----------------------------- SETI Team Problems ---------------------------

vodka314 said:

You people are pathetic

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NOPE!!! what IS pathetic is your post. You OBVIOUSLY DON'T see what is going on here. So if you don't have any constructive input.............................

Rob

Folks, there is more than enough already going on:

Can we all please strive to not flame or be insulting to anyone or anything?

Thank you.

I refuse to read any more bullshi7. Most of wich is so petty it does not deserve this post

dear all

I joined very recently the team, and did not notice anything amiss.
As I did not see much, perhaps I could be said to belong to the 3rd group (the "silent majority" as we say in France) described by none1 and rogerdugans.

The dispute and especially the malicious intent ascribed to the other's actions sound quite petty.

There seem to be nothing that can not be discussed and agreed upon in public among adults.

If you really think that something is so wrong that the team wust do without someone (either you because you leave, or because the other (who so offended you) must leave), will you accept the responsability for diminishing the CPU ressource devoted to SETI ?

Are you ready to switch off the CPU which might (just might) just detect the one repeat occurence of the signal we are looking for ?

I am a bit dramatic on purpose, but I hope you get my drift.

Sitting, bewildered, by the sideline ....

papounet

Update from last post -- 20 minutes later.

After realizing that the link posted had over 4 pages of fun reading ahead of me, I tried to make sense of it. I can only truthfully state that I read to Maestro's massive post, and after that started semi-reading (you know, when you only read little snippets of posts, and not every post at that?).

WARNING:: This post contains -- remarks I am well ready to get flamed for, ignorance (with a touch of natural stupididty), severe emotion (note: one should NEVER trust emotion alone!), hopefully some intellect, ect.

1) Why are we "flaming" (which some are IMO) vodka314? His post was short, and to the point. IMO, we are being pathetic right now. If nobody minds, I'll elaborate on my own oppinion on this matter. PLEASE skip to the end of this post if you really don't feel like it. I don't want to have this go on any longer than it has to, and reading this whole post (while explaining my position for asking the final question) will inevtably delay your action by at least a minute. And time is precious in all matters. You have been warned.

His post is simple. "You people are pathetic". It doesn't even include a period for goodness sake! (note: that may be habit of his to not inclue periods on short posts. I know of many who do this, so I could have just "read that in") Afer posting this comment (which IMO is as valuable as ANY comment posted before!), he is then flamed!! (not true flames I must admit. but unwillingness to truly study his, albeit short, argument) Why does he believe we are pathetic??

Since he is posting in this thread, it must have something to do with this issue (or an issue in the thread that was linked to). Look at us. We're bickering over a tiny issue!! (granted, some parts of this issue are FAR from tiny and need to be addressed now.) Bickering (simply for lack of a better word in my limited vocabulary), half-flaming, and posting marathon posts to voice both what we know and believe. Look at me. I'm doing it too! We do all this, and why does he call us pathetic??

It's not the fact that it's a small issue like a name change, and it's not the fact that it's a big issue like who actually has power in this team. Rather, it's the bickering (remember... only using "bickering" because a lack of a word) part. We are arguing when we could be solving these issues!! We proceed to write post upon post, leave this team, and more just because for some reason we aren't adressing (or think that somebody isn't adressing) the issue.

These issues DO need to be adressed. But this is an inappropriate way of addressing them (though IMO, is a great way to release the steam from the friction that is a given from any group of people this size!). We need to stop posting huge threads about WHY WE THINK WE ARE RIGHT, and instead post threads on WHAT WE SHOULD DO, regardless of who IS right! Saying "I was only doing what I thought was right" is (although not counter-productive) not helping the issue. Rather, one should ASK the question "What do you want me to do?".

In health class last week, we were discussing conflict. We went over how people argue, and what techniques are used. Blaming, preaching, avoiding, and placating were all the ways that one argues. However, an argument is useless (for solving the issue) because although it displays all the oppinions and facts, it does not do the single thing that is required to solve a problem. And that is asking.

Again, look at us. We are arguing over this issue. As I said, arguing will bring out all the facts, but cannot solve a problem. In issues such as these, we need to solve the problem. A knowledge of all the facts is good, but you can do that at the SAME TIME as asking the critical question "What do you want?". When somebody asks that question it forces the person who is asked that question to stop and decide (hopefully calmly) what they actually want.

We are pathetic. Rather than trying to SOLVE the issue, we debate ABOUT the issue so that everybody saves themselves (at least partially) from blame. While it is good to save yourself, if we attack the issue right away, we never have to even GET to the point that people are accusing people of doing things. So, although this is a very hard skill to learn (teach says can take a lifetime), you must ask that question before tempers flare (wether or not they are repressed) because somebody is bound to get burnt, and then attempt to burn somebody else so that they aren't the only one in pain.

HOWEVER We can overcome this very quickly by asking the question. Just because we are pathetic now, does not mean we cannot learn from this to get rid of (or at least diminish) our pathetic-ness.

