AMD Athlon-64

The Coolest · Nov 20, 2002

DaddyB said:
1.4ghz + 800 = 2200
2.0ghz + 800 = 2800

Thats the way it works for all athlons, it isnt done in ratio or percentages.

That is totaly wrong, sorry. A member on these forums has come up w/ a formula which works for every single Palomino XP. because AMD began tinkering w/ their speeds and ratings on Tbreds I don't think the formula works very well. but if it was just adding a constant number then he would never have come up w/ a formula...
I'll try to figure out the formula of the Athlon-64 and post it

OC-Master · Nov 20, 2002

The Coolest said:
That is totaly wrong, sorry. A member on these forums has come up w/ a formula which works for every single Palomino XP. because AMD began tinkering w/ their speeds and ratings on Tbreds I don't think the formula works very well. but if it was just adding a constant number then he would never have come up w/ a formula...
I'll try to figure out the formula of the Athlon-64 and post it

The formula for the AthlonXP has worked from the Palomino XP /T-bred A 1500+ right up to 2200+. For every 100+ rating, you add 66.66MHz.

Then came the T-bred Bs which ratings change starting at 2400+

2400+ = 2GHz on the new rating. 2400+ on the old Palomino rating = 2066MHz (66MHz higher on old rating with same PR). With the introduction of 333FSB, you add an addition 100 PR without adding any MHz.

Barton is the same as 333FSB T-breds BUT now you add once again additional 100 PR rating due to the 512KB of L2 cache that Barton posesses.

The Clawhammer is going to have a very short life span (time wise and model wise). I expect that there wont be very many models released do to the fact that 0.09 micron processors take effect at the end of next year.

3400+ = 2GHz, 3800+ = 2.4GHz and 4200+ = 2.8GHz

Basically, the baseline is on a rating of 2GHz and 3400+. From there on, when you add MHZ, you ad the same amount of MHz along with the PR Rating.

OC-Master

WerewolfX · Nov 20, 2002

But OC-Master Barton will have a 400 FSB as well as 512k of cache so how will we predict the PR rating

DaddyB · Nov 20, 2002

The Coolest said:
I'll try to figure out the formula of the Athlon-64 and post it

You wont be able to figure out the formula from just one CPU, you will need at least 2 (you could always go look up the 800Mhz hammer benches, i think they compared to a 1.2ghz xeon but Im not sure).

I think the only way we will know what the PR ratings will be is to wait until AMD releases them. The main point I was making in the posts above is that it doesnt seem a 2ghz athlon 64 will be able to compete with a P4 3.4ghz, regardless of how the math is done. Perhaps there is some more tweaking of the chip or chipset that will change that or maybe the hammers just dont do well in 3dmark, only time will tell.

The Coolest · Nov 20, 2002

Well they have the 3400+ 3800+ and 4200+ so I even got 3 CPUs. If they would still use older system like multiplier, which apearantly they will not(?) Because of the ingrated memory controller, it runs as fast as the CPU... But it may be that the system will be CPU speed + 1400 as the only difference between the CPUs is that every CPU is 400 faster and also has 400 more PR...

OC Detective · Nov 20, 2002

WerewolfX said:
But OC-Master Barton will have a 400 FSB as well as 512k of cache so how will we predict the PR rating

For the Barton with 400FSB and increased L2 cache I would guess that for a CPU with a speed of 2200 MHz the rating will be a XP3100+ and possibly be in direct competition with Intels 3.06

tbirdkiri · Nov 20, 2002

Goo Kenson said:
Woooo! This has potential. 2.8 ghz AMD, HT technology and integrated memory controller! Now they need to work on cooling...

wow.. i had no idea amd had planed on implementing HT on the x86-46 line.. im sure Intel sold it too them without a hitch..........

sacasm aside, where did you hear this? i was under the impression amd had an extreme dislike for HT...

minoukat · Nov 20, 2002

tbirdkiri said:
wow.. i had no idea amd had planed on implementing HT on the x86-46 line.. im sure Intel sold it too them without a hitch..........

sacasm aside, where did you hear this? i was under the impression amd had an extreme dislike for HT...

I think they're talking about HyperTransport (the Hammer bus), and not HyperThreading ...

tbirdkiri · Nov 20, 2002

well in that case... sorry, just too much talk about HT latly...

kevmarks · Nov 20, 2002

Oh cr@p, they are using PR ratings again

. If they are using PR rating, should'nt it be against the itanium II?

If they PR them against the P4 they will lose. A P4 3.5 Ghz will be very cheap by the third or forth quater of next year. And if they do PR against the itanium, who the hell in BestBuy is going to know what one of those is?

