- Joined
- Dec 13, 2002
- Location
- Southern California
They didnt even take out the wei, all they did was take out the button to run the test and get the meaningless number. You can still run it through command prompt on win8.1.
-
Welcome to Overclockers Forums! Join us to reply in threads, receive reduced ads, and to customize your site experience!
Does Furmark really kill video cards?
- Thread starter SMOKEU
- Start date
I think the real meaning is lost in all of this... that the WEI is borderline useless and there are other, more accurate and more telling benchmarks that one should be running to get an idea of system performance.
Now, can we move on?
- Joined
- Jul 17, 2014
I've got your point that other softwares are better then wei. But have you got my point that doesn't make windows rating a crap? There are three different words good, average, and crap. Neither the windows rating nor other softwares are crap. Windows rating does the job its designed for perfectly. Think of it like a calculator and human brain. The calculator is much faster and better then human brain for simple as well as complex arithmetic operations but that doesn't mean human brain is crap, it can still do small simple arithmetic functions with acceptable speed. Do you get that? Good keep it up then !!
Last edited:
- Joined
- Dec 13, 2005
I think it's crap because it seems to base it's rating on nothing, not that other benchmarks are better. Here's an example:
I have a work laptop. It has an i7 4600u with a HD4400 iGPU. It gets a 6.5 in both the graphic rankings.
The GTX670 in my desktop gets a 7.9 in those same rankings, the highest it can go.
My problem is 1. the 670 is a last gen card, and not even the best of that generation. How does it max out the WEI ranking?
2. What is stopping the average user from looking at those numbers and thinking a 670 offers just a 21% performance boost over the 4400? Any good, or even just an average benchmark, will show a much wider performance margin between the two.
3. What does the ranking mean? Most other benchmarks will run an actual benchmark that you can see. At some point it will show you the framerate. This lets the user know "OK, this card can run X at Y settings at a playable frame rate." What does a 6.5 vs 7.9 tell me?
To put it in terms of your human brain vs. calculator example, it's like giving both the equation "4 x 4 + 20". One gives you the correct answer (36). The other pretends to do work and then says "yes, this equation should give you a number higher than 20." One is useful, the other is crap independent of the other answer.
I have a work laptop. It has an i7 4600u with a HD4400 iGPU. It gets a 6.5 in both the graphic rankings.
The GTX670 in my desktop gets a 7.9 in those same rankings, the highest it can go.
My problem is 1. the 670 is a last gen card, and not even the best of that generation. How does it max out the WEI ranking?
2. What is stopping the average user from looking at those numbers and thinking a 670 offers just a 21% performance boost over the 4400? Any good, or even just an average benchmark, will show a much wider performance margin between the two.
3. What does the ranking mean? Most other benchmarks will run an actual benchmark that you can see. At some point it will show you the framerate. This lets the user know "OK, this card can run X at Y settings at a playable frame rate." What does a 6.5 vs 7.9 tell me?
To put it in terms of your human brain vs. calculator example, it's like giving both the equation "4 x 4 + 20". One gives you the correct answer (36). The other pretends to do work and then says "yes, this equation should give you a number higher than 20." One is useful, the other is crap independent of the other answer.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Sep 7, 2013
plus it caps mechanical drives at 5.9 no matter what speeds you get.
Though admittedly, I scored 6.0 one time
Though admittedly, I scored 6.0 one time
- Joined
- Aug 30, 2004
- Location
- Santa Barbara, CA
As others have suggested, the power draw of a card is dictated by the on-board hardware limits. So, any claims to the contrary are complete nonsense.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Jul 17, 2014
Well, windows uses that evaluation engine to manage its features and background services accordingly. If the engine is crap, then everything based upon that engine is crap making the windows completely crap and any testing software you run on this windows will use those crap background services which makes your whole windows and other softwares running in its framework crap. Now windows may not be perfect but is still not crap and so is with its engine. Unbelievable guys!! I'm done with protecting microsoft's respect for its windows from wrong beliefs.
Yes it does
Furmark killed my Laptop completely. I was running it and ca. 3 min into the benchmark at a temperature of 80°C my laptop just went out dead. Since then it wont power up under any condition (battery removed etc) removing. No leds blinking, no beep just dead silence. So be careful folks when you use that benchmark.
Furmark killed my Laptop completely. I was running it and ca. 3 min into the benchmark at a temperature of 80°C my laptop just went out dead. Since then it wont power up under any condition (battery removed etc) removing. No leds blinking, no beep just dead silence. So be careful folks when you use that benchmark.
- Joined
- Jul 31, 2004
False. Either bad cooling killed your laptop or a random coincidence killed your laptop.
- Joined
- Jun 28, 2012
This power virus of an application could easily kill a laptop.
- Joined
- Sep 7, 2013
Sounds like a short or bad cooling as petteyg said.
Whatever fault is to blame, fact is that the laptop died while running furmark, so you can't say it has nothing to do with it. Also 80°C is really not critical for hardware. I recommend not using furmark, when you suspect anything could not be ok with your system. I on my part had been experiencing bsods while gaming and used furmark to test a fix. Unfortunately this fried not only the gpu but the whole laptop.
My laptop broke while looking at your thread. It must be your fault.
See the logic here?
80c is pretty critical to me, knowing that laptops have sub standard cooling to start with.
Last edited:
Not going to honor your limited communication skills or knowledge with any further arguing.
Perfect.
- Joined
- Jul 31, 2004
Furmark does not change the card's voltages or clocks like <insert-overclocking-program-here>. If the card stops working after using Furmark, the card was already broken (either inadequate cooling or inadequate circuitry) and you just didn't notice it yet.
- Joined
- May 10, 2009
Nope. Sorry, but nope.