Now, after that WHOLE HUGE post, I will admit that I have just joined into the whole arguing thing I said to stay away from. However, I will now ask the critical question. And I ONLY want constructive answers to this. No matter how wacky, how possibly lethal to the team, how great for the team, ect, I want your suggestions on what to do. We've debated enough. Now is the time to ask:

What do you want?

EDIT: I see we have at least started with this question by creating the poll for team name. This is a great start. Remember to keep asking this untill all issues here are solved. Arguing gets us nowhere until the question is asked.
JigPu

I havent crunched a WU in about two weeks, but I could say I was a member of the 3rd group... I crunch WU for the pure fun of crunching WU.

What do you want?

I have been offline a couple days.
I come back and have a SETI forum that reads like a novel.
I wont post comments or opinions on other items until we resolve the first one that blew all of this into the open.

I have taken the first step, and voted for the team name in the poll.

We are a TEAM, now lets act like one.
Everyone that belongs to the team and the forum here NEEDS to take the first step and vote. GO DO IT!

Then we can move onto whatever else needs to be taken care of, after this has been resolved.

The team name is just a smokescreen for the problem that drove the name change in the first place. Until you guys figure that out, this is going nowhere.

Robbie said:

NOPE!!! what IS pathetic is your post. You OBVIOUSLY DON'T see what is going on here. So if you don't have any constructive input.............................

Rob

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Rob that is callous, shallow, and totally uncalled for here. Don't post in such an inflamatory manner again.

William

Greg M said:

The team name is just a smokescreen for the problem that drove the name change in the first place. Until you guys figure that out, this is going nowhere.

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This COULD be true, but it is the FIRST step in dealing with all the problems that we have right now.

According to the statements of the parties involved (in the big thread on the subject, it IS true. The name is a symptom, not the disease. If you think the name at all deals with the root cause, there isn't any more I can say to convince you.

For the time being, this issue is being put to rest.

I've spoken to both TC and SpeeDJ......as well as members from both "sides" on the phone. I've also spoken to numerous members via PM's.

What all agree on is change. There are definitely some changes needed and both sides state they are willing to work with everyone else on the issues at hand. I'm spending some time attempting to design a room for distributed computing leaders, where they can privately hammer out details or hack each other up.

Both sides have also said they've made mistakes and will work on amending them.

I am NOT a part of SETI, nor do I have the authority to tell SETI members how to run or lead their team. I have the authority to disassociate the distributed computing teams from overclockers.com, however this would not accomplish anything, and would most definitely do more harm than good for ALL parties involved.

Until the team leaders hammer out some structure on their own, stop the bickering. Give them some time to make some solid decisions.......they have a lot of issues to work on.

The team name is currently overclockers.com

now, would someone kindly hi-jack this thread?

Excellent move and that does address the issues.

Thank you!

Now we've done it! We've woken the sleeping monster, he looks angry, you won't like him when he's angry.

Seriously, now that we've got what appears to be most of the problems in the open, let's let the "higher ups" do what they have to to get this thing straightened out. Re-hashing what's already been said after this point would be counter productive.

Thank you for your time effort Shadow ÒÓ.

Now if I could find a copy of the Sims for N64 i could get my daughter off of that one system and quit wasting CPU cycles on something other than SETI!

Back to bussiness guys!

FRANK

thanks Shadow for your work.

I beleive this thread should be (temporalily) close by the webmaster with an explanation that work is being done to adress the issues
and pointing to the actual work done such as the proposals at
http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38113&perpage=30&pagenumber=1

Shadow ÒÓ said:

What all agree on is change. There are definitely some changes needed and both sides state they are willing to work with everyone else on the issues at hand. I'm spending some time attempting to design a room for distributed computing leaders, where they can privately hammer out details or hack each other up.

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umm this leaders room is a bad idea, im sick of the all the secrecy. name change and the renegade website both became problems because of secrecy. no more. one could argue that all of our current hidden problems would be best resolved there out of the public eye, but the only way to prevent new problems like these is to keep everyone on the same page.

Shadow ÒÓ said:

now, would someone kindly hi-jack this thread?

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YATTA!!!

That's a scary link.

I think it's time to get off the computer and play Halo.

BUT BEFORE I GO...
Folks tweaking their rank into a comedic representation of individualism is confusing. It makes it difficult to identify the moderators. I can understand the need to be "Senior Beaver", but can somebody get me a handbook that decodes the roll along with those of the Under-Beavers?

Hey, Wa11y was the one to bring the "Yatta" craze to the forums... I'm just hi-jacking the thread the only way I know how...

Shadow ÒÓ said:

For the time being, this issue is being put to rest.



now, would someone kindly hi-jack this thread?

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[attempted hijack in progress]

Well, We could try this....

Or This one...

Or we could talk about how another team from Foxboro Mass (New England Revolution (soccer) is playing in a Championship Game....

[/attempted hjack]





*edit* Wow...I guess it took me a bit too long to dig up the URL's...LOL Beat out by a country mile...