Celebrity 1990-82
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-378.htm
8" x 5-5/8" x 2"
2-378

Chevrolet Lumina APV 1996-91
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-649.htm
8" x 5-1/2" x 2"
2-649

--------------------------------------------------

Geo Tracker 1997-89
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-646.htm
5-1/2" x 5-3/4" x 1-1/4"
2-646

--------------------------------------------------

Acura Integra (ALL) 2000-94
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-696.htm
8" x 5" x 2"
2-696

--------------------------------------------------

Honda Civic (ALL) 1997-96
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-705.htm
7-7/8" x 5" x 2"
2-705

Honda Civi (ALL) 1995-92
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-696.htm
8" x 5" x 2"
2-696

Honda Civic SEDAN, WAGON 1991-88
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-697.htm
8" x 5" x 2"
2-697

Honda Civic (all) 1987-84
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-570.htm
7-7/8" x 4-3/4" x 1-1/4"
2-570

Honda CRX (all) 1995-92
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-696.htm
8" x 5" x 2"
2-696

Honda CRX (coupe) 1991-88
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-697.htm
8" x 5" x 2"
2-697

Honda Del Sol (all) 1997-93
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-696.htm
8" x 5" x 2"
2-696

--------------------------------------------------

Lexus ES250 1991-90
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-689.htm
8-5/8" x 5-1/2" x 1 1/3"
2-689

--------------------------------------------------

Mazda Miata 1993-90
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-710.htm
7-1/8" x 5-3/4" x 1-14"
2-710

Mazda RX7 1991-86
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-713.htm
7-1/8" x 5-3/4" x 1-1/4"
2-713

------------------------------------------------

Merkur Scorpio 1989-88
Merkur XR4TI 1989-85
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-756.htm
9-1/8" x 5-3/8" x 1-5/8"

-------------------------------------------------

Mitsubishi Pickup (ALL) 1996-87
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-715.htm
7-1/8" x 5-3/4" x 1-1/4"
2-715

-------------------------------------------------

Oldsmobile Cierra 1996-93
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-378.htm
8" x 5-5/8" x 2"
2-378

-------------------------------------------------

Pontiac LeMans 1993-90
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-515.htm
8" x 5-5/8" x 2"
2-515

-------------------------------------------------

Suzuki Samuri 1995-86
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-688.htm
5-1/8" x 5-5/8" x 1-1/4"
2-688

-------------------------------------------------

Subaru ALL 1989-80
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-587.htm
7-1/8" x 5-1/2" x 1-1/3"
2-587

-------------------------------------------------

Toyota 4-Runner 1988-1984
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-608.htm
7-7/8" x 5-1/4" x 2"
2-608

Toyota Camry 1991-1987
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-689.htm
8-5/8" x 5-1/2" x 1 1/3"
2-689

Toyota Camry 1986-1983
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-690.htm
8-5/8" x 5-3/4" x 1-1/4"
2-690

Toyota Celica 1989-88
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-691.htm
8-1/2" x 5-3/4" x 2
2-691

Toyota Corolla MAY NOT BE US MODEL.....1997-88
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-651.htm
8-5/8" x 5-1/2" x 1-1/3"
2-651

Toyota Corolla Sedan 1987-84
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-610.htm
8-5/8" x 5-1/2" x 1-1/3"
2-610

Toyota Coupe 1987-83
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-603.htm
7-1/8" x 5-1/2" x 1-1/3"
2-603

Toyota Cressida 1988-85
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-613.htm
7-3/4" x 5-5/8" x 2"
2-613

Toyota Land Cruiser 1987-81
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-606.htm
7" x 5-1/4" x 2"
2-606

Toyota Van Wagon 1990-83
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-609.htm
7-1/8" x 5-1/4" x 1-1/4"
2-609

--------------------------------------------------------

Volkswagen EuroVan 2002-92
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-745.htm
8-3/8" x 5-1/2" x 1-5/8"
2-745

Volkswagen Vanagon 1992-80
http://www.heatercore4u.com/2-747.htm
8-3/8" x 5-1/2" x 1-5/8"
2-747

[SemiCycle]

Can you tell me the details maskedgeek? I don't have 100 post, so I can't get into that part of the forums yet

[JFettig]

you should pm him about it also

9in long, 5in wide 2in deep 25 bucks, pm him and you can make a deal im sure

[SemiCycle]

I think I may go with this one

http://www.partsamerica.com/PartDetails.asp?SourceArea=SHOP&SourcePage=SEARCHRESULTS&CategoryCode=&QueryID=455625&QueryCounter=1&BeginRecord=1&EndRecord=25&PreviousPage=PartTypes&LastRecord=25&TopLevelCategoryCode=&TopLevelCatDesc=&PartType=524&UnitPrice=16%2E99&MfrCode=FEC&MfrPartNumber=2%2D378++++++++++&ProductDescription=HEATER+CORE++++++++++++++++++++ ++++&ShipmentRestriction=2++&Quantity=1&Weight=4%2E5&HandlingCost=0&CoreCharge=0&StoreCount=2115&DcCount=1&HomeDelCount=0&SoItemFlag=1&ShipRestrictionCode=2++&SearchFor=Heater+Core&AppliedDiscount=0&SpecialType=


Only $16.99 :)
It seems like anything that isn't domestic cost an arm and a leg.