That's like saying your engine is defective if you get on the freeway in second gear and run it at the redline at full throttle for a 200 mile drive.
GPUs are not built for what Furmark puts them through. They are GRAPHICS PROCESSING UNITS. Furmark is a mathematical calculation designed to use as much power as possible.
Your phone is not designed to work in space. If you take it to space and expose it to hard vacuum in raw sunlight and it fails, is that the phone's fault?
Furmark is an abusive program that forces the GPU to do things that it is not designed to do.
It forces GPUs that don't actively regulate their power draw to fit within TDP to go outside their TDP. This is akin to the above situations. The driver (you) is abusing the hardware.
Your other option is to say that the TDP should be higher, or the clocks/volts lower, so that Furmark doesn't take the card outside its limits.
Welcome to 20% or so lower gaming performance. Enjoy!
Would you prefer to pay more for less performance and have the GPU be somewhat more idiot-resistant, or have better performance at a lower price with the tradeoff that if a local user* tries hard enough they can destroy it?
I know what my choice is.
* See Wikipedia.
That's like saying your engine is defective if you get on the freeway in second gear and run it at the redline at full throttle for a 200 mile drive.
GPUs are not built for what Furmark puts them through. They are GRAPHICS PROCESSING UNITS. Furmark is a mathematical calculation designed to use as much power as possible.
Your phone is not designed to work in space. If you take it to space and expose it to hard vacuum in raw sunlight and it fails, is that the phone's fault?
Furmark is an abusive program that forces the GPU to do things that it is not designed to do.
It forces GPUs that don't actively regulate their power draw to fit within TDP to go outside their TDP. This is akin to the above situations. The driver (you) is abusing the hardware.
Your other option is to say that the TDP should be higher, or the clocks/volts lower, so that Furmark doesn't take the card outside its limits.
Welcome to 20% or so lower gaming performance. Enjoy!
Would you prefer to pay more for less performance and have the GPU be somewhat more idiot-resistant, or have better performance at a lower price with the tradeoff that if a local user* tries hard enough they can destroy it?
I know what my choice is.
* See Wikipedia.
- Joined
- Jul 31, 2004
Space is outside a phone's operating parameters. FurMark does EXACTLY what GPUs are designed to do: complex geometric modeling and texturing of said models.
If card-maker-X can make it so your GPU doesn't overload and fail in the middle of games, they can make it so it doesn't overload and fail in the middle of OpenCL or CUDA or whatever computation. If software can kill the hardware without changing its parameters, then the hardware was already broken. On the other hand, if the card is overclocked, then PEBKAC. In neither case is Furmark or whatever software at fault.
If card-maker-X can make it so your GPU doesn't overload and fail in the middle of games, they can make it so it doesn't overload and fail in the middle of OpenCL or CUDA or whatever computation. If software can kill the hardware without changing its parameters, then the hardware was already broken. On the other hand, if the card is overclocked, then PEBKAC. In neither case is Furmark or whatever software at fault.
- Joined
- May 10, 2009
Is it? Have you checked to see what your phone is rated to do?
Have you checked to see what every GPU that can run Furmark is rated to do?
I suspect not.
Bonus: Have you ever designed a product?
I suspect not on that one, too.
How many GPUs do you think AMD would sell if they mandated that ever GPU produced that can run Furmark have active power throttling circuitry?
How many people would pay $100 for a card that currently costs $70?
Few people would. Making a failed product and a fired engineer. Don't forget that you're talking about EVERYTHING, not just top end stuff.
Do you run your 15a house power circuits at 14.99a long term?
Do you, in fact, run your car at redline for long term highway miles? It's technically within its operating parameters.
While Mr. Scott is not, perhaps, the fluffiest and most gentle person, he is also not wrong.
I know what industry he comes from, I have experience there, people that are wrong do not prosper there. People who make things up to appear right do not prosper there (far from it), and finally compared to the standard between-professionals conversation what you've been treated to is staggeringly fluffy.
If you'd rather be treated as a customer than a peer, that is perhaps a different story.
I figure you'd rather be treated as a knowledgeable peer rather than a know-nothing customer. Please correct me if I'm wrong there.
OH OH OH BONUS!
GPU's have a TDP, a Thermal Design Power. Guess what Furmark causes them to violate on its way to blow them up?
TDP.
So there you go, Furmark causes operation outside the literal design parameters.
This goes, like all my posts here, for cards that do not have active power limiting.
Have you checked to see what every GPU that can run Furmark is rated to do?
I suspect not.
Bonus: Have you ever designed a product?
I suspect not on that one, too.
How many GPUs do you think AMD would sell if they mandated that ever GPU produced that can run Furmark have active power throttling circuitry?
How many people would pay $100 for a card that currently costs $70?
Few people would. Making a failed product and a fired engineer. Don't forget that you're talking about EVERYTHING, not just top end stuff.
Do you run your 15a house power circuits at 14.99a long term?
Do you, in fact, run your car at redline for long term highway miles? It's technically within its operating parameters.
While Mr. Scott is not, perhaps, the fluffiest and most gentle person, he is also not wrong.
I know what industry he comes from, I have experience there, people that are wrong do not prosper there. People who make things up to appear right do not prosper there (far from it), and finally compared to the standard between-professionals conversation what you've been treated to is staggeringly fluffy.
If you'd rather be treated as a customer than a peer, that is perhaps a different story.
I figure you'd rather be treated as a knowledgeable peer rather than a know-nothing customer. Please correct me if I'm wrong there.
OH OH OH BONUS!
GPU's have a TDP, a Thermal Design Power. Guess what Furmark causes them to violate on its way to blow them up?
TDP.
So there you go, Furmark causes operation outside the literal design parameters.
This goes, like all my posts here, for cards that do not have active power limiting.
Last edited:
Similar threads
