X800np and X800XL?

Has anyone seen any appearances of the X800XL or X800np especially anywhere? So for I have seen a few off sites having the X800XL for over $300, but not a sign of the X800np. They should be here by the end of the month right?

ati stated the where gonna be available on jan 1st... so you better dont hold your breath

a more realistic time to upgrade might be mid february, when all the nf4 mobos will have somewhat good prices and the x800xl is in stock...

never heard of the x800np... has it got 16 pipes?

x800np is 12 pipes but for $199 it crushes everything below an x800xl, x800pro or 6800gt costing way more. x800xl will crush anything below an x800xt or 6800u

Ya even though I already scheduled to sell my computer and buy new parts by the end of January, it looks like it might take mid-feburary for everything to come out. ATI was selling the X800XL on their website for a while I think, but there's no sign of the X800np which is what i'm after.

Overclocker550 said:

x800np is 12 pipes but for $199 it crushes everything below an x800xl, x800pro or 6800gt costing way more. x800xl will crush anything below an x800xt or 6800u

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x800xl with a mild oc crushes the 6800gt in everything but doom3 imho

thnx for clarifying the x800np having 12 pipes. I think its okay for mainstream, but if you want to stay "cheap" (i should say "reasonable priced" instead) and get top notch power, an x800xl + ATI Silencer 4 is my setup of choice

ap673, im actualy ahead of ya... i already sold 95% of my old system and was hoping to order my stuff by now but ohh well, this comp will serve me well for web browsing for now and ill use it as a server later.

Its worth to wait to mid february: prices, bugs, availability and brands should be better by then for the perfect nf4,a64,x800xl setup


Bare in mind people that the x800xl is VERY LIKELY TO BE CLOCK LOCKED on its release. Its a gamble wether its going to be unlockable/overclockable at its release or later but anyhow its the best price/performance ratio we will see in a long time.

Clock locked?? I've never heard of that. Do you have a link or something?
I'm searching for more recent x800xl reviews, but all I find are those written on december 15th.

Damn clock locked.. I was so happy, when I found out, that some manufactures will add power connectors to their cards. Which would IMHO lead to very good overclocks, as its just a x800xt on a smaller die process with lower clockspeeds.

/offtopic

it seems, as if I've got the same plan.. most of my system is sold,too and it seems our dream machines would be quite similar

Are there any ATi cards for which there hasn't been a work-around for the clock lock though? It's usually only just a driver thing anyway so I don't think it'll be a big deal even if it is locked.

Captain Hilts said:

Are there any ATi cards for which there hasn't been a work-around for the clock lock though? It's usually only just a driver thing anyway so I don't think it'll be a big deal even if it is locked.

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yes and no

the later radeon 9700 non-pro and 9500s where bios locked, a simple flash solved the issue. This can be the case of the x800xl.

OTOH, the radeon x800 pro has HARD LOCKED pipes, not sure about the clocks, the vivo version is softmodable by flashing. This can be the case of the x800np, but the risk of defective pipes and the card dying is too high for me to try this route.

The thing gets worse, no matter if its x800xl or x800np they both might have been factory undervolted so the core cant be overclocked that much. Many lower profile ati cards have that issue. It will only deter the overclock rate, not like killing it. The toughest overclockers will volt-mod them of course.

Nothing to worry about unless ati comes with something more sophisticated, unlikely because it would raise production costs


lifthanger: i certainly have no proof if the x800xl will be clock locked but ATI must be aware this is the card made for budget ocers, im just basing my thoughts on my statements above.

well I fear that your thoughts will become reality.
I suffered from two stock undervolted ati cards 'til now, but at least its another story with the x800xl.. there's no need to overclock this baby.
And if this should be the case someday, then a voltmod can be done..
Let's see what happens, this will be my next card either way..

hey! thats not the way l337 overclockers think! you should oc EVERYTHING right out of the box!... lol just kidding but thats the way i treat my hardware

PhobMX said:

yes and no

the later radeon 9700 non-pro and 9500s where bios locked, a simple flash solved the issue. This can be the case of the x800xl.

OTOH, the radeon x800 pro has HARD LOCKED pipes, not sure about the clocks, the vivo version is softmodable by flashing. This can be the case of the x800np, but the risk of defective pipes and the card dying is too high for me to try this route.

The thing gets worse, no matter if its x800xl or x800np they both might have been factory undervolted so the core cant be overclocked that much. Many lower profile ati cards have that issue. It will only deter the overclock rate, not like killing it. The toughest overclockers will volt-mod them of course.

Nothing to worry about unless ati comes with something more sophisticated, unlikely because it would raise production costs


lifthanger: i certainly have no proof if the x800xl will be clock locked but ATI must be aware this is the card made for budget ocers, im just basing my thoughts on my statements above.

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Yeah I had a 9500 PRO, the bios flash was easy enough though so that still means that there hasn't been a clock lock for which there hasn't been a work-around so I don't see it as being a big issue.

