WTF is up with this. COC Cel = P3 200mhz less? Right.........

Where the hell do you guys get the notion that a OC Celeron = a P3- at 200mhz less. Sometimes I wonder if most of you here are 12yr olds, who play follow the leader, hearing something, and following along with it.

Im aware that if you have a celeron at 1GHz with a 100-120mhz bus and then you have a P3 800-1GHz with a 133mhz bus or higher ya, its gonna smash the celeron. But if both chips are running at a 133bus but the celeron is 200mhz faster, or even 100mhz faster than Celeron will smash the P3.
Now if your talkin about windows apps, I could see the P3 coming ahead a bit because of its cache, in games? Games don't hardly use cache, so if you've got a Celeron 200mhz faster, its gonna crush the P3 in number crunching. Unless of course the P3- has a higher bus.

Id take a P3 over a Celeron any day, but you can't discriminate the celerons performance when oc'ed.

Let me ask you this....

How many Celerons have you seen/heard of that have run at 133 FSB (N2 cooling NOT an option, here) ??

I know of two, legitimate, that have hit that mark, and one of them wasn't 100 % stable there.

My P/// runs at 159 FSB all day, without a hiccup. Bandwidth blows the Celeron out of the water. Memory bandwidth at the much higher bus speed. Factor in the much superior L2 of the P/// core, and it's really no contest.

That's where the 200 MHz figure comes into play.

Mr B

The concept of it being "faster" is not completely correct. More like the P-III will benchmark "most" scores higher. Also, yes, cache does make a difference, even in most games. True, the better your video card, the less of a difference it makes, but more cache still gains more performance in most applications, including games. I don't know about 200 MHz, but certainly a Celeron will have to be overclocked at least 100 to 150 MHz faster to equal a P-III. Several of the hardware sites have confirm this. If you have evidence otherwise, then produce it. I'd like to see it.

We are not stupid and most of us are not kids even though they are welcome here and there opinions as well and if you give us a try you'll find out we are quite open minded, theres no need to come at us with a vengance we would gladly debate this with you with smiles on our face rite or wrong, there is allot of combined personly exsperience here so we do have a pretty good general idea of PC's and how they run. We are all human and make mistakes give us a break. even though in this instance we are not making a mistake.

Ok I see all yer points.

Mr.B: My friends Celeron 800 runs at 1200Mhz, thats on a 150mhz FSB.
And we tested it at 155Mhz FSB. Just a note. But I see your point still.

Actually, thats my big debate right now. I could get my friends Celeron 800@1200 or I could use the money to purchase a P3-800E and overclock that. Im thinking of getting the P3 right now for all the reason you guys have mentioned.
I judt didn't see how you guys here were getting P3 @200mhz slower can compete. n e how, Its clear now. Although I think batboy is kinda right, in that its not 200mhz. I think that part got over extended.

what cooling does he have on that 800, i really am suprised by that mark.

Actually, hes using a standard Intel heatsink, but he dosn't run it at 1.2gig.
He has for the past month ran it at 1066, but then I showed him the temp it was running at (idle) 56c, so he turned it down to 800.
56c was from 1.85V too. I think he needs better cooling.

WoW!! I'm a 12 year old kid!! Cool, I wish I didn't have any of these nagging responsibilities...

Ditto all the prior posts, and I've seen the CPU benchmarks that prove (rather show since it wasn't up for debate) the 200Mhz difference in favor of the P3, it's the cache (bandwidth?? what does that really mean anyway??).

daver343 (Jun 11, 2001 09:43 p.m.):
Where the hell do you guys get the notion that a OC Celeron = a P3- at 200mhz less. Sometimes I wonder if most of you here are 12yr olds, who play follow the leader, hearing something, and following along with it.

Im aware that if you have a celeron at 1GHz with a 100-120mhz bus and then you have a P3 800-1GHz with a 133mhz bus or higher ya, its gonna smash the celeron. But if both chips are running at a 133bus but the celeron is 200mhz faster, or even 100mhz faster than Celeron will smash the P3.
Now if your talkin about windows apps, I could see the P3 coming ahead a bit because of its cache, in games? Games don't hardly use cache, so if you've got a Celeron 200mhz faster, its gonna crush the P3 in number crunching. Unless of course the P3- has a higher bus.

Id take a P3 over a Celeron any day, but you can't discriminate the celerons performance when oc'ed.

Click to expand...

I see you obviously did your research on this one

I have seen many comparrissons and reviews where they have had a list as long as your arm with all the differnant speeds of p3's and celeron2's, and even overclocked the celeron consistantly scores the same as a p3 clocked 200mhz slower in anything where the cpu is the limiting factor. Be it quake 3, studio max, even general windows apps, and it is to do with the L2 cache, apart from being half the size it is also half as associative. The p3 E and EB's have 256k of 8 way associative L2 cache. The direct-mapped cache's efficiency is worked out as it's size multiplied by it's set accociativity, so the p3's 256x8=2mb compared with the celerons 128x4=512kb, this is why in somethings even the katmai can be better than a celeron2 though it's cache is running at half speed because it has 512k 2 way set associative cache. The bus speed makes very little differance to this as accessing memory at 133mhz compared with 100mhz is still slow.

Hope this clears some stuff up.

P!!! 800, is on order. Thx for the responses. Its a P!!! 800E, btw.



But wait, say you have a P!!! 600E at the 100fsb and then you have got a Celeron 800 on that 100fsb, they would be equal because of the cache?

in most things the p3 600 and cel 800 would be almost exactly the same speed, in a few things the celeron would be about 5% faster.
Good look with that p3, getting 1066mhz will take a bit of look though.