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Nehalem release moved forward

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I'm not comparing anything dude, just asking a simple question, I think you need a :soda:to chill out a bit :)

I am chilled out . I think that this is great ! I am so looking forward to this next CPU ! I want one I may even get one just don't know yet ! Intel is on top of it's game now and this is going to drive CPU's into a whole new area no one has seen before ! I am excited about this news as should every one be !
 
Thank you I will and as far as I see it Intel taking this huge leap is a testament of how much they are putting into there R&D seems to me the other side is lacking in this area
Surely it is, Intel has a massive R&D budget and has a large number of talented people on hand.
even if AMD goes under I really doubt that it will hurt us that bad there is still IBM Sun micro and VIA .
Tell me, how many PC processors do those three make? Which IBM, Sun or VIA processor are you going to put into your PC as an alternative to a Nehalem? The Sony + IBM cell processors are fantastic at doing massive amounts of MIMD and vector math, but it's completely incapable of being used as a central PC processor. Sun makes processors too, but only if you want an UltraSparc on your desk -- I have one and can take a pic if you like :D and while it's a cool linux rig , Windows is not an option.

And VIA makes some incredibly good low-power processors, but believe me when I say that they are NOT competitive, nor do they really want to be. They have the lower power segment cornered, and they seem to be doing well with it.

this would not be the end all be all as if comp went down and Intel said well there is no need for R&D or for us to move forward then no one would be into buying any of there stuff any more and go with Apple ! you seem to think that the end of all computers is at hand when in fact tit is not .
Well now wait -- think about what you just said -- people would go with Apple? You do realize that every brand new Mac that you can go buy right now is built out of Intel processors and chipsets, right?

If Intel has no competition (and right now, IBM, Sun and VIA are not competitors) then why would they dump billions of dollars to continue going faster and faster? As a business, you innovate to keep people buying your product. Having other businesses trying to take your customers away provides a very BIG reason to continue innovation at a rapid pace.

When you're the ONLY business in that market, the innovation pace need only be fast enough to give something for "old customers" to re-purchase.
 
Granted but if the competitor can not keep up the pace you really have no other choice at all . we can not tell Intel to slow down or stop going forward now can we?
This is not good for AMD not at all and if I were them I would ramp up R&D to the fullest take some of the cash they are pumping into ATI R&D and move it to the CPU side is all . but if they do not do this fast they may find them selves playing catch up to a game that is all ready won . See what I am saying now ?
I want one so bad they look so sexy and fast !
 
I am chilled out . I think that this is great ! I am so looking forward to this next CPU ! I want one I may even get one just don't know yet ! Intel is on top of it's game now and this is going to drive CPU's into a whole new area no one has seen before ! I am excited about this news as should every one be !

I share your excitement, make no mistake.....but any market needs multiple, or at least two, competitors to ensure that the pace of technology advancement and prices remain competitive and balanced, otherwise the dominant player can charge much higher prices for "lesser" advanced technology, that is simple market dynamics. If AMD goes down you and I will be at a huge disadvantage as Intel will no longer need to invest millions to stay on top of their game, also Intel would have no need to price product competatively....competition is good for the end user ... that is the bottom line.
 
Granted but if the competitor can not keep up the pace you really have no other choice at all . we can not tell Intel to slow down or stop going forward now can we?
This is not good for AMD not at all and if I were them I would ramp up R&D to the fullest take some of the cash they are pumping into ATI R&D and move it to the CPU side is all . but if they do not do this fast they may find them selves playing catch up to a game that is all ready won . See what I am saying now ?
I want one so bad they look so sexy and fast !

Wait, so now that ATI/AMD has finally come out on top on the graphics department, you would take their budget and move it to the processor front? Even if they did that, it would still not be more than what Intel is spending. AMD needs to hold onto their lead over NVidia, and they need to work to offer something Intel doesn't with their CPUs, not take them on head-on.

EDIT: added quote to make it clear whom I was responding to
 
Intel loves their profit... I wonder how much they'll be making off each Nehalem :p I think my Q9450 will last me through Nehalem, I'll wait for the next, and hopefully AMD (or some successor) will have caught up by then and prices will be reasonable again.

Granted but if the competitor can not keep up the pace you really have no other choice at all . we can not tell Intel to slow down or stop going forward now can we?
This is not good for AMD not at all and if I were them I would ramp up R&D to the fullest take some of the cash they are pumping into ATI R&D and move it to the CPU side is all . but if they do not do this fast they may find them selves playing catch up to a game that is all ready won . See what I am saying now ?
I want one so bad they look so sexy and fast !

I think you need to go read some of the front page articles. AMD simply doesn't have spare cash. They can't put more into R&D, because "more" lacks a physical manifestation.
 