Undervolting is another thing, usually happens with the memory more than anything though. The funny thing is that it seems from the reviews that they're getting much higher memory clocks than core clocks. I wouldn't doubt if that's just a result of the XL using the new 110nm process. Seems like everyone using anything below 130nm is having problems scaling clockspeeds.

Captain Hilts said:

like everyone using anything below 130nm is having problems scaling clockspeeds.

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the disease is now present in video cards, just great

also note those guys use stock cooling for their reviews, so i guess an ati silencer 4 should do the job

"Bare in mind people that the x800xl is VERY LIKELY TO BE CLOCK LOCKED on its release. Its a gamble wether its going to be unlockable/overclockable at its release or later but anyhow its the best price/performance ratio we will see in a long time."


If this is true, ati will be shooting themselves in the foot, alot of people will spend the extra $100 for a 6800gt because an overclocked 6800gt will crush a stock x800xl. They will win those who dont care to oc though but I overclock and if its locked, I am not touching the x800xl, period

Overclocker550 said:

If this is true, ati will be shooting themselves in the foot, alot of people will spend the extra $100 for a 6800gt because an overclocked 6800gt will crush a stock x800xl. They will win those who dont care to oc though but I overclock and if its locked, I am not touching the x800xl, period

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yet more bs from you m8...

1- here in this very tread you can find 2 people that are willing to keep the x800xl even if its not overclockable and WE are overclockers

2- an overclocked 6800gt might not crush the x800xl, at least show some facts about it. Second, you are comparing apples to oranges, an apples to apples comparison would be an overclocked x800xl vs oced 6800gt, and i doubt the 6800gt would stand a foot in IQ in any game and only win in FPS in doom3.

3- I hardly see either sixpacks or overclockers spending $100 more just for 10-15 more fps. Besides $100 isnt a true difference in current prices, more like $60 where the gap would be reduced just for nvidiots.

4- Anybody that can overclock the 6800gt has the skill to flash the x800xl and overclock it. As hits and me stated, it might be just a bump in the road, nothing that cant be beaten from time to time. It is possible to hard lockk pipes, but ati hasnt been succesful to lock clocks without an alternative method (a hardware clock-locking chip? unlikely since that would be expensive for them) Knowing this, it would be very lazy of you (no phun intended) to pay $60-$100 more for something you can fix in 5 minits.

Maybe "bare in mind" was a little to rough, it means you wont be able to oc right outta the box but it wont be difficult to fix.

next?

I hope some of you got in on the x800xl for $239 from ati.com!!!

I am an ati fan but if they lock it and no one can find a way to unlock it to overclock, I will assure you people will pay more for the overclocking nvidia card. Not all but ati will lose alot of customers. I am also disapointed in the 4.12 drivers, they keep crashing

Overclocker550 said:

I am an ati fan but if they lock it and no one can find a way to unlock it to overclock, I will assure you people will pay more for the overclocking nvidia card. Not all but ati will lose alot of customers. I am also disapointed in the 4.12 drivers, they keep crashing

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that sounds much more reasonable but it still isnt. The vast mayority of users arent overclockers. An unbeatable clock lock would just scare some overclockers, which are already a minimum amount of atis costumers. OTOH sixpacks will just go with the cheapest and good solution: the x800xl. Its much better bang for the buck than the 6800gt if iq is what you are looking for and dont mind lagging behind a little in doom3.

you are right it would be bad for us overclockers, but as weve analyzed already its very unlikely ati will stop us. Resistance is futile, even more when they would need to invest millions of dollars just to force 5% of their marketshare to buy the more expensive options

Overclocker550 said:

"Bare in mind people that the x800xl is VERY LIKELY TO BE CLOCK LOCKED on its release. Its a gamble wether its going to be unlockable/overclockable at its release or later but anyhow its the best price/performance ratio we will see in a long time."


If this is true, ati will be shooting themselves in the foot, alot of people will spend the extra $100 for a 6800gt because an overclocked 6800gt will crush a stock x800xl. They will win those who dont care to oc though but I overclock and if its locked, I am not touching the x800xl, period

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If you overclock it or not, there is very little increase for the x800xl by overclocking. This is why the other X8*0 cards use a different core. The only bang for the buck with the x800xl is if you don't overclock.

Quailane said:

If you overclock it or not, there is very little increase for the x800xl by overclocking. This is why the other X8*0 cards use a different core. The only bang for the buck with the x800xl is if you don't overclock.

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i believe we still have to see these cards in action to make such assumptions. who knows, it might overclock madly. I would take the x800xl over the x800pro anyday just for the extra pipes

PhobMX said:

i believe we still have to see these cards in action to make such assumptions. who knows, it might overclock madly. I would take the x800xl over the x800pro anyday just for the extra pipes

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Same right here man. I'm planning on building a new rig and selling my current one to my brother. The X800XL is in the plans.

Seeing it so competitive at stock really sells it to me. Plus the price is just awesome.