• Welcome to Overclockers Forums! Join us to reply in threads, receive reduced ads, and to customize your site experience!

Solar panel inverter directly to PSU & system?

Overclockers is supported by our readers. When you click a link to make a purchase, we may earn a commission. Learn More.
I'm curious if there's enough surface area on the roof for panels to provide that amount of electric (i.e 2-3 kw minimum in winter?) I definitely think 5-6 panels could fit on one side facing the sun, so I'm not sure if it's better to have them automatically rotated so they tilt to match the angle of the sun, or put 5 on each side and have the morning light charge one roof and the afternoon light charge the other roof.

You've not indicated your geographic region, so I can't really comment on the number of panels you'll need for any given load/season. Let me know your insolation zone and I can advise accordingly.

In terms of trackers, we're using the Zomeworks. It works very well and is the most reliable unit on the market today. Keep in mind that for the cost of a typical tracker + installation, you can buy a dozen or more panels. Trackers are generally recommended in installations where space is limited.

The number of panels required in a given array is a function of the amount of voltage being > the voltage of your system, divided by the number of panels. Full-size panels are typically 26 volts; since panel voltage output varies with the intensity of light, it's recommended that each array consists of a minimum of 4 panels wired in series for a total of 104 volts for a 48-volt system. Multiple arrays are wired in parallel.

If you're going to run an inverter at all, go for a true sine wave unit. Square wave inverters are very hard on equipment, especially anything with an AC motor.
 
1200watts isnt that bad in terms of power used by everyday devices... consider you might only use the cook top for about 30mins maybe a 1hr, so if its 30mins your looking at 600WH vs 1200WH for using it for one hour. since induction heats up faster other electric style/type stoves. the only other i would consider using is a propane or natural gas stove...

Cool, yeah, I'd have to find out what other appliances I'd use. I'm sure I can figure something out. :thup:

You've not indicated your geographic region, so I can't really comment on the number of panels you'll need for any given load/season. Let me know your insolation zone and I can advise accordingly.

In terms of trackers, we're using the Zomeworks. It works very well and is the most reliable unit on the market today. Keep in mind that for the cost of a typical tracker + installation, you can buy a dozen or more panels. Trackers are generally recommended in installations where space is limited.

The number of panels required in a given array is a function of the amount of voltage being > the voltage of your system, divided by the number of panels. Full-size panels are typically 26 volts; since panel voltage output varies with the intensity of light, it's recommended that each array consists of a minimum of 4 panels wired in series for a total of 104 volts for a 48-volt system. Multiple arrays are wired in parallel.

If you're going to run an inverter at all, go for a true sine wave unit. Square wave inverters are very hard on equipment, especially anything with an AC motor.

I'm near:
IL Chicago 41° 53' N 87° 38' W (10 year average) kWh/m2/day
Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Avg
1.5 2.45 3.2 4.48 5.56 6.07 5.68 5.27 4.51 3.07 1.69 1.26 3.72
from: http://www.apricus.com/html/insolation_levels_usa.htm

So I'm thinking I could fit 3 square meters on one side giving me 1.26kWh/m^2 x 3 on one roof for ~3x9 feet for a total of 27 square feet of panels. Is there another tracker system where the top part near the apex is stationary and attached to the roof, yet pivots so it only moves the lowest region like pistons and elevates it into a second configuation of a sideways V?
Are there any benefits wiring one array (4 panels) in parallel? If possible.
 
Last edited:
I used MS paint to draw a possibly unusual piston/hydraulic setup. I think it looks cool, but not sure if it's practical, though I think it could be cheaper if I wanted to use the same array for a morning and afternoon thing. I also had another idea where the panels could use a track to slide/crawl over the top so it just looks the same on the other side. What do you think?

Edit: That Zomeworks is a very cool setup. I'm curious how much more 360 degrees rotation collects compared to a more limited east-west alternation.
 

Attachments

  • Solar configs.png
    Solar configs.png
    7.8 KB · Views: 238
Last edited:
For Chicago, your kWh/m2/day (insolation) for December is 2.27. 4 fixed-mount panels at 225W w/ an 80% battery efficiency factor = (.9KW*2.27) * .8 = 1.6KW/H per day.