AMD is not going to go any were with the acquisition of ATI and the huge leaps ATI is making over nVidia I doubt that this is going to happen .
I do however feel that it is time for Intel to shine and now that the P4 net burst and hyper threading is over they are shining far brighter than ever and I want to give Intel it's due and not focus on what might happen to AMD as well they are going no were any time soon and will continue to make competitive stuff to keep Intel moving forward . this is a great time for us we are going to be getting a far better CPU out of Intel than EVER before ! I am so excited for intel and myself !
 
Well no ones said it so I will: AMD is not going to 'Die'. The company isn't going to disappear. If they completely flop fiscally, they'll be bought out by some other chip designer. The new parent company will benefit from AMD's R&D and in turn AMD gets to live on. Anyone know of a giant chip manufacturer with money to burn? [INTEL] Intel will benefit from the ATi sector as well, as they're already pursuing the graphics market. All I'm saying is the 'Ultimate Chip Merger' isn't that far flung. How is any of what I just wrote relevant to the OP? Intel's next chess move will be made a bit sooner, thats all. Does anyone believe that AMD can keep living on like this? They NEED money. Theres two ways they can get it: Be competitive in the CPU market [LOL] or get bought by someone that does have money. I'd rather it not be Intel, but it is possible.
 
The competitions board will never allow the takeover of AMD by Intel, once again guys the issue for me is not whether AMD goes bust completely but it is whether they can offer something to challenge Intel and I honestly hope they can otherwise Intel will have the power to play the CPU market in any shape and form they see fit to.
 
Well I would like to know how this got derailed into OMG AMD !! OMG AMD !!
Get over it This is a Intel forum and a lintel thread no place for this AMD stuff ok?
I can hardly wait to see this Chip in full on action and what the price will be of both the mobo , Chip and RAM ! this is going to be a total MONSTER !
 
Well I would like to know how this got derailed into OMG AMD !! OMG AMD !!
:D Even you had a stake in the talk about AMD, and nobody here has done the "AMD OMG" thing yet ;) If all that we're "allowed" to do is parrot "OMG INTEL OMG INTEL" then it's going to be a very uninteresting and dry thread.

As I mentioned in my very first post in this thread...
Albuquerque said:
Nehalem is a monster
... and there's no question about it. But Nehalem being a monster can really only be put into context next to what else is available. However, here's something you might not know trickson: The original Nehalem code-name described a netburst chip (aka, Pentium 4 design spec). That's right, Nehalem was going to be a higher clocked, higher bussed child of the P4.

Three years ago when Intel finally admitted Netburst's defeat, they re-used the Nehalem code name to describe a far-off descendant ot the new Core architecture, and they decided it would include their first integrated memory controller -- just like their competitor had been doing :) In essence, Nehalem's massive amounts of computing power is a product of netburst getting beat to death by AMD.

Let's say that in a different way: if AMD hadn't been able to compete with the Netburst architecture, Nehalem would never have been the monster that it is now.

And now, extend this logic four more years: if AMD isn't able to compete with the Nehalem architecture, Intel has no reason to create such another huge monster.

It doesn't matter if it's AMD, Sun, IBM or Via -- or it could even be someone new that we don't know yet. The core problem is the same: when a business gets this far ahead of everyone else, innovation begins to slow to a crawl and prices stop moving downard. The whole reason that we're talking about Intel's competition is because competition is what made Intel the powerhouse that it is today. Without competition, Intel will lose their edge -- and we as enthusiasts will lose as a result.

You can't tell me that such a thing wouldn't make you go :(

Oh, and to someone else's point: AMD will never die, I agree with that. But they don't have to die in order to stop making PC chips... Does anyone from the 386/486/Pentium days remember Cyrix? They couldn't compete, but they're still around -- you won't be buying any PC chips from them though :)
 
Well I am done !
Sick and tired of trying to compete with the AMD fan bays here with the great news from the Intel side . I was hoping for a thread of excitement only to read the AMD fanboys come on talking about the doom and gloom of how this is some how going to cripple forward motion and innovation because it is too fast and AMD can not keep up . ...
I talked about Intel on the AMD forum and got kicked off for 3 days seems it is OK to talk about AMD here though 2 faced ! I am done !
 
What the hell IS Nehalem?

I'm sick of all this "Lord of the Rings" ****. :)

To sum it all up:

9 processors were gifted to the race of men by AMD. But we were all of us deceived... In secret Intel forged a processor into which they poured all of their malice, hate, and will to dominate all of the earth. One processor to... uh... go fast or something.
 
:D Even you had a stake in the talk about AMD, and nobody here has done the "AMD OMG" thing yet ;) If all that we're "allowed" to do is parrot "OMG INTEL OMG INTEL" then it's going to be a very uninteresting and dry thread.

As I mentioned in my very first post in this thread...