AMD should drop all this PR cr@p, it's going to get way to complex in the 64 bit world for joe sixpack to work out.

nealric · Nov 20, 2002

I think they have to do the pr for joe 6 pack. Joe six pack thinks "Why do i get this amd (who ever heard of that, must be bad) at 2g (higer must be better) for $2000 when I can get an intel (ive heard of them so they must be good) at the "same" speed for half that"

OC-Master · Nov 20, 2002

kevmarks said:
Oh cr@p, they are using PR ratings again . If they are using PR rating, should'nt it be against the itanium II?

If they PR them against the P4 they will lose. A P4 3.5 Ghz will be very cheap by the third or forth quater of next year. And if they do PR against the itanium, who the hell in BestBuy is going to know what one of those is?

AMD should drop all this PR cr@p, it's going to get way to complex in the 64 bit world for joe sixpack to work out.

Well,

First, Intel is going to have a large gap between now and August next year. Appearently, only two more CPUs are going to be released between now and then. That being, the 3.2GHz CPU and 3.33GHz CPU, both P4HT CPUs.

The Athlon-64's PR rating is specifically designed to run against Intels raw clock speed on there Pentium4 processors. Once Intel releases Prescott, all heck will break loose and we'll see processor scream past 4GHz no problem. By the end of 2004, We will see Prescott top out at 5.5~6.0GHz stock with little or no cooling problems. 0.09 Micron starts to give out at 5.5GHz so 6GHz may be possible

AMD will respond but for now, I heard the Athlon-64 (Clawhammer) is supposed to hit 3.2GHz by Christmas next year.

OC-Master

Snakebitten2 · Nov 21, 2002

So is it official Athlon64 will use DDR2? Any idea if it will be backwards compatable with the faster DDR1 sticks? (400mhz and higher)

Arkaine23 · Nov 21, 2002

DDR/DDR2

Yeah, I thought the integrated controller would NOT handle DDR2.

OC-Master · Nov 21, 2002

Re: DDR/DDR2

Arkaine23 said:
Yeah, I thought the integrated controller would NOT handle DDR2.

The reason for the delay was because AMD wanted to allow "official" DDRII support in the Athlon-64 processor. The Athlon 64 will use DDRII 400 memory sticks at launch.

OC-Master

kevmarks · Nov 21, 2002

But if they market it directly against the P4 they are going to loose. a 3.2 ghz chip from intel will be in the $200 - $300 mark by the middle of next year.

I know for a fact that Athlon64 will be no where near that price point. AMD will have the situation of

Athlon64, 3200+ = $$$$ at least over $500 + DDRII price
P4 3.2 = $200 - $300 + cheap DDR memory

Not only that, they are only selling the chip on it's 32 bit performance. They should have 3200/4000 P4 / Sun Sparc PR.
Or something like that might give a better indication. IMO they should drop all this PR stuff, and just market the chip as being superior. There should market the 64 bit capabilities of the chip, and not the 32.

As much as I love AMD (check my sig) I think they are digging there own grave with this one.

filip04 · Nov 21, 2002

athlon-64, nintendo-64

sound almost the same

they should've stayed with the clawhammer... so much more POWERFUL

dxiw · Nov 21, 2002

400bus as in 200 double pumped or 100 quad pumped.....

btw intel's prescott will be lik 200 quad pumped....i want to see hammer compete with 800fsb

OC Detective · Nov 21, 2002

kevmarks said:
But if they market it directly against the P4 they are going to loose. a 3.2 ghz chip from intel will be in the $200 - $300 mark by the middle of next year.

I know for a fact that Athlon64 will be no where near that price point. AMD will have the situation of

Athlon64, 3200+ = $$$$ at least over $500 + DDRII price
P4 3.2 = $200 - $300 + cheap DDR memory

Not only that, they are only selling the chip on it's 32 bit performance. They should have 3200/4000 P4 / Sun Sparc PR.
Or something like that might give a better indication. IMO they should drop all this PR stuff, and just market the chip as being superior. There should market the 64 bit capabilities of the chip, and not the 32.

As much as I love AMD (check my sig) I think they are digging there own grave with this one.

The reason they have the PR is so they can market the chip as being superior - thats why they dont use the chip speed. Its their way of trying to educate the masses. I dont for one minute think that when the 64 is launched it will be twice the price of its Intel equivalent - more likely similar or slightly discounted as that is their current marketing strategy.

OC-Master · Nov 22, 2002

dxiw said:
400bus as in 200 double pumped or 100 quad pumped.....

btw intel's prescott will be lik 200 quad pumped....i want to see hammer compete with 800fsb

400MHz Bus as in 200 X 2

AMD has already shown 166 X 2 so 200 X 2 wont be too hard to do.

OC-Master

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