Keep in mind that this is under ideal circumstances; i.e., nothing blocking the full view of rising and setting sun and the ideal angle of 55 degrees south (Winter angle). Days with heavy clouds will result in significantly lower output.

Xenohitsu said:
Is there another tracker system where the top part near the apex is stationary and attached to the roof, yet pivots so it only moves the lowest region like pistons and elevates it into a second configuation of a sideways V?...I used MS paint to draw a possibly unusual piston/hydraulic setup. I think it looks cool, but not sure if it's practical, though I think it could be cheaper if I wanted to use the same array for a morning and afternoon thing. I also had another idea where the panels could use a track to slide/crawl over the top so it just looks the same on the other side. What do you think?.

I've seen custom/industrial systems that use other methods, but all of the commercially available systems are similar to mine. If you're a competent welder/engineer/fabricator with the knowledge and equipment, I'd encourage you to design your own. Keep in mind that you have to maintain the proper N/S angle while tracking E/W.

Xenohitsu said:
Edit: That Zomeworks is a very cool setup. I'm curious how much more 360 degrees rotation collects compared to a more limited east-west alternation.

The amount of solar energy at the end and beginning of the day is so small that a few more degrees of rotation won't make any real difference.

Xenohitsu said:
Are there any benefits wiring one array (4 panels) in parallel? If possible.

Please see previous post. Your array output voltage must exceed your current battery voltage by 10% minimum in order to charge and PV voltage varies with intensity of sunlight. It's therefore recommended that PV array voltage >= 4 times the standing battery voltage, keeping within the limits of your controller.
 
Last edited:
Thanks hafa and everyone!

Looking at the dimensions of individual solar panels, they seem to average 60"x36" each, meaning I could fit at least one array on each roof slant, assuming it's about 60" long and the house ~12 feet in length=an Epu. Using the Pythagorean theorem, their loft height is 3'8" and 6' wide, so I did sqrt (3^2*3.67^2)=sqrt 22.4=~4.7ft~56" and I saw some panels under 60", plus I didn't take into account additional wall width that'd add to the base and thus hypotenus, so it'd probably fit on a Tumbleweed Tarleton! I'm not sure if two arrays, one on each side would be better than a tracker, though if cloudy days at a static angle would result in less than 1Kw, or worse- less than 600w/h/ day, then I'd definitely measure the monthly lows before buying a tracker or another array to find out my minimum needs (Edit: I just noticed you said aprox. 12 panels can be bought in place of one tracker and installation, so I'd probably go w/ as many panels as I can fit). One record month, when I used to live in a small studio, I had a ComEd bill with an average of 1.6kwhs/day- I used about 3 CFLs, a 225w mini-fridge, a ceiling fan (I had an air conditioning unit, but the ceiling fan was cool enough), an Eee PC <15w, a microwave, and toaster that I used once a day each for less than 2, 5 minutes, so I'm definitely up for the challenge again. Granted, my laundry and furnace heat were not included in that, plus I plan to do some real cooking, so I'd probably go with at least two arrays...very interesting what that will produce...

Thanks hafa and everyone!

Looking at the dimensions of individual solar panels, they seem to average 60"x36" each, meaning I could fit at least one array on each roof slant, assuming it's about 60" long and the house ~12 feet in length=an Epu. Using the Pythagorean theorem, their loft height is 3'8" and 6' wide, so I did sqrt (3^2*3.67^2)=sqrt 22.4=~4.7ft~56" and I saw some panels under 60", plus I didn't take into account additional wall width that'd add to the base and thus hypotenus, so it'd probably fit on a Tumbleweed Tarleton! I'm not sure if two arrays, one on each side would be better than a tracker, though if cloudy days at a static angle would result in less than 1Kw, or worse- less than 600w/h/ day, then I'd definitely measure the monthly lows before buying a tracker or another array to find out my minimum needs (Edit: I just noticed you said aprox. 12 panels can be bought in place of one tracker and installation, so I'd probably go w/ as many panels as I can fit). One record month, when I used to live in a small studio, I had a ComEd bill with an average of 1.6kwhs/day- I used about 3 CFLs, a 225w mini-fridge, a ceiling fan (I had an air conditioning unit, but the ceiling fan was cool enough), an Eee PC <15w, a microwave, and toaster that I used once a day each for less than 2, 5 minutes, so I'm definitely up for the challenge again. Granted, my laundry and furnace heat were not included in that, plus I plan to do some real cooking, so I'd probably go with at least two arrays...very interesting what that will produce...