[Shazbot]

Glad to hear that you can stretch tubing over the inlet/outlet. That'll save some modding :)

About the fans, if you're not OCing I would think a decent heater core and the 3 80mm fans are enough. IMHO - Most WC systems don't need much more then one 120mm fan to cool a heater core. It might be another matter if the rest of your case is generating lots of heat that will also get pulled through the rad.

If you add the push fan under the rad, do you have the room to space it about 1" away from the rad? There are some good posts about the benefit of not putting the fans directly on the rad. If you don't have the space then I'd just stick with the pull fans and not "block" part of the rad off from ariflow.

I'd say try it out the way you want first and see what happens. At worst you can add another fan later.

Good Luck!
Mark

[CrashOveride]

mg, what are the dimensions of your rad/heater core?:D :eh?: :D

[seantx]

If it helps, I have the same case as you and went with the Chevette core ($16.99 at a local auto zone). I built the shroud out of lexan, used a dremel to cut off the standard barbs, JB Welded new 5/8" barbs on, painted everything black then mounted the shroud with a single 120mm fan (with 7V mod) vertical in the bottom of the case. The bottom two bays were removed (a no-no for your requirements I know). With a Aquajet 1200 pump and BE Cooling block my processor stays about 5 degrees over ambient folding 24/7. VERY quiet.

I wanted to mount mine in the bottom of the case horizontally but the IDE headers on the mobo are in the perfectly wrong location for this. I've honestly considered changing to a different mobo to make this happen and reclaim the lost drive bays. A sheet metal duct could be run at a 90 degree angle from the front of the case and provide plenty of cool air. Guess it just depends on how much engineering you want to do.

[DodgeViper]

Check out the article that I mentioned above. It's a detailed explaination of how I converted a Chevy Chevette heater core to what is pictured below.

[SemiCycle]

Thanks for teh info seantx

[SemiCycle]

Great article Dodgeviper. Not only is your heater core effective, it is attractive too. A+ modding.

[DodgeViper]

Here is a photo of the front mod that did not appear in the article.

[DodgeViper]

Photo of the new D-Tek TC-4 REV2 water block.

[seantx]

Originally posted by DodgeViper
Check out the article that I mentioned above. It's a detailed explaination of how I converted a Chevy Chevette heater core to what is pictured below.

I've seen it several times but am still impressed. That is a work of art DV.

I read your article extensively before starting on mine. Mine looks like total shyte in comparison to yours but it works well enough.

[DodgeViper]

In the photo of the front mod above I used a fan guard. Reason: I use a filter on the intake to keep dust and lint from going through the rad. Living in deserts of Arizona I need to clean the filter once a week. Also using two fans does help. I have found that my temps are 2c higher when I tried just using one fan in the pulling mode.

I had purchased some Tygon tubing and had trouble getting the 1/2" tubing to seal on the barbs, so I bought this cheap grade of tubing to get the system up and running again. I would not recommend the tubing I am using, as it's very stiff and does not bend very easy. When I get the chance I am going to replace the tubing again with 1/2" x 1/8" Tygon tubing, but will not use the ear clamps I used in the article. I found that these clamps tend to pinch the hose away from the barb causing leaks. The clamps that I am using now are ideal for the application if you buy the correct size.

If anybody has any question feel free to PM.

[SemiCycle]

How does that TC-4 REV2 compare to other blocks you ahve used Dodgeviper?

[DodgeViper]

I had been using the Gemini High Volume water block. With this block I had changed the barbs to 1/2" fittings, but the inlet on the blocks were still 1/8" fittings. This was causing back pressure on the 1250 pump and creating heat.

Now with the D-Tek TC4 the water is flowing through the block without nearly the restrcitions. I had wrote last week that the temps were below the Gemini, but I need to retract that statement because the ASII had not had time to set. My current temps are 2c below what the Gemini was giving me, but I do believe had I had a Eheim 1048 pump that has an output of 10 watts the Gemini would hold its ground.

The TC is going to stay in my system because it matches up with my Eheim 1250 pump.