... and there's no question about it. But Nehalem being a monster can really only be put into context next to what else is available. However, here's something you might not know trickson: The original Nehalem code-name described a netburst chip (aka, Pentium 4 design spec). That's right, Nehalem was going to be a higher clocked, higher bussed child of the P4.

Three years ago when Intel finally admitted Netburst's defeat, they re-used the Nehalem code name to describe a far-off descendant ot the new Core architecture, and they decided it would include their first integrated memory controller -- just like their competitor had been doing :) In essence, Nehalem's massive amounts of computing power is a product of netburst getting beat to death by AMD.

Let's say that in a different way: if AMD hadn't been able to compete with the Netburst architecture, Nehalem would never have been the monster that it is now.

And now, extend this logic four more years: if AMD isn't able to compete with the Nehalem architecture, Intel has no reason to create such another huge monster.

It doesn't matter if it's AMD, Sun, IBM or Via -- or it could even be someone new that we don't know yet. The core problem is the same: when a business gets this far ahead of everyone else, innovation begins to slow to a crawl and prices stop moving downard. The whole reason that we're talking about Intel's competition is because competition is what made Intel the powerhouse that it is today. Without competition, Intel will lose their edge -- and we as enthusiasts will lose as a result.

You can't tell me that such a thing wouldn't make you go :(

Oh, and to someone else's point: AMD will never die, I agree with that. But they don't have to die in order to stop making PC chips... Does anyone from the 386/486/Pentium days remember Cyrix? They couldn't compete, but they're still around -- you won't be buying any PC chips from them though :)

ZOMG, someone said 'AMD' in and Intel section, call the modcops..

But seriously, Albuquerque has a great point here about Intels recent past and the influence AMD had on them.

"..remember Cyrix?" Exactly. I still have one. AMD won't disappear, but to get back to their competitive heyday they need money they don't have.

Trickson: I'm glad you're taking a break.
 
Well I am done !
Sick and tired of trying to compete with the AMD fan bays here with the great news from the Intel side . I was hoping for a thread of excitement only to read the AMD fanboys come on talking about the doom and gloom of how this is some how going to cripple forward motion and innovation because it is too fast and AMD can not keep up . ...
I talked about Intel on the AMD forum and got kicked off for 3 days seems it is OK to talk about AMD here though 2 faced ! I am done !

I'm not really sure what happened in the AMD forums, but nobody here is attacking you, and I'm pretty sure you're overreacting. There are no AMD fanboys in here that I can see, in fact so far as I can tell, every person in this thread uses exclusively Intel computers.

Perhaps if you later have some time for all the reading (yeah, I know, there's a lot of info in only a few posts) you'll understand what we're trying to explain :( But there really is a valid reason to be worried about innnovation and price, and Intel's aggressive push of such a killer processor really does serve as a warning to us all...

To sum it all up:

9 processors were gifted to the race of men by AMD. But we were all of us deceived... In secret Intel forged a processor into which they poured all of their malice, hate, and will to dominate all of the earth. One processor to... uh... go fast or something.

BWAHAHAHAHA! This is sig worth material! :bday:
 
Lets try to stop talking about AMD and try and focus on this amazing flagship processor from Intel from now on. Rather than compare the two.

Will they run any cooler? I hear that water cooling is kinda not needed since the Core2 chips run fine on air. Can the same be said for the new ones?
 
Lets try to stop talking about AMD and try and focus on this amazing flagship processor from Intel from now on. Rather than compare the two.

Will they run any cooler? I hear that water cooling is kinda not needed since the Core2 chips run fine on air. Can the same be said for the new ones?

That's fine until you want more speed ;)

Air and water will never be enough for some of us. I just hope Nehalem doesn't mind the cold :beer:
 
Will they run any cooler? I hear that water cooling is kinda not needed since the Core2 chips run fine on air. Can the same be said for the new ones?

Core 2's still benefit from water, just like P4's did. I mean, I aircooled a 1.8A all the way to 2.7Ghz, and I aircooled a 2.4C to 3.4Ghz. But water stretched it to 2.85Ghz on the former and 3.6Ghz on the latter, while being a lot quieter ;)

The most current details available suggest that, on an equal performance basis, the Nehalem will run cooler than the Core 2. However, we don't buy performance levels, we buy Ghz :D So the Nehalem at equal clocks ends up being something like 10% hotter than the Core 2 if I recall correctly.

So expect a marginal increase in heat, but a larger proportion of performance to go with it. Water will still be my choice of cooling :)
 
C So the Nehalem at equal clocks ends up being something like 10% hotter than the Core 2 if I recall correctly.

Yes, the reviewer claimed a 10% increase in heat and a 20-30% increase in performance. If I remember correctly, that was compared with a core2quad
 
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