Edit 2: I also noticed you wrote a minimum of 4 panels in each array. I probably could fit 5 panels on each side, which is 15'. There's little room in these buildings, though the ones larger than the Epu (89sq ft) are 117sq ft (Tarleton and Lusby), and feature closets near the front- I know this is a bit off topic, but those larger models have 2 extra closets plus a 2nd storage loft which might actually serve well for batteries, though it looks like some batteries need ventilation (your doors feature them), so I'd take a while to figure out which batteries I would end up choosing, though AGM ones seem nice. I'm curious what electric car manufacturers are using for their batteries, as maybe there's a technology there that isn't too different. I'm looking considering many types of batteries, like lithium and Nickel-Fe...
 
Last edited:
if you got a bit more to spend and want a smaller battery with the same size AH rating, look at Lifepro4 batteries.

I just noticed ThunderSky made the Li-Pho-4 ones in that portable Sol-man one in my first link. I definitely prefer vent-free maintenance considering it's the same building and the closet space will be limited.
 
Edit 2: I also noticed you wrote a minimum of 4 panels in each array. I probably could fit 5 panels on each side, which is 15'. There's little room in these buildings, though the ones larger than the Ep... I'm looking considering many types of batteries, like lithium and Nickel-Fe...

As long as the total voltage does not exceed the maximum capacity of your controller, you're good to do. Most controllers typically can handle 150VDC, so since 26 * 5 = 130 you should be good be good to go.

As far as batteries go, other than lead-acid, you're likely going to have a bit of a wait before anything with sufficient service life and usable charge/discharge characteristics is commercially available/affordable. Also note that there are currently no commercially available home solar system charge controllers for anything other than lead acid.
 
As far as batteries go, other than lead-acid, you're likely going to have a bit of a wait before anything with sufficient service life and usable charge/discharge characteristics is commercially available/affordable. Also note that there are currently no commercially available home solar system charge controllers for anything other than lead acid.

I agree that I might have to wait a while for service life and charge/discharge characteristics. I have been currently researching forums that have been discussing custom-built/assembled ones on this recently, and found:
http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showt...4-The-future-for-off-grid-battery-banks/page3
http://www.solarpaneltalk.com/showt...-Lithium-Iron-Phosphate-(-LFP-LiFePO4-)/page3

Built-in BMS can be found with LiPho4 battery packs it seems by programming, and one person was describing a custom controller that uses PWM but also discusses the benefits of MPPT. Those are, admittedly, three new terms that I just learned and am not sure if always refer to inverters (which I might do without), controllers or batteries so I am curious how people have fared with them. Some quotes:

"Main battery charger controller
BMS at each cell
They all have to talk to each other"

"IF anyone is interested this is how I have set up 3 x100ahr LiFePo4 batteries for charging by solar and for use with MSW inverter..
Im not claiming this is the correct way or even the best way to do it,, But ...all 3 systems been in use over 2 years now almost 3 years with NO PROBLEMS..
Charger a 30a PWP 12v charger set to output 14.8v with no equalization..
Battery cell over charging 1x 3.9V 1watt zenner diode and 1x10ohm resistor across each cell
One low voltage sensor set to disconnect the inverter and anything else connected to the battery pack at 10v
Facts as found out the expensive way by me are if you discharge a cell below about 2.2 v it will be destroyed even if done just one time only.
If you over charge above about 4.4v they have a very short life.
If you look at charts from the manufacturesr you find there is little power above 3.8v and it stays fairly constant until about 2.5v then hits a brick wall. So use between those 2 voltages and all is well with the world."

"Steca PR 20.20 solar regulator will be used. Controller has also a function to disconnect the load in case of battery discharge."
 
Last edited:
Back